Poland closes all schools and kindergartens for 2 weeks. Children are the most efficient, stealth spreaders of coronavirus.

[Marcin2 + 726]

Polish PM Mateusz Morawiecki just announced closing of all schools, kindegartens and similar institutions for children starting Monday 16 March 2020, for 2 weeks.

Parent are strongly advised to voluntarily keep children at home starting today.

We have already 22 cases in Poland.

Children are the best, most effcient, stealth spreaders of all contagious diseases, also coronavirus disease

Major recent epidemics of flu point to children as spreaders of the virus. Children have mild symptoms, or no symptoms at all. Their parents and other adult relatives suffer from serious cases.

The same is with coronavirus:

- Vast majority of children, especially small children had mild symptoms or no symptoms at all, virtually no developed serious symptoms like pneumonia.

- No children below the age of 9 died from the disease globally,

- Studies show that even asymptomatic kids or with common cold symptoms are contagious,

- Children are interracting with each other, spreading the virus very fast for the whole group and care providers,

- They next spread the virus to the parent and other relative

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

13 minutes ago, Marcin2 said:

They next spread the virus to the parent and other relative

Yes exactly!

Shutting the schools will achieve absolutely nothing, in fact it will probably make things worse as they are more likely to infect their extended family and also I presume they are able to go out to shops etc and are therefore more likely to spread it to the general population.

Not one of Poland's sharpest policies IMO.

[Guillaume Albasini + 851]

Here in Switzerland there is some debate about this question.

If the schools are closed who will be in charge of the children while their parents are at work ? In many cases it will be the grand-parents. The parents will bring the children in the morning and bring them back in the evening, increasing the interactions and the risk of contaminating the people who are the more at risk.

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

So this is essentially yet another poorly thought out mechanism by a government to make the ‘unwashed masses’ think that they are forward thinking and doing SOMETHING’ to prevent the fear driven virus from spreading.

IT’S A FLU, just use you heads for something besides growing hair!

This politically correct victim mentality is getting old....

[Marcin2 + 726]

8 hours ago, Guillaume Albasini said:

Here in Switzerland there is some debate about this question.

If the schools are closed who will be in charge of the children while their parents are at work ? In many cases it will be the grand-parents. The parents will bring the children in the morning and bring them back in the evening, increasing the interactions and the risk of contaminating the people who are the more at risk.

Interraction children&their grandparents is as contagious as interraction children&their parents. I agree.

The clue is that interraction child&child is also very contagious, and each child has such interraction with at least 20 other children during each day at school/kindergarten. So 1 coronavirus positive child could spread the virus to even 50 other children before its parents also get ill. Remember that children continue spreading the virus UNTIL their caregivers get ill, it is a lot of delay, cause the children themselves in vast majority of cases have mild symptoms and are suspected potential cariers.

That is why In the beginning of the epidemic when there are not so many cases, and all cases could be tracked and contacts quarantined, closing of schools has a lot of sense.

China was able to contain epidemic, and South Korea and Japan seem to be on the good path: each of the 3  because of the strong quarantine regimes since the beginning of the outbreak. South Korea/Japan also because of fast testing of thousands of people (up to 20,000 daily in first days) - so kept track of the disease before it became unwieldy.

Italy is the first country where we can observe how epidemic can look when authorities are too weak or cannot act decisively for other reasons.

Well, Iran was probably the first that was overhelmed by epidemic but they can calm dissent and censor information, so Italy is the first democratic country.

 

Edited March 11, 2020 by Marcin2
typo

[Marcin2 + 726]

8 hours ago, Douglas Buckland said:

So this is essentially yet another poorly thought out mechanism by a government to make the ‘unwashed masses’ think that they are forward thinking and doing SOMETHING’ to prevent the fear driven virus from spreading.

IT’S A FLU, just use you heads for something besides growing hair!

This politically correct victim mentality is getting old....

Douglas, lets wait another 10 days and return to this discussion on exactly 21 March 2020.

I bet US would have 10,000+ cases and schools would be closed, at least in California, New York and a few other states.

[0R0 + 6,251]

8 hours ago, Rob Plant said:

Yes exactly!

Shutting the schools will achieve absolutely nothing, in fact it will probably make things worse as they are more likely to infect their extended family and also I presume they are able to go out to shops etc and are therefore more likely to spread it to the general population.

Not one of Poland's sharpest policies IMO.

IT will help. Schools are better spreaders than he Diamond Princess for viruses. Schools are like petri dishes for infections. 

This is a good response where there have been confirmed community spread. Overly aggressive as a national policy. But it helps. 

[Coffeeguyzz + 454]

Mr. Buckland/Mr. Marcin2

If I were to post one week ago that soldiers would be patrolling a town 25 miles away from NYC in efforts to enforce a mandatory quarantine, you all would understandably ridicule me, dismiss my "rants", and probably seek to cyber banish me out with the other "kooks".

National Guard troops are - right this moment - patrolling the streets of New Rochelle to effect this government mandated quarantine.

 

Suggest folks keep a close eye on northern Italy's unfolding tragedy as it seems to be coming to an area right near you in the coming weeks (days?). 

 

Quote seen online ... "Whatever we do ahead of time for a pandemic will seem to be over reacting. Whatever we do after the fact will seem to be insufficient."

Just so.

 

History books will mark this time as a significant event.

The then-past is still to be written.

[0R0 + 6,251]

40 minutes ago, Coffeeguyzz said:

Mr. Buckland/Mr. Marcin2

If I were to post one week ago that soldiers would be patrolling a town 25 miles away from NYC in efforts to enforce a mandatory quarantine, you all would understandably ridicule me, dismiss my "rants", and probably seek to cyber banish me out with the other "kooks".

National Guard troops are - right this moment - patrolling the streets of New Rochelle to effect this government mandated quarantine.

 

Suggest folks keep a close eye on northern Italy's unfolding tragedy as it seems to be coming to an area right near you in the coming weeks (days?). 

 

Quote seen online ... "Whatever we do ahead of time for a pandemic will seem to be over reacting. Whatever we do after the fact will seem to be insufficient."

Just so.

 

History books will mark this time as a significant event.

The then-past is still to be written.

I think the overall quarantine in Italy was an incorrect response. It was  unnecessarily harsh and counterproductive. It sabotages the entire economy and the health care system as well. Besides which, in Italy, with a 40% tax avoidance rate, it is not bloody likely that any of this will be a reality on the ground. 

[Tomasz + 1,608]

Marcin's rectors closed classes at the University of Warsaw and they closed schools, so yesterday several thousand students were waiting in order for books in the University of Warsaw Library, and the young were supposedly wandering around all Warsaw shopping malls.

In my opinion, this is more PR action because the government must demonstrate itself before the May presidential election

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

6 hours ago, Marcin2 said:

Douglas, lets wait another 10 days and return to this discussion on exactly 21 March 2020.

I bet US would have 10,000+ cases and schools would be closed, at least in California, New York and a few other states.

Whether the US does it or not does not diminish the fact that it is a politically morivated knee jerk reaction!

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

12 hours ago, 0R0 said:

IT will help. Schools are better spreaders than he Diamond Princess for viruses. Schools are like petri dishes for infections. 

This is a good response where there have been confirmed community spread. Overly aggressive as a national policy. But it helps. 

As Guillaume points out who looks after the children when they aren't at school? Not the parents as they'll be at work.

So who does that leave?? yes you've got it the grandparents, the MOST susceptible demograph and the MOST likely to die from catching it.

if you think that is a good response and a good idea then I dont understand your logic at all.

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

The US bans all flights from the EU but not the UK.

I just don't get this response by POTUS at all, I think this is purely a political decision to be seen to be doing something.

Surely the orange man knows that Heathrow in London is the main Euro hub for transatlantic flights and that many Europeans normally get a connecting flight from their country to Heathrow and then on to the States.

How many Europeans are going to admit that is what they have done if challenged and potentially be refused entry to the USA? London has 40%+ foreign nationals living in it so very hard to establish if a European isnt actually living in England and has been for years.

Knee jerk, poorly thought through reaction.

 

[0R0 + 6,251]

39 minutes ago, Rob Plant said:

As Guillaume points out who looks after the children when they aren't at school? Not the parents as they'll be at work.

So who does that leave?? yes you've got it the grandparents, the MOST susceptible demograph and the MOST likely to die from catching it.

if you think that is a good response and a good idea then I dont understand your logic at all.

They are doing this earlier than other places in their progression. It is still low risk to grandma, and quite effective in restricting transmission through children. 

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

This was posted by @Bob D on another thread and is very interesting but also scary, Its definitely worth reading.

https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-act-today-or-people-will-die-f4d3d9cd99ca

[Guillaume Albasini + 851]

As Tomas Pueyo shows in his excellent analysis, the lockdown of Wuhan was decided when the known number of cases reached 400. And this decision had an effective impact. Italy waited for too long deciding the lockdown when they reached 10'000 cases.

Now 15 countries are already over the 400 threshold that triggered the lockdown in Wuhan. I think we'll see an increasing number of countries in lockdown in the coming days.

Just closing schools or banning air travel will not be enough to really have en impact.

Edited March 12, 2020 by Guillaume Albasini
typo

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

This guy has got a lot to answer for!

[Geoff Guenther + 317]

39 minutes ago, Guillaume Albasini said:

As Tomas Pueyo shows in his excellent analysis, the lockdown of Wuhan was decided when the known number of cases reached 400. And this decision had an effective impact. Italy waited for too long deciding the lockdown when they reached 10'000 cases.

That is some great analysis, and the governments should be using that as the basis for both policy and communication right now. 

Last night's bizarre speech - blaming everything on foreigners when the virus has already been circulating in the US for two months - was completely unhelpful and has just battered markets even more. Like you said, we're two months late for the policies announced. 

What are the domestic policies? Are we going to stop the St Patrick's Day parade? What were the problems with the testing and when do you think people can start getting tested? 

Four years ago the US would have taken the lead worldwide in stemming the crisis. Today the country is trying not to implode on itself while it puts up walls all around. 

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

20 minutes ago, Geoff Guenther said:

Are we going to stop the St Patrick's Day parade

I believe this is cancelled for the first time ever

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

55 minutes ago, Rob Plant said:

This guy has got a lot to answer for!

Well done! You’ve found the heathen! Is he Chinese?

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

John from Oxford apparently

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

3 minutes ago, Rob Plant said:

John from Oxford apparently

Clever how he initiated his nefarious plan in Wuhan. Undoubtedly an MI6 man...😂

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

The Coronavirus isn’t all bad!

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

4 minutes ago, Rob Plant said:

The Coronavirus isn’t all bad!

I’ll take a six pack, please...

[Geoff Guenther + 317]

8 minutes ago, Rob Plant said:

The Coronavirus isn’t all bad!

Where can I get checked?