GREEN NEW DEAL = BLIZZARD OF LIES

[ronwagn + 6,290]

10 hours ago, Eric Gagen said:

Repeat this slowly after me:  never purchase a vehicle from General Motors.  Their build quality is dubious at best, and they take design and engineering shortcuts to save money It doesn’t matter what the specifications are on paper, because if it comes from GM there is an excellent chance that it won’t meet those specifications, or have other subtle problems that aren’t on the spec sheets.

I once had a used station wagon from GM. the worst problem it had was the fabric ceiling liner raining old foam particles on my head. My big Ford Wagon was great until I ran into a deer and they totaled it. I think Ford designed their valves to wear out after 140,000 miles. I am really not very knowledgeable about engines to tell you the truth. 😉 I used to consider myself a Ford guy, then I discoverd Nissans and Hyundais etc. 

[Ecocharger + 1,374]

Here is the bottom line on the energy crisis...the public panic and green mania which has gripped the minds of politicians and activists has produced plans of attack on the oil industry and oil pipelines. This in turn has chilled investment into future oil production and pipelines, and has already choked the supply of oil to American consumers. Economic death by self-strangulation. 

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Crude-Oil/Moodys-Oil-Industry-Must-Spend-542-Billion-To-Avoid-Supply-Shock.html

"This year, spending is expected at $352 billion, while medium-term annual investment has to grow to $542 billion to keep with the demand returning from the pandemic slump, according to Moody’s.

“The industry will need to spend significantly more, especially if oil and gas demand keeps climbing beyond pre-pandemic levels through 2025,” Moody’s analysts wrote in the report, as carried by Bloomberg.

Underinvestment in upstream projects is a major wild card for oil markets going forward, analysts and industry officials say.

The oil industry is “massively underinvesting” in supply to meet growing demand, which is set to return to pre-COVID levels as soon as the end of 2021 or early 2022, Greg Hill, president of U.S. oil producer Hess Corp, said last week.

Last year, global upstream investment sank to a 15-year low of $350 billion, down from around $600 billion before the pandemic, according to estimates by Wood Mackenzie from earlier this year."

Edited October 8, 2021 by Ecocharger

[Ecocharger + 1,374]

On 10/6/2021 at 9:32 PM, nsdp said:

We are going to have to change your ID to horse manure spreader, You have posted links to  teh Friendswood Journal(Link through O&G Links)l and Bloomberg. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-02-20/a-giant-flaw-in-texas-blackouts-it-cut-power-to-gas-supplies . There is no OFFICAL REPORT at freighter the PUCT who posted this to warn every one and with 72 hours notice they still screwed up or the RRCI  the RRC

  Apparently you don't know the difference between  an official record published in the Texas Registerhttps://www.sos.texas.gov/texreg/index.shtml. and some one with link from a local yokel newspaper

A little slow, nsdp...NG pipelines are a central part of the NG backup system, so your point is, as usual, off the mark.

[Rob Plant + 2,601]

On 10/6/2021 at 9:42 PM, Ecocharger said:

That has already been dealt with. The problem is that there is no way to distinguish how much of the greenhouse effect is due to CO2 and how much is due to CFC-related gases, some of which are 55,000 times more potent than CO2 as greenhouse gases. The models relied upon for these data fail to separate the two effects, so the models are not functional in an analytical context.

Indeed there are, and many of these last much much longer in the atmosphere.

Check out this bad boy!

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021/04/we-need-to-replace-the-worlds-most-potent-greenhouse-gas/

[Ecocharger + 1,374]

Restrictions on banks with respect to energy sector investments have created an energy undersupply crisis in a short period of time, thanks to the drastic changes in U.S. energy policies. The markets will only worsen going forward.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Natural-Gas/Record-High-Natural-Gas-Prices-Will-Send-Oil-Demand-Even-Higher.html

"Yet, another report, also by Reuters, said that other analysts expected a lot of gas-to-oil switching this winter, which would drive oil prices higher and drive some UK energy suppliers out of business. "This has never happened before at such a global scale. The market has always tried to substitute from costly oil to much cheaper natural gas," Reuters quoted a SEB commodity analyst as saying. Now the tables have turned, and both commodities are soaring amid not only forecasts for a cold winter, however inaccurate they might be at this point in time, but also expectations for higher energy demand during this winter season. Meanwhile, supply remains tight. OPEC+ refused to boost production by more than 400,000 bpd monthly. Russia's President Vladimir Putin said the country will step up gas deliveries to Europe, but some analysts doubt that it has the capacity to do so, even if it is willing to do it without expecting concessions in return, which is likely. "Currently, the Russian domestic gas market remains tight, with its inventories running low, output already near its peak and winter looming in Russia as well, limiting gas export capacity," said Adeline Van Houtte from the Economist Intelligence Unit."

Edited October 8, 2021 by Ecocharger

[ronwagn + 6,290]

16 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

Here is the bottom line on the energy crisis...the public panic and green mania which has gripped the minds of politicians and activists has produced plans of attack on the oil industry and oil pipelines. This in turn has chilled investment into future oil production and pipelines, and has already choked the supply of oil to American consumers. Economic death by self-strangulation. 

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Crude-Oil/Moodys-Oil-Industry-Must-Spend-542-Billion-To-Avoid-Supply-Shock.html

"This year, spending is expected at $352 billion, while medium-term annual investment has to grow to $542 billion to keep with the demand returning from the pandemic slump, according to Moody’s.

“The industry will need to spend significantly more, especially if oil and gas demand keeps climbing beyond pre-pandemic levels through 2025,” Moody’s analysts wrote in the report, as carried by Bloomberg.

Underinvestment in upstream projects is a major wild card for oil markets going forward, analysts and industry officials say.

The oil industry is “massively underinvesting” in supply to meet growing demand, which is set to return to pre-COVID levels as soon as the end of 2021 or early 2022, Greg Hill, president of U.S. oil producer Hess Corp, said last week.

Last year, global upstream investment sank to a 15-year low of $350 billion, down from around $600 billion before the pandemic, according to estimates by Wood Mackenzie from earlier this year."

This is due to the WOKE corporation philosophy of going along with the government  and the younger people mow making up a larger portion of their employees and future hires. If they prevail, we will be just like Europe in the near future. That is not a good thing. The thinking involved is coming from what Rush Limbaugh would call "heads full of mush." They have been brainwashed by socialist professors who are aiming to destroy our economy in order to rebuild America in their own version of socialism. They want total power in the hands of the federal government. The Green Dream will become a permanent nightmare.

Here are the real facts about what the world uses for energy. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_energy_supply_and_consumption

Edited Wednesday at 10:56 PM by ronwagn
reference

•  

 

Edited October 8, 2021 by ronwagn
reference

[Eric Gagen + 713]

19 hours ago, ronwagn said:

I once had a used station wagon from GM. the worst problem it had was the fabric ceiling liner raining old foam particles on my head. My big Ford Wagon was great until I ran into a deer and they totaled it. I think Ford designed their valves to wear out after 140,000 miles. I am really not very knowledgeable about engines to tell you the truth. 😉 I used to consider myself a Ford guy, then I discoverd Nissans and Hyundais etc. 

Knowing how long it’s been since you could buy station wagons new, I’m guessing this was quite some time ago 

[ronwagn + 6,290]

2 minutes ago, Eric Gagen said:

Knowing how long it’s been since you could buy station wagons new, I’m guessing this was quite some time ago 

I now have a very large Nissan NV3500, a Town and Country minivan, and a subcompact Mitsubishi Mirage. Usage around town is the Mirage which gets around 40mpg in town or on the road. Vans beat wagons when it comes to space. When I first got out of the army in 1965 I went to an auto show. There prime show off was a hydrogen powered sedan. Surprised? My other favorite was a Jeep Wagoneer which I really would have liked to own but never could afford. I see that they are pushing them again. Too late, my Nissan van is much bigger. 

[Boat + 1,315]

2 hours ago, ronwagn said:

This is due to the WOKE corporation philosophy of going along with the government  and the younger people mow making up a larger portion of their employees and future hires. If they prevail, we will be just like Europe in the near future. That is not a good thing. The thinking involved is coming from what Rush Limbaugh would call "heads full of mush." They have been brainwashed by socialist professors who are aiming to destroy our economy in order to rebuild America in their own version of socialism. They want total power in the hands of the federal government. The Green Dream will become a permanent nightmare.

Here are the real facts about what the world uses for energy. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_energy_supply_and_consumption

Edited Wednesday at 10:56 PM by ronwagn
reference

•  

 

Your lost Ron and have no clue what woke is. Agricultural sells food but cares nothing about nutrition. That’s not woke. Our medical system does a great job selling pills but cares nothing about solving disease. Our system makes profits, grows market share but cares little about working on root causes. That is not woke.   Tech helps make incremental improvements but can’t keep up with overwhelming population growth. Humans have the tools but not the will or brains so life itself remains volatile. The end result is a stressed resource scenario, stressed healthcare system and much unneeded pain and misery for humans. That ain’t woke and won’t be for the foreseeable future. Most of you live in fear of one thing or another which in theory could have been easily avoided. 

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,537]

On 10/7/2021 at 7:03 AM, Eric Gagen said:

Repeat this slowly after me:  never purchase a vehicle from General Motors.  Their build quality is dubious at best, and they take design and engineering shortcuts to save money It doesn’t matter what the specifications are on paper, because if it comes from GM there is an excellent chance that it won’t meet those specifications, or have other subtle problems that aren’t on the spec sheets.

GM has been a bench on what not to do for yrs, which is very odd. They do build v-8 engines that truly are world class, and then dumb them down to mediocracy..

Edited October 8, 2021 by Eyes Wide Open

[notsonice + 1,063]

4 hours ago, ronwagn said:

This is due to the WOKE corporation philosophy of going along with the government  and the younger people mow making up a larger portion of their employees and future hires. If they prevail, we will be just like Europe in the near future. That is not a good thing. The thinking involved is coming from what Rush Limbaugh would call "heads full of mush." They have been brainwashed by socialist professors who are aiming to destroy our economy in order to rebuild America in their own version of socialism. They want total power in the hands of the federal government. The Green Dream will become a permanent nightmare.

Here are the real facts about what the world uses for energy. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_energy_supply_and_consumption

Edited Wednesday at 10:56 PM by ronwagn
reference

•  

 

what a load of bs babble............ the younger people mow making up a larger portion of their employees and future hires. If they prevail, we will be just like Europe in the near future. That is not a good thing.????? really you are babbling more and more bs these days. ...........

[notsonice + 1,063]

Here is an example of the Government pushing the Green New Deal over the past 40 years while getting rid of the nasty old school refrigerants. Today a new fridge uses 30 KWH a month compared to 180 KWH per month in 1972. A permanent nightmare????

 

The Proof is in the Pudding: How Refrigerator Standards Have Saved Consumers $Billions

Today’s refrigerators have been designed to save energy and money without detriment to capacity,
functionality, or extra features. | Image source: Building Technologies Program

What’s your favorite late night snack – that go-to treat that melts away the troubles of the day as you curl up in front of the TV? Perhaps it’s a creamy bowl of Rocky Road or maybe some delicious, spicy Szechuan chicken left over from a recent take-out feast. Refrigerator-finds like these may make you feel bad about indulging in guilty pleasures, but at least you don't have to feel bad about how high your energy bill will be to cure your cravings. That’s because of innovative technology and meaningful energy conservation standards put into place by the Office of Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy's Building Technologies Program.

In recent decades, the Energy Department has led technological innovation that vastly improved the energy efficiency of our refrigerators and freezers (and thousands of other household appliances). As a result, it’s a lot easier on your pocket and on the environment to keep that ice cream at peak frosty perfection. In fact, today’s refrigerators use only about 25 percent of the energy that was required to power models built in 1975. Even while continually improving efficiency to meet standards, refrigerators have increased in size by almost 20 percent, have added energy-using features such as through-the-door ice, and provide more benefits than ever before. Refrigerators today can be customized to fit consumer needs with touch-screen displays, glass doors, or even a beer tap.

The dramatic rise in efficiency began in response to the oil and energy crises of the 1970s when refrigerators typically cost about $1,300 when adjusted for inflation, a hefty price to pay for an energy waster. Refrigeration labels and standards have improved efficiency by two percent per year since 1975. Due to research, useful tools, partnerships with utilities and other organizations, and market initiatives that helped enable refrigerator and other appliance standards, the Energy Department has helped avoid the construction of up to 31 1-GW power plants with the energy saved since the first Federal standards in 1987. That’s the same amount of electricity consumed by Spain annually.

The Department will soon have strengthened the standards for household refrigerators three times. Each time, manufacturers have responded with new innovations that enabled their products to meet the new requirements and often to exceed them. Refrigerators that performed above and beyond the minimum standards qualified for the ENERGY STAR label, motivated consumers to care about energy usage, and primed the market for continued efficiency improvements.

Decades worth of progressive energy-efficiency standards for refrigerators have translated into big savings for consumers. Compared to refrigerators of the 1970s, today's refrigerators save the nation about $20 billion per year in energy costs, or $150 per year for the average American family.

The next proposed increase in refrigerator and freezer efficiency -- scheduled to take effect in 2014 -- will save the nation almost four and a half quadrillion BTUs over 30 years. That’s three times more than the total energy currently used by all refrigeration products in U.S. homes annually. It’s also the equivalent amount of energy savings that could be used to power a third of Africa for an entire year

The Energy Department is continuing to invest even more in future innovations for energy efficient products. So go ahead and indulge with those late night snacks and frozen treats. Your fridge has you covered.

To learn more about Appliance Standards and how they save consumers money go to the Building Technologies Program website.

Edited October 8, 2021 by notsonice

[ronwagn + 6,290]

11 minutes ago, notsonice said:

what a load of bs babble............ the younger people mow making up a larger portion of their employees and future hires. If they prevail, we will be just like Europe in the near future. That is not a good thing.????? really you are babbling more and more bs these days. ...........

Come up with a logical refuting argument if you are able. Quit the B.S.  Our expected GDP growth this year is about 1%. That is way less than inflation. 

[ronwagn + 6,290]

3 minutes ago, notsonice said:

Here is an example of the Government pushing the Green New Deal over the past 40 years while getting rid of the nasty old school refrigerants. Today a new fridge uses 30 KWH a month compared to 180 KWH per month in 1972. A permanent nightmare????

 

The Proof is in the Pudding: How Refrigerator Standards Have Saved Consumers $Billions

Today’s refrigerators have been designed to save energy and money without detriment to capacity,
functionality, or extra features. | Image source: Building Technologies Program

What’s your favorite late night snack – that go-to treat that melts away the troubles of the day as you curl up in front of the TV? Perhaps it’s a creamy bowl of Rocky Road or maybe some delicious, spicy Szechuan chicken left over from a recent take-out feast. Refrigerator-finds like these may make you feel bad about indulging in guilty pleasures, but at least you don't have to feel bad about how high your energy bill will be to cure your cravings. That’s because of innovative technology and meaningful energy conservation standards put into place by the Office of Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy's Building Technologies Program.

In recent decades, the Energy Department has led technological innovation that vastly improved the energy efficiency of our refrigerators and freezers (and thousands of other household appliances). As a result, it’s a lot easier on your pocket and on the environment to keep that ice cream at peak frosty perfection. In fact, today’s refrigerators use only about 25 percent of the energy that was required to power models built in 1975. Even while continually improving efficiency to meet standards, refrigerators have increased in size by almost 20 percent, have added energy-using features such as through-the-door ice, and provide more benefits than ever before. Refrigerators today can be customized to fit consumer needs with touch-screen displays, glass doors, or even a beer tap.

The dramatic rise in efficiency began in response to the oil and energy crises of the 1970s when refrigerators typically cost about $1,300 when adjusted for inflation, a hefty price to pay for an energy waster. Refrigeration labels and standards have improved efficiency by two percent per year since 1975. Due to research, useful tools, partnerships with utilities and other organizations, and market initiatives that helped enable refrigerator and other appliance standards, the Energy Department has helped avoid the construction of up to 31 1-GW power plants with the energy saved since the first Federal standards in 1987. That’s the same amount of electricity consumed by Spain annually.

The Department will soon have strengthened the standards for household refrigerators three times. Each time, manufacturers have responded with new innovations that enabled their products to meet the new requirements and often to exceed them. Refrigerators that performed above and beyond the minimum standards qualified for the ENERGY STAR label, motivated consumers to care about energy usage, and primed the market for continued efficiency improvements.

Decades worth of progressive energy-efficiency standards for refrigerators have translated into big savings for consumers. Compared to refrigerators of the 1970s, today's refrigerators save the nation about $20 billion per year in energy costs, or $150 per year for the average American family.

The next proposed increase in refrigerator and freezer efficiency -- scheduled to take effect in 2014 -- will save the nation almost four and a half quadrillion BTUs over 30 years. That’s three times more than the total energy currently used by all refrigeration products in U.S. homes annually. It’s also the equivalent amount of energy savings that could be used to power a third of Africa for an entire year

The Energy Department is continuing to invest even more in future innovations for energy efficient products. So go ahead and indulge with those late night snacks and frozen treats. Your fridge has you covered.

To learn more about Appliance Standards and how they save consumers money go to the Building Technologies Program website.

On the other hand refrigerator prices have skyrocketed and their lifespan does not compare to the models made long ago. The same is true with most appliances. Adding insulation is not rocket science. 

[ronwagn + 6,290]

1 hour ago, Boat said:

Your lost Ron and have no clue what woke is. Agricultural sells food but cares nothing about nutrition. That’s not woke. Our medical system does a great job selling pills but cares nothing about solving disease. Our system makes profits, grows market share but cares little about working on root causes. That is not woke.   Tech helps make incremental improvements but can’t keep up with overwhelming population growth. Humans have the tools but not the will or brains so life itself remains volatile. The end result is a stressed resource scenario, stressed healthcare system and much unneeded pain and misery for humans. That ain’t woke and won’t be for the foreseeable future. Most of you live in fear of one thing or another which in theory could have been easily avoided. 

Agriculture has vastly expanded lifespans all around the world. The biggest health problem is now obesity which leads to many secondary health problems. Medical care is more available and better than ever. Our leaders in the present administration are the lost boys and girls. They have no common sense and are destroying our economy with bad advice and stupid regulations. They want to destroy basic liberties of all kinds and gain total control over our lives. Diseases have been conquered all over the world. Our present leaders have paid to develop new and more damaging froms of COVID. 

[Jay McKinsey + 1,489]

9 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

Come up with a logical refuting argument if you are able. Quit the B.S.  Our expected GDP growth this year is about 1%. That is way less than inflation. 

You are full of such BS and babbling. 

Goldman Sachs' economists lowered their US growth forecast for 2021 to 5.7% from 6.2% on expectations of a "harder path" ahead for consumers.

[ronwagn + 6,290]

Figure in the inflation that people are paying and going to pay. http://www.shadowstats.com/alternate_data/inflation-charts

 

 

Edited October 8, 2021 by ronwagn

[notsonice + 1,063]

8 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

On the other hand refrigerator prices have skyrocketed and their lifespan does not compare to the models made long ago. The same is true with most appliances. Adding insulation is not rocket science. 

refrigerator prices have skyrocketed????? what are you babbling about. Lifespan, the problem with newer refrigerators (1990 to now) is they do last forever and it is hard to get people to replace them with new efficient refrigerators. Cost ? They have dropped (adjusted for inflation)

 

......

Prices for Appliances, 1997-2021 ($20)

According to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, prices for appliances were 16.36% lower in 2021 versus 1997 (a $3.27 difference in value).

Between 1997 and 2021: Appliances experienced an average inflation rate of -0.74% per year. In other words, appliances costing $20 in the year 1997 would cost $16.73 in 2021 for an equivalent purchase. Compared to the overall inflation rate of 2.16% during this same period, inflation for appliances was lower.

[ronwagn + 6,290]

1 minute ago, notsonice said:

refrigerator prices have skyrocketed????? what are you babbling about. Lifespan, the problem with newer refrigerators (1990 to now) is they do last forever and it is hard to get people to replace them with new efficient refrigerators. Cost ? They have dropped (adjusted for inflation)

 

......

Prices for Appliances, 1997-2021 ($20)

According to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, prices for appliances were 16.36% lower in 2021 versus 1997 (a $3.27 difference in value).

Between 1997 and 2021: Appliances experienced an average inflation rate of -0.74% per year. In other words, appliances costing $20 in the year 1997 would cost $16.73 in 2021 for an equivalent purchase. Compared to the overall inflation rate of 2.16% during this same period, inflation for appliances was lower.

I was referring to older models that could last for several decades without repairs. 

[notsonice + 1,063]

21 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

Come up with a logical refuting argument if you are able. Quit the B.S.  Our expected GDP growth this year is about 1%. That is way less than inflation. 

real GDP growth 2021 adjusted for inflation is expected to be over 5 % .

 

Real GDP is adjusted for price changes and is therefore regarded as a key indicator for economic growth.
...

Characteristic	GDP growth rate compared to previous year
2022*	3.52%
2021*	6.39%
2020	-3.51%
2019	2.16%   Ron you really need to stop bsing all the time

 

 

[notsonice + 1,063]

6 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

I was referring to older models that could last for several decades without repairs. 

yeah keeping a 30 year old fridge saves you????? it will cost you around $15 a month to run it and a new fridge around $3 a month. Over time you will pay dearly for the old fridge . PS in the summer your old fridge will heat up your kitchen and you have to run your AC harder just to keep your house cool. Get yourself a Kill - a -watt meter and you will find out that your old fridge really does suck the power. Damn those socialists in government pushing new fridges to reduce CO2 emissions ?

Edited October 8, 2021 by notsonice

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,537]

1 hour ago, notsonice said:

yeah keeping a 30 year old fridge saves you????? it will cost you around $15 a month to run it and a new fridge around $3 a month. Over time you will pay dearly for the old fridge . PS in the summer your old fridge will heat up your kitchen and you have to run your AC harder just to keep your house cool. Get yourself a Kill - a -watt meter and you will find out that your old fridge really does suck the power. Damn those socialists in government pushing new fridges to reduce CO2 emissions ?

"Over time you will pay dearly" In a word just priceless....

 

[turbguy + 1,391]

5 hours ago, notsonice said:

Here is an example of the Government pushing the Green New Deal over the past 40 years while getting rid of the nasty old school refrigerants. Today a new fridge uses 30 KWH a month compared to 180 KWH per month in 1972. A permanent nightmare????

 

The Proof is in the Pudding: How Refrigerator Standards Have Saved Consumers $Billions

Today’s refrigerators have been designed to save energy and money without detriment to capacity,
functionality, or extra features. | Image source: Building Technologies Program

What’s your favorite late night snack – that go-to treat that melts away the troubles of the day as you curl up in front of the TV? Perhaps it’s a creamy bowl of Rocky Road or maybe some delicious, spicy Szechuan chicken left over from a recent take-out feast. Refrigerator-finds like these may make you feel bad about indulging in guilty pleasures, but at least you don't have to feel bad about how high your energy bill will be to cure your cravings. That’s because of innovative technology and meaningful energy conservation standards put into place by the Office of Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy's Building Technologies Program.

In recent decades, the Energy Department has led technological innovation that vastly improved the energy efficiency of our refrigerators and freezers (and thousands of other household appliances). As a result, it’s a lot easier on your pocket and on the environment to keep that ice cream at peak frosty perfection. In fact, today’s refrigerators use only about 25 percent of the energy that was required to power models built in 1975. Even while continually improving efficiency to meet standards, refrigerators have increased in size by almost 20 percent, have added energy-using features such as through-the-door ice, and provide more benefits than ever before. Refrigerators today can be customized to fit consumer needs with touch-screen displays, glass doors, or even a beer tap.

The dramatic rise in efficiency began in response to the oil and energy crises of the 1970s when refrigerators typically cost about $1,300 when adjusted for inflation, a hefty price to pay for an energy waster. Refrigeration labels and standards have improved efficiency by two percent per year since 1975. Due to research, useful tools, partnerships with utilities and other organizations, and market initiatives that helped enable refrigerator and other appliance standards, the Energy Department has helped avoid the construction of up to 31 1-GW power plants with the energy saved since the first Federal standards in 1987. That’s the same amount of electricity consumed by Spain annually.

The Department will soon have strengthened the standards for household refrigerators three times. Each time, manufacturers have responded with new innovations that enabled their products to meet the new requirements and often to exceed them. Refrigerators that performed above and beyond the minimum standards qualified for the ENERGY STAR label, motivated consumers to care about energy usage, and primed the market for continued efficiency improvements.

Decades worth of progressive energy-efficiency standards for refrigerators have translated into big savings for consumers. Compared to refrigerators of the 1970s, today's refrigerators save the nation about $20 billion per year in energy costs, or $150 per year for the average American family.

The next proposed increase in refrigerator and freezer efficiency -- scheduled to take effect in 2014 -- will save the nation almost four and a half quadrillion BTUs over 30 years. That’s three times more than the total energy currently used by all refrigeration products in U.S. homes annually. It’s also the equivalent amount of energy savings that could be used to power a third of Africa for an entire year

The Energy Department is continuing to invest even more in future innovations for energy efficient products. So go ahead and indulge with those late night snacks and frozen treats. Your fridge has you covered.

To learn more about Appliance Standards and how they save consumers money go to the Building Technologies Program website.

Add to all of that, the apparent efficiency improvement to ICE vehicles.

And nat gas furnaces.  Yearsago,  nat gas water heater storage tanks were UN-insulated!   Now, some heaters don't even have tanks.

And efficiency imrovements in building construction.

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,129]

1 hour ago, turbguy said:

Add to all of that, the apparent efficiency improvement to ICE vehicles.

And nat gas furnaces.  Yearsago,  nat gas water heater storage tanks were UN-insulated!   Now, some heaters don't even have tanks.

And efficiency imrovements in building construction.

And now you have to wait 2 minutes for almost hot water and you are utterly SCREWED if you are taking a shower and someone wants to run a load of clothes, or wash their hands... Yea, great step forward... We gave up and put a tank back in and life is good again.  EDIT Was on a 300,000 BTU machine.  Most installed are SMALLER and even shittier.  Heaven help you if you have a little calcium or other minerals in your water, it will quickly PLUG, and you have to spend several hundred for a plumber to clean it out... Instead of buying a couple hundred dollar tank and spending $5/month extra all in the name of "efficiency"....

Dumbest thing since sliced bread.  DO NOT GET INLINE WATER HEATERS!!!  Unless you LOVE lukewarm showers and wish to wait 6 years for hot water to arrive

PS: the Under sink INSTAHOT with small flow actually do work, but once again you better not have minerals in your water.

Edited October 9, 2021 by footeab@yahoo.com

[turbguy + 1,391]

9 hours ago, footeab@yahoo.com said:

And now you have to wait 2 minutes for almost hot water and you are utterly SCREWED if you are taking a shower and someone wants to run a load of clothes, or wash their hands... Yea, great step forward... We gave up and put a tank back in and life is good again.  EDIT Was on a 300,000 BTU machine.  Most installed are SMALLER and even shittier.  Heaven help you if you have a little calcium or other minerals in your water, it will quickly PLUG, and you have to spend several hundred for a plumber to clean it out... Instead of buying a couple hundred dollar tank and spending $5/month extra all in the name of "efficiency"....

Dumbest thing since sliced bread.  DO NOT GET INLINE WATER HEATERS!!!  Unless you LOVE lukewarm showers and wish to wait 6 years for hot water to arrive

PS: the Under sink INSTAHOT with small flow actually do work, but once again you better not have minerals in your water.

The undersink INSTAHOT's typically have a small tank.

At least mine does.