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Or natural gas. Hydro does not work in droughts. 😊

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2 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

Or natural gas. Hydro does not work in droughts. 😊

The Key term is Energy-mix for every Country. It takes a lot of time to check all those Powerlines, Powersystems, Gas Pipelines and compare with Households, Industry, Backup and Reserves. It takes Years. And of course the Baltic Staates still hang on the Russian Power System for at least 2-3 Years. Polish Systems are too small, the same for at least other 7 Staates.

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12 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

Talk is cheap. I want to see real results from renewables. Ones that do not cause electricity prices to skyrocket and harm consumers and economies. Fossil fuels are needed. Currently Europe is using mainly coal. More Russian gas is fine as long as Russia is complied with. It gives them a lot of bargaining power whenever they want to dominate small countries in mittleeuropa. 

It will take TIME do get enough renewables in place. I am sure it will be done eventually but currently there are too many naive voters out there falling for green dreams that are far away. That also trust the Russian Bear while not concerned that they flare their gas, have NO renewables, and worked with their cronies to stop development of natural gas in Western Europe. 

Results are what counts, not B.S. 

Well if BS is not good for you, stop BSing.

take a look at this site and you will see where renewables including hydro, biomass and Nuclear  stand in each country in Europe for power generation

https://windeurope.org/about-wind/daily-wind/electricity-mix?utf8=✓&areas=&commit=Apply+filters

 

Currently Europe is using mainly coal.??? BULLSHIT it is less than 20 percent coal.

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Jay McKinsey said:

You mean battery storage. Done.

Are you serious?!?

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27 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

Or natural gas. Hydro does not work in droughts. 😊

Not much danger of that in most of Europe. As a side note, the European future must be Ukraine, which is over 70% carbon free already. (50% nuke, the rest hydro)

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12 minutes ago, notsonice said:

Well if BS is not good for you, stop BSing.

take a look at this site and you will see where renewables including hydro, biomass and Nuclear  stand in each country in Europe for power generation

https://windeurope.org/about-wind/daily-wind/electricity-mix?utf8=✓&areas=&commit=Apply+filters

 

Currently Europe is using mainly coal.??? BULLSHIT it is less than 20 percent coal.

1. Nuclear is running out of its lifespan in Europe and needs replacement.

2. Wind and Solar cannot keep up with the need yet. It needs help from fossil fuels, period.

3. Coal, lignite and natural gas are not expendable at all. They provide 114GW. 

4. Hydro is an old technology but is clean. I do not equate it with wind and solar. It is not always reliable either. Many greens do not like dams and want to tear them down.

The green dream is still far away and meanwhile European electricity prices are soaring!

That is not even mentioning all the oil that is needed to fuel all the ICE vehicles, or all the added electricity that is needed to fuel the projected electric vehicles!

Sweet dreams!

 

 

 

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Andrei Moutchkine said:

Not much danger of that in most of Europe. As a side note, the European future must be Ukraine, which is over 70% carbon free already. (50% nuke, the rest hydro)

That is a possibility. Western Europe has decided to rid itself of all of its nuclear plants. At least that is my understanding. With the Greens having great influence, I doubt that will change. Are the Greens advancing in Eastern Europe?

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1 minute ago, ronwagn said:

That is a possibility. Western Europe has decided to rid itself of all of its nuclear plants. At least that is my understanding. With the Greens having great influence, I doubt that will change. Are the Greens advancing in Eastern Europe?

France is still big on nukes, to some extent Sweden. Really tearing them down is a German thing only. AFAIK, there is no significant Green presence anywhere in the East, where people still have real problems to deal with. Don't need to invent any new ones :)

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1 minute ago, ronwagn said:

 

Currently Europe is using mainly coal.??? Like I said if you do not like BS stop BSING

It needs help from fossil fuels, period. Yes it does , however all of Europe is decreasing the need for fossil fuels and it is being replaced by renewables.

Peak power in Europe on daily basis is 350 GW and fossil fuels including gas is now less than 30 percent ....not as you say mainly.

4. Hydro is an old technology but is clean. I do not equate it with wind and solar. It is not always reliable either. Many greens do not like dams and want to tear them down. ???? Really they are tearing it all down in Europe (newsflash Hydro is expanding yet in Europe. Hydro in Europe is used as the swing producer or the Peak power generator now in tandem with wind and solar.

 

Once again your attempt to pump nat gas and coal fails in Europe

Again if you do not like BS stop posting BS

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6 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

That is a possibility. Western Europe has decided to rid itself of all of its nuclear plants. At least that is my understanding. With the Greens having great influence, I doubt that will change. Are the Greens advancing in Eastern Europe?

more BS Germany yes the rest of Europe . NO

 

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1. Nuclear is running out of its lifespan in Europe and needs replacement.

2. Wind and Solar cannot keep up with the need yet. It needs help from fossil fuels, period.

3. Coal, lignite and natural gas are not expendable at all. They provide 114GW. 

4. Hydro is an old technology but is clean. I do not equate it with wind and solar. It is not always reliable either. Many greens do not like dams and want to tear them down.

The green dream is still far away and meanwhile European electricity prices are soaring!

That is not even mentioning all the oil that is needed to fuel all the ICE vehicles, or all the added electricity that is needed to fuel the projected electric vehicles!

Sweet dreams!

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(edited)

1 hour ago, ronwagn said:

Currently Europe is using mainly coal.

It will take TIME do get enough renewables in place.

Wrong again. Coal is at the bottom of the list. Renewables are at the top. Do you ever get anything right? Or do you just spew misinformation on purpose? 

image.thumb.png.5d5118ce43d31d66572588effbd91735.png

image.thumb.png.afb311de9b9a373b507fb3999233c729.png

https://www.iea.org/data-and-statistics/charts/electricity-mix-in-the-european-union-january-september-2020

Edited by Jay McKinsey
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17 minutes ago, notsonice said:

more BS Germany yes the rest of Europe . NO

 

There is only one nuclear plant under construction in France and it is five times over budget. It has been under construction since 2007. It might open next year, after a 15 year wait. There is one in Finland and five in Eastern Europe. One in Turkey. I would reiterate that nuclear is dead in Western Europe. Eastern Europe is another story apparently. 

https://www.nesfircroft.com/blog/2019/05/8-major-european-nuclear-power-projects-to-watch-in-2019-and-beyond

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flamanville_Nuclear_Power_Plant 

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39 minutes ago, Andrei Moutchkine said:

Are you serious?!?

Yes. I am quite certain you have no clue how many batteries are being installed or how fast their cost is falling.

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3 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Wrong again. Coal is at the bottom of the list. Renewables are at the top. Do you ever get anything right? Or do you just spew misinformation on purpose? 

image.thumb.png.5d5118ce43d31d66572588effbd91735.png

image.thumb.png.afb311de9b9a373b507fb3999233c729.png

https://www.iea.org/data-and-statistics/charts/electricity-mix-in-the-european-union-january-september-2020

Ahem. You do know that this way of reporting mostly carries big hydro? I reckon, it is more like 10% without. EUROSTAT reports close to 20%, but that also includes hydro

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/energy/data/shares

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5 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Wrong again. Coal is at the bottom of the list. Renewables are at the top. Do you ever get anything right? Or do you just spew misinformation on purpose? 

image.thumb.png.5d5118ce43d31d66572588effbd91735.png

image.thumb.png.afb311de9b9a373b507fb3999233c729.png

https://www.iea.org/data-and-statistics/charts/electricity-mix-in-the-european-union-january-september-2020

You and other green dreamers always like to look at electical production even though it is failing to provide the energy needed to maintain reasonable prices! Europe is in a real mess due to over dependence on renewables. 

The real picture includes all energy used. That includes all fossil fuels including the diesel, gasoline, and propane used for machinery and transportation. 

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php?title=Energy_statistics_-_an_overview

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5 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Yes. I am quite certain you have no clue how many batteries are being installed or how fast their cost is falling.

Best wishes on that. How about a reference. 

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1 minute ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Yes. I am quite certain you have no clue how many batteries are being installed or how fast their cost is falling.

Actually, I have plenty of clue. The only attempt to deploy a municipal-scale lithium battery AFAIK was a Tesla-made array in South Australia, and it was a resounding failure

https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/australia-sues-neoen-lack-power-its-tesla-battery-reserve-2021-09-23/

So, why don't you start with your own house, if you are so upbeat? Can you afford it?

Merely switching all of the US drivers to Teslas today would take the entire global lithium cell market.

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2 minutes ago, Andrei Moutchkine said:

Ahem. You do know that this way of reporting mostly carries big hydro? I reckon, it is more like 10% without. EUROSTAT reports close to 20%, but that also includes hydro

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/energy/data/shares

Yes I know, so what? Hydro is a renewable source. 

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1 minute ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Yes I know, so what? Hydro is a renewable source. 

I know, too. But most of it is nothing new. It takes decades to plan and built a new hydro dam, even if there is an available location (which there usually isn't)

So, the rich pork barrel train o'EU green energy subsidies is effectively reaching only solar and windpower projects, so it'd be interesting to see how far that got them. The base hydro is no achievement of the greens, everybody likes it.

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(edited)

21 minutes ago, Andrei Moutchkine said:

Actually, I have plenty of clue. The only attempt to deploy a municipal-scale lithium battery AFAIK was a Tesla-made array in South Australia, and it was a resounding failure

https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/australia-sues-neoen-lack-power-its-tesla-battery-reserve-2021-09-23/

So, why don't you start with your own house, if you are so upbeat? Can you afford it?

Merely switching all of the US drivers to Teslas today would take the entire global lithium cell market.

You don't have even the beginning of a clue.

California is on track to have 2.5GW of batteries online by the end of the year. https://www.spglobal.com/platts/en/market-insights/latest-news/electric-power/082621-feature-battery-storage-capacity-rapidly-rising-across-california-thermal-remains-strong

Australia is on track to have almost as much and Hornsdale Big Battery has been a huge success.

EIA reports that the US will add 4.3GW (including California) of batteries this year.

planned U.S. utility-scale electricity generating capacity additions

 

And new big batteries get announced almost every day.

 

 

Edited by Jay McKinsey

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20 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

There is only one nuclear plant under construction in France and it is five times over budget. It has been under construction since 2007. It might open next year, after a 15 year wait. There is one in Finland and five in Eastern Europe. One in Turkey. I would reiterate that nuclear is dead in Western Europe. Eastern Europe is another story apparently. 

https://www.nesfircroft.com/blog/2019/05/8-major-european-nuclear-power-projects-to-watch-in-2019-and-beyond

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flamanville_Nuclear_Power_Plant 

That is because

a) France allegedly does not need need much new baseload capacity

b) Areva is bankrupt, same as US/Japanese Westinghouse

as a corollary of b) you effectively got to hire Russia's Rosatom if you want a Gen III+ (post-Fukushima safe) reactor on time and on budget. The only remaining real competitors are Chinese and Koreans, but they've got no track record yet.

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23 minutes ago, Andrei Moutchkine said:

Ahem. You do know that this way of reporting mostly carries big hydro? I reckon, it is more like 10% without. EUROSTAT reports close to 20%, but that also includes hydro

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/energy/data/shares

According to Reuters Wind and Solar make up 20% of the EU electricity mix and rising fast. 

image.png.797c866fd6b56896b00d6c312158a15c.png

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4 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

You don't have even the beginning of a clue.

California is on track to have 2.5GW of batteries online by the end of the year. https://www.spglobal.com/platts/en/market-insights/latest-news/electric-power/082621-feature-battery-storage-capacity-rapidly-rising-across-california-thermal-remains-strong

Australia is on track to have almost as much and Hornsdale Big Battery has been a huge success.

EIA predicts that the US will add 4.3GW (including California) of batteries this year.

planned U.S. utility-scale electricity generating capacity additions

 

And new big batteries get announced almost every day.

 

 

I believe in this being remotely commercially viable when somebody offers me as much as a proper UPS to power my computers for a few hours that I can afford, not to speak of something for my entire apartment. Otherwise, can government subsidies make anything a smashing success. I don't get none of these though.

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(edited)

4 minutes ago, Andrei Moutchkine said:

I believe in this being remotely commercially viable when somebody offers me as much as a proper UPS to power my computers for a few hours that I can afford, not to speak of something for my entire apartment. Otherwise, can government subsidies make anything a smashing success. I don't get none of these though.

Sorry, but grid batteries make money every single day, they aren't backups. The California batteries didn't get any subsidies.

Edited by Jay McKinsey

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