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Anger over four U.S. senators insider trading

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"Many" Americans will be livid when they discover the lives traded off for profiteering during the pandemic.

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Senators and Representatives have been trading from insider information for as long as we've been a Republic. That's one of the few flaws of the Constitution. Since we more or less copied the Magna Carta, I have blamed it. 😃

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6 hours ago, Gerry Maddoux said:

That's one of the few flaws of the Constitution.

It's not a flaw in the Constitution, its a flaw in personal integrity.   We actually have laws against insider trading.  You don't need to be a Executive or employee of the company to be guilty of "insider" trading.   The only requirement is that you acted on information in your possession that was not available to the general public.  Those in Congress can be prosecuted if the Justice Department can make the case.

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9 hours ago, Geoff Guenther said:

"Many" Americans will be livid when they discover the lives traded off for profiteering during the pandemic.

That's funny!   The media will make it a thing, but the rank and file American will complain as they pop open another beer. Being the apathetic lemmings we are, no social response will become of it.

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It didn't take an insider to know when to sell.  I got out of the market (actually entered tight stop-loss orders)  when I learned that a.) people could be asymptomatic and infectious for 14 days;  b.) China locked down their second largest city in the hopes of containment. 

China is the second largest economy and the worlds manufacturing center.   How much more did you need to know before deducing the infection is coming your way AND economic ripples will go around world.

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(edited)

7 hours ago, Gerry Maddoux said:

Senators and Representatives have been trading from insider information for as long as we've been a Republic. That's one of the few flaws of the Constitution. Since we more or less copied the Magna Carta, I have blamed it. 😃

The insider information trades should be illegal for the House, Senate, President and all government insiders at any level. It is already for the common citizen. Our public servants have largely become our public masters. This needs to be changed. We should all be sick of our politicians, at all levels, becoming rich in office. There are many other ways that graft is paid for favors also. 

Possibly we could come up with a system that thoroughly evaluates a politician and his family's wealth before, during, and after holding office. Often promises are made for favors after a public employee resigns. Often those promises just involve a very lucrative position in an industry associated with what the employee or politician regulated. 

Peter Schweizer has written several books on public corruption and seems to be the foremost expert on it. http://peterschweizer.com/

The Government Accountability Institute also. http://www.g-a-i.org/

 

Edited by ronwagn
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The corruption that is going to play out during this pandemic will be mind blowing, I want to know when was first case and why that Country did not respond to the World, Would also like to know about the ongoing hacking issues!

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4 minutes ago, RichieRich216 said:

The corruption that is going to play out during this pandemic will be mind blowing, I want to know when was first case and why that Country did not respond to the World, Would also like to know about the ongoing hacking issues!

Which hacking issues in particular?

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I arranged to sell all my remaining stock back in November but it took until mid January to wrap everything up. I'm not going to claim I brilliantly saw all this coming, I just thought I'd had a pretty good run and it was time to take profits off the table. I moved everything into annuities and even though the returns are low, the floor is high, considering those equities are down about 50% now. 

As for this being insider trading, if the senators knew that Covid19 was going to cause governors to shut down entire states then they had inside info. If they suspected things were going to go to hell in a hand basket, well they weren't alone and the info was out there. 

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^

Good answer. You were smart, and they may have been too. 

Annuities mean that you have a great concept in your head about living a long time. I have never had that. 

But you're right, the wealth destruction going on right now is something much worse than 2008 . . . may be because of the contagion.

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8 hours ago, George8944 said:

It's not a flaw in the Constitution, its a flaw in personal integrity.   We actually have laws against insider trading.  You don't need to be a Executive or employee of the company to be guilty of "insider" trading.   The only requirement is that you acted on information in your possession that was not available to the general public.  Those in Congress can be prosecuted if the Justice Department can make the case.

I would say that insider trading should be legalized. The lack of the old steady leak of inside information pre-insider trading restrictions has led to great volatility and a lack of market indications preceding a public disclosure of unpredictable news. As a result, market intelligence firms employ high tech methods at very high prices to gain insight from outside. Including satellite reconnaissance counting cars in retail parking lots to predict sales, and offices to see hiring.  Stalking swanky meeting places with facial recognition software on cameras to see who is meeting with whom to predict deals. These services are so expensive even fund managers for pension funds can't afford them, only the hefty fee structure of hedge funds can pay for that. It is less fair than insider trading. 

Fiduciary duty breaches in disclosure of proprietary information is one thing, and if it isn't theft, it is a civil matter between the company and its leaky employees. It should really be taken off the criminal law books entirely.

More information is better for investors. Insider trading law is doing the exact opposite, and limits freedom of speech and association. Finally, it does not prevent insider trading, as insiders routinely buy and sell stock based on their internal knowledge and file reports after the fact. It only provides "chosen" insiders with the privilege of acting on inside information. Insider trading laws are a punishment for the investing public, and a privilege for insiders.

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(edited)

Okay, but wouldn’t this simply put politicians and ‘captains of industry’ in the drivers seat as they would have more access to market intelligence than anyone else?

Edited by Douglas Buckland
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6 hours ago, 0R0 said:

I would say that insider trading should be legalized.

You said a lot that I agree and disagree with.   I agree that the more information that is public, the better it is.  However,  there will ALWAYS be insider information.   In the minutes prior to making a public announcement somebody knows what will be announced before everyone else. That moment is long enough to place a buy (or sell) order on your brokers mobile app.  Short of a universal Vulcan mind meld, it's impossible to not have some level of hidden knowledge for a period of time.

I'm in technical sales (test instrumentation) and over the years I have been privy to many new products coming to market.  Unfortunely, here in the rustbelt, by the time a new idea is in production,  it's in the news.   My collegues in Silicon Valley don't have said problem.

The downside of universal information are law suites.  If a company announces they are working on plans or releasing a new gizmo, and fails to do so,  they can and do get sued by people who placed their bet and lost.  They accuse the company of false and misleading information. Also in my job I've seen many ideas get scrubbed after a year or more of development because they learn the product can't be made economically enough to go to market.

I'm on the fence regarding criminal vs civil prosecution.  I think I mostly agree that for  "small" stuff it should be a civil matter.  However a leak could do serious and irreputable damage to a company.  Such damage is a kin to other white collar crimes that are prosecuted in criminal court.

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On 3/20/2020 at 1:36 PM, canadas canadas said:

Many Americans are very angry over four U.S. senators insider trading stocks after receiving information on CV before stock prices collapsed.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8132245/GOP-senator-gave-dire-coronavirus-warning-heeled-constituents-Capitol-Hill-social-club.html

"All animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others"

True in any oligarchy (like United States) or autocracy (like China).

You cannot do anything about it US Constitution is dead.

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23 hours ago, Gerry Maddoux said:

Senators and Representatives have been trading from insider information for as long as we've been a Republic. That's one of the few flaws of the Constitution. Since we more or less copied the Magna Carta, I have blamed it. 😃

Can you elaborate on the Magna Carta may be fun while we’re locked down 👍🏻👍🏻

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On 3/21/2020 at 11:54 AM, Marcin2 said:

You cannot do anything about it US Constitution is dead.

That's exactly what they want you to believe.   It will die when people stop asserting its use and acquiese to tyranny.   We stopped fighting for and defending our freedoms.   We are an apathetic lot.

"The Only Thing Necessary for the Triumph of Evil is that Good Men Do Nothing"     

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