The Downside of Political Correctness

[0R0 + 6,251]

10 minutes ago, frankfurter said:

Armed, violent aggression against journalists is the hallmark of a fascist state. Trump may be the perpetrator, but he is not the originator. The originators were Bush, who created the NSA, followed by Obama with his new power to assassinate anyone anywhere without due process.

That was done by Democrat mayor's police departments. Not by Trump, who sent nobody outside of Washington DC.

With you about the assassination doctrine in peacetime, something we can agree on. Great, have a drink after dumping a CCP official out the window.

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

7 minutes ago, 0R0 said:

21 minutes ago, frankfurter said:

Armed, violent aggression against journalists is the hallmark of a fascist state. Trump may be the perpetrator, but he is not the originator. The originators were Bush, who created the NSA, followed by Obama with his new power to assassinate anyone anywhere without due process.

That was done by Democrat mayor's police departments. Not by Trump, who sent nobody outside of Washington DC.

With you about the assassination doctrine in peacetime, something we can agree on. Great, have a drink after dumping a CCP official out the window.

The NSA was founded in 1952 by Harry Truman.  Your algorithm requires adjustment, franky.

[ronwagn + 6,290]

What Black conservatives are saying. 

https://www.breitbart.com/social-justice/2020/06/05/black-conservatives-reject-medias-racism-victimhood-narratives-condemn-blacklivesmatter/

[SUZNV + 1,197]

Criminals  and people who are not looking for jobs will always be attracted to the big cities:

-Easy to blend in. In small town, most of people know each others.  And contrast to the ideal of they are racist, they are actually very curious about outsider who recently joined their communities. It is much harder to hide from the polices in small towns as everyone watch out for any things unusual happened around their neighborhood. Easy to stand out if you sleep at day and go out at night.

-Bigger markets for drugs or illegal jobs. Especially night lifestyle. In the small town, maybe a bar and that's it. 

-Inner cities have better public transportation and welfare centers without the need of maintaining a car. Easier to hang out with fellows. Yes people go to work in inner city in weekdays but they are going back to the surrounding suburbans for family safety and good school zones or neighborhood and better living standard and privacy.  And people votes where they live not where they work.

Maybe the exceptions are young students or young professionals who still have student lifestyle and no family yet.

So whenever social tensions rise, it started from the cities first. The bigger the cities, the more likely to vote for Dem.

Edited June 7, 2020 by SUZNV

[ronwagn + 6,290]

19 hours ago, Enthalpic said:

Indeed, regardless of what "side" you care about it is very unstable times.

If the extreme left goes way too crazy trump may use it as reasonable justification for further draconian measures. Trump is a media and attention man, if he can turn the media into a 100% propaganda machine I suspect he will.  He already threatened his beloved twitter.

If the left "extremists" dial it back and do peaceful protests only, and trump issues shady policies with little justification anyways, and only more unrest will ensue.

Ideally, the separation between media and government is upheld as much as possible. I also hope the demonstrations just end - no more awareness can be gained from this - it just creates more opportunities for clashes.

The draconian measures I am seeing is moves to defund the police. Mayor Garcetti in Los Angeles is one. https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/06/03/los-angeles-mayor-eric-garcetti-cut-150-million-from-police-reinvest-in-communities-of-color/

Minneapolis Mayor Forced to Leave Protest for Refusing to Defund Police https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/06/06/get-the-fk-outta-here-minneapolis-mayor-jacob-frey-forced-to-leave-protest-for-refusing-to-defund-police/

So Americans of all colors are preparing to defend themselves https://finance.yahoo.com/news/gun-stocks-soar-riots-looting-171142977.html

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

4 hours ago, ronwagn said:

What Black conservatives are saying. 

https://www.breitbart.com/social-justice/2020/06/05/black-conservatives-reject-medias-racism-victimhood-narratives-condemn-blacklivesmatter/

Love Candice Owens.  Isn't it interesting that many of us will defend, just as an example, Venezuelan people and offer assistance and guidance, but in the end acknowledge that the Venezuelan people MUST take control of their own situation?  My apologies if my words don't express this sentiment properly.  Essentially, there is only so much that races other than your own can or will do to lift you up; after that it is up to you and your own community to take control and raise yourselves up.  We'll give you a hand, not because of charity but because of our deep belief in individual freedom, respect and God given rights.  Now, get yourselves up, put in the hard work, and take my hand.  We'll get over the finish line together.

[frankfurter + 562]

6 hours ago, Dan Warnick said:

The NSA was founded in 1952 by Harry Truman.  Your algorithm requires adjustment, franky.

Truman?  thanks for correcting me. wow, the tyranny has persisted for very much longer than I knew. frankly (no pun), the USA has so many depts, we foreigners have difficulty to keep them straight.

your note caused me to research this further.  so Bush created DHS in 2002?  very extensive power and scope. The 22 federal departments and agencies absorbed by Dept Homeland Security are:

Transportation Security Administration
Coast Guard 
Federal Emergency Management Agency 
Secret Service 
Customs and Border Protection
Immigration and Customs Enforcement
Citizenship and Immigration Services
Critical Infrastructure Assurance Office of the Department of Commerce
National Communications System of the Federal Bureau of Investigation
National Infrastructure Simulation and Analysis Center
Energy Assurance Office of the Department of Energy
Federal Computer Incident Response Center of the General Services Administration
Federal Protective Service 
Office of Domestic Preparedness
Federal Law Enforcement Training Center 
Integrated Hazard Information System of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration
National Domestic Preparedness Office of the FBI
Domestic Emergency Support Team of the Department of Justice
Metropolitan Medical Response System of the Department of Health and Human Services
National Disaster Medical System of the Department of Health and Human Services
Office of Emergency Preparedness and the Strategic National Stockpile of the Department of Health and Human Services
Plum Island Animal Disease Center of Department of Agriculture

 

[Wombat + 1,028]

11 hours ago, Yoshiro Kamamura said:

I think you confuse "freedom of speech" with the childish concept of "I can babble whatever I want". There is no discussion with an individual that does not respect facts, basic laws of logic and nature, and lies in almost every sentence. 

Japan is the most monocultural society on the planet, so I suggest you shut your trap before the Americans feed you to the Chinese.

[Wombat + 1,028]

10 hours ago, SUZNV said:

Political correctness and freedom of speech are mutual exclusive, you cannot have both.

Then I vote for freedom!

[frankfurter + 562]

8 hours ago, 0R0 said:

There he is again, the Han Chinese Supremacist who likes to call everyone else racist. Projection dear @Frankenfuhrer.

It will not be long till your namesake Frankfurt Institute is abandoned and its graduates shunned by society everywhere.

A cop station was burned. Not the first time.

Don't take the mainstream media reporting and the "leadership" posing in front of the protesters to be representative of their plight or complaint. It is a protest against authoritarian brutality that was translated by the left into a racial issue. It isn't'. This is not 1968.

Being the racist that you are, you seem incapable of viewing things from any other perspective.

 

well, I see your point.  But you refuse wilfully to see mine.  You and others here cannot post anything without denigrating the Chinese.  Wagon begins his post by a false accusation against Mao and denigrating the Chinese, in his sole opinion, for no freedom of speech. Wagon's question and point could have been made objectively.  But no, he had to denigrate a race of people. The fact is, you support his post, by attacking me for racism.  Thus, you and he are the true racists, for you cannot express yourselves in any other way, nor do you see your racism.

In your own words, Americans are protesting against authoritarian brutality.  I will point out the brutality is perpetrated by the police and national guard, for decades: against blacks, hispanics, students, peaceful protestors, journalists. Police brutality against journalists, specifically, is the hallmark of a fascist state.

You have chosen the Chinese to be your enemy, sadly. But your true enemy lives within your own country. 

 

[Wombat + 1,028]

11 hours ago, SUZNV said:

Political correctness and freedom of speech are mutual exclusive, you cannot have both.

I am glad you finally admit that polical correctness is a form of fascism, that it denies freedom?????????????

[Wombat + 1,028]

11 hours ago, SUZNV said:

Political correctness and freedom of speech are mutual exclusive, you cannot have both.

Let us not forget: "White men cannot jump"?

[Wombat + 1,028]

11 hours ago, SUZNV said:

Political correctness and freedom of speech are mutual exclusive, you cannot have both.

I think African Americans just jealous coz Eminem best rapper ever?

[SUZNV + 1,197]

20 minutes ago, Wombat said:

I am glad you finally admit that polical correctness is a form of fascism, that it denies freedom?????????????

Dude, when did I advocate for political correctness? Off course it denies freedom of speech.

[SUZNV + 1,197]

1 hour ago, frankfurter said:

well, I see your point.  But you refuse wilfully to see mine.  You and others here cannot post anything without denigrating the Chinese.  Wagon begins his post by a false accusation against Mao and denigrating the Chinese, in his sole opinion, for no freedom of speech. Wagon's question and point could have been made objectively.  But no, he had to denigrate a race of people. The fact is, you support his post, by attacking me for racism.  Thus, you and he are the true racists, for you cannot express yourselves in any other way, nor do you see your racism.

In your own words, Americans are protesting against authoritarian brutality.  I will point out the brutality is perpetrated by the police and national guard, for decades: against blacks, hispanics, students, peaceful protestors, journalists. Police brutality against journalists, specifically, is the hallmark of a fascist state.

You have chosen the Chinese to be your enemy, sadly. But your true enemy lives within your own country. 

 

-Protesters demand for a right or for justice. In this case the black people have as much rights as any other race and the police will go to trail, what are the purpose of these protesters? To make people hate polices or hate white? Mind you this event happens in Democrats controlled cities and states, shouldn't they represent equality with their employees?

-Peaceful protesters did nothing to stop their alliance to loot and burn, so they hate police brutality but love their alliance brutality? These peaceful people are the shield for the looters and burners behind their back and shoots the police. So when they are in trouble, should they call 911 or call their alliance? Do you think polices are roaming on street and shoot or hurt any black man they can see for sports? There are black &hispanic&asian in police force or army as well so shouldn't they fire on each other first.

-Can't you see most of the black victims have criminal records and "one the way to build new life"? None will know if they will be good or bad but they did have a criminal records. To deal with these "may still be criminals" or looter or burner or gangsters, what trait do you expect the police, national guards to have ? Political correctness ? Which countries don't have violent police brutality or racism problems? France? Germany? HK? China? The only difference are the mainstream in the US  and some US politicians encourage the protesters for political purposes while others don't encourage protesters at all and don't bail these out. 

Because you are from Germany:

https://www.dailysabah.com/europe/2019/07/31/at-least-12000-violent-attacks-by-german-police-recorded-annually

https://www.dw.com/en/police-violence-in-germany-an-underreported-problem/a-50462692

Shouldn't you worry about problems in your country first? Or it is safer for you to accuse US polices brutality  across the sea than confront Germany polices brutality? In countries without any protesters, of course the polices are "super nice" so people don't dare to protest.

 

Edited June 7, 2020 by SUZNV

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

17 hours ago, Yoshiro Kamamura said:

I think you confuse "freedom of speech" with the childish concept of "I can babble whatever I want". There is no discussion with an individual that does not respect facts, basic laws of logic and nature, and lies in almost every sentence. 

Well, it's okay if you think that. 

But the fact per the United States Constitution is, it is the "right of free speech"; not the "right to have the other person GIVE YOU a fair (in your opinion) discussion".

Norms of civilized discussion, debate following accepted forms of etiquette, and consideration of whether or not you wish to engage with another person in such a debate are very different matters indeed.  You may choose not to engage in, or to disengage from, debate or discussion with another person, but you do not have the right to stop them from having their thoughts, opinions or expressions of the same.

[0R0 + 6,251]

8 hours ago, frankfurter said:

well, I see your point.  But you refuse wilfully to see mine.  You and others here cannot post anything without denigrating the Chinese.  Wagon begins his post by a false accusation against Mao and denigrating the Chinese, in his sole opinion, for no freedom of speech. Wagon's question and point could have been made objectively.  But no, he had to denigrate a race of people. The fact is, you support his post, by attacking me for racism.  Thus, you and he are the true racists, for you cannot express yourselves in any other way, nor do you see your racism.

In your own words, Americans are protesting against authoritarian brutality.  I will point out the brutality is perpetrated by the police and national guard, for decades: against blacks, hispanics, students, peaceful protestors, journalists. Police brutality against journalists, specifically, is the hallmark of a fascist state.

You have chosen the Chinese to be your enemy, sadly. But your true enemy lives within your own country. 

 

Neither I nor Ward have chosen China to be an enemy. Indeed, we hope that the Chinese people will be our allies in grinding the Communists that occupy their country into the dust. The CCP has stated that it is in a total war against the West "by all means" that it is using the entirety of its economy to military strategic goals. It has succeeded in "bombing" the Wests' rust belts economically by producing those products at a loss for decade after decade. The CCP speak openly of using biowarfare against the West. Which is what they did with the Wuhan coronavirus.

They have guided China into an economic dead end at rocket speed and amazing inefficiency. All purely by the CCP's decisions.

You are getting the National Guard's role incorrectly, they are rarely called in, and only in support roles since the Kent State incident 50 years ago, or for humanitarian support. They are in the Governor's control, as police are under municipal control and within State legislator's powers. Your CCP friendly Democrat Governors and Mayors are trying hard to establish CCP like absolute control in their local authority, which is what the protests are actually about. The Democrat politicians and their friends in the media put a racial lipstick on this porker to hide that fact. And they send their police after the journalists who try to document the facts of the protests, that they are about the Democrat's authoritarian brutality. They act as if they are the CCP thuggery's US branch. Perhaps they are CCP agents.

In my view, China and the CCP are opposed forces, not equalities of each other as you keep insisting. I reject your characterization of opposition to the CCP as somehow related to China the people, or the geography, or the country other than being the occupying force controlling them. The CCP is communist, racist, genocidal thugs.

 

[0R0 + 6,251]

7 hours ago, SUZNV said:

-Peaceful protesters did nothing to stop their alliance to loot and burn, so they hate police brutality but love their alliance brutality? These peaceful people are the shield for the looters and burners behind their back and shoots the police. So when they are in trouble, should they call 911 or call their alliance? Do you think polices are roaming on street and shoot or hurt any black man they can see for sports? There are black &hispanic&asian in police force or army as well so shouldn't they fire on each other first.

Peaceful protesters have figured out that these "allies" are AntiFa scum and looters and have been handing them over to the police to be arrested. The are no longer acting as  their "human shields".

@Frankenfuhrer is a Chinese troll farm worker. He is not German so far as I know.

[0R0 + 6,251]

@Wombat and @SUZNV completely agree that political correctness is incompatible with free speech.

[SUZNV + 1,197]

27 minutes ago, 0R0 said:

Peaceful protesters have figured out that these "allies" are AntiFa scum and looters and have been handing them over to the police to be arrested. The are no longer acting as  their "human shields".

@Frankenfuhrer is a Chinese troll farm worker. He is not German so far as I know.

But mainstream will group these groups together anyhow and count the total numbers and why would any law abiding citizens would break the curfew and do the peaceful protests at night. And frankly I cannot see any point of protesting until we have the trail result. By the time they figured it out the damage is done, which is sad. The riots burning and looting wouldn't start without these "useful idiots", good intention doesn't mean good consequence.

Then I want to congrats for Frankenfuhrer for his pay raise from 50 cents to 70 cents since he has  been working hard in the last 3 months.

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

On 6/6/2020 at 4:55 PM, frankfurter said:

happy to see a xxxx like you be concerned about freedom of speech.

Describing Ron as a "xxxxx" is way off the track.  I very, very rarely am provoked to apply the Red Arrow; that is reserved for those who are demonstrating they are a Jackxxx.

You, Frankfurter, have demonstrated that you are a jackxxx.  I demand you remove that post. 

Edited June 8, 2020 by Selva
both posts have been edited for calling other members names

[Marcin2 + 725]

I am not convinced at all by the claims at oilprice forum: we like Chinese nation and we only fight with CCP. We want to destroy CCP, we need the regime change but we love Chinese.

 It is the same narrative that was used in Libya: we want to get rid of Gaddafi but we love Libyans, we like  this nation, want to end their sufferings. Overthrowing the Gaddafi and the destruction of this developed country and the later civil war is the single worst event in history of this country since it was Roman province.

I am not a fan of CCP or Gaddafi, but I do not like the hypocrisy of users of this forum.

Fall of CCP would probably mean an immense suffering of Chinese nation.

 

Edited June 7, 2020 by Marcin2
Typo

[ronwagn + 6,290]

18 hours ago, Wombat said:

Let us not forget: "White men cannot jump"?

https://www.thesportster.com/basketball/top-15-nba-players-who-prove-that-white-men-can-jump/

[ronwagn + 6,290]

4 hours ago, Marcin2 said:

I am not convinced at all by the claims at oilprice forum: we like Chinese nation and we only fight with CCP. We want to destroy CCP, we need the regime change but we love Chinese.

 It is the same narrative that was used in Libya: we want to get rid of Gaddafi but we love Libyans, we like  this nation, want to end their sufferings. Overthrowing the Gaddafi and the destruction of this developed country and the later civil war is the single worst event in history of this country since it was Roman province.

I am not a fan of CCP or Gaddafi, but I do not like the hypocrisy of users of this forum.

Fall of CCP would probably mean an immense suffering of Chinese nation.

 

Anyone not opposing the CCP is not in favor of freedom of speech or any civic freedoms whatsoever. All need to earn social credits to use public transport etc. 

https://www.visualcapitalist.com/the-game-of-life-visualizing-chinas-social-credit-system/

The Game of Life: Visualizing China’s Social Credit System

From China Stories https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Wb2YoQGpSWTz32ljsiA_ey6FLVqc2Dpe7Fnpiqn9lBs/edit#

[Marcin2 + 725]

2 hours ago, ronwagn said:

Anyone not opposing the CCP is not in favor of freedom of speech or any civic freedoms whatsoever. All need to earn social credits to use public transport etc. 

 

https://www.visualcapitalist.com/the-game-of-life-visualizing-chinas-social-credit-system/

The Game of Life: Visualizing China’s Social Credit System

From China Stories https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Wb2YoQGpSWTz32ljsiA_ey6FLVqc2Dpe7Fnpiqn9lBs/edit#

This system is all wrong (even that I am 100% positive that US has similar, but secret system of scoring citizens to identify potential threats to national security).

I am on the same page about CCP as Americans at this forum.

My concern is ( as always) how far would you go to get rid of CCP in China ?

The only way I see it succesful is starting WW3. Personally I can even live with CCP existing 4000 miles from  my country to prevent such a war.