GREEN NEW DEAL = BLIZZARD OF LIES

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

1 hour ago, TailingsPond said:

I bet a lot of people would have higher quality of life if they used less electricity. 

Put down your phone, turn off Netflix, go outside, exercise, actually interact with others.

Sure, stop driving your car, stop using lights in the operating rooms of hospitals, learn to read in the dark....you make a lot of sense, old boy.

[TailingsPond + 461]

2 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

Sure, stop driving your car, stop using lights in the operating rooms of hospitals, learn to read in the dark....you make a lot of sense, old boy.

A 10% reduction doesn't require anything so drastic. 

Logic fail, try again.

 

Edited September 11, 2022 by TailingsPond

[notsonice + 1,065]

3 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

Sure, stop driving your car, stop using lights in the operating rooms of hospitals, learn to read in the dark....you make a lot of sense, old boy.

keep babbling like an idiot, it is what you do best.

[notsonice + 1,065]

On 9/10/2022 at 8:01 AM, Ecocharger said:

Here is where the rubber meets the road. The Green revolution and climate mania has brought about an energy strangulation of the European economies and a drastic reduction in the standard of living for the average consumer.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/EU-Ministers-Call-For-10-Cut-In-Energy-Consumption.html

"EU energy ministers are calling for a 10% reduction in electricity consumption. 

According to the WSJ, the electricity rationing plan appears to have support from many member states. 

Today’s emergency meeting is just the latest of many efforts the EU has made to quash economic upheaval due to industry shutdowns, and to prevent protests due to skyrocketing energy prices. "

a 10% reduction in electricity consumption.....The Green revolution and climate mania has brought about an energy strangulation of the European economies????

No Putin has brought about the need to reduce consumption. Pretty simple.

now running along little one and leave the discussion to the adults in the room.

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

1 hour ago, TailingsPond said:

A 10% reduction doesn't require anything so drastic. 

Logic fail, try again.

 

Nonsense, 10% reduction compounded over time becomes a gigantic cut, stressing every sector of consumer and producer.

You want European nations to turn the clock back and resuscitate the Dark Ages, that is contrarian thinking accelerated to insanity.

America will be the next target in the cross-hairs of these witless wonders.

Edited September 11, 2022 by Ecocharger

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

48 minutes ago, notsonice said:

keep babbling like an idiot, it is what you do best.

Says the champion babbler.

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

16 hours ago, notsonice said:

a 10% reduction in electricity consumption.....The Green revolution and climate mania has brought about an energy strangulation of the European economies????

No Putin has brought about the need to reduce consumption. Pretty simple.

now running along little one and leave the discussion to the adults in the room.

Unfortunately for you, the new British PM has begun to revive the oil and fracking industries, so fossil fuels will be the basis of an economic revival in Britain going forward.

The rest of Europe will have to turn the lights out.

That's right, the lights are going out all over Europe thanks to the misguided and half-brained climate panic.

Edited September 12, 2022 by Ecocharger

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

The climate panic set are at it again, yelping and whining because the British PM has begun to revive the production of energy in Britain.

These "economists" are, as usual, working with defective models and worrying about the destruction of finite energy supplies.

Did anyone enlighten them as to the new sources of energy due to the fossil fuel burgeoning initiated by the new PM?

I guess British economists do not bother to read the newspapers.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/Economists-Warn-Energy-Bill-Price-Caps-Could-Lead-To-Blackouts-In-UK.html

"Economists are warning that UK Prime Minister Truss' plan to cap energy bills could lead to blackouts.

Experts at the economic think tank the Institute for Fiscal Studies (IFS) said energy supplies may run dry due to the government propping up energy spending.

“The less UK households reduce their energy demand, the greater demands placed on others… there is simply not enough energy to go round, which would require rationing or increase the risk of blackouts,” the organisation added."

 

Edited September 11, 2022 by Ecocharger

[lexington green + 22]

In America, and elsewhere, multiple energy sources have been applied for electricity generation:  hydro electric, nuclear, geo thermal, fossil fuels.   Solar energy and wind are now commodities being added to the mix.  Hydrogen is also being added to the mix. Adding new sources, even intermittent, does not harm to a power grid's ability to produce energy.  Electric output is throttled up and down daily, in response to demand.  Germany, the 4th largest economy in the world, has been sourcing half of it's electricity generation from renewable energy for several years. And, during that time, it has sustained economic growth.   If it had not adopted new sources of energy, the natural gas shortage faced by Europe this winter would be a lot worse.   Fossil fuels are facing competition they didn't have a couple of decades ago.  Regardless of what politicians advocate for more or less production of fossil fuels, the competition will continue.  Total cost of operation will be a consideration.   When my car was designed to include a lithium battery in the power train, it's gas mileage was effectively doubled to 52 mpg (that's 52 mpg every tank).  That's a lower cost of operation, and the car has over 200,000 miles on it.  So, new power sources are here, and they will continue to be adopted.  No political debate or ideological based discourse is going to prevent it.  

[Rob Plant + 2,605]

2 hours ago, lexington green said:

In America, and elsewhere, multiple energy sources have been applied for electricity generation:  hydro electric, nuclear, geo thermal, fossil fuels.   Solar energy and wind are now commodities being added to the mix.  Hydrogen is also being added to the mix. Adding new sources, even intermittent, does not harm to a power grid's ability to produce energy.  Electric output is throttled up and down daily, in response to demand.  Germany, the 4th largest economy in the world, has been sourcing half of it's electricity generation from renewable energy for several years. And, during that time, it has sustained economic growth.   If it had not adopted new sources of energy, the natural gas shortage faced by Europe this winter would be a lot worse.   Fossil fuels are facing competition they didn't have a couple of decades ago.  Regardless of what politicians advocate for more or less production of fossil fuels, the competition will continue.  Total cost of operation will be a consideration.   When my car was designed to include a lithium battery in the power train, it's gas mileage was effectively doubled to 52 mpg (that's 52 mpg every tank).  That's a lower cost of operation, and the car has over 200,000 miles on it.  So, new power sources are here, and they will continue to be adopted.  No political debate or ideological based discourse is going to prevent it.  

Agree with most of that!

Germany not quite at 50% renewable, I make it 40% , but still pretty decent and its a bloody good job they have diversified ot theyd be even more in the brown stuff.

https://www.destatis.de/EN/Themes/Economic-Sectors-Enterprises/Energy/Production/Tables/gross-electricity-production.html

Ive got a hybrid too, my commute is all electric (charge at work so its free) and its saved me a fortune in fuel bills!

[Rasmus Jorgensen + 1,169]

9 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

Nonsense, 10% reduction compounded over time becomes a gigantic cut, stressing every sector of consumer and producer.

You want European nations to turn the clock back and resuscitate the Dark Ages, that is contrarian thinking accelerated to insanity.

?

How is less energy consumption back to the dark ages?
More football, less playstation is bad? 

more exercise, less candycrush is bad? 

Better insulation of houses is bad? 

More efficient use of resources is bad? 

I fail to see the logic in how this stresses anything. 

 

[Old-Ruffneck + 1,177]

2 hours ago, Rob Plant said:

Ive got a hybrid too, my commute is all electric (charge at work so its free) and its saved me a fortune in fuel bills!

Nothing is free, someone is paying for that (your company), maybe one of the benefits working there. 

[Rasmus Jorgensen + 1,169]

11 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

That's right, the lights are going out all over Europe thanks to the misguided and half-brained climate panic.

pls explain to me how turning off Neon advertisements in the middle of the night harms anyone? I just don't get it. 

Some are doing to save on electricity. We turn the TV off in my house when we are not watching it - did that long before the price of electricity shot throught he roof.

[Boat + 1,315]

Here in America we’re just spoiled. I demand 71 degrees and I demand my electricity cheaper. Once we get away from FF and those huge swings in prices I believe that can happen. It’s about getting rid of the peaks in demand. Over the next three years battery factories will be coming online that are cheaper, denser and massive growth in scale. Here come the 10’s of billions. As a side note. 800kw batteries and chargers are coming. Quick charging will be the norm. Maybe small range and small cheap battery that you top off occasionally if you don’t drive a lot. BTW, I didn’t retire to sit around in the heat. The Astros have the second best record in baseball and you go outside? That’s hellfiredamination talk. 
What that means is countries that export FF will no longer hold the world hostage. None will care about your politics or your opinion. You will no longer be relevant. You listening Putin and Saudi? Iran, Iraq aka/ poverty is us. 

Edited September 12, 2022 by Boat

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

9 hours ago, lexington green said:

In America, and elsewhere, multiple energy sources have been applied for electricity generation:  hydro electric, nuclear, geo thermal, fossil fuels.   Solar energy and wind are now commodities being added to the mix.  Hydrogen is also being added to the mix. Adding new sources, even intermittent, does not harm to a power grid's ability to produce energy.  Electric output is throttled up and down daily, in response to demand.  Germany, the 4th largest economy in the world, has been sourcing half of it's electricity generation from renewable energy for several years. And, during that time, it has sustained economic growth.   If it had not adopted new sources of energy, the natural gas shortage faced by Europe this winter would be a lot worse.   Fossil fuels are facing competition they didn't have a couple of decades ago.  Regardless of what politicians advocate for more or less production of fossil fuels, the competition will continue.  Total cost of operation will be a consideration.   When my car was designed to include a lithium battery in the power train, it's gas mileage was effectively doubled to 52 mpg (that's 52 mpg every tank).  That's a lower cost of operation, and the car has over 200,000 miles on it.  So, new power sources are here, and they will continue to be adopted.  No political debate or ideological based discourse is going to prevent it.  

Like it or not, 85% of world energy source is fossil fuels, over 99% of automotive supply is fossil fuel, and that will continue indefinitely going forward. Just a fact of life.

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

6 hours ago, Rasmus Jorgensen said:

?

How is less energy consumption back to the dark ages?
More football, less playstation is bad? 

more exercise, less candycrush is bad? 

Better insulation of houses is bad? 

More efficient use of resources is bad? 

I fail to see the logic in how this stresses anything. 

 

Europe is reducing essential energy consumption by 10%. Where do you think that comes from? Lighting is cut, which is bad for vandalism on the streets for starters, increased traffic accidents....just think before you speak.

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

4 hours ago, Rasmus Jorgensen said:

pls explain to me how turning off Neon advertisements in the middle of the night harms anyone? I just don't get it. 

Some are doing to save on electricity. We turn the TV off in my house when we are not watching it - did that long before the price of electricity shot throught he roof.

Why do you think that street lights and neon lights are lighted? Just to be pretty?

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

3 hours ago, Boat said:

Here in America we’re just spoiled. I demand 71 degrees and I demand my electricity cheaper. Once we get away from FF and those huge swings in prices I believe that can happen. It’s about getting rid of the peaks in demand. Over the next three years battery factories will be coming online that are cheaper, denser and massive growth in scale. Here come the 10’s of billions. As a side note. 800kw batteries and chargers are coming. Quick charging will be the norm. Maybe small range and small cheap battery that you top off occasionally if you don’t drive a lot. BTW, I didn’t retire to sit around in the heat. The Astros have the second best record in baseball and you go outside? That’s hellfiredamination talk. 
What that means is countries that export FF will no longer hold the world hostage. None will care about your politics or your opinion. You will no longer be relevant. You listening Putin and Saudi? Iran, Iraq aka/ poverty is us. 

Supply constraints, and increasing costs for lithium, cobalt, copper will slow you down, buddy. Only the rich will be able to afford an electric future.

But that is all unnecessary. I predict that the current climate panic will fade as the science begins to achieve public awareness. The current new British PM has already punctured the fake claims of climate panic and Britain will now ramp up its fossil fuel resources.

[Boat + 1,315]

3 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

Like it or not, 85% of world energy source is fossil fuels, over 99% of automotive supply is fossil fuel, and that will continue indefinitely going forward. Just a fact of life.

That is correct. But times are changing from those that ridiculed Al Gore to those that think Putin is someone you should follow. Woke is on your ass with the charts and driven by the truth. Chinas coal use Is down this year along with pollution. No save by Mongolian coal. It’s been decades but commonsense will eventually win over purpose driven polluters. For several years global energy just keeps getting cleaner and cleaner. With the eminent military drive to Moscow it will colder there but cleaner.  

[Boat + 1,315]

5 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

Supply constraints, and increasing costs for lithium, cobalt, copper will slow you down, buddy. Only the rich will be able to afford an electric future.

But that is all unnecessary. I predict that the current climate panic will fade as the science begins to achieve public awareness. The current new British PM has already punctured the fake claims of climate panic and Britain will now ramp up its fossil fuel resources.

Not climate panic by the rich. A Tesla goes 0-60 in 2.3 seconds. Foreigners get little about the US. Google high school, college and pro football attendance on one weekend. It’s bigger than oil or politics. 

[Jay McKinsey + 1,489]

On 9/10/2022 at 6:57 AM, Ecocharger said:

Retirement rates are negligible. 

So, according to your source, the trade volume of used cars, which are 100% fossil fuel vehicles, presumably excluding trucks, was 3.85 million in 2010, which means presumably officially registered sales. That seems like a very tiny number for China, so I guess it does not include the vast majority of used car sales.

And in 2021 there were 17.59 officially registered used car sales, about a 457% increase in about ten years, a huge growth rate.

Usually in every other country, used vehicle sales are three times the new vehicle sales. China is probably the same.

So we have for China

70% of new car sales are fossil fuel

100% of used car sales are fossil fuel

100% of new truck sales are fossil fuel

100% of used truck sales are fossil fuels

100% of new highway bus sales are fossil fuel

100% of used highway bus sales are fossil fuel

100% of new freight train engine sales are fossil fuel

100% of used freight train engine sales are fossil fuel

100% of new work vehicle sales are fossil fuel

100% of used work vehicle sales are fossil fuel

100% of new airplane sales are fossil fuel

100% of used airplane sales are fossil fuel

Altogether fossil fuel transportation by value would be well over 99% of the sales markets.

Electric is miniscule and insignificant.

No you are just clueless and incapable of doing economic research preferring just to make stuff up. New car sales nearly tripled during that time period so a 400% increase in used car sales tracks just fine.

Oh and this graphic of new vehicle sales includes all busses and trucks:

http://en.caam.org.cn/Index/show/catid/32/id/1716.html

Although China has more than 270 million vehicles on its roads, only an estimated 15 million secondhand models were sold in 2019. That’s in sharp contrast to places such as Australia, the U.K., and the U.S., where people buy more used cars than new ones. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-01-06/china-wants-to-build-a-306-billion-used-car-market

Oh and only a moron doesn't know that almost all used car sales are "officially registered".  In the US there is this place called the Department of Motor Vehicles that...

 

Edited September 12, 2022 by Jay McKinsey

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

7 hours ago, Boat said:

That is correct. But times are changing from those that ridiculed Al Gore to those that think Putin is someone you should follow. Woke is on your ass with the charts and driven by the truth. Chinas coal use Is down this year along with pollution. No save by Mongolian coal. It’s been decades but commonsense will eventually win over purpose driven polluters. For several years global energy just keeps getting cleaner and cleaner. With the eminent military drive to Moscow it will colder there but cleaner.  

Woke is stuck with outmoded and worthless statistical models which no longer merit any kind of respect.

The real science tells a different story.

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

4 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said:

No you are just clueless and incapable of doing economic research preferring just to make stuff up. New car sales nearly tripled during that time period so a 400% increase in used car sales tracks just fine.

Oh and this graphic of new vehicle sales includes all busses and trucks:

http://en.caam.org.cn/Index/show/catid/32/id/1716.html

Although China has more than 270 million vehicles on its roads, only an estimated 15 million secondhand models were sold in 2019. That’s in sharp contrast to places such as Australia, the U.K., and the U.S., where people buy more used cars than new ones. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-01-06/china-wants-to-build-a-306-billion-used-car-market

Oh and only a moron doesn't know that almost all used car sales are "officially registered".  In the US there is this place called the Department of Motor Vehicles that...

 

Jay, those are registered Chinese used car sales, just a small percentage of actual used sales in China.

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

7 hours ago, Boat said:

Not climate panic by the rich. A Tesla goes 0-60 in 2.3 seconds. Foreigners get little about the US. Google high school, college and pro football attendance on one weekend. It’s bigger than oil or politics. 

That is just what I said, only the rich can afford to stay driving in the electric future projected by this Climate Panic.

But that nightmare world you prefer will not happen, the new science has already debunked the weak climate models the woke rely on. That is clear in Britain, given the new policies there.

[Ecocharger + 1,375]

Talk about sore losers, the EU woke leaders must be really upset about Britain's new pro-fossil fuel policies, look at this new nonsense being proposed.

We hear this garbage whenever oil prices increase, about "windfall" taxes, a thoroughly discredited economic policy. Obviously these EU mandarins have never studied economics.

https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/EU-Gears-Up-to-Tax-Fossil-Fuel-Companies-Amid-Energy-Crisis.html

"If approved, the bill would install a minimum rate for a “solidarity contribution” from fossil fuels companies, while each EU member state could increase that rate, though not decrease it. 

The draft also indicates that the EU is gearing up to propose a mandatory power cut across the bloc, which is being interpreted as a move towards energy rationing as a stop-gap measure to avoid the spiraling of an energy crisis that has now been exacerbated by Russia’s cutoff of gas flows through Nord Stream 1. 

The power cut targets in the draft proposal, as seen by Bloomberg, seek to cut overall consumption, as well as to lower demand during selected peak hours during weekdays. 

The draft also discussed a cap on “excessive” revenue of non-fossil fuel power generating companies."

Edited September 12, 2022 by Ecocharger