Should Trump pardon Julian Assange ? How about Snowden ?

[Roch + 537]

What do you think ?  I believe 

Edited December 20, 2020 by Roch

[El Nikko + 2,145]

Yes

[Tomasz + 1,608]

Let me put it this way - in my opinion, releasing Assange would be a nice propaganda move.

Recently I watched an interview on the BBC with Aliyev satrap of Azerbaijan after a war with Armenia.

The BBC journalist asked Aliyev why you have censorship in your country.

And Aliyev a dictator but by no means stupid man, answered her that Britain, which imprisons a journalist for his views, will not lecture Azeri about freedom of speech. Journalist was really shocked and didnt know what to say. This fragment was cut from interviev but some russian trolls made a good use of it.

I would only add  that this  excerpt was  was seemingly a hit on Russian twitter a few weeks ago.

Because when you really persecute well-known Assange for years,  you are not really credible to me, defending journalists all over the world who are more politically suited to you.

Sure, Assange's methods were highly controversial.

Only really, because of all these real or alleged miracles over the ballot box in the USA and the persecution of Assange over the years in the USA, Great Britain and the USA, it is very easy target to hit with hostile propaganda, the more so because for a long time both these countries were poorly coping with the coronavirus pandemic.

Edited December 20, 2020 by Tomasz

[Tomasz + 1,608]

I'm not a fan of Aliyev either, but I think it's worth watching how he dealt with a BBC journalist asking him very embarrassing questions.

Once upon a time there was comedy corner here and in my opinion it is suitable because he is not really a stupid person.

As far as I know he worked as history professor in Moscow State University in the 90s before his father decided he should took power from him.
I always like when a heat public dispute arises  and someone uses something very strongly politically incorrect as an argument, such as in the case of the UK and BBC Prisoner of Belmash.
Although I would have probably gone from even a thicker pipe and reminded the infamous monster Jimi Savile to an aggressive BBC journalist.

If someone has not heard of him, it is worth reading about it because it is really the biggest disgrace of the BBC, at least after the Second World War.

But generally this is how you schooled a biased journalist and she has been dressed for all winter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Savile

Edited December 20, 2020 by Tomasz

[Tomasz + 1,608]

 

Continuing the BBC thread, I recommend something more from last week

 This version of the BBC journalist's conversation with Putin was posted on YouTube by the BBC - as you can see its 2,51 minutes long

 So lets see original discussion - its only 9,38 minutes long

So basically BBC made from 9,38 minutes discussion a cut version with Putin arguments totally out of context. 

Probably because Putin is well-know master of such discussions and totally owned BBC reporter. You may hate him but this is old KGB school.

So as Trump said its all fake news.

Edited December 21, 2020 by Tomasz

[Tomasz + 1,608]

 

I would not pardon Snowden, if I were you.

Have you ever wondered where all the latest successes of Russian or Chinese hackers come from?

I think because Snowden, one of the best IT specialists in the American secret services, betrayed all secretly American IT informations to the Russians. And they reveal some of them to the Chinese.

He is, in my opinion in a final  result  a worse traitor  than the famous Aldrich Ames who pulled back American intelligence in the USSR by some 30 years.

It was probably a very short conversation, no torture was needed.

A short conversation - either you reveal to us all the secrets of American intelligence so probably as a result some also to the Chinese, or we send you on the first plane to the USA where you will probably spend the rest of your life in prison.

So I would not completely condemn a man in his situation, but it is, after all, a traitor rather than an American hero.

In fact, in my opinion, the Americans should have sent some killer to eliminate him before he revealed all the greatest IT secrets of the American services.

Of course, not now, because I think he probably doesn't know anything interesting what he hasn't said.

Of course, some idealists may still believe that the heroic Snowde did not reveal all the secrets of American intelligence to the Russians and the Chinese during his many years in Russia.

However, I do not believe in such miracles.

Edited December 21, 2020 by Tomasz

[Wombat + 1,028]

Of course Trump should pardon Assange and Snowden. Without Assange, we would not know why USA failed in Iraq. Without Snowden, we would not know why it so easy for China and Russia to spy on us all. They were both just whistleblowers, alerting us to the mistakes of the deep state, aka: "The Swamp". The sooner we get to hear their sides to the story, the better.

[Tomasz + 1,608]

I personally have nothing against Snowden, and he has done an excellent job of revealing the magnitude of world surveillance.
  But do you really think it is a good idea to pardon someone who probably revealed to the Russians all the technological secrets of American intelligence?
Those Russians who eavesdrop on their SOMR program exactly like the Americans. There is such a general surveillance program probably less effective due to the technological backwardness of the Russians, but the intentions are exactly the same.

[El Nikko + 2,145]

On 12/20/2020 at 11:41 PM, Tomasz said:

I'm not a fan of Aliyev either, but I think it's worth watching how he dealt with a BBC journalist asking him very embarrassing questions.

Once upon a time there was comedy corner here and in my opinion it is suitable because he is not really a stupid person.

As far as I know he worked as history professor in Moscow State University in the 90s before his father decided he should took power from him.
I always like when a heat public dispute arises  and someone uses something very strongly politically incorrect as an argument, such as in the case of the UK and BBC Prisoner of Belmash.
Although I would have probably gone from even a thicker pipe and reminded the infamous monster Jimi Savile to an aggressive BBC journalist.

If someone has not heard of him, it is worth reading about it because it is really the biggest disgrace of the BBC, at least after the Second World War.

But generally this is how you schooled a biased journalist and she has been dressed for all winter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Savile

The BBC is a massive joke and they are losing their revenue as thousands of people are refusing to pay for this ridiculous propaganda.

[El Nikko + 2,145]

On 12/21/2020 at 2:34 PM, Tomasz said:

 

I would not pardon Snowden, if I were you.

Have you ever wondered where all the latest successes of Russian or Chinese hackers come from?

I think because Snowden, one of the best IT specialists in the American secret services, betrayed all secretly American IT informations to the Russians. And they reveal some of them to the Chinese.

He is, in my opinion in a final  result  a worse traitor  than the famous Aldrich Ames who pulled back American intelligence in the USSR by some 30 years.

It was probably a very short conversation, no torture was needed.

A short conversation - either you reveal to us all the secrets of American intelligence so probably as a result some also to the Chinese, or we send you on the first plane to the USA where you will probably spend the rest of your life in prison.

So I would not completely condemn a man in his situation, but it is, after all, a traitor rather than an American hero.

In fact, in my opinion, the Americans should have sent some killer to eliminate him before he revealed all the greatest IT secrets of the American services.

Of course, not now, because I think he probably doesn't know anything interesting what he hasn't said.

Of course, some idealists may still believe that the heroic Snowde did not reveal all the secrets of American intelligence to the Russians and the Chinese during his many years in Russia.

However, I do not believe in such miracles.

I do not agree with this one bit

Snowden did not actually release information that put anyone at harm he merely told the public that we were under mass surveillance and that all of our electronic communications were stored, logged and processed by AI.

Many of us knew this already but for anyone who loves freedom should respect Snowden.

The 'west' is (was) supposed to be the beacon of democracy and we are nothing of the sort today....if the west cannot be that anymore then it needs to die and be recreated.

Come to the UK and see what kind of liberties you have now...Christmas has been cancelled for no reason.

[Wombat + 1,028]

On 12/22/2020 at 10:44 PM, Tomasz said:

I personally have nothing against Snowden, and he has done an excellent job of revealing the magnitude of world surveillance.
  But do you really think it is a good idea to pardon someone who probably revealed to the Russians all the technological secrets of American intelligence?
Those Russians who eavesdrop on their SOMR program exactly like the Americans. There is such a general surveillance program probably less effective due to the technological backwardness of the Russians, but the intentions are exactly the same.

I read Snowden's book, and the one thing that stood out to me was not about citizen privacy, it was the National Security threat. An "own goal". What it revealed is that no country is safe, except China. Perhaps Iran and North Korea too. Only closed societies are able to defend against a massive cyber-attack. The IOT (internet of things) is only gonna make the situation worse. I can understand why so many Americans have become preppers. Snowden revealed just how weak our systems have become, and the election fraud in the USA is a very bad omen IMHO. I have a sixth sense for trouble, can smell it coming a mile off. Make no mistake, the globalists are taking advantage of the chaos caused by covid, all part of the "shock therapy", that Naomi Klein wrote about some years ago. There is going to be some kind of "reckoning" soon, dunno what form it will take, but when the ECB and PBOC introduce digital currencies, you know "the Great Reset" is gonna hurt? Where it all goes, nobody knows, but you can be sure that not many people will be spared.

[notsonice + 1,069]

On 12/22/2020 at 2:15 PM, El Nikko said:

I do not agree with this one bit

Snowden did not actually release information that put anyone at harm he merely told the public that we were under mass surveillance and that all of our electronic communications were stored, logged and processed by AI.

Many of us knew this already but for anyone who loves freedom should respect Snowden.

The 'west' is (was) supposed to be the beacon of democracy and we are nothing of the sort today....if the west cannot be that anymore then it needs to die and be recreated.

Come to the UK and see what kind of liberties you have now...Christmas has been cancelled for no reason.

Anyone that believes he did not put anyone at harm is a fool, You? In my book those who respect Snowden are worms. I hope Snowden ends up in our best prison in Cuba with the other terrorists he has helped.

In March 2014, Army General Martin Dempsey, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, told the House Armed Services Committee, "The vast majority of the documents that Snowden ... exfiltrated from our highest levels of security ... had nothing to do with exposing government oversight of domestic activities. The vast majority of those were related to our military capabilities, operations, tactics, techniques and procedures."^[113] When asked in a May 2014 interview to quantify the number of documents Snowden stole, retired NSA director Keith Alexander said there was no accurate way of counting what he took, but Snowden may have downloaded more than a million documents.^[114] The September 15, 2016 HPSCI report^[105] estimated the number of downloaded documents at 1.5 million.

In a 2013 Associated Press interview, Glenn Greenwald stated ^[115]

"In order to take documents with him that proved that what he was saying was true he had to take ones that included very sensitive, detailed blueprints of how the NSA does what they do."

Thus the Snowden documents allegedly contained sensitive NSA blueprints detailing how the NSA operates, and which would allow someone who read them to evade or even duplicate NSA surveillance.

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,539]

Frankly let them both loose, full pardons. I grow tired of the little chicken shit games being played. And it runs rampart thru out the worlds governing bodies.

Frankly i really do miss Mr. Jan Van Eck....he was actually able to articulate in a manner that was not so harsh...yet his conclusions were devastating....

Edited January 1, 2021 by Eyes Wide Open

[Wombat + 1,028]

On 12/23/2020 at 7:15 AM, El Nikko said:

I do not agree with this one bit

Snowden did not actually release information that put anyone at harm he merely told the public that we were under mass surveillance and that all of our electronic communications were stored, logged and processed by AI.

Many of us knew this already but for anyone who loves freedom should respect Snowden.

The 'west' is (was) supposed to be the beacon of democracy and we are nothing of the sort today....if the west cannot be that anymore then it needs to die and be recreated.

Come to the UK and see what kind of liberties you have now...Christmas has been cancelled for no reason.

You might want to watch this:

Catherine Austin Fitts Full Interview Planet Lockdown - YouTube