How China Is Racing To Expand Its Global Energy Influence

[Meredith Poor + 883]

"Under Xi Jinping, China has made huge inroads into global power markets, in large part thanks to Beijing’s assertive Belt and Road Initiative announced in 2013. This global infrastructure development program involves Chinese investment in around 70 countries and international organizations."

'Energy influence' is a bit different from 'energy supplier'. One action China has taken recently is to stop coal imports from Australia. This is 'influence', but only as a dominant consumer. This is an attempt by China to punish Australia for a specific policy. All this does is expose Australia's vulnerability to blackmail, something its citizens and government will probably seek to avoid in the future by making various adaptations. All this demonstrates is the value of having a diverse collection of allies.

"China’s overseas Belt and Road Initiative (BRI) poses a direct threat to meeting global climate change and greenhouse gas emissions goals.... ...the RBI initiative can be seen as a workaround for China to continue to talk the talk about cleaning up its emissions act while getting rich off of dirtying the air in other countries."

Countries like the US, Britain, and those in Europe essentially 'export' their pollution by having things made in China. How China is going to 'export' pollution to other countries by offshoring work raises the question of 'who is a bigger polluter than China'. About the only realistic candidate is India. The two of them aren't getting along, if anyone noticed. The countries along China's border, including Pakistan, Russia, India, Kazakhstan, and Bangladesh tend to be careless about pollution, however some if not most of them are in some state of conflict with China. Perhaps we're talking about Africa.

Realistically, one of the most desirable exports to third world countries coming out of China is solar panels. This might be 'influential', however panels tend to lower dependencies of all kinds, ultimately reducing anyone's influence over foreign governments or societies.

[frankfurter + 562]

uh, other than your feeble attempt to smear China, what is your point?

Border disputes?  All so-called disputes are the result of prior colonial powers taking lands away from China by force and unilaterally declaring borders: like the artificial borders in Africa today. If I came with my band of thugs to your property, skewered your wife, burned down your home, imprisoned you, and declared all your property to be my own, would you not seek the means to regain? If you die, would not your offspring?

China resolved all land borders except for India. India refuses to resolve, despite 60 years of invitations from China. India's border claims with China really have no basis. The border was decreed unilaterally by the Brits, after the Brits subjugated the various kingdoms within the India subcontinent, and long before India became a country. The Brits included lands taken from China.  China never accepted. No treaties were signed. In 1962, India attacked China over India's claims, and China repelled Indian forces into a rout. A key fact; China returned occupied lands to India, with certain understandings. A LAC was established, agreed by both sides. India has since reneged. The de facto border is the LAC. If India were to accept the LAC as the de jure border, the dispute would be resolved instantly.

 

[Meredith Poor + 883]

1 hour ago, frankfurter said:

uh, other than your feeble attempt to smear China, what is your point?

Border disputes?  All so-called disputes are the result of prior colonial powers taking lands away from China by force and unilaterally declaring borders: like the artificial borders in Africa today. If I came with my band of thugs to your property, skewered your wife, burned down your home, imprisoned you, and declared all your property to be my own, would you not seek the means to regain? If you die, would not your offspring?

China resolved all land borders except for India. India refuses to resolve, despite 60 years of invitations from China. India's border claims with China really have no basis. The border was decreed unilaterally by the Brits, after the Brits subjugated the various kingdoms within the India subcontinent, and long before India became a country. The Brits included lands taken from China.  China never accepted. No treaties were signed. In 1962, India attacked China over India's claims, and China repelled Indian forces into a rout. A key fact; China returned occupied lands to India, with certain understandings. A LAC was established, agreed by both sides. India has since reneged. The de facto border is the LAC. If India were to accept the LAC as the de jure border, the dispute would be resolved instantly.

 

Sounds like trolling. I seem to be a magnet for flamers.

There is blog post on the OilPrice main page with the above title. It quotes someone who is asserting China will shift it's manufacturing to other countries in order to reduce pollution within China. I just don't see how China is going to off-shore manufacturing in any meaningful way, whether or not it does so to countries that pollute more than it does, or will in the future.

[frankfurter + 562]

1 hour ago, Meredith Poor said:

Sounds like trolling. I seem to be a magnet for flamers.

There is blog post on the OilPrice main page with the above title. It quotes someone who is asserting China will shift it's manufacturing to other countries in order to reduce pollution within China. I just don't see how China is going to off-shore manufacturing in any meaningful way, whether or not it does so to countries that pollute more than it does, or will in the future.

uh, let me guess.. you are American, no?  Like others here, you cannot respond to anyone without first insulting them?

 

[Meredith Poor + 883]

11 hours ago, frankfurter said:

uh, other than your feeble attempt to smear China, what is your point?

What was this?

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

12 minutes ago, Meredith Poor said:

What was this?

LSD

[0R0 + 6,251]

10 hours ago, frankfurter said:

uh, let me guess.. you are American, no?  Like others here, you cannot respond to anyone without first insulting them?

 

Calls it like it is.

China smearing is legitimate so long as the CCP occupies China.

[RichieRich216 + 454]

A trained MONKEY would be a good replacement! Anybody or anything but Cris (  can’t fill daddy’s shoes ) Wallace really showed his ass!

[shadowkin + 584]

I think China has a bigger problem and that's figuring out how to feed it's population as their diet becomes more Westernized. This also feeds into the pollution aspect due to overuse of fertilizer and chemicals to squeeze out bigger yields.

I would be surprised if they off shored manufacturing in any meaningful way if for no other reason than the CCP is loathe to have millions of unemployed or who now must take lower paying jobs once manufacturing leaves.

[shadowkin + 584]

On 11/9/2020 at 1:55 AM, frankfurter said:

Border disputes?

China has border disputes because she is a colonial power that wants more land and sea because she sees it as her right as a great power. Her latest target is Tajikistan. Afaik no former colonial power had anything to do with that. The former colonial powers are gone but 100 years from now you'll still blame them.

[shadowkin + 584]

On 11/9/2020 at 1:55 AM, frankfurter said:

China resolved all land borders except for India.

How convenient to restrict to land borders. You really don't want people to know about the South China Sea and 9 dash line. I want to see you twist yourself in knots blaming this on former colonial powers.

[frankfurter + 562]

3 hours ago, shadowkin said:

China has border disputes because she is a colonial power that wants more land and sea because she sees it as her right as a great power. Her latest target is Tajikistan. Afaik no former colonial power had anything to do with that. The former colonial powers are gone but 100 years from now you'll still blame them.

You and others at this site really should stop fomenting LIES and bring yourselves up to date.

Fact; the Tajikistan-China border was resolved by Treaty during 2011. The disputed lands were allocated 96% to Tajikistan and 4% to China.

96 is a far far greater number than 4, thus to claim China is expansionist is yet another lie.

Again, the only de jure land border in dispute is with India, and only a part of the total border is disputed. India refuses to come to the negotiating table, thus the dispute continues. If India were to accept the de facto border as the de jure border, the situation would be resolved immediately, awaiting only completion formalities.

 

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,537]

That border dispute really is a confusing issue, it seems China has enough going on without a skirmish over a hilly terrain of no value. Stumbling over dollars to pick up dimes?

[frankfurter + 562]

3 hours ago, shadowkin said:

How convenient to restrict to land borders. You really don't want people to know about the South China Sea and 9 dash line. I want to see you twist yourself in knots blaming this on former colonial powers.

Incorrect. I do want people to know the history for what the west calls the 9-dash line; why China makes claims; and what is the nature of the claims.

Be honest: what do you know about the history? The history is long and detailed, and willfully ignored by westerners, yet the western colonial powers are directly responsible.

Discourse requires the other party to be learned, open minded, and rational; which cannot be assumed respecting Americans today.

 

 

 

[frankfurter + 562]

41 minutes ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

That border dispute really is a confusing issue, it seems China has enough going on without a skirmish over a hilly terrain of no value. Stumbling over dollars to pick up dimes?

I presume you mean the India-China border?  In which case, you should know India is aided and abetted by the USA?  Which raises the question: why is the USA involved in a dispute between 2 sovereign nations?

PLEASE ANSWER THIS QUESTION....

Fact: Post 1962 'war', China RETURNED THE OCCUPIED LANDS to India. So, how can anybody claim China is expansionist?

 

 

Edited November 12, 2020 by frankfurter

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,537]

37 minutes ago, frankfurter said:

I presume you mean the India-China border?  In which case, you should know India is aided and abetted by the USA?  Which raises the question: why is the USA involved in a dispute between 2 sovereign nations?

PLEASE ANSWER THIS QUESTION....

Fact: Post 1962 'war', China RETURNED THE OCCUPIED LANDS to India. So, how can anybody claim China is expansionist?

 

 

Yes i do mean China, as to our meddeling im sure there are quite a few of Obama's left over's that believe they are doing the right thing. Trumps involvement??? he is not that trival...its all about what makes sense....

Seriously China could be on the cuspid of greatness if they would just get there act together, this i can tell you if the US was allowed to import grain, oil, LNG...etc etc etc we US citizens would be rich..So the million dollar question why do you not turn your energy money and development towards your own people....The potential staggers the mind.

Edited November 12, 2020 by Eyes Wide Open

[shadowkin + 584]

2 hours ago, frankfurter said:

You and others at this site really should stop fomenting LIES and bring yourselves up to date.

Fact; the Tajikistan-China border was resolved by Treaty during 2011. The disputed lands were allocated 96% to Tajikistan and 4% to China.

96 is a far far greater number than 4, thus to claim China is expansionist is yet another lie.

It is you who needs to bring yourself up to date and stop telling lies. From the article:

Recently, official Chinese outlets relentlessly republished an article written by a Chinese historian, Cho Yao Lu, several times. The provocative article titled “Tajikistan Initiated the Transfer to China of Its Land and the Lost Mountains of the Pamir Were Returned to Their True Master.”

This is how it starts, with propaganda. Then it escalates to debt trap or military force to acquire territory. Now China wants 45%. Greater than 0 is expansionism by definition no matter how small.

https://tfipost.com/2020/08/china-claims-half-of-tajikistan-after-south-china-sea-and-himalayas-chinese-expansionism-hits-central-asia/

[shadowkin + 584]

1 hour ago, frankfurter said:

Discourse requires the other party to be learned, open minded, and rational; which cannot be assumed respecting Americans today.

You've repeatedly shown yourself to be ignorant and hypocritical so you cannot be learned or rational.

[frankfurter + 562]

57 minutes ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

Yes i do mean China, as to our meddeling im sure there are quite a few of Obama's left over's that believe they are doing the right thing. Trumps involvement??? he is not that trival...its all about what makes sense....

Seriously China could be on the cuspid of greatness if they would just get there act together, this i can tell you if the US was allowed to import grain, oil, LNG...etc etc etc we US citizens would be rich..So the million dollar question why do you not turn your energy money and development towards your own people....The potential staggers the mind.

at times difficult to comprehend your writing.  do you mean US exports? 

China IS getting its act together, to use your parlance. In only 30 years, China has become world 2nd largest economy and power, and 1st economy if measured in PPP terms. By every education metric, China now far surpasses any other country.  And, China has done this without a world war; the US needed WW2 to destroy Europe and usurp great Britain - think about it. China's accomplishments to date are unprecedented in world history, for their speed and depth.

Agree, the potential staggers the mind. Which is why the USA is now fighting a full-spectrum war, short of a hot war, to control China and ensure USA the exceptional, the MAGA, whatever; though the attempt is feeble.

You Americans are being deprived of enormous wealth to be derived from trade with China. Your handlers complain about a trade imbalance, yet do everything to prolong and ensure it. For example; China needs LNG, and the USA could supply great quantities, which by itself could dramatically alter the trade balance. But you continue to weaponise your currency and act in very hostile manner to China, thus deliberately preventing China from engaging. Thus other countries, like Qatar, benefit at your expense: well, actually, a very few 'oligarchs' benefit. This is all by design, which you do not see. I have stated repeatedly, your enemies are within.

 

 

 

[frankfurter + 562]

8 hours ago, shadowkin said:

It is you who needs to bring yourself up to date and stop telling lies. From the article:

Recently, official Chinese outlets relentlessly republished an article written by a Chinese historian, Cho Yao Lu, several times. The provocative article titled “Tajikistan Initiated the Transfer to China of Its Land and the Lost Mountains of the Pamir Were Returned to Their True Master.”

This is how it starts, with propaganda. Then it escalates to debt trap or military force to acquire territory. Now China wants 45%. Greater than 0 is expansionism by definition no matter how small.

https://tfipost.com/2020/08/china-claims-half-of-tajikistan-after-south-china-sea-and-himalayas-chinese-expansionism-hits-central-asia

Only an idiot would confuse a one-person historian with the incumbent government. You think a lone historian can direct a government and by himself unilaterally alter a treaty?

When you display some intelligence and knowledge, we can attempt discourse. 

 

 

Edited November 12, 2020 by Selva
Inappropriate language

[shadowkin + 584]

4 minutes ago, frankfurter said:

You must be an idiot.  Only an idiot would confuse a one-person historian with the incumbent government. You think a lone historian can direct a government and by himself unilaterally alter a treaty?

Again displaying your ignorance and hypocrisy but at this point it's willful stupidity This article was published several times by several outlets. That doesn't happen unless the CCP allows it. It's clearly part of their propaganda effort in the same way they come up with fake maps to justify claims on other lands.

Edited November 12, 2020 by shadowkin

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,537]

33 minutes ago, frankfurter said:

at times difficult to comprehend your writing.  do you mean US exports? 

China IS getting its act together, to use your parlance. In only 30 years, China has become world 2nd largest economy and power, and 1st economy if measured in PPP terms. By every education metric, China now far surpasses any other country.  And, China has done this without a world war; the US needed WW2 to destroy Europe and usurp great Britain - think about it. China's accomplishments to date are unprecedented in world history, for their speed and depth.

Agree, the potential staggers the mind. Which is why the USA is now fighting a full-spectrum war, short of a hot war, to control China and ensure USA the exceptional, the MAGA, whatever; though the attempt is feeble.

You Americans are being deprived of enormous wealth to be derived from trade with China. Your handlers complain about a trade imbalance, yet do everything to prolong and ensure it. For example; China needs LNG, and the USA could supply great quantities, which by itself could dramatically alter the trade balance. But you continue to weaponise your currency and act in very hostile manner to China, thus deliberately preventing China from engaging. Thus other countries, like Qatar, benefit at your expense: well, actually, a very few 'oligarchs' benefit. This is all by design, which you do not see. I have stated repeatedly, your enemies are within.

 

 

 

A question if i may, do you adhere to half truths? America devalues your currency? Plz elaborate!

[Boat + 1,315]

China will implode under its desire to control rather than flourish under common trade and freemarket principles.

[frankfurter + 562]

3 hours ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

A question if i may, do you adhere to half truths? America devalues your currency? Plz elaborate!

Currency?  Have you read any books by Rickards?  Do you or any other American ever review history?

Trump has, incessantly, claimed China has steadily devalued its currency. Would you agree; if a country's currency devalues vis a vis to the USD, then more of that country's currency is needed to buy USD? Let's assume you agree, ok?

So let's look at history. ok?   The symbol for China's currency is CNY (despite its true name of RMB).

In 1995, the Fx rate of CNY : USD was 13.23 : 1.00.

In 2020, the Fx rate of CNY : USD is 6.65 : 1.00

uh, the CNY is not 'devaluated' (Trump's word). The USD is 'devaluated'.  So who is waging the currency war?

 

Edited November 12, 2020 by frankfurter
typo

[frankfurter + 562]

56 minutes ago, Boat said:

China will implode under its desire to control rather than flourish under common trade and freemarket principles.

spoken like a true blue ignorant yank.  anybody who claims 'freemarket' is an ignoramus.  even your spelling is ignorant. in a 'free market', Iran and Venezuela would be selling their oil, in mega quantities, unhindered.