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Building A $2 Billion Subsea Solar Power Cable From Chile To China

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11 hours ago, NickW said:

Care to extrapolate those  costs and apply to a >10,000 mile cable across an ocean over 10,000 metres in depth in places?

Considered the costs of doing a repair on a cable at that depth? 

Considered the transmission losses even with HVDC? 

The reason Tibetan solar is potentially viable  as a resource and chile is pie in the sky is:

  • Its relatively close
  • Its on home turf
  • It can be backed up with Hydro & peaking plant. 
  • Doesn't require the worlds entire copper supply to build it. 

Ah, finally, rationality in a discussion on intermittent energy sources.  No, it is NOT rational economically to try and power a country from the other side of the world or 1000's of kilometers away.  Hey, we finally agree.  So, from here on out we can all agree, powering countries from Pie in the Sky Utopia from other time zones and several borders long distances away as a topic can be laughed at properly.  Even before we talk about a little thing called war... 🙄

There is an exception here...  Bottom of Pacific ocean is ~2C and since zero oxygen down there, nothing rusts, so moving parts will last a VERY long time or radiators will also not clog up due to rust etc   We have superconductors which operate at -20C...  A superconductor cable with cooling/insulation would not require the worlds entire copper resources.  Just other rare elements instead....  🙄

There is a reason people have continually looked at solar based solar power beaming technology.  Problem is anything of that massive amount of power is truly one of the scariest weapons, or unintentional weapons on/above earth. 

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6 hours ago, NickW said:

1.4GW North Sea link (longest interconnector in the World) is 450 miles long and cost 2 billion Euros 

Using 1st world costs in the 3rd world, I shake my head.  You probably aren't old enough to remember the Aswan Dam.  Also remember Chile has more copper than any one else and they can manipulate that cost and make it a non-cash item.

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17 hours ago, NickW said:

The solar resource in Tibet is comparable to Chile (its a bit better there)  and year round too - I have already posted the figures on this thread

The 1.4GW North Sea link (worlds longest interconnector) cost 2 billion Euros to lay a set of cables 450 miles with transformers at either end. The North Sea is very shallow. 

Care to extrapolate those  costs and apply to a >10,000 mile cable across an ocean over 10,000 metres in depth in places?

Considered the costs of doing a repair on a cable at that depth? 

Considered the transmission losses even with HVDC? 

The reason Tibetan solar is potentially viable  as a resource and chile is pie in the sky is:

  • Its relatively close
  • Its on home turf
  • It can be backed up with Hydro & peaking plant. 
  • Doesn't require the worlds entire copper supply to build it. 
  • While China is on the same time zone geographically Tibet is 2-3 zones behind the eastern coastal areas. This means the Tibetan solar will be producing after nightfall in the East. 

 

 

 

 

How many years have you worked as a dispatcher? You don't know which has greater value.  I still my IBEW local 66 card and certification from IEEE as a Power Generation and Transmission specialist.

Logistics into Tibet are at best difficult.  Two, you have ethnic issues in Tibet.   You have never looked at a map to see the problems getting any  where in Tibet.  I knew growing up two American pilots who flew from the terminus of the Over the Hump flights in WWII to 14th AF bases.   Chinese pilots flew the Hump from India to China. Logistics in Tibet will be hell according to the stories  the two pilots told me. .   Repairs on a cable in the mountains  will be far worse fishing a cable off the bottom of the ocean based on China's experience in the north with Three Gorges Dam and the HVDC lines from it.  Fiber optic cable laying has made  mid latitude cable laying and repair routine not a Herculean effort the way power line work in western China is.  Check your facts rather than making something up.

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On 11/18/2021 at 3:34 PM, Meredith Poor said:

Chile, because Australia and Argentina are on China's ****-list.

China is on a lot more s--t lists. 😊

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6 hours ago, nsdp said:

Using 1st world costs in the 3rd world, I shake my head.  You probably aren't old enough to remember the Aswan Dam.  Also remember Chile has more copper than any one else and they can manipulate that cost and make it a non-cash item.

Chile's mining operators are not going to forgo >$10,000 ton for processed copper. 

 

This Chile - China cable really is the domain of Oil Price.coms crack pipe connoisseurs 🤣

A 3 GW cable, even if it can deliver 24/7 - 365 days a year (with solar.....) is 26 Twh

Lets say wholesale electricity price in China is 10c/kwh 

Thats $2.6 billion of revenue a year. 

From which you have to deduct

  • Cost of the solar farms
  • Building of the transmission both on land and submarine
  • Building the transformers
  • Operating the system
  • No doubt some taxes
  • In reality transmission losses with HVDC are about 1.5% per 1000km so the system will lose 15-20% of the input energy

 

NSL was 2 billion Euros through shallow seas. . Even if we assume the Pacific fantasy can be done at 1/3 the price per km the cable is 22x longer with double the capacity. You are looking at a 31 billion euro ($35 billion USD)  investment . 

 

 

 

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6 hours ago, nsdp said:

How many years have you worked as a dispatcher? You don't know which has greater value.  I still my IBEW local 66 card and certification from IEEE as a Power Generation and Transmission specialist.

Logistics into Tibet are at best difficult.  Two, you have ethnic issues in Tibet.   You have never looked at a map to see the problems getting any  where in Tibet.  I knew growing up two American pilots who flew from the terminus of the Over the Hump flights in WWII to 14th AF bases.   Chinese pilots flew the Hump from India to China. Logistics in Tibet will be hell according to the stories  the two pilots told me. .   Repairs on a cable in the mountains  will be far worse fishing a cable off the bottom of the ocean based on China's experience in the north with Three Gorges Dam and the HVDC lines from it.  Fiber optic cable laying has made  mid latitude cable laying and repair routine not a Herculean effort the way power line work in western China is.  Check your facts rather than making something up.

The hump is the Himalayas Mountains rather than the Tibetan plateau* that sits behind it.

None of this has stopped the Chinese building roads in Tibet or indeed large wind farms. Now if you can get wind turbines and towers up onto the plateau you can do it with solar as the plant is smaller and modular. 

Infact while on the subject of facts lets introduce some about solar in Tibet

This is What 4 Million Solar Panels Look Like From Space | Climate Central

Consortium for Battery Innovation | » China Shoto – World’s highest solar farm

Tibet: solar power has resolved electricity usage issues for over 600,000 people_News_TIBET

 

Let us know when they start laying the pacific cable. 

 

 

* Flat elevated table land

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(edited)

7 hours ago, nsdp said:

Using 1st world costs in the 3rd world, I shake my head.  You probably aren't old enough to remember the Aswan Dam.  Also remember Chile has more copper than any one else and they can manipulate that cost and make it a non-cash item.

the 3rd world? Chile 3rd world???? You obviously have never lived in Chile ....... Santiago makes any city in the US looks like the 3rd world. Metro system that is fabulous. High rises that can withstand 9.0 earthquakes with little to no damage.... Cost of housing in Chile???? Same as US..........You really should have quit before you posted on this thread. A cable from Chile to China??? who are you kidding. Once again invest in it ...you will be parted with your monies.

 

Santiago - Chile’s Capital and largest city

The Republic of Chile (officially) by this metrics ranks 42nd out of 189 countries and would thus be considered a FIRST WORLD nation by their HDI ranking.


Blue - “First World” - Yellow - “Second World” & Red - “Third World” based upon countries HDI score. Chile ranks 42, which falls into the “First World” category by this updated metric representation.

Blue - “First World” - Yellow - “Second World” & Red - “Third World” based upon countries HDI score. Chile ranks 42, which falls into the “First World” category by this updated metric representation.

Edited by notsonice

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