COVID is real now

[Zhong Lu + 845]

Hate isn't a bad thing.  But the idea that a person should hate something because they're a member of some group is stupid.  

[ronwagn + 6,290]

23 hours ago, Hotone said:

Here in Malaysia, just like many Asian countries, everyone wears the 3 ply surgical masks when going out and about.  They are single use only and disposed immediately.  Each mask costs about 15 US cents when purchased in a pack of 50, and they are widely available in all the shops and even restaurants.  I wonder what is the price of 3 ply masks in your location and are they readily available?

If available, they are too expensive for the average person. Why? I wonder? Even hospitals seem to have trouble keeping stock. America better start producing a lot of things, and fast. 

[ronwagn + 6,290]

5 hours ago, Enthalpic said:

Not just setting COVID records!  New all-time highs!  Lost more in one month than most do in a year.

 

 

https://app.tmxmoney.com/news/cpnews/article?locale=EN&newsid=f41675&mobile=false

"The Treasury Department reported Monday that the deficit hit $864 billion last month, an amount of red ink that surpasses most annual deficits in the nation's history and is above the previous monthly deficit record of $738 billion in April."

 

 

Unfortunately the Democrats would spend even more. We could become like Venezuela with them.

[ronwagn + 6,290]

Yes, and fueled strictly by left wing lies. How many people were shot and killed and businesses burned supposedly because of a worth cause. The whole charade was run by BLM and Antifa with money from Soros and his ilk. The whole country was already irate over the film of Floyd, which was just used as a spark to instigate all of the havoc. IMO the whole thing will help Trump at the polls. I pray that Americans are not stupid enough to fall for lies by BLM, Antifa, The Squad, etc. etc. 

[BradleyPNW + 282]

9 hours ago, Ward Smith said:

Obviously typed too fast for you 

 

I'm honestly hoping that I slip up one day so you can catch me and land a real hit. You would celebrate for days and I'd be so happy for you. 

[BradleyPNW + 282]

7 hours ago, Enthalpic said:

How much TV does he watch? 

 

So much TV that he thinks a president is judged by their ratings. 

 

[BradleyPNW + 282]

1 hour ago, ronwagn said:

Yes, and fueled strictly by left wing lies. How many people were shot and killed and businesses burned supposedly because of a worth cause. The whole charade was run by BLM and Antifa with money from Soros and his ilk. The whole country was already irate over the film of Floyd, which was just used as a spark to instigate all of the havoc. IMO the whole thing will help Trump at the polls. I pray that Americans are not stupid enough to fall for lies by BLM, Antifa, The Squad, etc. etc. 

wtf

[frankfurter + 562]

7 hours ago, ronwagn said:

If available, they are too expensive for the average person. Why? I wonder? Even hospitals seem to have trouble keeping stock. America better start producing a lot of things, and fast. 

Shortage of affordable PPE is due purely to your crony, secretive, protective "capitalism". Fact: millions of gloves and masks are being hoarded to control supply, which then controls price. Fact: hundreds of millions of items could be imported, cheaply, but your pres and his cronies are preventing this. It is the most callous policy ever followed. 

 

[frankfurter + 562]

7 hours ago, ronwagn said:

Unfortunately the Democrats would spend even more. We could become like Venezuela with them.

how much printed so far, about $7 trillion?  where has it gone?  not towards a solution to end the covid spread, cure, crisis.  massive unemployments now, cannot pay rents, soon cannot afford food and clothing, deathly violence, divided peoples, huge debts at all levels, the elite 0.1% earns and holds great majority of all wealth, police and army turned against the citizens....  USA is spiralling quickly into the pre French revolution crisis.  could this be by design?  

[Yoshiro Kamamura + 274]

8 hours ago, ronwagn said:

Yes, and fueled strictly by left wing lies. How many people were shot and killed and businesses burned supposedly because of a worth cause. The whole charade was run by BLM and Antifa with money from Soros and his ilk. The whole country was already irate over the film of Floyd, which was just used as a spark to instigate all of the havoc. IMO the whole thing will help Trump at the polls. I pray that Americans are not stupid enough to fall for lies by BLM, Antifa, The Squad, etc. etc. 

As a Trump supporter, you should never accuse anyone of lying. Your big master Donald lies every day, in almost every sentence, in the most stupid, childish, and verifiable way. He lies on Tuesday that he never said what he said on Monday, even though to refute it, it's as trivial as running the footage from Monday and seeing that he is indeed lying again. He is the grandmaster of lying, the big Honcho of falsehood, and every his statement should be taken with utmost doubt. And that's not "bias", that's pure experience - because he was the one who introduced this "culture" of casual lying into the politics (presuming perhaps correctly, that his followers are too stupid to verify his statements). 

So next time you accuse someone of lies, remember, it's your side that lies the most, that lies constantly, and in the worst manner imaginable. You have sided with crooks. Remember that, please. Thank you. 

Edited July 14, 2020 by Yoshiro Kamamura

[0R0 + 6,251]

On 7/13/2020 at 6:59 AM, Yoshiro Kamamura said:

You are totally resistant to any form of education. Everything is a conspiracy, even dead people don't really die (except it's really, really difficult to pull dead people out of nowhere if they have no history, names, data, etc). You probably imagine they use the same trick as small theatres that parade the same actors over and over in front of the audience to give the impression of "big army". 

The dead are real. Each have a name, life history, and each one leaves a corpse behind that must be disposed of. 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-covid-19-deaths-are-counted1/

Wake the fck up! Not every rag that suits your story pulled from twitter or facebook tells the truth. If anything, COVID numbers are underestimated, because many uninsured poeple are dying quietly at ghettos and slums, 

I didn't claim a conspiracy, I am pointing out a reporting methodology distortion. The CDC guidelines imported from Italian practices and the convention in order to obtain fast reporting over thoreough confirmation was a positive CV19 when died criterion.

From your reference:

In Colorado, the discrepancy over people dying with COVID-19 versus of COVID-19 is due to federal reporting guidelines requiring the health department to report any COVID-positive death to the CDC, even if COVID-19 wasn’t thought to cause the death, Gov. Jared Polis said in a news conference Friday (May 15). The health department has been instructed not to report those deaths as being caused by COVID-19 to the public, Polis said. 

The other side of the excess deaths counts is that people were not obtaining "elective" procedures like bypasses, cancer operations, chemotherapy, dialysis nor seeking help for what appeared to be less serious issues that were mini strokes or heart attacks that were not followed up with the usual treatments because the patients didn't go to see a doctor.

We discussed here the question of how many lives are usually saved by the modern medical system that were not being saved because the system was shutdown nearly wholly or in part so as to leave capacity open for the surge of CV19 cases. It was a significant number on the same scale as CV19 deaths reported. So yes, there is an undercounting, and no, it is not indicating as much of an under-reporting as people on the left are trying hard to claim.

Looking at the statistics from Temp. measurement reports by Kinsa to running through county and state records, the progression of the pandemic and its mortality were, as was known in Feb from Chinese data confirmed by Japanese, Korean, Taiwan and others, far lower than touted in the press, the misconceptions, some of which I fell for about asymptomatic carriers, high fatality rates, the capture of cases by testing were just speculation by epidemiologists who are apparently ignorant of microbiology of viruses and immunology and were demanding proof of anyone challenging their entirely unsubstatiated presumptions. Thus Niel Furgeson's inflated estimates of deaths and hospitalizations got media and political attention - not because they were useful but because they were alarming. At the same time, opposing Oxford epidemiologist Dr Sunetra Gupta was giving what is a broader and more truthful picture of how CV19 is spread broadly - that its R0 is highly dependent on localized population density and people's behaviors in congregating in enclosed spaces. She was the only epidemiologist of high renown to point out that T cell responses do more of the work than antibody responses do, thus undercounting of infections by serological tests shows inflated mortality numbers though those were 20-50 times smaller already than the mortality rates reported from confirmed cases.

The picture emerging was of a very contagious virus with really low mortality rates and a lack of residual resistance for most people because of a lack of exposure to prior viral outbreaks. Recent German studies showed that though antibody tests showed a 25% chance of infection from some households with CV19 cases, when complemented by T cell tests for activity against the virus, that lifted the infection rate to 75%. With that in mind the IFR is 50-100 times smaller than you would obtain from confirmed cases reported, now that testing is more liberal, the results may be "only" 20-40 times higher confirmed CFR than actual IFR.

The actual IFR estimates continue falling as more data comes in while reported CFR is falling too in all age groups. In part that was because in the initial waves medical treatment was just as likely to kill a patient than save him, while there are known protocols with good track records now, bringing hospitalization rates and death rates in the hospital down to a CFR 1/8th of the initial values, and making this a 0.1% aggregate mortality virus, less than a flu season, particularly so for the young and healthy.

That there are conspiracies by pharma, business, media, and most of all the official sector and its bureaucrats grabbing opportunities to gain power, eject Trump from office, get endless free credit, distribute funds to friends and kill off competition from small business is not at all in question. That there are long standing conspiracies to use a pandemic to track individuals and tag them electronically and then institute a global government is not in question either. That Marxist groups have been using this opportunity to create mayhem and erase history in the Marxist Revolutionary social cookbook methods is also not in question. These are all facts. Observable if you care to look.

The leftists are entirely blind to any of this, adhering to their leadership as if it has any intention of doing good. They don't. They are just as intent on creating a global government and suppressing all the freedoms you enjoy just as China's CCP is doing. And for the same reasons, driven by both similar ideologies and interests as well as observations of current conditions. All of which are just wrong.

The outright statements are on the record for the left's plans for creating economic and social mayhem, expanding govt powers and suppressing individuals economically and socially, where accomplishing the goals of leftist dogma stands above the benefits to the public at large.

That you and @Yoshiro keep protesting here that there is no conspiracy, that the virus is as bad as the panic mongers say indicates that you are part of the conspiracy and the movement for totalitarian socialist government in America and the world.

Many on these forums have reached that conclusion and categorize you as Chinese/communist agents like @Frankfurter obviously is. You do not actually have an audience here, just people who feel it is their duty to counter your statements so that there is a record of opposing arguments and actual facts.

 

 

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

1 hour ago, 0R0 said:

That there are conspiracies by pharma, business, media, and most of all the official sector and its bureaucrats grabbing opportunities to gain power, eject Trump from office, get endless free credit, distribute funds to friends and kill off competition from small business is not at all in question. That there are long standing conspiracies to use a pandemic to track individuals and tag them electronically and then institute a global government is not in question either. That Marxist groups have been using this opportunity to create mayhem and erase history in the Marxist Revolutionary social cookbook methods is also not in question. These are all facts. Observable if you care to look.

The leftists are entirely blind to any of this, adhering to their leadership as if it has any intention of doing good. They don't. They are just as intent on creating a global government and suppressing all the freedoms you enjoy just as China's CCP is doing. And for the same reasons, driven by both similar ideologies and interests as well as observations of current conditions. All of which are just wrong.

The outright statements are on the record for the left's plans for creating economic and social mayhem, expanding govt powers and suppressing individuals economically and socially, where accomplishing the goals of leftist dogma stands above the benefits to the public at large.

That you and @Yoshiro keep protesting here that there is no conspiracy, that the virus is as bad as the panic mongers say indicates that you are part of the conspiracy and the movement for totalitarian socialist government in America and the world.

Many on these forums have reached that conclusion and categorize you as Chinese/communist agents like @Frankfurter obviously is. You do not actually have an audience here, just people who feel it is their duty to counter your statements so that there is a record of opposing arguments and actual facts.

Nothing to add really, you nailed it right on the head. Just wanted to highlight your good work. Carry on good sir. 

[crazy trip + 90]

I personally think this is minimally something to open mindedly think about:

A recent study from the New England Journal of Medicine suggests use of masks outside health care facilities “offers little, if any, protection from infection.”

The Journal cited public health authorities who “define a significant exposure to Covid-19 as face-to-face contact within 6 feet with a patient with symptomatic Covid-19 that is sustained for at least a few minutes (and some say more than 10 minutes or even 30 minutes).”

“The chance of catching Covid-19 from a passing interaction in a public space is therefore minimal,” the journal concluded. “In many cases, the desire for widespread masking is a reflexive reaction to anxiety over the pandemic.”

[crazy trip + 90]

I’m curious if this is only a problem in Florida or is are other states not getting their numbers right as well?!!

 If this report is true the implications are IMO staggering!!

According to the latest publication of statewide test results from the Florida Department of Health, published on Friday, several testing facilities’ positivity rates for coronavirus tests were 27.66, 33.33, 37.10, 40, 43.13, 44.44, 50, 55, 57.14, 59.23, 60, 87.5, 91.18, and 100.

Twenty-two labs reported 100-percent positivity rates. Two labs reported 91.18-percent positivity rates. 

The Florida Department of Health’s stated positivity rates and associated volume of coronavirus cases does not match claims made by the testing facilities, reported FOX 35:

 

Countless labs have reported a 100 percent positivity rate, which means every single person tested was positive. Other labs had very high positivity rates. FOX 35 found that testing sites like Centra Care reported that 83 people were tested and all tested positive. Then, NCF Diagnostics in Alachua reported 88 percent of tests were positive.

How could that be? FOX 35 News investigated these astronomical numbers, contacting every local location mentioned in the report.

The report showed that Orlando Health had a 98 percent positivity rate. However, when FOX 35 News contacted the hospital, they confirmed errors in the report. Orlando Health’s positivity rate is only 9.4 percent, not 98 percent as in the report.

“The report also showed that the Orlando Veteran’s Medical Center had a positivity rate of 76 percent,” added FOX 35. “A spokesperson for the VA told FOX 35 News on Tuesday that this does not reflect their numbers and that the positivity rate for the center is actually 6 percent.”

The outlet added:

“FOX 35 News went on to speak with the Florida Department of Health on Tuesday. They confirmed that although private and public laboratories are required to report positive and negative results to the state immediately, some have not. Specifically, they said that some smaller, private labs were not reporting negative test result data to the state.”

FOX 35’s Robert Guaderrama is awaiting a response from state officials regarding the health department’s errors:

 

Florida has a statewide positivity rate of 12.5 percent, according to the state’s latest claims of 266,119 “confirmed cases” among Florida residents against a state population of nearly 21.5 million.

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

4 hours ago, 0R0 said:

That you and @Yoshiro keep protesting here that there is no conspiracy, that the virus is as bad as the panic mongers say indicates that you are part of the conspiracy and the movement for totalitarian socialist government in America and the world.

 

 

Disagreeing with you does not make one part of a conspiracy.  Even if there were a conspiracy the vast majority of people would not be part of it, or the secret would be out and therefore it would no longer a be a conspiracy.   Most people are just duped and have no idea of what is going on in a real conspiracy.

Don't end up thinking every democrat is some CCP operative and should be reported - that is total insanity. I don't think trump supporters are secret agents of the Freemasons or anything silly like that - just unenlightened.

Lastly, consider that you could be the one that is duped here; but not by China or the Dems. 

 

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

17 minutes ago, crazy trip said:

I’m curious if this is only a problem in Florida or is are other states not getting their numbers right as well?!!

 If this report is true the implications are IMO staggering!!

According to the latest publication of statewide test results from the Florida Department of Health, published on Friday, several testing facilities’ positivity rates for coronavirus tests were 27.66, 33.33, 37.10, 40, 43.13, 44.44, 50, 55, 57.14, 59.23, 60, 87.5, 91.18, and 100.

Twenty-two labs reported 100-percent positivity rates. Two labs reported 91.18-percent positivity rates. 

The Florida Department of Health’s stated positivity rates and associated volume of coronavirus cases does not match claims made by the testing facilities, reported FOX 35:

 

Countless labs have reported a 100 percent positivity rate, which means every single person tested was positive. Other labs had very high positivity rates. FOX 35 found that testing sites like Centra Care reported that 83 people were tested and all tested positive. Then, NCF Diagnostics in Alachua reported 88 percent of tests were positive.

How could that be? FOX 35 News investigated these astronomical numbers, contacting every local location mentioned in the report.

The report showed that Orlando Health had a 98 percent positivity rate. However, when FOX 35 News contacted the hospital, they confirmed errors in the report. Orlando Health’s positivity rate is only 9.4 percent, not 98 percent as in the report.

“The report also showed that the Orlando Veteran’s Medical Center had a positivity rate of 76 percent,” added FOX 35. “A spokesperson for the VA told FOX 35 News on Tuesday that this does not reflect their numbers and that the positivity rate for the center is actually 6 percent.”

The outlet added:

“FOX 35 News went on to speak with the Florida Department of Health on Tuesday. They confirmed that although private and public laboratories are required to report positive and negative results to the state immediately, some have not. Specifically, they said that some smaller, private labs were not reporting negative test result data to the state.”

FOX 35’s Robert Guaderrama is awaiting a response from state officials regarding the health department’s errors:

 

Florida has a statewide positivity rate of 12.5 percent, according to the state’s latest claims of 266,119 “confirmed cases” among Florida residents against a state population of nearly 21.5 million.

You don't die from a false positive (spare me the diatribe about mislabelled cause of death, I know all about that.)

The case numbers were skyrocketing, but the daily deaths were holding steady; which gave some credence to the "it's just increased testing or false positives" argument.  However, now the deaths per day is rising fast too, just a lag between cases detection and them getting sick enough to pass away.

Two days ago :380

Yesterday: 465

So far today : 732

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

 

[UNC12345 + 171]

5 hours ago, 0R0 said:

The outright statements are on the record for the left's plans for creating economic and social mayhem, expanding govt powers and suppressing individuals economically and socially, where accomplishing the goals of leftist dogma stands above the benefits to the public at large.

You really believe this BS?

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

4 minutes ago, UNC12345 said:

You really believe this BS?

BS=Basic Strategy for the Left

Let's just look at a few key indicators and see where they fall. What could possibly go wrong here? 

Defund the police

Don't open the economy

Arrest churchgoers, small business owners, beachcombers …

Arrest non mask wearers (unless they're rioting)

Encourage rioting

Fire people for not being Woke

Need I go on? 

 

[Yoshiro Kamamura + 274]

2 minutes ago, Ward Smith said:

BS=Basic Strategy for the Left

Let's just look at a few key indicators and see where they fall. What could possibly go wrong here? 

Defund the police

Don't open the economy

Arrest churchgoers, small business owners, beachcombers …

Arrest non mask wearers (unless they're rioting)

Encourage rioting

Fire people for not being Woke

Need I go on? 

 

No need, there is enough unsubstantiated, conspiracy-theory style drivel as it is. Especially now, when Trump decided, inspired by his favorite oriental dictators, that the best treatment of a problem he cannot solve is denying its existence, and despite warnings of actual professionals, he is driving the country, pedal to the metal, to a catastrophe of yet unprecedented levels. 

[UNC12345 + 171]

12 minutes ago, Ward Smith said:

Need I go on? 

No, you needn't go on.  So just to clarify, you honestly believe that all we are going through, the social and economic and human misery, is a big, purposeful effort on the part of the left/democrats to simply make Trump look bad so he'll lose the election?  

Edited July 14, 2020 by UNC12345
changed point

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

27 minutes ago, Ward Smith said:

 

Defund the police

 

Arrest churchgoers, small business owners, beachcombers …

Arrest non mask wearers (unless they're rioting)

 

Hard to do many arrests if you defund the police.

Do they want more or less policing?  You two are not clear on that at all. 

 

 

0R0 said:

"The outright statements are on the record for the left's plans for creating economic and social mayhem, expanding govt powers and suppressing individuals economically and socially, where accomplishing the goals of leftist dogma stands above the benefits to the public at large."

Edited July 14, 2020 by Enthalpic

[0R0 + 6,251]

1 hour ago, Enthalpic said:

Disagreeing with you does not make one part of a conspiracy.  Even if there were a conspiracy the vast majority of people would not be part of it, or the secret would be out and therefore it would no longer a be a conspiracy.   Most people are just duped and have no idea of what is going on in a real conspiracy.

Don't end up thinking every democrat is some CCP operative and should be reported - that is total insanity. I don't think trump supporters are secret agents of the Freemasons or anything silly like that - just unenlightened.

Lastly, consider that you could be the one that is duped here; but not by China or the Dems. 

 

You mean like Biden, who's son manages a billion dollar hedge fund for Chinese invesment? Or Feinstein with similar quid pro quo? While I don't believe they are communists, I do believe they havie an arrangement in order to promote implementation of  new left ideas in "green" projects, awarding prizes by race, and creating mass unemployment via UBI. That on top of the traditional progressive movement goals of high taxation, broad redistribution of income, international governance and political control over individuals including the press.

That said, the Democratic party is a big tent and has many factions. Not all of them are sell outs, Not all of them are defacto Chinese agents.

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

30 minutes ago, UNC12345 said:

No, you needn't go on.  So just to clarify, you honestly believe that all we are going through, the social and economic and human misery, is a big, purposeful effort on the part of the left/democrats to simply make Trump look bad so he'll lose the election?  

The Left will happily put this country through all kinds of misery, just for power. No doubt about it. They didn't invent the crisis, but they "never let a crisis go to waste". 

29 minutes ago, Enthalpic said:

Hard to do many arrests if you defund the police.

Do they want more or less policing?  You two are not clear on that at all. 

Purposefully obtuse or just stupid? Asking for a friend. 

There's more the left is doing, I wasn't intending to create an exhaustive list. For instance fighting reopening schools while simultaneously paying the teachers even more (their most generous donors).

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

5 minutes ago, Ward Smith said:

 

Purposefully obtuse or just stupid? Asking for a friend. 

There's more the left is doing, I wasn't intending to create an exhaustive list. For instance fighting reopening schools while simultaneously paying the teachers even more (their most generous donors).

Your post contained a clear self-contradiction, I asked for clarification and you reply with insults and something completely unrelated to the question.

In your opinion do the left want more or less policing?  Simple question.

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

2 minutes ago, Enthalpic said:

Your post contained a clear self-contradiction, I asked for clarification and you reply with insults and something completely unrelated to the question.

In your opinion do the left want more or less policing?  Simple question.

The Left wants to fire all existing police (they committed the unpardonable sin of voting Republican) to be replaced by their own "politically correct" brown shirt "police" who will happily shake down whitey for reparations, real and imagined. Speaking of "imagined" the Left has already been running with their "police reimagined" sloganeering. In the past week everyone from the left have been running with that line. 

The Mckluskeys committed the unpardonable sin of defending their property because the police were following "stand down" orders from their leftist politicians in St Louis. That will become the new norm in the US, tax payers will lose the services they've paid for while the brown shirts will claim the recently vacated properties that whitey will leave behind as they abandon the cesspools these cities will become. But the left still won't care! The worst city in the US is Detroit but it's a highly prized position, as the leftists who made bank running it (into the ground) can attest.