Cost of Solar Continues to Decrease

[KeyboardWarrior + 527]

22 hours ago, NickW said:

With a figure you made up? 

I suppose when I blasted you for thinking that hydrogen from solar was profitable, that was all made up too. 

The figures are right there. We've got the plant's capital cost, the solar output per installed kilowatt in alberta, and a good average electric rate that doesn't even include wasted power over the noon hour. 

[NickW + 2,714]

2 hours ago, KeyboardWarrior said:

I suppose when I blasted you for thinking that hydrogen from solar was profitable, that was all made up too. 

The figures are right there. We've got the plant's capital cost, the solar output per installed kilowatt in alberta, and a good average electric rate that doesn't even include wasted power over the noon hour. 

Which appears to be based on a 20 year panel life. 

[KeyboardWarrior + 527]

7 minutes ago, NickW said:

Which appears to be based on a 20 year panel life. 

No, it's based on yearly power output and initial capital cost. Are you ready to make a real argument? 

[KeyboardWarrior + 527]

@NickW

Search up the power output per installed kilowatt in alberta.

Find the total cost of the plant.

Bridge residential rate with industrial rate as 7 cents per kilowatt hour, and give yourself an advantage by ignoring overload at the noon hour (assume all power is sold)

Find your yearly earnings. Hope to god there's no interest on the money, because when you're operating with 5% returns a 3% interest rate is deadly. 

[Irina + 2]

On 5/2/2020 at 9:31 AM, NickW said:

Coking coal is not used in power stations.Even the UK  has opened a new coking coal mine 

RE India. If the Nepalese would kick out the Maoists (payrolled by China) then they  could develop its huge Hydro potential (might as well as all the glaciers are going to melt) and supply electricity to India. That would massively curtail Coal demand. 

On a practical level India replacing old inefficient coal fired plant with modern units* make sense - less local pollution and Co2 per kwh of output. 

* I hope the investment is in modern units. 

Well thank you, Gentlmen, I know what coking coal is used for. I just mentioned this example to confirm that mining industry will not be totally shut down at once and as simple as it was stated before in the discussion. Re India, totlly agree though.

 

 

[NickW + 2,714]

44 minutes ago, Irina said:

Well thank you, Gentlmen, I know what coking coal is used for. I just mentioned this example to confirm that mining industry will not be totally shut down at once and as simple as it was stated before in the discussion. Re India, totlly agree though.

 

 

Well yes. The UK approved a new coking coal mine last year. As an eco pragmatist I see this as being necessary for manufacturing the steel for wind turbine towers, rail track etc. Might as well mine it locally and create some jobs than import it. 

[NickW + 2,714]

16 hours ago, KeyboardWarrior said:

@NickW

Search up the power output per installed kilowatt in alberta.

Find the total cost of the plant.

Bridge residential rate with industrial rate as 7 cents per kilowatt hour, and give yourself an advantage by ignoring overload at the noon hour (assume all power is sold)

Find your yearly earnings. Hope to god there's no interest on the money, because when you're operating with 5% returns a 3% interest rate is deadly. 

I can concede that against legacy coal generation in a relatively cold climate solar is going to struggle. However whats the comparison between coal new build and solar new build? 

[KeyboardWarrior + 527]

2 hours ago, NickW said:

I can concede that against legacy coal generation in a relatively cold climate solar is going to struggle. However whats the comparison between coal new build and solar new build? 

I'm actually focusing on its comparison to combined cycle gas plants. Solar will beat coal faster than combined cycle, and that's fine. I'd be willing to bet that desert solar panels with new technology might be ahead of coal right now. From what I've gathered, desert solar basically has a 50% output bonus, which cuts payoff time to a 10-15 year range. 

[NickW + 2,714]

6 minutes ago, KeyboardWarrior said:

I'm actually focusing on its comparison to combined cycle gas plants. Solar will beat coal faster than combined cycle, and that's fine. I'd be willing to bet that desert solar panels with new technology might be ahead of coal right now. From what I've gathered, desert solar basically has a 50% output bonus, which cuts payoff time to a 10-15 year range. 

Alberta if Wiki is to be believed is predominantly Coal.

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

Cost of solar and wind dropped 26% in California last year. 

The average price of RPS contracts that were executed in 2019 was 2.82 ¢/kWh compared to 3.81 ¢/kWh in 2018.

https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/uploadedFiles/CPUCWebsite/Content/About_Us/Organization/Divisions/Office_of_Governmental_Affairs/Legislation/2020/2020 Padilla Report.pdf

[Meredith Poor + 894]

On 5/2/2020 at 9:46 AM, NickW said:

Burlington is in the USA or has Trudeau ordered an Invasion?

 

 

There are a bunch of Burlington's, and a bunch of Jacksonville's and Huntsville's.

[NickW + 2,714]

3 minutes ago, Meredith Poor said:

There are a bunch of Burlington's, and a bunch of Jacksonville's and Huntsville's.

I see - there is a suburb of Ontario called Burlington. 

[Dan Clemmensen + 1,011]

On 4/29/2020 at 7:36 AM, Irina said:

 

It will not be that simple.

Read more at:
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/industry/energy/power/will-not-stop-coal-based-power-plants-immediately-without-a-plan-rk-singh-at-et-gbs-2020/articleshow/74526090.cms?utm_source=contentofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst

 

Also in the end of 2019 India and Russia signed MOU for coking coal from Russian Far East, the plam is to ship Russian coking coal to India via the Northern Sea Route.

Irina, coking coal  (also called 'metallurgical coal") is used to make steel. This is different from "thermal coal", which is used to produce electricity. Solar and wind cannot directly replace coking coal, because steel incorporates actual carbon molecules that are provided by the coke.

[Dan Clemmensen + 1,011]

On 5/1/2020 at 9:32 AM, Dan Warnick said:

All well and good, Jay.  When will I receive an email offer or an offer with my current electric bill (used to be a knock on the door) telling me that all I need to do is choose solar over the current source of electricity to my home and I will enjoy reduced electric bills for evermore (with no part of the taxes I pay subsidising either one)?  "All you need to do, dear customer, is check here: __"

Sign me up!

This will depend on your utility. A utility that owns coal plants will try every trick they can to use their own coal-powered electricity instead of buying cheaper solar or wind, because the regulators (subsidizers) permit them to pass the cost along to the consumer. You won't get your nice email offer from that utility. You might eventually get it from a municipal or co-op electrical provider or other middleman who is free to negotiate wholesale prices from alternative electricity producers.