Today 127 new cases in US, 99 in China, 778 in Italy

[Marcin2 + 724]

US from 173 to 320 , 127 new cases

China from 80,552 to 80,651, 99 new cases,

Italy from 3,858 to 4,636 , 778 new cases

Again this numbers are nowhere directly presented in headlines.

How important is Dow Jones for Trump administration, that President is questioning World Health Organization death data ?

I am writing about this as it is similar to initial  cover up in China.

Fortunately US has free press so information is provided, but President being too optimistic about dangers could  cause reckless behaviour of US  citizens.

 

Edited March 7, 2020 by Marcin2
Deleted some insulting and provocative sentences

[0R0 + 6,251]

I don't really think Americans expect leadership from the political side. The medical side is more important for Americans. The CDC would have been useful if their top layers weren't ancient holdovers from the Obama admin. But they flubbed it badly with bad test kits, a power driven demand to have tests sent to their regional labs and abysmally bad testing guidelines. As I said, they were "not looking".

People are loading up. They went and looked up "corona virus" peaking in early Feb. There is a rush but not a panic for virus related items. Otherwise, people are stocking up on at least 14 days worth of routine supplies to make sure they can avoid needing to go out if there are confirmed cases in their area. Businesses and schools are acting according to their contingency plan when confirmed cases show up in their vicinity. Most have cancelled their employee's travel. Airline tickets are down 20% as of Mar 1 and estimated down over 30% for this weekend. 

Cruise lines will apparently stop embarkations entirely as cancellations are making most scheduled cruises uneconomical. Confereneces are being cancelled, we will see how fast events dine-in restaurants and schools respond. Some have gone to tele-learning already. 

The reason it is not headline news is because the culprits in the failure are at the CDC. Meaning Democratic appointees. Trump's apparent nonchalance not withstanding. There is plenty of criticism of Trump in the media. Second issue is that it is old news. 

 

 

[Marcin2 + 724]

4 hours ago, 0R0 said:

I don't really think Americans expect leadership from the political side. The medical side is more important for Americans. The CDC would have been useful if their top layers weren't ancient holdovers from the Obama admin. But they flubbed it badly with bad test kits, a power driven demand to have tests sent to their regional labs and abysmally bad testing guidelines. As I said, they were "not looking".

There should be leadership from the political side, just to assure people that somebody is in control, even if heavy handed control.

What about countrywide State of Emergency ?, I would be Trump I would do it, with televised national announcement, maybe National Guard deployment in some states, and so on, just to SHOW leadership. But it would also help with the disease.

Stock market would tank but only for a few days. Democrats & probably part of Republicans would call this excessive,

but that is what Trump needs, to shut the propaganda of all people critisizing him before November election.

Being excessive in the epidemic is the BEST thing politician can do. Afterwards you can always claim you saved thousands of lives, in epidemic no opponents  have good contra arguments, and would be seen as not caring.

The WORST thing is to be too optimistic, I do not know why Trump lost his political instinct on this issue.

Should definitely call Steve Bannon, for advice.

[Geoff Guenther + 317]

1 hour ago, Marcin2 said:

Being excessive in the epidemic is the BEST thing politician can do. Afterwards you can always claim you saved thousands of lives, in epidemic no opponents  have good contra arguments, and would be seen as not caring.

The WORST thing is to be too optimistic, I do not know why Trump lost his political instinct on this issue.

It's a complete failure of planning on the Administration's part. Everyone is pointing at everyone else and no one knows who is in charge - Trump firing the entire pandemic response team certainly has had an impact. As for the CDC, everyone's surprised at their ineptitude today and there needs to be an inquiry as to why they couldn't handle testing when almost all other countries could.

Trump probably could declare a state of emergency. There are a few problems standing in the way right now:

• Trump refuses to admit that he is wrong. The moment he sees people on Twitter mocking him for flip-flopping on this he'll get irate
• It goes very much against Trump's base, some of whom are "libertarian at all costs" and very vocal about it
• Democrats and some Republicans are leery of his "emergencies" since he likes to declare them to fund pet projects
• The administration still doesn't have a Plan-B. Locking people in their homes is fine, but how are you going to get them food, toilet paper (hah), and testing.  The administration can't even agree that the tests should be run for free for everyone

It's been a miserable start to dealing with COVID-19, but low population density in the US may slow its spread. The administration may be able to recover from this with proper leadership - Pence and Mark Meadows are probably not the guys.

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

3 hours ago, Marcin2 said:

There should be leadership from the political side, just to assure people that somebody is in control, even if heavy handed control.

What about countrywide State of Emergency ?, I would be Trump I would do it, with televised national announcement, maybe National Guard deployment in some states, and so on, just to SHOW leadership. But it would also help with the disease.

Stock market would tank but only for a few days. Democrats & probably part of Republicans would call this excessive,

but that is what Trump needs, to shut the propaganda of all people critisizing him before November election.

Being excessive in the epidemic is the BEST thing politician can do. Afterwards you can always claim you saved thousands of lives, in epidemic no opponents  have good contra arguments, and would be seen as not caring.

The WORST thing is to be too optimistic, I do not know why Trump lost his political instinct on this issue.

Should definitely call Steve Bannon, for advice.

No, the worst thing is running around like Chicken Little screaming, “The sky is falling! The sky is falling!”

[0R0 + 6,251]

Quite frankly we already missed the boat because the CDC took over a month to get a widely available test kit to the front lines. And in the interim hoarded the tests and gave truly idiotic testing guidelines based on old "information" from China which hid human to human transmission for weeks. 

By now, the virus is everywhere. All across the planet. Only aggressive testing of the contact chain and affected communities will identify the carriers so that they know to self quarantine. 

The only thing to do on the political front is to fund at least the testing, and force the CDC to be transparent.

[James Regan + 1,776]

16 hours ago, Marcin2 said:

US from 173 to 320 , 127 new cases

China from 80,552 to 80,651, 99 new cases,

Italy from 3,858 to 4,636 , 778 new cases

Again this numbers are nowhere directly presented in headlines.

How important is Dow Jones for Trump administration, that President is questioning World Health Organization death data ?

I am writing about this as it is similar to initial  cover up in China.

Fortunately US has free press so information is provided, but President being too optimistic about dangers could  cause reckless behaviour of US  citizens.

 

Over 6000 (1200 last 24 hours) in Italy, the numbers are doubling over night as per the amounting tests being carried out, so once POTUS gets his “beautiful “ tests ( yes he said they were beautiful ) (( an Indian FTR1200 is beautiful)) on the go expect the same doubling of numbers for the USA. If you don’t test you don’t have confirmed cases you just keep spreading the virus hap hazzardly

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

From outside of mainstream, for consideration.  Note that this is simply a bit of thinking outside the box, rather than being a mindless lemming running toward the panic cliffs.

Long article.  intro summary below.

Trump Halts CDC Fearmongering. But Why Are Antibiotics & Not Anti-Virals Quelling The COVID-19 Coronavirus? Is It Really A Virus?

Based on an exclusive interview with Lawrence Broxmeyer MD

BULLET POINT SUMMARY

• COVID-19 Coronavirus is as much an ecological disaster as it is a medical one. Initially it appears to be a unique experience centered in Wuhan, China.  It emanates from an environment of incinerated pig waste, airborne particles, and low vitamin D blood levels in winter, and weakened immune systems, particularly among smokers, drinkers and the elderly.
• It is believed both the Spanish flu of 1918 and the COVID-19 coronavirus began as zoonotic (animal to human) infections. Not from bats as first reported in the Wuhan COVID-19 outbreak, but rather from pigs, and pig waste.
• The 1918 Spanish flu pandemic began in the midst of an infectious pig slaughter of undiscovered cause, a few hundred miles from Camp Funston, what is Fort Riley today. Similarly, the outbreak of the COVID-19 coronavirus outbreak began in the Wuhan, China area in the wake of a massive kill-off of pigs who were dying from African Swine Flu.
• Viral outbreaks arise in winter, but so does tuberculosis.
• Some types of mycobacteria do not have cell walls and can mimic the appearance of a virus under the microscope.
• Antibiotics cannot be used for viruses. If a virus, then why aren’t antiviral drugs working but antibiotics are?
• COVID-19 coronavirus may just be a “passenger virus,” not the primary microbial organism that kills by filling the lower lungs with fluid.
• Both the current Wuhan COVID-19 coronavirus and tubercular mycobacteria do not tend to infect or cause serious disease in young children roughly 5-12 years of age.
• Fear of the COVID-19 coronavirus may be misplaced. More people are killed by Mycobacterium tuberculosis (1.7 million) in a year than the few who have been infected (~80,000) or have died (less than 2000) of the COVID-19 coronavirus.
• It is projected that the “COVID-19 Coronavirus” will peak worldwide in March and then return in a second but lesser peak in September, in accordance with Yang’s Wuhan study from 2004 to 2013, describing the annual TB surges in Wuhan, China.

Saying the spread of the COVID-19 coronavirus is inevitable, a CDC (Centers for Disease Control) official advised Americans “brace themselves” and prepare to shut down public schools, avoid going to church, and self-quarantine their families.  These onerous measures are for a virus that has infected just 53 Americans (Feb. 25), mostly among people who traveled recently to China.

Recognizing the possibility that some officials within the CDC are potential handmaidens to the drug and vaccine industry that would benefit from such scare tactics, President Trump decided to issue all governmental statements about COVID-19 from The White House.

After all, the CDC seemed to be about ready to bring down the entire U.S. economy and shutter small businesses that would never recover from even a short quarantine.

Doomsday virus?

Irresponsible and implausible predictions that COVID-19 coronavirus could produce symptomatic viral infection in 60% of the world’s population with 45 million deaths   ̶   fueled by sensationalized news reports, were purely unfounded and certainly premature. Perhaps the only thing that could be considered beneficial about these dire prognostications was when one quick-thinking woman in China used the fear of the virus in a positive way, and feigned she was infected to foil a rapist.

...

 

[Tomasz + 1,608]

Last time I looked at the price of the test for an uninsured person it exceeded $ 3,000 in the US. Don't you think that this is a fundamental problem?

Edited March 8, 2020 by Tomasz

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

And in different news...

State Department Doctor Allowed Americans with Coronavirus to Fly Back to the US …Updated

President Trump is reportedly furious after a State Department doctor ignored the President’s orders and allowed Americans, sick with the coronavirus, to return to the US from Japan.  Dr. William Walters, Executive Director and Managing Director for Operational Medicine for the Bureau of Medical Services at the U.S. Department of State, made the decision to bring the patients back to the US.

Dr. Walters rationalized his decision to override the President and the CDC and allow individuals sick with the coronavirus to return to the US: ...

 

======================================================

Comment by someone:

Ian Brownlee. DoS Senior Foreign Service 30-years who countermanded @POTUS' order that NO infected citizen be flown back to CONUS. Not only flew them back, the infected were split into TWO groups and flew on BOTH of the chartered aircraft with NON-infected passengers who weren't told of their infected co-passengers. It gets worse, rather than one common destination the two aircraft flew to TWO SEPARATE destinations. At BOTH of these airports, there were NO protocol controls for separating the infected and no quarantining. Upon landing, ALL passengers were allowed to freely come into direct contact with family members and other loved ones as well as the general public. 

Ian Brownlee did EVERYTHING in his power to assure the most efficient spread of the virus in the U.S. short of chartering separate aircraft for EACH of the infected passengers, making sure that each aircraft flew to separate destinations and that there were NO CDC pandemic protocols set up to receive these passengers.

Last, Ian Brownlee made sure that the White House would not be informed of the actual situation until ONE HOUR of the two aircraft landing at the two uninformed, unprepared airports.

[0R0 + 6,251]

Thanks.

So the "pros" did this on purpose. I see a trial coming. 

 

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

2 minutes ago, 0R0 said:

So the "pros" did this on purpose.

Seems that way.

Poll: New Hampshire Democrats would prefer an extinction-causing meteor over Trump reelection

A majority of New Hampshire Democrats said in a new poll that they would rather a "giant meteor strikes the Earth, extinguishing all human life" than see President Trump reelected.  ...

... Voters were also asked in the online survey conducted by YouGov: "Which of the following outcomes would you prefer occur on November 3, 2020? Donald Trump wins re-election or A giant meteor strikes the earth, extinguishing all human life."

Sixty-two percent of Democrats picked the meteor, while 38 percent chose a second term for Trump.  ...

[0R0 + 6,251]

10 minutes ago, Tom Kirkman said:

Seems that way.

Poll: New Hampshire Democrats would prefer an extinction-causing meteor over Trump reelection

A majority of New Hampshire Democrats said in a new poll that they would rather a "giant meteor strikes the Earth, extinguishing all human life" than see President Trump reelected.  ...

... Voters were also asked in the online survey conducted by YouGov: "Which of the following outcomes would you prefer occur on November 3, 2020? Donald Trump wins re-election or A giant meteor strikes the earth, extinguishing all human life."

Sixty-two percent of Democrats picked the meteor, while 38 percent chose a second term for Trump.  ...

Do we have a trace on the contact chain from these two flights from Japan to the current positive testing population? Are they mostly from that source?

 

[frankfurter + 562]

On 3/7/2020 at 9:53 AM, Marcin2 said:

US from 173 to 320 , 127 new cases

China from 80,552 to 80,651, 99 new cases,

Italy from 3,858 to 4,636 , 778 new cases

Again this numbers are nowhere directly presented in headlines.

How important is Dow Jones for Trump administration, that President is questioning World Health Organization death data ?

I am writing about this as it is similar to initial  cover up in China.

Fortunately US has free press so information is provided, but President being too optimistic about dangers could  cause reckless behaviour of US  citizens.

 

"Fortunately US has free press so information is provided".  This is the biggest joke I have heard in decades.  FACT;  the CDC has STOPPED reporting new cases.  The VicePOTUS is delegated to "take charge".  Take charge is a euphemism to control the narrative.  Weeks have passed since cases were detected, and virtually no testing of suspected cases.  The US can process only 70,000 cases IN TOTAL. The fact is the situation is now out of control in the US.  All for the sake your POTUS to secure his re-election.

And you vile people continue to criticise China for withholding information, responding too late, etc, etc.  Yet you accept the same from your POTUS and CDC.  Fact; sufficient information has now been gathered to show the covid19 originated in the USA, not China. 

Warning; the covid19 is coming to your neighbourhood, and soon. 

 

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

Us vile people think frankfurter’s elevator doesn’t go all the way to the top...

[Guillaume Albasini + 851]

Some signs of improvement in China : they are closing the makeshift hospitals  they opened last month.

 

Makeshift hospitals built to treat novel coronavirus infected patients with mild symptoms in Wuhan, Hubei province, the epicenter of the outbreak, are expected to wrap up operation around March 10, China Central Television reported on Sunday.

Since Feb 5, 14 makeshift hospitals in the city have been operating, with the longest running for 33 days, and treating more than 12,000 cases, it said.

As of Sunday afternoon, 11 of the 14 hospitals have suspended operation, with their patients either discharged or transferred to designated hospitals, it said.

https://www.chinadaily.com.cn/a/202003/08/WS5e64f4a8a31012821727d3e2.html

[Marcin2 + 724]

On 3/7/2020 at 2:04 PM, Douglas Buckland said:

No, the worst thing is running around like Chicken Little screaming, “The sky is falling! The sky is falling!”

I think Media , specifically US media did a great job for China, by this kInd of behaviour.

Big headlines that another 100 persons died the previous day, and so on. Italy could not count on this special care, special treatment. I just observed the obvious.

At  a country level, situation in Italy is much worse than ever was in China.

 

[Marcin2 + 724]

On 3/9/2020 at 6:51 AM, frankfurter said:

"Fortunately US has free press so information is provided".  This is the biggest joke I have heard in decades.  FACT;  the CDC has STOPPED reporting new cases.  The VicePOTUS is delegated to "take charge".  Take charge is a euphemism to control the narrative.  Weeks have passed since cases were detected, and virtually no testing of suspected cases.  The US can process only 70,000 cases IN TOTAL. The fact is the situation is now out of control in the US.  All for the sake your POTUS to secure his re-election.

And you vile people continue to criticise China for withholding information, responding too late, etc, etc.  Yet you accept the same from your POTUS and CDC.  Fact; sufficient information has now been gathered to show the covid19 originated in the USA, not China. 

Warning; the covid19 is coming to your neighbourhood, and soon. 

 

We are both Chinese agents, do not remember ?

I am not American.

I am trying to stay neutral.

[Rob Plant + 2,617]

On 3/9/2020 at 5:51 AM, frankfurter said:

And you vile people continue to criticise China for withholding information

Nice to see you're on your A game when it comes to tact and diplomacy Frankfurter (sarc).

I think many, if not all, on this forum have a bias one way or another and you are certainly one of them, as you categorically refuse to ever criticise the CCP in any way. This always weakens your argument.

Personally apart from the distinct possibility of this being caused in a lab in Wuhan. I think the Chinese have taken extraordinary measures to get an element of control on this outbreak and should be applauded for doing so. We will see if Italy's total lock down has the same effect or whether it is too late.

In the UK we have a PM who 1 week says we should shake everybody's hand and then a few days later says expressly not to do so. UK airlines are still flying to Italy and people are coming into the UK with NO testing or quarantine. Meaningless and useless are apparently the UK's response to this. We are still allowing sporting occasions to go ahead (Cheltenham horse racing festival this week, more than 250,000 attending), stupid doesn't come close.

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

Quarantine the horses! They are innocents! Not too concerned about the spectators....

[Guillaume Albasini + 851]

Comparing the curve of the active cases  can give an an idea of where each country is on the bell curve.

  CHINA

SOUTH KOREA

IRAN

FRANCE

ITALY

  USA

SPAIN

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 10, 2020 by Guillaume Albasini

[Marcin2 + 724]

Graphs above by @Guillaume Albasini are the best single piece of information I have read about coronavirus.

They should be on the first page of major news outlets everywhere.

You know your country situation in one glance.

If it could be mixed with number of deaths with right hand scale 1/30 of left hand scale it would also tell a lot about characteristic of epidemic in esch country.

Edited March 11, 2020 by Marcin2
Typo

[Boat + 1,315]

On 3/6/2020 at 10:24 PM, 0R0 said:

I don't really think Americans expect leadership from the political side. The medical side is more important for Americans. The CDC would have been useful if their top layers weren't ancient holdovers from the Obama admin. But they flubbed it badly with bad test kits, a power driven demand to have tests sent to their regional labs and abysmally bad testing guidelines. As I said, they were "not looking".

People are loading up. They went and looked up "corona virus" peaking in early Feb. There is a rush but not a panic for virus related items. Otherwise, people are stocking up on at least 14 days worth of routine supplies to make sure they can avoid needing to go out if there are confirmed cases in their area. Businesses and schools are acting according to their contingency plan when confirmed cases show up in their vicinity. Most have cancelled their employee's travel. Airline tickets are down 20% as of Mar 1 and estimated down over 30% for this weekend. 

Cruise lines will apparently stop embarkations entirely as cancellations are making most scheduled cruises uneconomical. Confereneces are being cancelled, we will see how fast events dine-in restaurants and schools respond. Some have gone to tele-learning already. 

The reason it is not headline news is because the culprits in the failure are at the CDC. Meaning Democratic appointees. Trump's apparent nonchalance not withstanding. There is plenty of criticism of Trump in the media. Second issue is that it is old news. 

 

 

I thought Trump had replaced everyone that is not loyal to him. With every crisis we find more Obama holdovers. 🙃

[frankfurter + 562]

23 hours ago, Rob Plant said:

Nice to see you're on your A game when it comes to tact and diplomacy Frankfurter (sarc).

I think many, if not all, on this forum have a bias one way or another and you are certainly one of them, as you categorically refuse to ever criticise the CCP in any way. This always weakens your argument.

Personally apart from the distinct possibility of this being caused in a lab in Wuhan. I think the Chinese have taken extraordinary measures to get an element of control on this outbreak and should be applauded for doing so. We will see if Italy's total lock down has the same effect or whether it is too late.

In the UK we have a PM who 1 week says we should shake everybody's hand and then a few days later says expressly not to do so. UK airlines are still flying to Italy and people are coming into the UK with NO testing or quarantine. Meaningless and useless are apparently the UK's response to this. We are still allowing sporting occasions to go ahead (Cheltenham horse racing festival this week, more than 250,000 attending), stupid doesn't come close.

Thanks for your recognition and compliment.

You are mistaken to deduce I never criticise the CCP.  Surprised?  But my approach is to use facts, not the hysteria I see from so many on this site. And, I try to focus on the real culprits, not to smear everybody associated.

You cling still to your belief the CCP is responsible for leaking this virus. But nobody has yet cited any proof; maybe there is none for such claim?  You may be surprised to learn a few facts.  Such as, the Wuhan 'lab' comes under the public hospital administration, not the military.  It has no remit for bio-weapons. Bio-weapons are the remit of the military, the world over. 

The strain of what is now called covid19 was, in fact, 1st engineered in the USA, in a military sponsored lab.  It was given to Canada and Australia. Australia tampered with it further to add HIV. It was not given to China. 

In Sept '19, a woman in the US died from symptoms very similar to covid19.  I may say no more about this case.  

In late Oct '19, the world military games were held in Wuhan. The US military competed. 4 US athletes were hospitalised for 2 weeks in Wuhan, saved from near death, for a flu, having the exact same symptoms as covid19.  You can find this story in the media. 

By mid Nov '18, the Wuhan health authority detected an alarming increase in 'flu' cases, but could not determine what this was, as NOBODY in the world had seen this prior and thus no reagent was obtainable that could identify it. Nobody, except the US, who refused to release any reagent to China upon request.  China was left on her own to develop the identification procedure, which took some weeks. By then, the cases began exploding, and the alarm went to the central government, who reacted promptly.  The local government tried to keep a lid on things, to avoid panic, and we can say now they did not do such a great job: but they were truly overwhelmed by this. Mistakes were made, and those responsible have been held under house arrest for now. 

For the athletes, the Wuhan health authority assumed they had a normal strain of corona, as the season in the US was underway, and already the US was reporting deaths. Thus, Wuhan treated the symptoms, as is normal for flus, and did not call for CT scans and extensive blood panels.  The athletes were not placed in isolation wards, and they recovered sufficiently to be air-lifted back to the US, per the instructions of the US military.

Since the outbreak, the information is reported world-wide. In the US, the CDC has stopped reporting cases, and the V-POTUS is assigned to control the narrative. Thus, the US govt is just as reprehensible as any other, even more so, and the continual smearing of China is hypocritical to say the least.

Circumstances allow dots to be connected. "China" is justified to say the covid19 is imported. Wuhan may be the epicentre, the victim, but it is not the origin.  The circumstances surrounding the covid19 connect many dots.  Is this intentional or unintentional?  Will we ever have proof and truth?  Given the implications, those being of war, I rather doubt. Too many parties have too many reasons to see this covered-up and buried. 

The social and economic consequences of this virus may be dire. The West has a very cavalier attitude to this and is totally unprepared for the disaster that awaits.  The US has no national health care system. The vast majority of hospitals are at capacity. The vast majority of people cannot afford the costs of tests or the deductibles. 30% have no insurance. Very few test kits are available currently. The costs in the US are 100x those in China: ponder that for say 10,000 patients. Could the govt build more "clinics" in only 7 days?  Where would the doctors, nurses, techies come from to man the ramparts?  The EU is in even worse condition. What about the poorer countries?  Truly, the reaction to date is too little too late. 

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

Take an Advil and call me in the morning. You’ve got the FLU!