Are Electric Vehicles Really Better For The Environment?

Are electric vehicles really that much better for the environment than regular cars? I get that you're cutting down on fuel, but that electricity is obviously coming from somewhere. If not solar or wind, it's coming from coal or other non environment friendly alternatives.

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There is pretty much a fossil fuel backbone to all of this for now. However a typical car engine is about 25% efficient. An electric motor is typically greater than 90%. So overall you will get less emissions with the EV, even in areas with heavy coal.

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This depends on where and how you get your electricity. If you're burning coal or oil for 90+%, this might tip the scales the other way. There are plenty of ICEs that can beat those numbers, especially when cut by 10% of the electric motor and another 10% by the battery charging losses. If you have wind, solar, or other renewables providing much of the total, then it's a pretty win for electric.

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I absolutely agree that there are tradeoffs, but on the other side of the coin: the ICE car  today will yield progressively worse emissions as it ages due to the engine wearing out. The EV  will get progressively better over time because the grid itself is getting cleaner.

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Well where households have a solar power so it's not so much an issue. But there's a lot of places in the States that are heavily reliant on burning coal for electricity and that coal burning also produces a lot of toxic gases into the air.

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EVs are still cleaner than all-gas cars, no matter the electrical source. They are better on coal, even better on natural gas, Best on zero emission sources like hydro solar, wind and nuclear.   You can check it here for comparison. 

http://carboncounter.com/

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The comment about electric being more efficient than ICE even if you are using grid power is pure nonsense. Grid power delivered for use is almost always less than 25% efficient from power of the source fuel. Then you have charging, battery loss, discharging controlling the power to the motor and then the motor itself. Probably 15% is the highest source to motive power that you will see. If you are generating power from the sun at the point of use, it is a different game. It is still not free power or emission free power.

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Living in a big city makes you aware of how much time we spend at traffic lights and being stuck in traffic. An EV would have an advantage in fuel and pollution.

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Look at where they build the batteries for these things. The factories are in barron wastelands. 

th.jpg

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On ‎6‎/‎8‎/‎2018 at 5:30 PM, Lloyd said:

The comment about electric being more efficient than ICE even if you are using grid power is pure nonsense. Grid power delivered for use is almost always less than 25% efficient from power of the source fuel. Then you have charging, battery loss, discharging controlling the power to the motor and then the motor itself. Probably 15% is the highest source to motive power that you will see. If you are generating power from the sun at the point of use, it is a different game. It is still not free power or emission free power.

When you say grid power is generally less than 25% efficient, I'm assuming you are you referring to fossil fuel plants, can you please clarify?

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On 6/8/2018 at 6:01 PM, ronwagn said:

Zero emissions sources have their own issues such as visual pollution, bird chopping, disposal of the materials, etc 

Problems with solar power https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gTwu4bI13ewq6wHYSBhvwfRptf6NL8u-03vFEnrKscA/edit

Problems with wind turbines https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zx10GNbo8Oj7kDTxPF1vUZ5u0b8ce07zsEojs9U7u10/edit

Disposing of Nuclear Energy isn't really a problem the reason why is kept on ground on dry cask storage is because is usefull for fast reactors, which conver U-238 to Pu-239 and then use it, plus it got fission products in the rare earths and platinum group  you need only 763KG of Uranium-238 or Thorium-232 to generate the same energy as 1.97 million tons of coal, 3.8 million tons of lignite, or 1.14 million tons of natural gas.

Once you go on molten salt reactor the nuclear waste problem is trivial.

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On 6/8/2018 at 10:01 PM, ronwagn said:

Zero emissions sources have their own issues such as visual pollution, bird chopping, disposal of the materials, etc 

Problems with solar power https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gTwu4bI13ewq6wHYSBhvwfRptf6NL8u-03vFEnrKscA/edit

Problems with wind turbines https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zx10GNbo8Oj7kDTxPF1vUZ5u0b8ce07zsEojs9U7u10/edit

You can't beat Breitbart and the Daily Caller for reasoned debate and analysis can you. 

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A lot of EV owners have solar panels, which makes EV's very efficient.

 

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That is a good solution if convenient and with backup but I think it would be relatively rare. 

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Nick W, I am happy to debate with you. You don't seem to be offering any real information though. Tough that you don't like Breitbart.  Sans subsidies solar and wind are in big trouble. I am an advocate of using natural gas. It is cleaner overall, far less expensive, superabundant and available worldwide. Biogas and methane hydrates are also great sources. 

Useful References for the Natural Gas Revolution https://docs.google.com/document/d/19Yf0MWpo91vrlu-mmJtjB1ERukjJo5W41oi4RZVQBug/edit

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