Hot mic at White House Covid press briefing. "Everybody here's been vaccinated anyway."

[0R0 + 6,251]

2 hours ago, frankfurter said:

Normally, I ignore people like you. But your hatred is blind and runs deep, and thus is the most dangerous.

Your govt has an agenda you do not see. Your CDC is but a tool, and has deliberately withheld information to mislead citizens.   The fact is, millions are indeed infected.  Your govt simply refuses to test people for antigens: these tests can prove infected people prior to the Wuhan outbreak. The simplest means to debunk the claim about the athletes is to publicly identify them, test them, and release the results. Your govt refuses this.  WHY? The CDC has removed reports about the very large spike in 'flu' cases during Nov 2019, following the return of the military 'athletes'.  Those 'flu' cases resulted in abnormally high deaths.   The question to all this is WHY? 

Add to this picture is the now proven research for the types of covid; A, B, C.  Type A is the origin. B can come from A only: A cannot come from B.  Virtually all covid cases tested so far in the USA are type A.  No type A are found among the ethnic Chinese in China; all ethnics have type B. The only type A cases found in China are white caucasian, American expats, who were residing in Wuhan prior to the outbreak.

These factors, together with many others, indicate the USA is the origin. 

 

 

You are interpreting the article incorrectly, and the assumption that the virus was initially A and mutated to B because viruses of type A are closer to the naturally occurring ones is inherently false. An artificial virus tends to revert to its original form. Type A  would then be a later virus. Since the testing was done by Chinese with CCP control on US expats in Wuhan, it would only be possible for the results to conform to the narrative from the CCP. 

Hence it is all propaganda. In the US, you can ask the soldiers in question to do the tests, but you can't make them do it nor publish it unless they permit it. This is not China, not even for soldiers in active duty.

As you may have noticed on flu spikes, there are many of them in many years. Ha it been this extremely contagious virus, then the timeline of spread would not have been what it is. 

The CDC did indeed lie and hide the truth by repeating what China and the WHO had said, and by fumbling and sabotaging testing for the purpose you pointed out, of creating a "1984" world. Which you pretty much live in in the CCP's China. Do your country and the world a favor and dump a CCP official out the window A useful wikileak would come in handy too.

 

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

Just as an aside...

There is so much dissenting opinion and opposing theories being spouted, from medical experts, or simply opinions from those who appear to be medically inclined on this forum (for example), and from the national and international health organizations.....is it any wonder the masses are simply calling ‘bullshit’ and wanting to go back to work!

[frankfurter + 562]

4 hours ago, 0R0 said:

You are interpreting the article incorrectly, and the assumption that the virus was initially A and mutated to B because viruses of type A are closer to the naturally occurring ones is inherently false. An artificial virus tends to revert to its original form. Type A  would then be a later virus. Since the testing was done by Chinese with CCP control on US expats in Wuhan, it would only be possible for the results to conform to the narrative from the CCP. 

Hence it is all propaganda. In the US, you can ask the soldiers in question to do the tests, but you can't make them do it nor publish it unless they permit it. This is not China, not even for soldiers in active duty.

As you may have noticed on flu spikes, there are many of them in many years. Ha it been this extremely contagious virus, then the timeline of spread would not have been what it is. 

The CDC did indeed lie and hide the truth by repeating what China and the WHO had said, and by fumbling and sabotaging testing for the purpose you pointed out, of creating a "1984" world. Which you pretty much live in in the CCP's China. Do your country and the world a favor and dump a CCP official out the window A useful wikileak would come in handy too.

 

A virus reverts to a previous state, as in retro-mutation?  very interesting.

Whatever your position and hatred to China, China is beyond anything you or your country could do to harm and subdue China.  By attempting to harm China, you are simply harming yourselves.  1984 is not a danger, not an issue for China: the people accept their state, for reasons I doubt you would comprehend and accept, and nothing you would or could do will change them.

The danger of 1984 is for the USA.  China is your enemy only because you choose to make her so.  Your real enemy is within.

 

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

4 hours ago, Douglas Buckland said:

Just as an aside...

There is so much dissenting opinion and opposing theories being spouted, from medical experts, or simply opinions from those who appear to be medically inclined on this forum (for example), and from the national and international health organizations.....is it any wonder the masses are simply calling ‘bullshit’ and wanting to go back to work!

You are right, Douglas.

Another thing that gets me, as always, with the MSM (I have an interesting take on them in a minute) is that they continuously, without fail, portray Midwesterners (or really anyone that doesn't live in New York, Washington D.C., Los Angeles, San Francisco, Seattle and a few others) as simply behind the times, at least, certainly not highly educated, and usually holding a gun and a beer, while wandering aimlessly through life in the hills.  They will descend on places like the courthouse we recently saw portrayed during the Michigan protests, and take lots of photos; but the only photo they will print is the one where a few of our farm boys get together in front of the courthouse dressed in their finest hunting garb and holding one kind of rifle or another.  Those boys are there, sure enough, but we see them as more or less typical, successful farmers, truckers, factory and shop managers, hell even oil field workers.  We KNOW they are by and large hard working, dependable, honest guys who would go out of their way to right a wrong and to lend a helping hand to anyone who needs it.  They/we come from very nice places like this, or maybe 20 miles outside of town (don't spread this to very many city folk; they might try to move here):

Some people might be surprised that most of us don't go around with rifles at the ready and a beer in our hand.  Most of us dress well and go to jobs that even require us to dress nicely, but usually not in an unnecessary suit and tie.  We even have clothing stores IN our towns where we can buy nice clothes.  Amazing, isn't it?  We are Doctors, Lawyers, scientists, EMTs, Farmers, Gas Station owners, Executives, Office workers, Small Business owners and employees, Sheriffs and police officers, construction workers, and every other kind of professionals.  MANY of these people are Veterans, proud of having served our country in uniform.  We are proud of those soldiers, we respect those soldiers, and we thank them for their service; not because it is PC but because we truly appreciate what they do to allow us to live our lives the way we choose to.

AS for MSM and why we tend to call them MSM:  We call them MSM (Mainstream Media) because they only represent the cities listed above, and a few others.  They skip ALL of us, entirely.  We don't count to them.  Boo-hoo  !  But in reality nobody cries about it, not for a minute.  They write us off so they are the MSM.  In the Midwest, and other places outside that list of cities, good journalism is going strong.  We demand it.  Our local governments will hear court cases against news organizations that report falsehoods and slander.  We will see to it that news organizations that practice such tactics are driven out of the market.  Sometimes, when a given cause is great enough, we will protest in front of our capital buildings, statehouses and court buildings.  And our local governments pay attention.   They know they'd better because they are our neighbors, and we will tell them to get it together to their face, over the fence, at the store, in the barbershop, at a restaurant, at a high school game or even in their taxpayer provided offices if necessary.

Okay, rant over.

[Ernst Reim + 33]

7 hours ago, 0R0 said:

Wrong on both counts. 

Sunlight does help and so does humidity. Humidity effects are insufficient to bring R0 down close enough to 1 where the propagation is just self sustaining. But R0 correlations do show a decline with higher humidity and temperature.

The flu also goes down when it gets warm outside. That is because people spent more time outdoors then indoors, take the bike or walk to work, instead of taking the subway etc. All this decreases R0 simply because it increases average distance and reduces the actual amount of shared air. But it has nothing to do with the disinfecting effect of sunlight!

The study Ward was referring to showed a decline to 50% in 2 min under sunlight and in humid air. That is important, since it essentially means that we do not have to worry about fomite pathways outside and, for example, that we do not have to start disinfecting playgrounds every evening. But, although I do not have any values about the typical droplet lifetime between exhalation and infectious inhalation, I really do not see how reducing the viral count to 50% in 2 min can reduce R0 significantly in direct droplet infection.

[0R0 + 6,251]

3 hours ago, Ernst Reim said:

I really do not see how reducing the viral count to 50% in 2 min can reduce R0 significantly in direct droplet infection

You are presuming that the virus spreads quickly through direct contact. It is not how it seems to work outside of the confined quarters of subways buses and elevators. It spreads both through that and longer distances of fine aerosol droplets hanging in the air in enclosed spaces for 3 hours, and in long time frames of several days on surfaces indoors. 

The main issue with direct contact is that you get a much higher initial infection dose. Thus the virus has a head start over your immune response in the race. So you are more likely to develop symptoms in that case.  

[0R0 + 6,251]

6 hours ago, frankfurter said:

A virus reverts to a previous state, as in retro-mutation?  very interesting.

Whatever your position and hatred to China, China is beyond anything you or your country could do to harm and subdue China.  By attempting to harm China, you are simply harming yourselves.  1984 is not a danger, not an issue for China: the people accept their state, for reasons I doubt you would comprehend and accept, and nothing you would or could do will change them.

The danger of 1984 is for the USA.  China is your enemy only because you choose to make her so.  Your real enemy is within.

 

You are already living within a "1984" situation within China for a decade. 

The reversion by mutation to a stable form of the virus close to its natural state is the necessary outcome of having artificial (or accidental) components hacked onto the original virus. Those had no evolutionary advantage so are shed in subsequent mutations. Dr. Luc Montagnier, Nobel prize winning virologist explains it simply. I referenced him to you before. You are obviously not allowed to incorporate information into your narrative. 

I absolutely like the Chinese people, I abhor the CCP as the genocidal remnant left from the Soviet empire to control China on behalf of themselves and in the name of a defunct social movement. Your excuse for Chinese "accepting their state" is precisely what the "1984" scenario is about. That is a clear indication that you are living within it. 

Do your people a favor and dump a CCP official out the window. The world will be a better place. 

[SUZNV + 1,197]

7 hours ago, frankfurter said:

A virus reverts to a previous state, as in retro-mutation?  very interesting.

Whatever your position and hatred to China, China is beyond anything you or your country could do to harm and subdue China.  By attempting to harm China, you are simply harming yourselves.  1984 is not a danger, not an issue for China: the people accept their state, for reasons I doubt you would comprehend and accept, and nothing you would or could do will change them.

The danger of 1984 is for the USA.  China is your enemy only because you choose to make her so.  Your real enemy is within.

 

Reversely, CCP chose to be hostile with Western Democracy Countries as a friendship between Chinise people with others will undermine their totalitarian power, Chinese will love to exercise their democratic rights. Especially scine Tiananmen Square where Chinese students wanted democracy. Their diplomacy is only for exports, stealing IPs,resources and corrupting politicians and gained power from these with the help of traitorous politicians, greedy corps and mainstreams and a bunch of mainstream zealots and free riders that can tolerate CCP crimes but cannot tolerate their own people who work hard to pay tax and have different views. Or the countries whose economies are held as hostages so their citizen rather expect US to do more to help them rather than standing up against CCP's crime.  US even without Republican or Democrat is still US, China without CCP is still China, had China only existed since 1951? 

People who say CCP China is too powerful to do anything and should work with them for mutual benefits are simply taking excuses for selling out their country benefit or to hide their corruptions or being selfish gain from other's pain (Chinese or not Chinese) They simply are eating on their children's future. Do free people have to pay ransom for freedom?

Real enemy is from within:

Quote

 

“It’s something we are looking at,” O’Brien responded when asked at the conservative Heritage Foundation thinktank if the federal government could examine CalPERS’ investments in Chinese defense firms. “It’s an issue of security for American investors.”

The California state executive agency is the largest U.S. public pension fund. It manages pension and health benefits for more than 1.6 million California public employees, retirees, and their families. A CalPERS representative did not immediately return a request for comment.

“Some of the CalPERS investment policies are incredibly concerning,” O’Brien said. “We’ve got folks who are going to rely on their pension for their retirement and putting those investments into companies that don’t have GAAP accounting and they don’t have the same reporting requirements that American companies do is scary.”

“If someone told me I had to invest my 401(k) in Chinese state-owned enterprises or partially state-owned enterprises, where they don’t follow the generally accepted accounting principles and they don’t have to report to independent regulatory bodies, I’d be pretty worried about that,” he continued.

“It’s something we are taking a look at and it’s concerning and, moreover, OK, why are we sending American capital to a country and supporting a defense industry that is popping out a couple of destroyers and frigates a month and threatening to have total over-mass against us in the Indo-Pacific,” O’Brien said.

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-china-calpers/u-s-looking-at-calpers-holdings-in-chinese-defense-firms-top-white-house-official-idUSKBN20Y2GS

Why should anyone invested in China not hate Trump for this? The hostage is right there.

Edited April 28, 2020 by SUZNV

[frankfurter + 562]

6 hours ago, 0R0 said:

You are already living within a "1984" situation within China for a decade. 

The reversion by mutation to a stable form of the virus close to its natural state is the necessary outcome of having artificial (or accidental) components hacked onto the original virus. Those had no evolutionary advantage so are shed in subsequent mutations. Dr. Luc Montagnier, Nobel prize winning virologist explains it simply. I referenced him to you before. You are obviously not allowed to incorporate information into your narrative. 

I absolutely like the Chinese people, I abhor the CCP as the genocidal remnant left from the Soviet empire to control China on behalf of themselves and in the name of a defunct social movement. Your excuse for Chinese "accepting their state" is precisely what the "1984" scenario is about. That is a clear indication that you are living within it. 

Do your people a favor and dump a CCP official out the window. The world will be a better place. 

Congrats. You hit the hammer with the nail. Seems subtlety is lost here. 

Seems Montagnier is now a rather controversial figure. I can find no paper wherein he documents his science to prove this covid retro-mutates to some earlier form. 

 

 

[frankfurter + 562]

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/chinagate-new-russiagate-and-far-more-dangerous

uncanny. I was about to write something similar. zerohedge spared me the effort and time. 

 

[0R0 + 6,251]

1 hour ago, frankfurter said:

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/chinagate-new-russiagate-and-far-more-dangerous

uncanny. I was about to write something similar. zerohedge spared me the effort and time. 

 

For once you are right. And what are you doing about it in your own country?

Edited April 29, 2020 by 0R0

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

On 4/22/2020 at 5:51 AM, Dan Warnick said:

• Enough people agree that enough is enough, and go to their State Capitals to openly protest for their Constitutional rights.  The President quietly, respectfully, voices support for the people.  Good people.  Nice, peaceful, organized people, fighting for their rights.  (Dominos, anyone?)  
• Governors are now in a quandary, and their first rebuttals to these protests actually show they may have overstepped their legal authority.  True or not is immaterial at that point.
• That shames the Governors, who are now worried about their reelection bids, into quickly announcing their (accelerated) plans to end the isolation.  They have just played right into the President's hand.  They have clearly taken responsibility for the lockdown and they have been shamed by the people into lifting it.  
• If the isolation is found to have been lifted too early and a second wave comes, it's on the Governors.  Trump will no-doubt point out that he wouldn't have done it that way.  "I think it was too soon, but the Governors were the ones with that difficult call".  "They made it clear I didn't have the authority".  In the unlikely event that no second wave comes, Trump can say he pushed the Governors to lift the isolation much earlier than they would have.

California, of all places (They abhor Trump and all of us), after the governor's losing weekend corralling his citizens away from the beaches, made this announcement today:

Newsom: California to begin reopening in 'weeks,' may start school year in July

OAKLAND, Calif. — California schools could welcome back students this summer and retail and manufacturing businesses could reopen in the coming weeks, Gov. Gavin Newsom said Tuesday as he offered his most concrete glimpse yet of what a gradual reopening may look like.

With health care capacity and hospitalizations stabilizing, Newsom said the state is "weeks, not months" away from making “meaningful modifications” to a statewide order that has relegated Californians to their homes for nearly six weeks. On Tuesday, Newsom said schools could start the next academic year early, possibly in late July or early August, though he did not specify how much instruction could occur on campuses.

“We are considering the prospect of an even earlier school year,” Newsom said, adding that “we need to start preparing for the physical changes in the schools.”

(more at link)

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

4 minutes ago, Dan Warnick said:

California, of all places (They abhor Trump and all of us), after the governor's losing weekend corralling his citizens away from the beaches, made this announcement today:

Newsom: California to begin reopening in 'weeks,' may start school year in July

Good.  The media and Governors appear to be losing control of the narrative, and deservedly so.

Covid reality is not even close to matching the media-induced Covid panic.

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

Trigger Alert!  Can you watch this video to the end?  It's only 11 minutes and 28 seconds.  (Warning: if you suffer from TDS, you may want to keep a barf bag nearby)  The video highlights the President playing his violin, er, the media.

WATCH Trump ENRAGE Media With Their Own Words During Coronavirus Pandemic

 

[Ernst Reim + 33]

I do not want to mix with internal politics of another country, but from an international perspective the important thing is not the video. The important thing is that somebody thinks it noteworthy to mention that the media get things wrong. And that a head of state derives justification from telling the media that they were wrong. That's like a teacher after being caught out with a spelling error on the board, grabbing some essays and saying "But look at the errors you guys made!".

Could you imagine Boris Johnson telling in a press conference that the Sun and The Guardian were wrong on that and that date? That Merkel tells Bild and Spiegel "Hey, look at the nonsense you said a month ago?". Trudeau mocking the Toronto Sun for getting something wrong?

In any other (Western) country, people expect government information to be more reliable than whatever the media say, simply because they assume that a lot of people put a lot of thought into any statement issued by the government. Do Americans get how **weird** it is for a government to proudly find error in media information? To even think that the accusation "You did not take it seriously enough!" toward a government can be countered by "You did not either. Look I have the video!" toward the media? It is not the media's job to make decisions and govern a country.

Edited April 30, 2020 by Ernst Reim

[Marcin2 + 726]

On 4/28/2020 at 8:47 PM, 0R0 said:

You are already living within a "1984" situation within China for a decade. 

The reversion by mutation to a stable form of the virus close to its natural state is the necessary outcome of having artificial (or accidental) components hacked onto the original virus. Those had no evolutionary advantage so are shed in subsequent mutations. Dr. Luc Montagnier, Nobel prize winning virologist explains it simply. I referenced him to you before. You are obviously not allowed to incorporate information into your narrative. 

I absolutely like the Chinese people, I abhor the CCP as the genocidal remnant left from the Soviet empire to control China on behalf of themselves and in the name of a defunct social movement. Your excuse for Chinese "accepting their state" is precisely what the "1984" scenario is about. That is a clear indication that you are living within it. 

Do your people a favor and dump a CCP official out the window. The world will be a better place. 

I think CCP assimilated Chinese society, in a way that intelligent parasite is overtaking its host. One could not be disassociated from the other. I said numerous times that people with good shelter, food, decent life, the ability of social promotion could agree to live in whatever typoe of government is offered to them, even Chinese dictatorship. With all its drawback current CCP led government is the best Chinese experienced in 4,000 years of their history.

They only just started foreign travel, most to Hong Kong, give them 5-10 years until they will not be comfortable with CCP rule.

[Yoshiro Kamamura + 274]

On 4/22/2020 at 1:18 AM, Enthalpic said:

Yes, he could bully the states.  Classy.

You guys sound like you are interpreters for trumps manipulation tactics and disregard for other democratically elected leaders. 

How about we take what he says as something remotely close to the direct truth on occasion...

Unfortunately, there is a distinct group of people here who just ignore the facts. You could present them, but they will pretend them like they do not exist. Like showing snapshots from an orbit to a flatearther: "Is this some librul propaganda?"

This thread of course aged terribly, because nobody really understands exponential growth, so people were saying "it's just a flu", until they suddenly did not know where to bury all the corpses. 

[Yoshiro Kamamura + 274]

By the way, the fact is that Trump actually seriously suggested treating COVID-19 with injecting disinfectants and heat and UV light. No amount of stupid jokes done around it will make it go away - he did say that, and it sets the upper boundary for his intelligence in quite a transparent and easy-to-understand way. 

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

Thanks to @Tom Kirkman for the reminder that this thread was over here.  Good timing, Tom, what with recent news out of the White House that the President and the Vice President need to practice social separation.   Judging by the photo at the top of The Hill's article, their wives may appreciate a little physical separation of "those boys". 

Meanwhile, CNN asks the in-depth question: Why is the President always asking VP Pence if he'd like a mint?  Wolf Blitzer: Stand by for Breaking News from CNN as our very own Jim Accoster provides in-depth coverage based on his own close, personal relationship with the men.

Pence to distance himself from Trump as COVID-19 precaution

 

© UPI Photo

President Trump and Vice President Pence plan to keep some distance from one another out of an abundance of caution after one of the vice president's top aides tested positive for the coronavirus.

The two leaders plan to maintain their distance for the "immediate future" after consulting with the White House medical unit, an administration official said. The decision is the latest step put in place by the White House to try and mitigate the spread of the virus after two staffers working in the building tested positive last week.

White House press secretary Kayleigh McEnany told reporters later Tuesday that it was Pence's personal choice to stay away from the president.

"The vice president has made the choice to keep his distance for a few days, and I would just note that that's his personal decision," she said at a press briefing, adding that Pence would determine how long he would choose to keep his distance from Trump.

The two leaders had previously attended White House events together, often standing side-by-side at coronavirus briefings throughout the month of April.

Trump told reporters on Monday that he would discuss keeping some separation from Pence as a precautionary measure after his press secretary, Katie Miller, was one of the staffers who tested positive.

"I have not seen him since then," Trump said. "But I would say that he will — he and I will be talking about that. Yeah, we could talk on the phone."

Miller tested positive last Friday, one day after a military member who serves as a personal valet for Trump tested positive. The White House has implemented additional measures in the days since to try and keep the president safe.

Both Trump and Pence are now tested daily instead of weekly, as are some officials who are in regular contact with either leader.

The most visible change came Monday when a memo instructed all officials working in the West Wing to wear a mask when they were not at their desks or able to maintain proper social distancing from others. The new policy was on display in the Rose Garden, where every official in attendance had a mask on other than Trump.

Pence traveled to Iowa on Friday, the day Miller tested positive. He is working from the White House this week, though his public schedule shows he has been holding meetings with governors and other officials via teleconference and videoconference. The vice president did not attend Monday's Rose Garden event.

 

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

On 5/4/2020 at 5:09 AM, Marcin2 said:

I think CCP assimilated Chinese society, in a way that intelligent parasite is overtaking its host. One could not be disassociated from the other. I said numerous times that people with good shelter, food, decent life, the ability of social promotion could agree to live in whatever typoe of government is offered to them, even Chinese dictatorship. With all its drawback current CCP led government is the best Chinese experienced in 4,000 years of their history.

They only just started foreign travel, most to Hong Kong, give them 5-10 years until they will not be comfortable with CCP rule.

There I was, agreeing with most of what you were saying, and then you touched on travel and "most to Hong Kong".  I thought you knew better, that the Chinese now (pre-pandemic) travel in rather large numbers all around the world.  The number visiting Thailand alone in 2019 was about 11 million.

Thailand's 2019 foreign tourists up 4%; China virus, strong baht a risk

Visitors from China, Thailand’s biggest source of tourists, increased by 4.4% to 10.99 million in 2019.

[Marcin2 + 726]

-

Edited May 19, 2020 by Marcin2
-

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

18 minutes ago, Marcin2 said:

Dan, 

149 million overseas trips in 2018, 71% to Hong Kong, Macau and Taiwan.  Of this 51 million  visited Hong Kong in 2018, the most popular Chinese outbound tourism destination.

I do not know detailed statistics for the rest 29%: but Thailand, Japan, Vietnam were top destinations.

And I quote "and most to Hong Kong".

Finish your math:  51 / 149 = Not most (34.2%)

[Marcin2 + 726]

-

Edited May 19, 2020 by Marcin2
-

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

10 minutes ago, Marcin2 said:

Oh, come on Dan you are better than this.

You just derived your knowledge from simplified media article.

Vast Majority of people ( including you) and majority of journalists just do not know that outbound tourists in China includes tourists from Mainland to Hong Kong Macau and Taiwan.

That is why they usually write that most visited is Thailand ( with 11 million, whereas Hong Kong is 54 million) They do not understand that only 29% is „real abroad”

You now use meaning of word most to prove your point.

Just say Thank you.

In this context I use most as „the largest subset of the set”, not majority.
But maybe you are right and : Most travelled destination means that over half of people travel there. 

 

Wow.  All that to....what?

Call me simple, but when someone says "most to Hong Kong", I think they mean most to Hong Kong.  It never occurred to me to go through the exercise you cite above.

I chose not to correct you when you cited Hong Kong as foreign travel as I didn't think it worth the bother.  I merely thought it worth clarifying to anyone reading along that the Chinese people do indeed travel all over the world in large numbers; not "most to Hong Kong".

[Marcin2 + 726]

-

Edited May 19, 2020 by Marcin2
-