Energy from thin air?

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

24-7 clean energy from thin air

Guess we can all just pack it in, life's good.  

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

2 hours ago, Ward Smith said:

24-7 clean energy from thin air

Guess we can all just pack it in, life's good.  

Feel the power!

"The devices produce a sustained voltage of around 0.5 volts across a 7-micrometre-thick film, with a current density of around 17 microamperes per square centimetre."

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2010-9

Edited February 18, 2020 by Enthalpic

[ronwagn + 6,290]

I was just getting ready to post this myself. I wonder if it will be scalable!

[0R0 + 6,251]

I wonder where the precipitate goes. The protein nanowires can hardly be expected to absorb water indefinitely, it has to come out somewhere to clear the way for more energy laden vapor to come in. 

I can already see it made to work with a source of warm humid air from NG fired boilers....

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

17 minutes ago, 0R0 said:

I wonder where the precipitate goes. The protein nanowires can hardly be expected to absorb water indefinitely, it has to come out somewhere to clear the way for more energy laden vapor to come in. 

I can already see it made to work with a source of warm humid air from NG fired boilers....

Condensate.

It appears it just works with a wetter side and a drier side and the moisture gradient yields a small voltage.

"We find the driving force behind this energy generation to be a self-maintained moisture gradient that forms within the film when the film is exposed to the humidity that is naturally present in air."

Edited February 18, 2020 by Enthalpic

[Otis11 + 551]

So what's driving that moisture gradient? If it's 'self-maintained' and 'energy producing' that's essentially a perpetual motion machine. (which violates physics)

What am I missing?

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

4 minutes ago, Otis11 said:

So what's driving that moisture gradient? If it's 'self-maintained' and 'energy producing' that's essentially a perpetual motion machine. (which violates physics)

What am I missing?

Evaporation on one side (more hydrophobic surface), condensation on the other side (more hygroscopic surface).

Heat would drive the evaporation - no violation of energy conservation.

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

If you just want a fantastically small amount of "free energy."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vacuum_energy

https://phys.org/news/2017-04-harness-mysterious-casimir-tiny-devices.html

[ronwagn + 6,290]

11 minutes ago, Enthalpic said:

If you just want a fantastically small amount of "free energy."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vacuum_energy

https://phys.org/news/2017-04-harness-mysterious-casimir-tiny-devices.html

Do you see andy hope for scalability?

 

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

5 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

Do you see any hope for scalability?

 

No

Edited February 19, 2020 by Enthalpic

[ronwagn + 6,290]

49 minutes ago, Enthalpic said:

No

Thanks, phew, I was going to dump all my energy stocks. 

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

You can also make mechanical energy from humidity/water and ambient heat.  

https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/energy/a16045/evaporation-engine/

Once again very small amounts of power. 

The things work a lot better when you add additional external heat... basically inventing a steam engine LOL.

[0R0 + 6,251]

5 hours ago, Enthalpic said:

Evaporation on one side (more hydrophobic surface), condensation on the other side (more hygroscopic surface).

Heat would drive the evaporation - no violation of energy conservation.

Without reading the details, the energy should be coming from the latent heat of the vapor condensing, so the water should not be re-evaporating if you got any significant current from the contraption. So it should drip on the bottom.

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

10 minutes ago, 0R0 said:

Without reading the details, the energy should be coming from the latent heat of the vapor condensing, so the water should not be re-evaporating if you got any significant current from the contraption. So it should drip on the bottom.

You don't. 

I'm far from an expert on this device (sadly, I can't even access Nature from home anymore) but I would just call it a tiny heat energy capture device.  The energy is clearly not coming from any net chemical reaction or phase change.

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

17 hours ago, 0R0 said:

I wonder where the precipitate goes. The protein nanowires can hardly be expected to absorb water indefinitely, it has to come out somewhere to clear the way for more energy laden vapor to come in. 

I can already see it made to work with a source of warm humid air from NG fired boilers....

When I read the article they talked about adsorbtion which is different than absorption. So the water would stay on the surface basically. I'm not going to support their contentions, just thought it was interesting. The hype train never seems to leave the station though…

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

12 hours ago, Ward Smith said:

When I read the article they talked about adsorbtion which is different than absorption. So the water would stay on the surface basically. I'm not going to support their contentions, just thought it was interesting. The hype train never seems to leave the station though…

There must be some diffusion from the wet side to the dry side to have a proper gradient.

Otherwise I like your correction - the wet side is almost certainty driven mostly by adsorption / hygroscopy.