Trump waves a Bible

[Geoff Guenther + 317]

I might write something here if I feel like it.

Edited June 8, 2020 by Geoff Guenther

[Geoff Guenther + 317]

Sorry guys, finger got stuck in the keyboard.

Edited June 8, 2020 by Geoff Guenther

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,555]

36 minutes ago, Geoff Guenther said:

According to one of the priests, both clergy and laity were chased from the church.

"Instead, law enforcement gassed peaceful protesters—including clergy members handing out water and supplies—so that the president could conduct a totally nonreligious performance of solidarity with Christians that managed to alienate the leaders of a church who see it as a part of their mission to get along with the president. It was a remarkable, and wholly unnecessary, act of aggression. Trump bulldozed the door to St. John’s when the key was sitting right in front of him."

https://slate.com/human-interest/2020/06/st-johns-church-rector-rob-fisher-trump-photo-op.html

Again the protesters were asked to leave and they did not, due to the violence done to both law enforcement and that church they were broomed...One does not expect a priest to have critical thinking in mob control..and anger. Had he wanted to get involved he merely should have walked into the crowd and ask them to pray...yet he did not..Nor did he act when the destruction occured to the church...now did he...Actually had he demonstrated presence of mind he would not have entered the church into the politics of man...foolishness of the heart is hard to overcome no matter how well meaning.

Assuming you are a US citizen....and a democratic? why would you care of god...the party does want god in there message..

Heathens everywhere...lol

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/on-faith/democrats-under-fire-for-removing-god-from-party-platform/2012/09/05/61b3459a-f79e-11e1-a93b-7185e3f88849_story.html

Edited June 8, 2020 by Eyes Wide Open

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

23 minutes ago, Geoff Guenther said:

According to one of the priests, both clergy and laity were chased from the church.

"Instead, law enforcement gassed peaceful protesters—including clergy members handing out water and supplies—so that the president could conduct a totally nonreligious performance of solidarity with Christians that managed to alienate the leaders of a church who see it as a part of their mission to get along with the president. It was a remarkable, and wholly unnecessary, act of aggression. Trump bulldozed the door to St. John’s when the key was sitting right in front of him."

https://slate.com/human-interest/2020/06/st-johns-church-rector-rob-fisher-trump-photo-op.html

And?  Were you under the impression that the President is a religious man?  Are you also under the impression that the President tells law enforcement how to do their jobs.  Trump is not the first to use the church as a political backdrop, far from it as the clergy in your article pointed out, and he won't be the last.

The President made a political statement by walking to the church and taking some photos.  Wow, that's original.

What's stunningly lost on you and the rest of the never Trumpers is that the entire battle over the 3 preceding days and nights was for political purposes, and they saw fit to injure so many, and destroy property, and threaten the perimeter of the White House to further their political agenda.  And don't repeat the BS line that it was all about the Floyd killing.  It may have still had elements of sincere protestors, but they were not the ones on the front lines attacking the security perimeter of the White House, or setting fire to structures and vehicles.

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,555]

3 minutes ago, Dan Warnick said:

And?  Were you under the impression that the President is a religious man?  Are you also under the impression that the President tells law enforcement how to do their jobs.  Trump is not the first to use the church as a political backdrop, far from it as the clergy in your article pointed out, and he won't be the last.

The President made a political statement by walking to the church and taking some photos.  Wow, that's original.

What's stunningly lost on you and the rest of the never Trumpers is that the entire battle over the 3 preceding days and nights was for political purposes, and they saw fit to injure so many, and destroy property, and threaten the perimeter of the White House to further their political agenda.  And don't repeat the BS line that it was all about the Floyd killing.  It may have still had elements of sincere protestors, but they were not the ones on the front lines attacking the security perimeter of the White House, or setting fire to structures and vehicles.

Below is the attitude of this socialist/progressive democratic party....and now they rise to christians and call havoc....get a life

Now you tube is no longer allowing videos of the democratic conventions?...Suppression of a new magnitude..

Edited June 8, 2020 by Eyes Wide Open

[0R0 + 6,251]

3 hours ago, Geoff Guenther said:

Excuse me? The National Guard, the police and even prison riot guards were called in.

While you might exist in your own little made-up world where everyone got things wrong before the God-like Trump arrived, the rest of us actually see what's going on.

Trump is so embarrassed at his aborted attempt at becoming a military strong-man that he is pulling the National Guard out of the city. The military brass and four former Chiefs of Staff have roundly criticized him for his terrible handling of this entire affair, including the military response in DC.

We are fortunate that the military right now is refusing to turn the US into a banana republic. Long may they continue to do so.

I think you are misreading the "dictatorial acts" of Trump. His target is to show his supporters, who are law and order people that he did what he could about the rioting. As with the "I decide when to reopen" incident, it  is intended to divert blame to the  governors and mayors, nearly all Democrats, by triggering exactly the response it got from media and officials loudly proclaiming, in turn that it is not the President's decision or taking the authority on themselves. Thus blame for the unnecessary in the first place, and unnecessarily prolonged shutdowns is on the Governors and Mayors, as is the limited and weak response to rioting.

DC is Federal territory so that the President can call in whomever he wants, so he demonstrated his "strongman" act by calling any group with guns to show up.

You keep falling into the trap of buying into the show and missing the messaging it is about. Trump is only about making his base go out and vote. It is not about what he says to the Dems but what it means for his base. His only attempts at swing voters are about the economy. Where the stimulus and Fed money printing have put out $5 Trillion, and $7 trillion are expected. The promised total amounts to nearly 40% of GDP and half of it is already out in the economy and the financial system. That will blow economic activity "like its 1999".  In my area, hiring is on fire. Business volumes outside of sit down restaurants theaters and bars is back to normal and in some stores it is outright hot with more business than I am used to seeing except before Christmass. I don't think the polls showing a "blue wave" are being conducted broadly enough, just as they had not been  useful when Trump was elected. 

The Trump base is livid about the shutdowns, not the virus mis handling. They are in total rage about the FBI/CIA/NSA Obamagate fiasco. They don't see any of the Democratic Kabuki shown on the mainstream media. Are more concerned about thousands hurt from rioting rather than one man killed by police. They have dropped CNN MSNBC and the networks entirely. What little they watch is Fox. Most of their info is on internal grapevines of social media, not so much public forums.

 

[notsonice + 1,255]

3 hours ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

Lmao....are you so sure...The story of biblical history demonstrates that is not to quite true...actually BS. Tread carefully here your in over your head making such a statement. I do believe believe there once was a rather significat christian that cleared out a temple with use of force...

Actually to that point ...Trump raising the bible would infuriate the progressive left to beyond reasoning....Or have you forgotten the anger rage and peaceful riot during the Democratic convention accepting the christian platform....

Yep 100 percent positive, Tread carefully??? over my head????? what a load of BS . Please tell me how much of a Christian Trump is. I do not find one instance that Trump has ever shown he is one in his life. Holding up a bible, that he does not own, and given to  him by no less than a Jew (how many Jews do you know that carry a bible in their purses ????) is a phony as it gets. But you go right ahead and offer some proof he is a Christian (standing in front of a church does not count)

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,555]

31 minutes ago, notsonice said:

Yep 100 percent positive, Tread carefully??? over my head????? what a load of BS . Please tell me how much of a Christian Trump is. I do not find one instance that Trump has ever shown he is one in his life. Holding up a bible, that he does not own, and given to  him by no less than a Jew (how many Jews do you know that carry a bible in their purses ????) is a phony as it gets. But you go right ahead and offer some proof he is a Christian (standing in front of a church does not count)

 

Do i sense a smidge of grandeur along with racism?.....Have you ever walked into a outdoor restroom on a hot day? A fundamental of christianity would be judge not lest ye be judged..One would assume your either ignorant of that...or a self appointed spokesman...you decide after all free will is part of the christian thing. Now that i do not get...and it doesnt really matter it is not for me to judge.

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,555]

8 hours ago, Geoff Guenther said:

Given that sources say that Barr ordered the attack, it doesn't surprise me that he's trying to blame it on other things. The government used the same tactics in the Civil Rights era. Barr may well spend years in prison for attempting to turn the military on the people.

For a perspective of what happens when it becomes the military vs the people take a look at Ret. Gen. Vincent K Brooks essay https://www.militarytimes.com/opinion/2020/06/06/dismay-and-disappointmenta-breach-of-sacred-trust/ or read what Gen. Mattis or Gen. Powell had to say.

I have just a few thoughts on general's. One there job is that of war,to prosecute war. To tread i into policy or politics is a egregious error in judgement. 

So much so a serious look into the code of conduct. It may well explain many of our failures in military engagements.

One job when war starts win, and inform a President of the costs. Let the politicians decide if war is worth the price of human life and the end of there problems...

There would be far fewer engagements in this world...far fewer.

 

[yellow + 5]

I don't come here often but it looks to me like the common greenie turds are using this site to discuss things that don't matter to working people. I guess if you have a lot of time on your hands, and are over educated with un-marketable knowledge, you make stupid comments based on "news" from MSNBC, CNN etc. 

[Geoff Guenther + 317]

9 hours ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

I have just a few thoughts on general's. One there job is that of war,to prosecute war. To tread i into policy or politics is a egregious error in judgement. 

So much so a serious look into the code of conduct. It may well explain many of our failures in military engagements.

One job when war starts win, and inform a President of the costs. Let the politicians decide if war is worth the price of human life and the end of there problems...

There would be far fewer engagements in this world...far fewer.

There is a major problem when you miss military and politics. The generals are speaking out because the Donald is politicizing the military. That is not their place. The military has been working 50 years to rebuild trust with the public. 

They're meant to focus on external problems, not fight with citizens. This is driving a wedge between people in the military as well, making them less ready and effective if they are actually needed. 

So military and government should be kept separate. Just like religion and government should be kept separate. 

The fact that priests (not protesters) were chased from St. John's for a photo op simply shows that Trump and his goon squad believe the church is subservient to Trump.

Much of what I've seen shows that white Evangelicals have become largely subservient, but black Evangelicals, mainline Protestants, Catholics, Mormons, and Jews have not.  

You can read Rev Gini Gerbaisi's post here.  

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

2 hours ago, yellow said:

I don't come here often but it looks to me like the common greenie turds are using this site to discuss things that don't matter to working people. I guess if you have a lot of time on your hands, and are over educated with un-marketable knowledge, you make stupid comments based on "news" from MSNBC, CNN etc. 

Now, now.  I think we have exceptional greenie turds.

[BradleyPNW + 282]

18 hours ago, 0R0 said:

I think you are misreading the "dictatorial acts" of Trump. His target is to show his supporters, who are law and order people that he did what he could about the rioting. As with the "I decide when to reopen" incident, it  is intended to divert blame to the  governors and mayors, nearly all Democrats, by triggering exactly the response it got from media and officials loudly proclaiming, in turn that it is not the President's decision or taking the authority on themselves. Thus blame for the unnecessary in the first place, and unnecessarily prolonged shutdowns is on the Governors and Mayors, as is the limited and weak response to rioting.

DC is Federal territory so that the President can call in whomever he wants, so he demonstrated his "strongman" act by calling any group with guns to show up.

You keep falling into the trap of buying into the show and missing the messaging it is about. Trump is only about making his base go out and vote. It is not about what he says to the Dems but what it means for his base. His only attempts at swing voters are about the economy. Where the stimulus and Fed money printing have put out $5 Trillion, and $7 trillion are expected. The promised total amounts to nearly 40% of GDP and half of it is already out in the economy and the financial system. That will blow economic activity "like its 1999".  In my area, hiring is on fire. Business volumes outside of sit down restaurants theaters and bars is back to normal and in some stores it is outright hot with more business than I am used to seeing except before Christmass. I don't think the polls showing a "blue wave" are being conducted broadly enough, just as they had not been  useful when Trump was elected. 

The Trump base is livid about the shutdowns, not the virus mis handling. They are in total rage about the FBI/CIA/NSA Obamagate fiasco. They don't see any of the Democratic Kabuki shown on the mainstream media. Are more concerned about thousands hurt from rioting rather than one man killed by police. They have dropped CNN MSNBC and the networks entirely. What little they watch is Fox. Most of their info is on internal grapevines of social media, not so much public forums.

No, it's not only messaging. Donald possesses authoritarian traits. He's restrained by the law but he has broken all of the norms at every opportunity, e.g. I don't have to show my taxes. 

Donald also attacks American bureaucracy and institutions that hold him in check as Deep State or Fake News. 

The American government relies to a great extent on the honor system. We presume elected representatives are good and honest dealers. We expect representatives to behave a certain way without writing laws to make them behave a certain way. 

Donald was impeached (forever) for Abuse of Power. The House of Representatives impeached him for using the powers of his office contrary to American standards and norms. The House declared Donald fell short of expectations under the process established by the US Constitution. 

The US senate chose to let Donald keep his office and now the American voting public will decide how they feel about that this November. As Bernie Sanders discovered, you can't win an election with a deeply dedicated base in the USA if you do not grow your alliances. Donald invests in base excitation at the expense of alliance growth. We know that is a losing electoral strategy so why does Donald do it? Because authoritarianism is his nature. So much so that he can't even make the smart play. 

 

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

2 hours ago, Geoff Guenther said:

There is a major problem when you miss military and politics. The generals are speaking out because the Donald is politicizing the military. That is not their place. The military has been working 50 years to rebuild trust with the public. 

They're meant to focus on external problems, not fight with citizens. This is driving a wedge between people in the military as well, making them less ready and effective if they are actually needed. 

So military and government should be kept separate. Just like religion and government should be kept separate. 

The fact that priests (not protesters) were chased from St. John's for a photo op simply shows that Trump and his goon squad believe the church is subservient to Trump.

Much of what I've seen shows that white Evangelicals have become largely subservient, but black Evangelicals, mainline Protestants, Catholics, Mormons, and Jews have not.  

You can read Rev Gini Gerbaisi's post here.  

Oh Geoff.  I’m going to go over this with you one more time, point by point, because I can see you are sympathy-traumatized.

1.      There is a major problem when you miss military and politics. The generals are speaking out because the Donald is politicizing the military. That is not their place. The military has been working 50 years to rebuild trust with the public. 

Seldom has a military been used for anything but politics.  If, as you claim, the Ex-generals are speaking out because the President is politicizing the military, I think a little self-reflection is in order for the HIGHLY political Ex-generals themselves.  All of the generals you speak of have served under presidents that used the military for political purposes, and all the conflicts they were involved in were and are considered politically controversial.  All of the Ex-generals are PAID contributors to the mainstream media.  All of them.  The Ex-generals are speaking out because they are paid to do so, they are political and they wish to protect their standings in their own social circles.  What Ex-general or even Ex-president is going to say anything other than to sue for peace?  I respect their opinions, but that is all they are, opinions, and they do not carry any weight whatsoever in this case.   

And don’t forget, what you are so vehemently against is that the military was kept on standby in case the Park Police and Secret Service Police lost control and the White House was in danger of being taken over by far-left political operatives.  They are criminals that are unpredictable and, by their own words, were attacking the establishment and the legally elected leader of our country.  When we had flooding and resultant looting in New Orleans, the National Guard also patrolled and helped protect people and property.  Nobody but the looters complained, and in the case here it is only the rioters that are complaining, and oh yes those that were supporting them.  It’s just that the people doing the attacking, rioting and looting are doing it for other selfish purposes. 

You say the military has been working 50 years to rebuild trust with the public.  The military, other than their HIGHLY political generals both past and present, is trusted and respected by the citizenry of the United States.  Is it not in Scotland? 

2.      They're meant to focus on external problems, not fight with citizens. This is driving a wedge between people in the military as well, making them less ready and effective if they are actually needed.

They are to be used within the laws of the United States.  The U.S. President, who is also the Commander in Chief, and the U.S. Attorney General (both current) have shown precedent and the laws that allow the use of the military in cases such as this.  And again, they were on standby in case the White House was in danger of being overrun.  The U.S. Military is by most estimates the most ready and effective in the world.  IMHO I don’t think a little guard duty at the capitol is bad experience for today’s military, and if their Commander in Chief were under attack, I don’t think one soldier or officer would want to be confined to barracks. 

3.      So military and government should be kept separate. Just like religion and government should be kept separate. 

That is your opinion.  I do not share it.

4.      The fact that priests (not protesters) were chased from St. John's for a photo op simply shows that Trump and his goon squad believe the church is subservient to Trump.

The Park Police were conducting a crowd clearing exercise.  It does not matter what reason the people, any of the people, thought they had to stay behind.  It would be helpful though if Rev. Gerbasi, the rector at St. John’s Church, who was on the patio that day catering to the needs of BLM, could tell us if they were checking political affiliations of all the people they were catering to that day, and the previous 3-4 days when many hundreds of those same people were attacking the perimeter of the White House.  The very symbol of our Nation, a nation that guarantees religious freedom.  You see, in situations where a police force is under attack by a non-uniformed opposing force, it can be rather difficult to separate the wheat from the chaff.  Whether they heard the 3 announcements that the Attorney General claims were made to announce their intentions or not, if they saw those terrible policemen coming they should have gotten out of harm’s way, and they did, shaken; not stirred.  It is worth noting that Attorney General Barr said he was there that day and at that time as well, and he clearly stated that 3 announcements were made with their intentions over the loud hailers.  I know, I know, you don’t like him either and you think he should go to jail; instead of rioters, property destroyers and looters.  Let’s agree to disagree on that, shall we?

5.      Much of what I've seen shows that white Evangelicals have become largely subservient, but black Evangelicals, mainline Protestants, Catholics, Mormons, and Jews have not. 

What the heck are you, and the mainstream media and the Left, even talking about with that statement?  Yes, I looked up the definition because I didn’t even know what it meant.  Where I come from you go to the Christian Church, the Catholic Church, or the Methodist Church.  Jewish Synagogues are found in the cities usually, but may be found in certain smaller towns, not sure.  The Mormon Church is based out of Utah.  Let’s see, we have the Baptists, the Lutherans.  I’m sure there are more that I’m just forgetting or not familiar with.

Anyway, I’m pretty sure if you asked any of them to identify themselves they would not tell you they are “white Evangelicals”.  I’m going to go with what Wiki said, and say this is a scholarly term made up by liberal scholars to help identify why the Left has been losing elections.  Further, I’m not sure you could accurately depict any religion as being subservient to Donald Trump!  LOL!  Imagine finding a clergy, anywhere in the country that agreed with that statement!  Whew!  Thanks for the break for laughter, it sure did lighten things up for me at this moment.

6.      You can read Rev Gini Gerbaisi's post here.    See Item 4 above.

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,555]

4 hours ago, Geoff Guenther said:

There is a major problem when you miss military and politics. The generals are speaking out because the Donald is politicizing the military. That is not their place. The military has been working 50 years to rebuild trust with the public. 

They're meant to focus on external problems, not fight with citizens. This is driving a wedge between people in the military as well, making them less ready and effective if they are actually needed. 

So military and government should be kept separate. Just like religion and government should be kept separate. 

The fact that priests (not protesters) were chased from St. John's for a photo op simply shows that Trump and his goon squad believe the church is subservient to Trump.

Much of what I've seen shows that white Evangelicals have become largely subservient, but black Evangelicals, mainline Protestants, Catholics, Mormons, and Jews have not.  

You can read Rev Gini Gerbaisi's post here.  

Only one thing comes to mind...

[BradleyPNW + 282]

1 hour ago, Dan Warnick said:

Oh Geoff.  I’m going to go over this with you one more time, point by point, because I can see you are sympathy-traumatized.

Thus begins yet another lecture on US laws, standards, and norms by someone who conflated the Declaration of Independence with the US Constitution. 

 

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

 

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,191]

On 6/4/2020 at 11:57 AM, El Gato said:

Just to set the record hon this He didn't go hide, The Secret Service made him go, he has no choice. What the Secret Service decides on in potential threatening situations is word, no one can override that, not even the President.

Blatantly not true.

[El Gato + 254]

1 minute ago, footeab@yahoo.com said:

Blatantly not true.

 

1 minute ago, footeab@yahoo.com said:

Blatantly not true.

Prove otherwise. That came from a former Secret Service officer with 20 yrs plus

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,191]

2 minutes ago, El Gato said:

 

Prove otherwise. That came from a former Secret Service officer with 20 yrs plus

He is the President, not the secret service. 

Secret service do not create the rules.  President does.

He is the President, not king.

It is why we have a VP. 

Trump does many things I like, and many things I Do not.  This was one of them. 

Edited June 9, 2020 by footeab@yahoo.com

[El Gato + 254]

So what, They have Protocol to follow, doesn't matter who's in office, and like you said, he's not a king. So when the occasion merits he has to listen to them.It's their job.

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

Messages from the Reverand at St. John's Church:

June 1, 2020 | 12:00 noon

Dear Parishioners,

 

We are writing from the Parish House where we’ve been able to fully assess the damage from last night’s protests.

 

As we know many of you have already heard, there was a small fire in the parish house basement. Thankfully, it appears to have been contained to the nursery—though, as you might imagine there is smoke and water damage to other areas of the basement.

 

We’re very happy to report that the rest of the church and parish house is untouched except for some exterior graffiti, which the city’s graffiti team has already covered up.

 

Fire investigators are still working, but once they are done, we have a crew standing by to secure the buildings.

 

Please know how grateful we are for the support and messages we’ve received in the past days. Please continue to pray for our community and our country.

 

In peace,

 

Rev. Rob Fisher, Rector

Paul Barkett, Senior Warden

Jeff Hantson, Junior Warden

 

June 1, 2020 | 9:00 a.m.

Dear St. John’s Community,

It has been a difficult night. If you have not seen it yet in the national news, a fire was set to St. John’s nursery tonight, but I am happy to report that the fire is completely out. I have just returned home from the church, and it is 1:58 a.m. as I begin writing this note.

My family and I had in fact left town on Friday for what we hoped would be a long weekend of R&R. We were essentially camping, almost totally off the grid. This morning our plan was to drive to where there was cell reception and watch the Pentecost service together. However, word got to me that the protest activity was intense and growing, so we quickly changed plans and drove back here as fast as we could.

In the car I was in touch with the wardens and also Bishop Mariann, with whom we have begun plans for making St. John’s a place for offering a ministry of presence—against racism and for God’s healing and compassion in the days ahead. I hope that many of you will join in this. (Please contact help@stjohns-dc.org to join this effort!)

The protests that began peacefully grew to something more, and eventually a fire was lit in the nursery, in the basement of Ashburton House.

Like many of you perhaps, I had little access to information about how bad the fire was while it was happening. It felt horrible to see glimpses of smoke rising by the stairs to our entrance on national TV, and then to have it confirmed with an up-close video showing the flames in the basement.

Fortunately, it was in fact completely extinguished. I just assessed the damage as best I could, in the semi-dark and with a flashing, bleating alarm system that I could not figure out how to shut off. My ears are still ringing, and I am still coughing a bit from various fumes I inhaled. But I am happy to share with you that I could see no other real damage besides that one room, and quite a bit of graffiti and debris around the exterior of the church. Protestors easily could have done a lot worse to our buildings, but they chose not to do that. (The damage I saw to other nearby buildings illustrated this point.)

None of this changes our purpose to be an instrument for God’s work through all of this, and in fact now more than ever. I pray for our collective wisdom, grace, courage and compassion as we move forward into what God is calling us to do and be next.

To the many of you who have reached out in various ways—thank you!

Shalom,
Rob+

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

23 hours ago, 0R0 said:

You keep falling into the trap of buying into the show and missing the messaging it is about. Trump is only about making his base go out and vote. It is not about what he says to the Dems but what it means for his base. His only attempts at swing voters are about the economy. Where the stimulus and Fed money printing have put out $5 Trillion, and $7 trillion are expected. The promised total amounts to nearly 40% of GDP and half of it is already out in the economy and the financial system. That will blow economic activity "like its 1999".  In my area, hiring is on fire. Business volumes outside of sit down restaurants theaters and bars is back to normal and in some stores it is outright hot with more business than I am used to seeing except before Christmass. I don't think the polls showing a "blue wave" are being conducted broadly enough, just as they had not been  useful when Trump was elected. 

The Trump base is livid about the shutdowns, not the virus mis handling. They are in total rage about the FBI/CIA/NSA Obamagate fiasco. They don't see any of the Democratic Kabuki shown on the mainstream media. Are more concerned about thousands hurt from rioting rather than one man killed by police. They have dropped CNN MSNBC and the networks entirely. What little they watch is Fox. Most of their info is on internal grapevines of social media, not so much public forums.

 

If he "overstimulates" for political gain that is just vote buying with deficit money.

Convenient for him he has won't have to answer many budget questions.  All questions would be answered with "COVID" so why bother asking.

Of course, dumping money into the economy helps but any idiot can do that. 

Almost like a company that cooks the books so they can keep the investors happy for another quarter or two...

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

13 minutes ago, footeab@yahoo.com said:

He is the President, not the secret service. 

Secret service do not create the rules.  President does.

He is the President, not king.

It is why we have a VP. 

Trump does many things I like, and many things I Do not.  This was one of them. 

After all is said and done, the whole church thing wasn't the smartest thing to do, I'll give you that.  He should have just stayed at the White House where he had just made a speech outside.  The Church visit was not well thought out, and he should not have decided to step into the middle of police operations.

[0R0 + 6,251]

4 hours ago, BradleyPNW said:

No, it's not only messaging. Donald possesses authoritarian traits. He's restrained by the law but he has broken all of the norms at every opportunity, e.g. I don't have to show my taxes. 

Donald also attacks American bureaucracy and institutions that hold him in check as Deep State or Fake News. 

The American government relies to a great extent on the honor system. We presume elected representatives are good and honest dealers. We expect representatives to behave a certain way without writing laws to make them behave a certain way. 

Donald was impeached (forever) for Abuse of Power. The House of Representatives impeached him for using the powers of his office contrary to American standards and norms. The House declared Donald fell short of expectations under the process established by the US Constitution. 

The US senate chose to let Donald keep his office and now the American voting public will decide how they feel about that this November. As Bernie Sanders discovered, you can't win an election with a deeply dedicated base in the USA if you do not grow your alliances. Donald invests in base excitation at the expense of alliance growth. We know that is a losing electoral strategy so why does Donald do it? Because authoritarianism is his nature. So much so that he can't even make the smart play. 

 

I do agree that he is personality wise a wannabe strongman. But he is not alone in his office and is surrounded by an administration that holds him back and a bureaucracy that acts rapidly against any of his over-reaches as those step on their toes.

As for his electoral strategy, it worked for him once, and it may work for him again, as the people who are energized with rage are his base, straight out blaming the Dem governors and "the swamp" bureaucrats for both the shutdowns and the riots. Not Trump and not the virus. For the Swing voters, as I pointed out - the enormous stimulus still being pushed through the system may actually cause an economic breakthrough to broad growth across the country outside the city cores and their states. Since city cores would never vote for him anyway, it is a winning proposition for Trump. The mass evacuation of the wealthy and middle and upper class from the big cities is already ongoing. Their suburbs are getting unsolicited bids. The wealth transfer is enormous and goes straight into the property values of the independent and conservative leaning suburbanites and small towners that also contain his core supporters.

NYC may be gutted economically within 2 years and continue spiraling for the next 2 decades.  Similarly CA in general and SF and the Valley and LA in particular. Seattle as well as Boston Chicago and Philly. Not clear what happens to Detroit.

The general mood of the Trump supporter's message to the undecided and skeptical is to point to the Democratic states and and cities and ask "aren't you glad you weren't there"?  Why would you want to give the Dems the whole country?