Ecocharger + 1,375 DL May 19, 2022 8 hours ago, Rob Plant said: @Ecocharger technology doesnt stand still and you are presuming that batteries will not develop which is a massive miscalculation. Here read this for example which uses no REE and could possibly give you a 900 mile range on the same volume size battery whilst being much lighter and much cheaper to make and more "green". Sulfur Battery Technology Could Make Electric Cars Go Three Times Further By 2024 https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesmorris/2022/04/02/sulfur-battery-technology-could-make-electric-cars-go-three-times-further-by-2024/?sh=54244a027eed Jay I'm doing your work for you all of a sudden lol The above may never happen, but someone somewhere will make something like this happen in the next 5 years IMHO and that will end ICE as the go to vehicle of choice, its inevitable! if it cheaper to build, more economical, none pollutive, has far less maintenance costs, and will continue to become cheaper as technology contantly improves then what is not to like??? I will believe it when I see it. As for now, it is in the "what if" stage. At that stage, the creators like to puff the possibilities. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,375 DL May 19, 2022 (edited) 4 hours ago, footeab@yahoo.com said: That so called "NEW" battery is what everyone ignored for decades due to fire/explosion problems. The culmination was S-Li batteries IMMOLATED about 100 Chinese in several VERY public accidents the worst of which was a BYD Lithium Sulfur battery bus explosion/fire which killed ~30 people. In any other country BYD would have been sued into oblivion. In China this is just business as usual and why no Chinese woman will buy Chinese baby formula as TWICE the same company who has twice killed a huge number of infants with their baby formula with poisons knowingly added, to get rid of the junk, never spent a single day in jail and the people running the company are still in charge. Same goes for BYD and their sulfur battery fires.. Until the explosive fire problems are solved and SHOWN via open testing with everyone watching regarding sulfur lithium, this is nothing but the usual brain dead "journalism" or propaganda trying to drum up $$$ for a start up company. As the same problem exists due to a dendrite short or a crash exposing the battery elements to oxygen. KABOOM BABY! Agree about Chinese enforcement of safety laws. I have a Chinese friend who tells me that regulations against recycling used food oils are routinely broken by well organized companies. No worries about legal enforcement stopping that, the cops reportedly look the other way. Presumably under government orders. Edited May 19, 2022 by Ecocharger Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,375 DL May 19, 2022 (edited) This is what happens when a misguided government declares war on oil and fossil fuels. https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Gasoline-Price-Gouging-Bill-Passes-The-House.html "The oil industry has maintained that market forces and government policies are behind today’s higher prices, with some analysts warning that very low inventories of oil products in the United States—including gasoline—along with a shortage of refining capacity, have laid the groundwork for a likely oil shortage crisis this summer. The national average price of a gallon of gasoline rose to $4.589 on Thursday - another new high and a $.17 per gallon increase from a week ago according to AAA." Edited May 19, 2022 by Ecocharger Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eyes Wide Open + 3,539 May 19, 2022 (edited) The Electric-Vehicle Unicorn Crash Cheap credit and political subsidies led startups to let their ambitions get ahead of market realities. Yet concerns are mounting in China about oversupply of what the country calls new energy vehicles. “Reckless investments and disorderly efforts can be seen in the country’s NEV industry,” Lin Nianxiu, vice chairman of the National Development and Reform Commission, warned in March. “We have too many EV firms,” Xiao Yaqing, minister of industry and information technology, said in September. Some 200 Chinese EV startups have launched in the chase for government subsidies. Many have struggled to scale up production, and some have gone bankrupt. Foreign auto makers, possibly excepting Tesla, are struggling to sell electric vehicles in a saturated Chinese market. China’s problem is twofold: too much investment chasing too little demand, and too many companies with too little profit. The U.S. is starting to see the same problems. Almost all EV startups went public by merging with SPACs, or special-purpose acquisition companies. That allowed them to avoid required financial disclosures and make exceedingly rosy business projections. The Federal Reserve encouraged risky investing by holding down short- and long-term interest rates. Easy money provided an enormous subsidy. But now the cost of capital is rising as the Fed tightens, and so are production costs as prices for lithium, nickel and cobalt surge. Rivian recently increased the price of its pickup truck by $12,000, to $79,500, to offset rising costs. Much still needs to be worked out before widespread adoption of EVs is feasible. Yet the Biden administration and states like California plan to use fuel-economy and emissions mandates to force auto makers to phase out conventional vehicles. What happens if electric cars don’t sell? Perhaps auto makers would lobby politicians for higher gasoline taxes to boost EV sales, as they are doing in Europe. More likely they’d discount electric cars and raise prices on gasoline-powered ones to compensate. The alternative would be bankruptcy. Mr. Biden says he wants to beat China in the electric-vehicle race. Americans would be better off if government didn’t try to drive the market. https://www.wsj.com/articles/ev-electric-vehicle-unicorn-crash-out-china-startup-gas-new-clean-energy-prices-auto-car-makers-carbon-emissions-biden-climate-change-tesla-11652970007 Edited May 19, 2022 by Eyes Wide Open 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 May 19, 2022 (edited) EVs are shoving aside real volumes of oil Electric vehicles displaced roughly 1.5 million barrels per day of oil last year, new analysis shows, an amount slated to grow as EV sales keep rising. Why it matters: The new estimates from the research firm BloombergNEF help to show EVs are shedding their status as a niche climate technology. Total transportation fuel demand was 43.7 million barrels per day last year, the firm said. The amount EVs have displaced doubled over the last six years, BloombergNEF said. The intrigue: What kinds of EVs are doing the heaviest lifting right now is surprising (to me anyway!). "Two- and three-wheeled EVs accounted for 67% of the oil demand avoided in 2021," the report notes, citing rapid adoption in Asia. Buses were next at 16% and then followed by passenger vehicles at 13%, though BloombergNEF adds that they're the fastest-growing segment. The big picture: BloombergNEF said last year's displaced oil demand amounts to roughly one-fifth of Russia's pre-invasion exports. Edited May 19, 2022 by Jay McKinsey 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,068 DM May 19, 2022 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said: EVs are shoving aside real volumes of oil Electric vehicles displaced roughly 1.5 million barrels per day of oil last year, new analysis shows, an amount slated to grow as EV sales keep rising. Why it matters: The new estimates from the research firm BloombergNEF help to show EVs are shedding their status as a niche climate technology. Total transportation fuel demand was 43.7 million barrels per day last year, the firm said. The amount EVs have displaced doubled over the last six years, BloombergNEF said. The intrigue: What kinds of EVs are doing the heaviest lifting right now is surprising (to me anyway!). "Two- and three-wheeled EVs accounted for 67% of the oil demand avoided in 2021," the report notes, citing rapid adoption in Asia. Buses were next at 16% and then followed by passenger vehicles at 13%, though BloombergNEF adds that they're the fastest-growing segment. The big picture: BloombergNEF said last year's displaced oil demand amounts to roughly one-fifth of Russia's pre-invasion exports. Electric vehicles displaced roughly 1.5 million barrels per day of oil last year, new analysis shows, an amount slated to grow as EV sales keep rising??????? Peak oil is at the doorstep or has already happened... By the end of 2022 another half million or so barrels of oil a day demand destruction from EV's is possible...... so at the end of 2022, 2 million barrels a day of oil reduction in demand due to EV's Ecochump will not like the news Jay....... Edited May 19, 2022 by notsonice 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KeyboardWarrior + 527 May 19, 2022 10 minutes ago, notsonice said: Electric vehicles displaced roughly 1.5 million barrels Holy crap, that’s… nothing at all 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,068 DM May 19, 2022 Just now, KeyboardWarrior said: Holy crap, that’s… nothing at all well it is as ...Oil demand 2019 was 99.4 million bpd and this year it is estimated it will be 99.3 million barrels....... Looks like peak oil has happened and EVs are leading in demand destruction Holy Crap ha ha ha 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 May 19, 2022 3 minutes ago, KeyboardWarrior said: Holy crap, that’s… nothing at all We are just getting started. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 May 19, 2022 (edited) 4 hours ago, notsonice said: well it is as ...Oil demand 2019 was 99.4 million bpd and this year it is estimated it will be 99.3 million barrels....... Looks like peak oil has happened and EVs are leading in demand destruction Holy Crap ha ha ha Yep looks like a peak. Edited May 20, 2022 by Jay McKinsey 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KeyboardWarrior + 527 May 20, 2022 4 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said: Yep looks like a peak. Yea just like that "peak" in 2020 you went on and on about. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 May 20, 2022 3 minutes ago, KeyboardWarrior said: Yea just like that "peak" in 2020 you went on and on about. Yep, same peak. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KeyboardWarrior + 527 May 20, 2022 Just now, Jay McKinsey said: Yep, same peak. Stop extrapolating curves. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 May 20, 2022 (edited) 6 minutes ago, KeyboardWarrior said: Stop extrapolating curves. Why? You don't like how I keep being right? Extrapolating curves is a key part of forecasting. Edited May 20, 2022 by Jay McKinsey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,068 DM May 20, 2022 (edited) 49 minutes ago, KeyboardWarrior said: Yea just like that "peak" in 2020 you went on and on about. 2020 peak? nope 2019... Remember 2020 it was the year Trump crashed oil demand.... Peak was 2019...... one of your fellow dimwitted statistical gurus has stated the 2022 would be bigger than ever....Looks like he got it wrong again 2019 is the Peak year 2020 Trumps crash 2021 recovery 2022 EVs and of course the $100 plus oil is making 2019 the PEAK 2023...High oil prices and more EVs means demand destruction....leading to the Peak of 2019 enjoy Edited May 20, 2022 by notsonice Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KeyboardWarrior + 527 May 20, 2022 1 minute ago, Jay McKinsey said: Why? You don't like how I keep being right? Extrapolating curves is a big part of forecasting. You weren't correct though were you? Try day trading for a week and learn what extrapolation does when there's no objective data for the future. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 May 20, 2022 Just now, KeyboardWarrior said: You weren't correct though were you? Try day trading for a week and learn what extrapolation does when there's no objective data for the future. What was I wrong about? In 2020 I posted here that oil demand peaked in 2019. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KeyboardWarrior + 527 May 20, 2022 @Jay McKinsey You're always going on about supply crunches for EV's and how "that's thu reel reason EV's haven't taken over". What about the oil supply crunch? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 May 20, 2022 (edited) 16 minutes ago, KeyboardWarrior said: @Jay McKinsey You're always going on about supply crunches for EV's and how "that's thu reel reason EV's haven't taken over". What about the oil supply crunch? It's great for EV demand. The only solution is to go EV even faster. Global oil production is never going to return to what it was. Russia can't be replaced without massive investment and that isn't happening. However massive investment is being made in renewable production such as battery inputs and production. Edited May 20, 2022 by Jay McKinsey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KeyboardWarrior + 527 May 20, 2022 21 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said: It's great for EV demand. The only solution is to go EV even faster. Global oil production is never going to return to what it was. Russia can't be replaced without massive investment and that isn't happening. However massive investment is being made in renewable production such as battery inputs and production. North Dakota can't reopen because of a worker shortage. Is that reflective of a market problem or an industry problem? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 May 20, 2022 Just now, KeyboardWarrior said: North Dakota can't reopen because of a worker shortage. Is that reflective of a market problem or an industry problem? Both. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KeyboardWarrior + 527 May 20, 2022 1 minute ago, Jay McKinsey said: Both. I think the fact that oil is $100 a barrel is indicative of an industry problem. If oil were really less relevant, the price would reflect this change. Russia isn't that big of a concern for the United States as far as oil is concerned. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 May 20, 2022 4 minutes ago, KeyboardWarrior said: I think the fact that oil is $100 a barrel is indicative of an industry problem. If oil were really less relevant, the price would reflect this change. Russia isn't that big of a concern for the United States as far as oil is concerned. Most of the EV oil replacement has occurred in China, SE Asia and Europe. The US EV market is a few years behind. And we do export our oil so it is directly affected by Russian oil leaving the market. Foreign demand for our petroleum has been increasing significantly since the war began. Your industry problem is that the labor market doesn't want to be part of a dying industry that doesn't pay them enough. Otherwise there wouldn't be a labor shortage. Davis says he would be open to returning to energy, but for now, he is one of thousands of workers in the United States and Canada who have left oil and gas jobs, put off by arduous conditions, remote locations, and insufficient compensation, or lured to the renewables sector as the world transitions to cleaner energy. https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/n-american-oil-companies-scramble-find-workers-despite-boom-2022-04-29/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eyes Wide Open + 3,539 May 20, 2022 (edited) 37 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said: Your industry problem is that the labor market doesn't want to be part of a dying industry that doesn't pay them enough. Otherwise there wouldn't be a labor shortage. More than 20 Republican-led states sue Biden for canceling the Keystone XL pipeline It’s the latest event in the more than 10-year struggle over Keystone XL’s expansion. By Jariel Arvin on March 18, 2021 5:22 pm Edited May 20, 2022 by Eyes Wide Open 2 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 May 20, 2022 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Eyes Wide Open said: Did you know the Saudis bought Lucid ( an EV maker) and are building an electric vehicle factory in the kingdom? Lucid announces long-term plan to bring advanced automotive manufacturing to Saudi Arabia to address global demand. Lucid estimates that the location of Lucid’s first international manufacturing plant in Saudi Arabia may result in up to $3.4 billion of value to Lucid over 15 years. New international manufacturing plant targets 150,000 vehicles per year at the King Abdullah Economic City will leverage U.S. engineering, R&D, and manufacturing expertise in assembling new models for global markets and complement Lucid’s flagship manufacturing site in Arizona, USA. Manufacturing facility to bring several thousand high-skilled jobs to Saudi Arabia, creating diverse job opportunities and supporting skills development for the region. Saudi Arabia, a major investor in Lucid, has agreed to buy up to 100,000 Lucid EVs over the next 10 years. The deal is for at least 50,000 vehicles over that time, with Saudi Arabia’s Ministry of Finance having an option to purchase up to 50,000 more. Deliveries will begin next year, the company said. Edited May 20, 2022 by Jay McKinsey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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