"We're Not Going to Negotiate Anymore"

[Zhong Lu + 845]

Let's just say the Chinese government lies a lot, just like Donald Trump, and leave it at that.  In terms of "integrity" and "general shittiness" I think Donald Trump and the Chinese government were made for each other.  

I'm not going to defend the integrity of the Chinese government.  But I will point out that anyone who supports Donald Trump has NO MORAL STANDING to criticize anyone else's integrity.  

Edited August 10, 2019 by Zhong Lu

[Zhong Lu + 845]

8 hours ago, Emil Kaneti said:

How so Russia?

Think about it.  If it wasn't for America, do you think Russia and China will get along? 

[BenFranklin'sSpectacles + 762]

1 hour ago, Zhong Lu said:

<shrug>  As will China.  

There's our answer: there won't be a deal. 

[JR EWING + 123]

On ‎8‎/‎8‎/‎2019 at 12:22 AM, Zhong Lu said:

Question: if there's no further negotiation or agreement on trade between US and China, what next? 

I agree that China loses.  But how exactly does the US "win?" 

While China may lose in the short term the US loses in the long term,

What China possesses in abundance is an ability to adapt and quickly, the US doesn't have this capability. The only thin the US is capable of doing quickly is starting wars, they fail to end them quickly but that's another story..

the US has weaponized trade, and are using sanctions to manipulate the markets. This is very apparent in the O & G industry today as it creates market share by imposing sanctions on producer countries.

Can anyone explain whether QE is a currency manipulation, and how does Trump propose to weaken the US dollar.

[JR EWING + 123]

27 minutes ago, BenFranklin'sSpectacles said:

There's our answer: there won't be a deal. 

the question is who decided that, my money is on China.

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,129]

2 hours ago, Zhong Lu said:

Let's just say the Chinese government lies a lot, just like Donald Trump, and leave it at that.  In terms of "integrity" and "general shittiness" I think Donald Trump and the Chinese government were made for each other.  

I'm not going to defend the integrity of the Chinese government.  But I will point out that anyone who supports Donald Trump has NO MORAL STANDING to criticize anyone else's integrity.  

Good thing politics, to those of us who are rational, are not often about morals but rather policy.  Policy Trumps those who are shifty with the truth for political gain or ego. 

Why there currently only 1 party worthy of a vote as the other has descended into Communist fantasies. 

Edited August 10, 2019 by Wastral

[Zhong Lu + 845]

I find that an odd sentiment considering that the Democrats in America aren't anything like the Communists in China.  

Edited August 10, 2019 by Zhong Lu

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

3 hours ago, Zhong Lu said:

I find it ironic that supporters of Donald Trump are bad mouthing China's integrity.  

Personally I think the Chinese government has as much integrity as the current American president.  

Okay, we'll note your opinion...

[Zhong Lu + 845]

1.  Trump lies as much as the Chinese government.

2.  Trump has had as many mistresses and extramarital affairs as the average high-level Communist member.

3.  Trump dodged the draft.  

4.  Trump tries to cheat the US government of as much of his taxable earnings as possible- again like the average high level Communist member.  

I'm not saying Trump is worse morally than the Chinese government.  Seems to me they're quite equivalent. The current president of the United State of America is not exactly a paragon of virtue.  

Edited August 10, 2019 by Zhong Lu

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

3 hours ago, Zhong Lu said:

Let's just say the Chinese government lies a lot, just like Donald Trump, and leave it at that.  In terms of "integrity" and "general shittiness" I think Donald Trump and the Chinese government were made for each other.  

I'm not going to defend the integrity of the Chinese government.  But I will point out that anyone who supports Donald Trump has NO MORAL STANDING to criticize anyone else's integrity.  

< eye roll >

So far in this and related anti-Trump threads, I've been labelled "stupid", "myopic" and now "no moral standing".  Anything else you want to add to the list?

 

 

 

[Zhong Lu + 845]

I'm not exactly anti-Trump.  Nor am I pro-Xi or pro-China. The only side I'm on is my own.  I like Donald Trump about as much as I like the average Chinese bureaucrat.  

The reference to "moral integrity" was in response to someone else attacking the morality of the China government.  I'm here to point out that any form of corruption you can accuse a Chinese bureaucrat of, you can also accuse Trump of.  In my eyes they appear to be very similar.  

Edited August 10, 2019 by Zhong Lu

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

1 hour ago, Zhong Lu said:

I'm not exactly anti-Trump.  Nor am I pro-Xi or pro-China. The only side I'm on is my own.  I like Donald Trump about as much as I like the average Chinese bureaucrat.  

The reference to "moral integrity" was in response to someone else attacking the morality of the China government.  I'm here to point out that any form of corruption you can accuse a Chinese bureaucrat of, you can also accuse Trump of.  In my eyes they appear to be very similar.  

I'm sorry I never learned Pinyin so this will be hard for you to read, but

E hu mau pi 

Or as Churchill would put it

https://youtu.be/TJ5sjFf4w1k

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

4 hours ago, Zhong Lu said:

1.  Trump lies as much as the Chinese government.

2.  Trump has had as many mistresses and extramarital affairs as the average high-level Communist member.

3.  Trump dodged the draft.  

4.  Trump tries to cheat the US government of as much of his taxable earnings as possible- again like the average high level Communist member.  

I'm not saying Trump is worse morally than the Chinese government.  Seems to me they're quite equivalent. The current president of the United State of America is not exactly a paragon of virtue.  

1. Please give us some examples of his lies.

2. Please show conclusively that Trump has had extra-marital affairs and mistresses.

3. Did Trump dodge the draft or was he legally excused? 

4. Did Trump 'hide' his taxable earnings or did he take advantage of legally existing loopholes?

Just as a matter of interest, what is the average number of mistresses and extra-marital affairs for you average high level Communist member?

[JR EWING + 123]

21 hours ago, Douglas Buckland said:

Everyone seems to enjoy mentioning the US debt. Does anyone have a listing of the debt of other developed countries?

only mentioned it as one poster thought that the US had 421 trillion in gold bullion stored up, and if that was the case I'm sure that US would have no debt.

[BenFranklin'sSpectacles + 762]

7 hours ago, JR EWING said:

the question is who decided that, my money is on China.

Does it really matter though? 

[BenFranklin'sSpectacles + 762]

6 hours ago, Zhong Lu said:

I find that an odd sentiment considering that the Democrats in America aren't anything like the Communists in China.  

I've heard this, but I have no way to confirm or deny.  Would you describe the differences?  I think that would be enlightening for everyone here. 

[Zhong Lu + 845]

It depends on which communists you're referring to.  If you're talking about the old guard Maoist communists, the Democrats are different because they're not jailing enemies of the state, encouraging agriculture reforms that may lead to a great famine, or starting wars in Korea or Vietnam. Say what you want of Mao, but he did do many big things (most of which backfired horribly), unlike Trump or the Democrats (who appear incapable of doing much of anything at all- instead they spend most of their time and energy shitting on one another- which as a libertarian I think is great).

If you're referring to the Chinese communists of today, well, the only things they care about is money and prestige.  A lot of them are more Republican than the average Republican.  

 

Edited August 10, 2019 by Zhong Lu

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

1 hour ago, Zhong Lu said:

It depends on which communists you're referring to.  If you're talking about the old guard Maoist communists, the Democrats are different because they're not jailing enemies of the state, encouraging agriculture reforms that may lead to a great famine, or starting wars in Korea or Vietnam. Say what you want of Mao, but he did do many big things (most of which backfired horribly), unlike Trump or the Democrats (who appear incapable of doing much of anything at all- instead they spend most of their time and energy shitting on one another- which as a libertarian I think is great).

If you're referring to the Chinese communists of today, well, the only things they care about is money and prestige.  A lot of them are more Republican than the average Republican.  

 

So, are you saying that engaging North Korea or confronting the trade issues with China are "big things"? From your comments, I would have assumed that you considered these issues of importance.

[Dmitry Bedin + 25]

On 8/7/2019 at 11:16 PM, Tom Kirkman said:

Subject: Remarks by President Trump Before Marine One Departure

The White House
Office of the Press Secretary
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
August 7, 2019

... THE PRESIDENT:  ... Our country is doing incredibly well. China is not doing well, if you look at the trade situation.

China just admitted yesterday that they've been a currency manipulator. First time they've ever been called out. Companies are moving out of China by the thousands, and our country is doing very well. We're going to see how it all works out. Somebody had to do this with China because they were taking hundreds of billions of dollars a year out of the United States. And somebody had to make a stand. So, I think our country is doing really well.

Q What's your reaction to the market reaction to the trade war? And what's next with China?

THE PRESIDENT: I think the market -- I think the market reaction is anticipated. I would have anticipated. I would have maybe anticipated even more. But ultimately, it's going to go much higher than it ever would have gone because China was like an anchor on us. China was killing us with unfair trade deals. The people that allowed that to happen are a disgrace. China, what they were doing to us, for years and years, taking hundreds of billions of dollars out, stealing intellectual property, targeting our farmers. All of that is ending, and they understand that.  ...

 

... Q Are you watching the stock market's reaction to China, sir?

THE PRESIDENT: I am. I think the market reaction is to be expected. I might've expected even more.

At some point, as I just said, we have to take on China. They've been taking -- look, they've been taking us to the cleaners for 25 years. This should've been done long before me as a President. You know the story better than anybody. You know it better than I do, frankly. Hundreds of billions of dollars a year taken out of our country. Stealing intellectual property.

And you know what? We, right now, we're sitting on top. We have money pouring in. We have powerful companies, strong companies. China is losing so many -- they're losing -- thousands and thousands of companies are leaving China now because of the tariffs. And we're in a very good position as to whether or not a deal will be made. I will tell you this: China would like to make a deal very badly.  ...

It is not smart to copy-past mentally disorded guy’s opinion as the answer. Almost every bold sentense failed facts-checking. GL

[Dmitry Bedin + 25]

A lovely topic where inteligent americans are prooving their inteligency at their best.

my 5c. 

To be competitor of China, US must become China. All Huawei story tell only one clear fact - fear. China is not like 20 years ago, not like 10 years ago.

Trade deficit. Thats my favorite:

- China’s export to US is only 20% of it’s global export. 29% is machinery, 28% electrinics. 20% texiles.

- US export to China is 27.86% agriculture. 23% vehicles 11% chemicals.

Trade deficit 3.2 now. Or 330 Bln $.

So, China export to US fine products, US esport to China raw materials.

Attempt of US to slow down develompent of China is same as to cut the leg before the marathon to blame the others runners in whatever. Tariffs is the most “red-neck” approach to marco economisc of any.

It is really an “american-inteligent” way of doing business with partners. If your partnes not Costa-Rica or Poland ( read puppy).

GL everybody

[ronwagn + 6,290]

11 hours ago, Zhong Lu said:

I find that an odd sentiment considering that the Democrats in America aren't anything like the Communists in China.  

The communists in China are actually full blown fascists. All countries I know of are fascist to some extent. Ayn Rand said:

The difference between [socialism and fascism] is superficial and purely formal, but it is significant psychologically: it brings the authoritarian nature of a planned economy crudely into the open. The main characteristic of socialism (and of communism) is public ownership of the means of production, and, therefore, the abolition of private property. The right to property is the right of use and disposal. Under fascism, men retain the semblance or pretense of private property, but the government holds total power over its use and disposal.

Ayn Rand

https://www.azquotes.com/author/12074-Ayn_Rand 25 quotes.

Even the United States is fascist IMHO. At least in my state of Illinois, and where I live now (Illinois) California, New York, New Jersey, Taxachusetts  are five of the worst. Those are two of the worst Demoncrat states IMO. Many people are leaving because they cannot afford their property and other taxes. Unfortunately they often stick with "progressive" politics wherever they go. 

Edited August 10, 2019 by ronwagn
reference

[ronwagn + 6,290]

7 minutes ago, Dmitry Bedin said:

A lovely topic where inteligent americans are prooving their inteligency at their best.

my 5c. 

To be competitor of China, US must become China. All Huawei story tell only one clear fact - fear. China is not like 20 years ago, not like 10 years ago.

Trade deficit. Thats my favorite:

- China’s export to US is only 20% of it’s global export. 29% is machinery, 28% electrinics. 20% texiles.

- US export to China is 27.86% agriculture. 23% vehicles 11% chemicals.

Trade deficit 3.2 now. Or 330 Bln $.

So, China export to US fine products, US esport to China raw materials.

Attempt of US to slow down develompent of China is same as to cut the leg before the marathon to blame the others runners in whatever. Tariffs is the most “red-neck” approach to marco economisc of any.

It is really an “american-inteligent” way of doing business with partners. If your partnes not Costa-Rica or Poland ( read puppy).

GL everybody

China is no more a partner than North Korea, Russia, Iran, Turkey, Cuba, etc. We are finally facing the truth because we have a very good leader in office. That makes our competitors very nervous, upset, and fretful. It is like denying children privileges for acting bad. 

[ronwagn + 6,290]

11 hours ago, Zhong Lu said:

I find that an odd sentiment considering that the Democrats in America aren't anything like the Communists in China.  

Only because the Demoncrats do not have enough power. Their wishes are slowly being realized in the states that they fully control. Thank God we have a good Constitution and Bill of Rights. Of course that is often ignored in those states. Our Judicial system is also subject to corruption as we have seen in recent history. I heard of one judge who told someone in his court that if the mentioned the Constitution one more time he would throw him in jail. 

[Zhong Lu + 845]

4 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

Only because the Demoncrats do not have enough power. Their wishes are slowly being realized in the states that they fully control. Thank God we have a good Constitution and Bill of Rights. Of course that is often ignored in those states. Our Judicial system is also subject to corruption as we have seen in recent history. I heard of one judge who told someone in his court that if the mentioned the Constitution one more time he would throw him in jail. 

I sorta agree, but I don't trust Trump's side either.  My position is simple: I want the US government divided. If the Democrats are in power, I support the Republicans, and if the Republicans are in power I support the Democrats.  Currently I'm neutral.  If Joe Biden wins, I hope Republicans continue to control the Senate.  

[ronwagn + 6,290]

4 minutes ago, Zhong Lu said:

I sorta agree, but I don't trust Trump's side either.  My position is simple: I want the US government divided. If the Democrats are in power, I support the Republicans, and if the Republicans are in power I support the Democrats.  Currently I'm neutral.  If Joe Biden wins, I hope Republicans continue to control the Senate.  

IMO we need to stop the Demoncrats from taking this country the route of Venezuela.