Would bashing China solve all the problems of the United States

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,554]

24 minutes ago, Marcin2 said:

 @0R0 the problem is some secret pact that was between China and US governments ?

US surrendered part of its independence, and like during opium wars had to import the cheap and harmful consumer goods from China: like electronics, furniture, toys etc ?

Otherwise I do not understand your point of blaming China.

I do not know any person that after shopping blames the mall owners that they spent too much money.

To explain again, I know about the bias and fact of blaming China, that is why I started this thread in the first place.

But the question is why making China scapegoat brings us any closer to the soultion of US domestic problems.

For example trade deficit: the consumer goods would be bought not in China but in Vietnam or Bangladesh or Mexico, total trade deficit would not change.

And if you want to spent 2,000 dollars for US manufactured desk, instead of 500 dollars for Made in China or Vietnam, you can also do it now, the same will be in the future. China has no impact on this situation.

And so on.

Actually a pattern interrupt needs to be laid down here...The US indepence has not been surrendered to any world body. That would require a fundamental change to our constitution just as any democracy in this world would require one would assume....i for one certainly cannot speak for the world.

This i can tell you...their is a world order trying to influence the US down that path...it will end shortly. Corporate America seems to have become a bit tipsy the last 30 yrs...Thats code for drunk on their own success.

This charade is finally being made public and it will have world wide implications.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2020/05/27/what_the_obamagate_scandals_mean_and_why_they_matter.html

 

 

[SUZNV + 1,197]

18 hours ago, Marcin2 said:

This obvious conclusion after watching US media and top US politicians requires not much further comment.

If US would critisize China strong enough it would solve the following US problems:

- high budget deficit,

- high trade deficit,

- Covid epidemic,

- high crime prevalence 

- uncontrolled illegal immigration

- American obesity problem

- high government debt

- rising unequalities in society

- high level political corruption called lobbying

and many, many others

I don't see any entity that US media and politicians won't criticize.  As a top powerful nation, US contains both the best and the worst values. All of the above are mentioned in every election, China is the newly refreshed issue in this election and that is why you think it try to make China as a scapegoat

Trump is enduring critics much more than CCP from media and politicians. He is a scapegoat to all of American "failures" himself as these problems happened under any previous presidents. CCP just got attentions a bit very late and they seem seeking for critics themselves by their cheat, hate and bully others to show how lucky their people are under their leadership. US had many politicians, mainstream, experts criticize Trump and defended CCP as well, these people are temporarily muted since theCovid19 reactions from CCP and new HK laws.

- Covid epidemic, which cause this recession , started from China and CCP didn't do anything to stop its spread to the world but within itself. They even bought all of the necessities much needed or selling low quality or fake tests, masks.

-High trade deficit is not an issue, at least for US consumption style, because most of currency anchor in US dollars, not gold. Besides, if suddenly US people start consumption in necessary goods only, we will have a recession no matter of trade deficit or not , but unfair trade deficit and no respect to the copyright is an issue so a strong criticize on this is kind of a wake up call. 

- High level political corruption called lobbying: beside corporations, China is one of the source.

-High government debt is not an immediate issue. US public foreign debt is only 4T on total, who they need to sell things to US. They lend their customer money. Secondly US owe US dollars, that is different from other governments owe US dollars. Most of the public debt are from social securities for retirements. The treasury yield at the moment are not that high yet. There are ways to pay for this: create more jobs and income to borrowing the social securities not deficit or the fed buy treasuries or inflation(kind of a ponzi scheme, the more risks the higher the yield  and bigger the balloon) or raise tax less spending to deflate the balloon(which will undermine economy health). So the debt is the motivation for government to spend wisely but not something that need to be priority in crisis time as long as you have a healthy economy and investment attraction in your country (Japan public debt -gdp ratio is twice as US without any big problem). And remember, the government debt is tied to its currency and unlike EU, US debt doesn't tied to any other Govs. And don't believe in public debt ratio in state controlled economies like China or Vietnam.

- High crime prevalence: depends on the serious nature of the crime and neighborhood, for example counting pick pocket or car breaking or not and how it affect day to day life. 

- Uncontrolled illegal immigration: US manage to go this far even with a large illegal immigration population (12 millions) but the illegal population seems cap at this. Mexico helps with stopping illegal immigrant from the their southern border.  The problem is Federal GOV don't have any direct power against sanctuary cities, the same with how should each state  or city deal with Covid19 patients or lockdown.

- American obesity problem: as a result of more office jobs. Modern life is more stress with more processing foods diet and carb are the cheapest compares to organic raw food, and lots of US people  old generation are workaholic and sacrifice their health for that. The more athletic you are in your teen,the harder to maintain it with an office job, I keep telling myself that.  I lost 300usd for betting online that I will lose 30lbs in 6 months :(. I used to lose 20kg in 6 months in the past with low carb diet but I gain back since marriage.

-Rising inequalities in society: US work has high rewards for the right hard work and right investments in college degrees or jobs. Because the cost of a company to pay for workers besides salary is high (insurances, 401k  etc.), permanents employees in manufacturing has lots of overtime when the economy is good. My wife is working in Precision Manufacturing and she studies toward Robotics Engineering degree at night, and her classmates are working in the same industry, many work 12 hours a day, or drive 2 hours to work, then go to class and then drive 2 hours back, one of the guy did both. Most of them are around 30. In IT industry, the less job securities (working for consultant companies or contractors), the more salary you make. High risk high returns. 

A medical graduate may have a debt of 300k when he/she finishes her degrees, after residency of 5 to 10 years (general or specialists) with the salary of 70k and become a doctor, their salary will start at around 180k. You can always have student loan but you have to invest wisely in what will you do. It is not anyone fault if you take a debt to do liberal arts and cannot find professional jobs. You can make a choice to invest in another degree or start working (and you can do school at night). You have to pay for your mistakes by working/studying harder with more debt. You can choose to work after high school and go to college at night if you want to lower the debt but you have to invest more time.

So if you are healthy but make a series of wrong choices or not hardworking enough while others in your age invest wisely in time and money, you will lack behind, but if you make a good choice and work hard on that, then you will be far ahead. That is the root of US inequality.

With low job securities, it helps people who constants learning to not out of date with their jobs and be ready to find new jobs. With high institutions fees, less people are willing to borrow or taking risk or have to invest more carefully and you will have to study harder to make a good use of it.  None wants to pay for your wrong choices. Yes you may be unlucky to graduate in recession time but you can always work harder and making good choice to catch up.  

With free colleges degrees and high job securities, more graduates and less jobs available. People feel so security with their jobs will stop updating for more productivity. Employers will don't want to high new people if it cost them too much to get rid off. If you want more secure, you can work more jobs, make your startup or saving for touch time. US life is about constant competitions states against states, cities against cities, companies against companies and lots of pressure but high reward. The bigger cities the more competition pressure but the more choices.

That  why US is a promising land for many generations of immigration because most of them came to the US with empty hand (and lower starting point compares to the local) but need more opportunities and choices and ready to work harder to catch up.  In many states, you don't even need to know English to start earning money.  I don't agree with "work life balance" concept that many people think as a new value, working & learning is a part of life.

Please don't think I am targeting you, ask you always raise good points for me to discuss.

Edited May 28, 2020 by SUZNV

[SUZNV + 1,197]

Both of the Western Countries and US governments were arrogant as they won the cold war and started corrupted themselves with politics since no more real threat until a few most recent year. I don't know why US media or Dem obsess with Russia than China. Can we not claim China interfere the elections with Covid19?

If there is a pack with CCP, it will be individual US politicians not  US Gov as a whole.

Edited May 28, 2020 by SUZNV

[Strangelovesurfing + 737]

14 hours ago, Douglas Buckland said:

“American Obesity, agreed”

I have to laugh at this. Apparently America is the only Western country with an obesity problem! Take a look at any affluent European country and Australia...no fat folks there - correct.

Here in Malaysia obesity and diabetes are recognized as as serious problem.

But never-mind, it makes the rest of the world happy to think that the majority of Americans are obese.

I'm with you, it's a worldwide issue and getting worse. I just cant deny it's a big problem in the US.

[canadas canadas + 136]

2 hours ago, canadas canadas said:

Sheldon Adelson is a very big donor supporter of both Donald Trump in the United States and Benjamin Netanyahu in Israel.  He owes much of his current prosperous financial situation to his big Macau, China casino. Is there any potential for conflict of interest here?  

Let's see.  In 2019, there was an increase in populist antineoliberal protests occuring in many different countries.  Then comes this CV-19 and starts to take a large toll on the livelihoods of millions of mostly working people who are now unemployed as a result.  At the same time many very rich are making billions out of this and have seen their wealth go up more than ever.  While some parties may appear to be warring with each other, it may just be optics to hide some collusion to cover up one of the largest wealth transfers so far. Neither China nor the richest of U.S. billionaires care about the fate of millions of unemployed Americans who have lost their jobs. Then you have the FED spending trillions on helping big financial speculators get out of risky debt instruments that they have put their money into so they do not lose anything.  It is possible that this will lead to a great financial depression for most. There are no real borders anymore in the world of neoliberalism, it is just the haves united against the have nots and so far they have been winning big time.

Edited May 28, 2020 by canadas canadas

[0R0 + 6,251]

13 hours ago, ralfy said:

The U.S. follows a neoliberal model following Reaganomics, with deregulation which empowers Wall Street. The latter, in turn, has been in control of the economy and the government for a long time, as it essentially makes up the Federal Reserve (a private consortium of Wall Street banks) and funds the government, especially the military industrial complex. That complex has been used to keep the dollar (and later, the petrodollar) propped up, and is the means by which the expensive military is funded plus consumer spending in the U.S. It's also the main reason why, given the Triffin dilemma, increasing debt and spending are inevitable. Finally, that's the bases of growth of the U.S. middle class.

That said, bashing China may solve U.S. problems. That is, from neoliberalism the country will end up protecting its economy (which is what China has been doing for itself), with the military downgraded extensively, most of the middle class returning to factories and farms, and the U.S. dollar falling apart.

The catch is that Wall Street, which essentially owns the U.S. economy and which is the main source of funds of both political parties and the military, won't support that.

Had China been a democratic market economy, then things would never have developed as they had. Resources would not have been diverted to the creation of loss making industries who's only advantage is geopolitical, to hollow out their equivalents in the West. Had the CCP not been in power, the democratic driver would have gotten the other 75% of Chinese through high school rather than focusing on creating chimeral enhanced viruses in Wuhan.

Triffin's dilemma is  the mechanism by which China had done its deed, but it was done globally. Not just in the US, but in Europe and other SE Asian countries. The main driver was the subsidy and loss tolerant funding of the China industries. They lowered the product cost out of China to below the cost of inputs (both in China and abroad) not to speak of being unable to recover their capital investment.

6 minutes ago, Marcin2 said:

 @0R0 the problem is some secret pact that was between China and US governments ?

US surrendered part of its independence, and like during opium wars had to import the cheap and harmful consumer goods from China: like electronics, furniture, toys etc ?

Otherwise I do not understand your point of blaming China.

I do not know any person that after shopping blames the mall owners that they spent too much money.

To explain again, I know about the bias and fact of blaming China, that is why I started this thread in the first place.

But the question is why making China scapegoat brings us any closer to the soultion of US domestic problems.

For example trade deficit: the consumer goods would be bought not in China but in Vietnam or Bangladesh or Mexico, total trade deficit would not change.

And if you want to spent 2,000 dollars for US manufactured desk, instead of 500 dollars for Made in China or Vietnam, you can also do it now, the same will be in the future. China has no impact on this situation.

And so on.

The pact was no secret. Kissinger and Nixon's actions in China were intended to have particular geopolitical and financial effects. China was invited to solve the problem of US inflation as a result of the Johnson guns and butter policies. Which was an incorrect analysis, as was the cost push inflation analysis and the role of union labor in it. With the Europeans and then OPEC (Saudi) pressure to stabilize the dollar causing a new geopolitical arrangement to support it. China was to create the supplemental marginal production to suppress Western prices so that the dollar would remain stable against gold and allow OPEC to perceive their compensation as fair. To satisfy Europeans that holding dollar reserves was not a target for diversion by policy.  Which they broke anyway by creating the Euro, just as they broke their commitments to the dollar exchange system by cashing their dollars for gold.

The primitive economic analysis by all involved, got the whole thing wrong. The dollar inflation was from the Eurodollar markets, not the US dual deficits (though they did contribute substantially). The main countries creating it by policy were Japan, Korea Italy Taiwan and Spain, Ireland Brazil and occasionally the UK Germany and others. They used the Eurodollar system to produce dollars (dollar monetary inflation) that were spent on investments in themselves or emerging market economies. They exported their inflation into the Eurodollar market and thus into the domestic US market. Thus weakening the dollar and causing the OPEC oil embargo.

So there was no secret, there was a pact.

The toys sneakers and furniture were not the issue. The steel and pharmaceutical and key strategic metals definitely were. The electronics and medical equipment were as well. The wholesale incorporation of US and European assembly operations into China were a China subsidized joint venture using semi-slave labor. The wholesale theft from US companies attempting to produce in China for the Chinese market was an issue. The CCP industrial espionage which was its only contribution to China's economic development was the other issue.

We don't blame the mall, nor the companies that had to do what the government policies forced them to do, though we do blame them for doing it with such relish.

This is not scapegoating.

China WAS and remains the MAIN source of the market distortions that have created all the social and economical problems you described in the OP - not only in the US. The entire Chinese economy is structured as a weapon against the US and its allies. It is not a market economy. It only does real business within, where it is largely crony capitalism. Outside it is only geopolitical accounting that ascribes value to enterprise.

The point isn't that it is somehow similar to buying a desk from Vietnam or the Philippines because it is made cheaper and better there. It is that you are buying the desk because it is cheaper to you, but was not made in order to make a profit in China, but in order to prevent desks being made in your home country, or anywhere else. The pricing does not cover the costs within China. The labor is not paid any more for their labor. Unlike the West's industrial labor that is paid above average, Chinese industrial labor is paid nearly 20% less, shares only in 1/3 to 1/2 of the average labor income gains, and is often not allowed to own property in the industrial cities they work in, so they are forced to live in dorms at the factories. They are tools for the elite to extract geopolitical goals without paying for it themselves, instead pressing down the pay of their industrial migrant labor. Put in other words, they are serfs to the CCP upper class..

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

52 minutes ago, Marcin2 said:

the problem is some secret pact that was between China and US governments ?

In point of fact, it was exactly that. A secret pact negotiated by the Chinese with an up and coming ambitious "dead broke" President named William Jefferson CLINTON. Why rent a hotel room, when you can pay Slick Willie millions to stay in the Lincoln bedroom? He embraced China and repulsed Japan, our erstwhile ally, all for filthy lucre. 

[Strangelovesurfing + 737]

12 hours ago, Marcin2 said:

Douglas - Chinese media are worse than American,

Eyed Wide Open - I did not understand his joke about WTO

Strange - these problems would exist No matter how much bashing or not, and some of them are (partly) caused by China, these are common problems of developed countries,

ralfy - diagnosis about origins of most problems from the list, Machiavellian idea that China bashing and isolationism could help cause US would re-emerge like phoenix from ashes After the short term demiseand the right conclusion that aristocracy/0.01%/Wall Street would not allow these reforms,

0R0 - another Machiavellian idea that bashing is not about diversion from real sources of problems but to facilitate decoupling ( vast majority of these problems are never the less of China trade origin) and the usual conclusion by 0R0: CWC.

MY idea was the most similar to what strange... said: problems would exist bashing or not. most of these problems are typical for many developed countries and they are also not solved like in US.

 

What is EXCEPTIONAL, unique in US approach is the choice of China to be the scapegot and trying to find external culprits for problems of domestic origin. Completely self-harmful approach of US politicians. As with CCP and China, I make here distinction that the core of the problem are US politicians and media they control and not Americans.

Yeah, many countries have 1. large budget, trade deficits, high government debt and lately 2.Covid epidemic but most of them understand that 1. We just do not like to consume within our means, 2. Epidemics just happen, culprit is evolution of species. Some countries were better and some less prepared, like in every other issue.

The media seems to be controlling politicians these days. The China bashing will stop in the US when a new trade/diplomatic equilibrium is established. You're only seeing this now because the media is highlighting it. Many people in this country have been deeply ambivalent about our relations with China, trade and diplomatic, for a long time now, myself included. This is the first time in decades the 'right track' / 'wrong track' see-saw is starting to nudge back to the 'right track' side of the equation IMO.

The US as a whole is just finally awakening to the reality of the Neo Great Game and how it's being played out. Again, China can go ahead and be China, we're just done helping it get a leg up and getting kicked in the head with that same leg.

Edited May 28, 2020 by Strangelovesurfing

[Strangelovesurfing + 737]

17 minutes ago, 0R0 said:

The primitive economic analysis by all involved, got the whole thing wrong. The dollar inflation was from the Eurodollar markets, not the US dual deficits (though they did contribute substantially). The main countries creating it by policy were Japan, Korea Italy Taiwan and Spain, Ireland Brazil and occasionally the UK Germany and others. They used the Eurodollar system to produce dollars (dollar monetary inflation) that were spent on investments in themselves or emerging market economies. They exported their inflation into the Eurodollar market and thus into the domestic US market. Thus weakening the dollar and causing the OPEC oil embargo

Can you expand on the Eurodollar and what you mention here? I'm ignorant on how this works.

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,554]

2 minutes ago, Strangelovesurfing said:

The media seems to be controlling politicians these days. The China bashing will stop in the US when a new trade/diplomatic equilibrium is established. You're only seeing this now because the media is highlighting it. Many people in this country have always been deeply ambivalent about our relations with China, trade and diplomatic for a long time now, myself included. This is the first time in decades the 'right track' / 'wrong track' see-saw is starting to nudge back to the 'right track' side of the equation. 

The US as a whole is just finally awakening to the reality of the Neo Great Game and how it's being played out IMO.

Sadly it is the corporate media that is doing its very best to cover what is going on with the Barr investigation. In front of the face of the nation a small group of people acting under the construct of american intelligence...law enforcement...and the courts attempted to derail a elected official.

This event is only being being played out on a few news networks....what appears to be a political coup and perhaps the greatest story written in 70 yrs is being suppressed. That cannot happen in a open and free press not even possible.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2020/05/27/what_the_obamagate_scandals_mean_and_why_they_matter.html

[canadas canadas + 136]

2 hours ago, El Gato said:

 

That has what to do with this thread?🙄🤣🤣

Is Chinese money somehow indirectly involved in helping these rightwing neoliberal politicians through their generous patron?

[SERWIN + 749]

6 hours ago, Douglas Buckland said:

The US founding fathers obviously thought that news outlets would always behave in a moral manner or else the would have included the terms responsible in the term ‘a free press’.

Our founding fathers assumed that there would still be "integrity" in the future. They were a better class of people than today. As anyone can now see, integrity has no meaning anymore, especially in government. But also a complete lack of it in the news anymore. I can't believe that they haven't been sued by now, knock a couple of billion off of their share for the year and maybe they'll think about getting rid of these losers that they call editors now. That used to be their job and now it seems like they are so stupid they will put anything in a newspaper or on TV. News on TV is like a constant display of their lack of intelligence, every day for some of them.....

[Marcin2 + 725]

@SUZNV The fact that Trump (but also Democratic and Republican Parties)are much more critisized than CCP is because Trump is US President and Dem and Rep are only parties.

Whereas CCP is foreign power with relatively insignificant and indirect impact on US domestic problems.

The same is in Poland, we have 20 billion trade deficit with China but Poles do not blame Chinese for the fact that Poles willingly buy Chinese consumer goods.

And trade deficit with China is a real economic problem in Poland , unlike in US. Both China and Poland have similar GDP per capita and we are direct rivals in manufacturing industry, unlike complementary in many areas US and Chinese economies.

Edited May 28, 2020 by Marcin2
Typo

[0R0 + 6,251]

26 minutes ago, Strangelovesurfing said:

Can you expand on the Eurodollar and what you mention here? I'm ignorant on how this works.

There a couple of posts from January and Febr. that describe this in some detail.

Historical perspective and structural understanding can be had from an investment of some hours with the "Eurodollar university" blogs. from Jeff Snider. https://www.macrovoices.com/podcast-transcripts/301-jeffrey-snider-eurodollar-university-part-1

Look for charts like these

 

 

 

 

 

[Marcin2 + 725]

@SUZNV

”China bought all the neccessities ( masks etc) and later exported fake tests and masks.”

When epidemic in China started China bough about 2 billion masks around the world in January and February 2020.

BUT

At the same time in February and March they increased the masks production and similar equipment about 15-20 times, from 10-15 million on Feb 1 to 200-250 million a day in late March 2020.

And in March and April 2020 they already started massive exports when masks where needed not in China but outside of China.

In April 2020 China exported about 4 billion masks.

In 2019 China manufactured 5 billion masks, majority of world output.

Similar number of masks manufactured in April 2020.

The world was able to get required number of masks because of Chinese briliant fantastic entrepreneurship.

Suddenly in 60 days every Chinese and his mother were producing masks and later test kits. You had 100 new producers of PPE each day.

With such explosive growth it is natural that dishonest companies and inexperienced/faulty producers flourished.

There was such demand that nobody asked whever this or that company manufactured masks for a year or just since last Monday.

China could spend a few weeks or months to regulate PPE exports but how many more people would die without 80% of PPE global supply ? 100,000 ? 200,000 ?

With fake tests I do not have opinion cause No information is available. There is No journalism at present , it is extinct spiecies, so we cannot know whever established Chinese pharmaceutical companies made grave mistakes or it was just scam by companies outside of industry.

Edited May 28, 2020 by Marcin2
Typo

[Marcin2 + 725]

1 hour ago, Ward Smith said:

In point of fact, it was exactly that. A secret pact negotiated by the Chinese with an up and coming ambitious "dead broke" President named William Jefferson CLINTON. Why rent a hotel room, when you can pay Slick Willie millions to stay in the Lincoln bedroom? He embraced China and repulsed Japan, our erstwhile ally, all for filthy lucre. 

Clinton refused entry of China into WTO, they would probably never got this membership. It was Bush Junior that allowed China into WTO in return for backing of War in Terror.

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

40 minutes ago, Marcin2 said:

Clinton refused entry of China into WTO, they would probably never got this membership. It was Bush Junior that allowed China into WTO in return for backing of War in Terror.

Do you purposely wish to deceive or are you suddenly confused? It's nothing to do with WTO, it's everything to do with Most Favored Nation Trading Status As you well should know

[SUZNV + 1,197]

16 minutes ago, Marcin2 said:

@SUZNV The fact that Trump (but also Democratic and Republican Parties)are much more critisized than CCP is because Trump is US President and Dem and Rep are only parties.

Whereas CCP is foreign power with relatively insignificant and indirect impact on US domestic problems.

The same is in Poland, we have 20 billion trade deficit with China but Poles do not blame Chinese for the fact that Poles willingly buy Chinese consumer goods.

And trade deficit with China is a real economic problem in Poland , unlike in US. Both China and Poland have similar GDP per capita and we are direct rivals in manufacturing industry, unlike complementary in many areas US and Chinese economies.

Before he became president, he didn't have much political alliance in both Parties and didn't help building any policy or manage any gov department  from both that brought US to this situation before 2017. Actually he used to join DEM before moving to GOP as a non gov member. Yet he got the blame more than any US president, maybe even more than Nixon for most of accumulated failures for decades and he is trying to change that. If the blame by media is correctly place , it should fix on any gov member of Clinton,Bush, Obama. It is like both parties gov previously hid rubbish under the carpet and Trump lifts the carpet up and everyone accuse him for the rubbish.

I couldn't see any media try to make CCP or China to be scapegoat, they only repeat what politicians say. In this election, they side with China to remove Trump as the common goal, I talked about that before Trump said it himself.

You are too modest to say Poland has similar GDP per capita with China. China economy is like a big big corporation with very toxic culture with 1.4b employees and try to be top in every industry. Of course their output will be high. US don't mind trade deficit as it only account for small percentage and gdp growth is more affect people life (people tend to compare with themselves in the past).  EU export percentage on gdp (47.2%)is much higher than China(19.5%), and the US (12.2%) but gdp growth rates are in the order of  2.1% 6.6% and 2.9% in 2018.

https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NE.EXP.GNFS.ZS

[SUZNV + 1,197]

2 hours ago, Marcin2 said:

@SUZNV

”China bought all the neccessities ( masks etc) and later exported fake tests and masks.”

When epidemic in China started China bough about 2 billion masks around the world in January and February 2020.

BUT

At the same time in February and March they increased the masks production and similar equipment about 15-20 times, from 10-15 million on Feb 1 to 200-250 million a day in late March 2020.

And in March and April 2020 they already started massive exports when masks where needed not in China but outside of China.

In April 2020 China exported about 4 billion masks.

In 2019 China manufactured 5 billion masks, majority of world output.

Similar number of masks manufactured in April 2020.

The world was able to get required number of masks because of Chinese briliant fantastic entrepreneurship.

Suddenly in 60 days every Chinese and his mother were producing masks and later test kits. You had 100 new producers of PPE each day.

With such explosive growth it is natural that dishonest companies and inexperienced/faulty producers flourished.

There was such demand that nobody asked whever this or that company manufactured masks for a year or just since last Monday.

China could spend a few weeks or months to regulate PPE exports but how many more people would die without 80% of PPE global supply ? 100,000 ? 200,000 ?

With fake tests I do not have opinion cause No information is available. There is No journalism at present , it is extinct spiecies, so we cannot know whever established Chinese pharmaceutical companies made grave mistakes or it was just scam by companies outside of industry.

Not all masks created equals. The only masks for Covid19 health workers where high viral load in the air are N95 or KN95, which China has nationalized 3M factories in China. Most of the N95 in the US has been shipped back to China and the sources were very very limited or high price. The PPE masks are use for people to limit their spreading the disease and use when people going out or on public transport, which can be self made and much needed before the lockdown.

It is political will that China wanted to "save the world" in PPE productions, not entrepreneurship. Both Taiwan and Vietnam was exporting these as well. VN exported 450 millions. One of my friend dad's factory was able to export 4 millions rain coat which can be used to cover the health workers.

I don't see any point in PPE productions in April and May have much meaning in the saving life once the lockdown and social distance started as many people has preconditions or over 60s are hidden already. The PPE masks even wouldn't be recommended by WHO at first until a month ago. We all eventually will contract this virus so the main point is not to overflow ICU for other non covid19 emergency, and get any mask to go to work and open the economy ASAP. The total number of deaths by Covid19 alone will not change much unless there is a vaccine or cure that efficient ,approved, and mass producing.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2020/04/26/china-has-nationalized-its-n95-mask-makers/#454b2ab244e2

And low quality of N95 or KN95 masks for heath workers were very demoralized as their life counted on it.

Edited May 28, 2020 by SUZNV

[BradleyPNW + 282]

3 hours ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

Sadly it is the corporate media that is doing its very best to cover what is going on with the Barr investigation. In front of the face of the nation a small group of people acting under the construct of american intelligence...law enforcement...and the courts attempted to derail a elected official.

This event is only being being played out on a few news networks....what appears to be a political coup and perhaps the greatest story written in 70 yrs is being suppressed. That cannot happen in a open and free press not even possible.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2020/05/27/what_the_obamagate_scandals_mean_and_why_they_matter.html

Man, they have you penned up in their conspiracy theory ecosystem. Donald barks, "OBAMAGATE!" and you guys start wiggling your tails and piddling on the floor because daddy's home. 

 

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

16 minutes ago, BradleyPNW said:

Man, they have you penned up in their conspiracy theory ecosystem. Donald barks, "OBAMAGATE!" and you guys start wiggling your tails and piddling on the floor because daddy's home. 

The dichotomy couldn't be clearer. You've got your eyes squeezed shut and @Eyes Wide Open obviously doesn't. And like the see-no-evil monkey, you've got your mouth wide open, spouting TDS nonsense. 

A Democratic Party President and staff illegally spied on the opposition candidate and you're seriously claiming there's nothing to see here folks, move along? Just how stupid do you have to be to believe this? Asking for a friend

[BradleyPNW + 282]

Ok guys, I've uncovered The TRUTH: the secret Chyna trade deal started with Richard Nixon in 1972. Bill Clinton was a deep state disciple of Tricky Dick recruited through agent Hillary who was recruited herself when she twerked on the Goldwater campaign. Hillary's final ascension was thwarted by MAGA before she could email 😉 Chyna the passwords to our global satellite defense shield from her private email server. 

Thank God for President Trump! 

(ps the fake news media is so unfair to our president, the greatest president ever in the 1,000 year history of America.)

 

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,554]

1 hour ago, BradleyPNW said:

Man, they have you penned up in their conspiracy theory ecosystem. Donald barks, "OBAMAGATE!" and you guys start wiggling your tails and piddling on the floor because daddy's home. 

 

It was leaked over three yrs ago, Napolitano just blurted it out and was removed from Fox..He had no ideal he had done..Today it happened exactly as foretold. The media will gin up a real chit show as a distraction...nothing will stop what is coming

 

Edited May 29, 2020 by Eyes Wide Open

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,554]

43 minutes ago, Ward Smith said:

The dichotomy couldn't be clearer. You've got your eyes squeezed shut and @Eyes Wide Open obviously doesn't. And like the see-no-evil monkey, you've got your mouth wide open, spouting TDS nonsense. 

A Democratic Party President and staff illegally spied on the opposition candidate and you're seriously claiming there's nothing to see here folks, move along? Just how stupid do you have to be to believe this? Asking for a friend

Asking for a friend i like that, my old playbook was what do i tell my wife....

[El Gato + 254]

Look Brad gave us a new Trump screen saver image Cool!