Sell Natural Gas Benefits to Grow the Market!

[ronwagn + 6,290]

I worked for Tidewater Oil, Getty Oil, and Phillips 66 when I first got out of the army. . I was a retail furniture salesman, sales manager, an manager for fifteen years before I went into a second career. Not long after I retired I started advocating natural gas after studying all the options. With the price of natural gas at record lows, it is a better option than ever! All I hear is groaning and moaning and pessimism while the advocates of so called renewables and batteries spout off like they are the only game in town. Where are the salesmen for natural gas?! You have to have maximum usage to have maximum demand. What percentage of their income is spent on marketing?! 

For years I participated in an engineers site although I am no engineer at all. I just did it to learn more about energy.

OK, so WHY is the natural gas industry not trying to sell new and old uses of natural gas?! Especially when it is at all time abundance and all time low cost?!  How about natural gas dryers and natural gas air conditioners or chillers? Below is a question I posed on the engineering site cr4.globalspec.com back about 2013. Dryers were mentioned positively by one poster although. 

Everyone on Oilprice.com knows that I promote (as a volunteer), natural gas vehicles, ships, locomotives et all. 

https://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/77350/Natural-Gas-Air-Conditioners-Cons-and-Pros

This site shows various options for using a natural gas air conditioner depending on your need. https://www.alpinehomeair.com/viewproduct.cfm?productID=453058740&linkfrom=froogle&campaign=53167777&content=&keyword=&msclkid=112f002d2a171dd192965f3592845a30&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=GOODMAN PLA&utm_term=4576992030740044&utm_content=Goodman

Natural Gas Dryers versus Electric Dryers.

https://www.alpinehomeair.com/viewproduct.cfm?productID=453058740&linkfrom=froogle&campaign=53167777&content=&keyword=&msclkid=112f002d2a171dd192965f3592845a30&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=GOODMAN PLA&utm_term=4576992030740044&utm_content=Goodman

 

 

Edited July 22, 2020 by ronwagn
addition

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

3 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

I worked for Tidewater Oil, Getty Oil, and Phillips 66 when I first got out of the army. . I was a retail furniture salesman, sales manager, an manager for fifteen years before I went into a second career. Not long after I retired I started advocating natural gas after studying all the options. With the price of natural gas at record lows, it is a better option than ever! All I hear is groaning and moaning and pessimism while the advocates of so called renewables and batteries spout off like they are the only game in town. Where are the salesmen for natural gas?! You have to have maximum usage to have maximum demand. What percentage of their income is spent on marketing?! 

For years I participated in an engineers site although I am no engineer at all. I just did it to learn more about energy.

OK, so WHY is the natural gas industry not trying to sell new and old uses of natural gas?! Especially when it is at all time abundance and all time low cost?!  How about natural gas dryers and natural gas air conditioners or chillers? Below is a question I posed on the engineering site cr4.globalspec.com back about 2013. Dryers were mentioned positively by one poster although

https://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/77350/Natural-Gas-Air-Conditioners-Cons-and-Pros

This site shows various options for using a natural gas air conditioner depending on your need. https://www.alpinehomeair.com/viewproduct.cfm?productID=453058740&linkfrom=froogle&campaign=53167777&content=&keyword=&msclkid=112f002d2a171dd192965f3592845a30&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=GOODMAN PLA&utm_term=4576992030740044&utm_content=Goodman

Natural Gas Dryers versus Electric Dryers.

https://www.alpinehomeair.com/viewproduct.cfm?productID=453058740&linkfrom=froogle&campaign=53167777&content=&keyword=&msclkid=112f002d2a171dd192965f3592845a30&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=GOODMAN PLA&utm_term=4576992030740044&utm_content=Goodman

 

 

I would like a fancy gas range with a huge hood someday - choice of pros.

Although, my flat-top electric is easy to clean...

Edited July 22, 2020 by Enthalpic

[ronwagn + 6,290]

2 minutes ago, Enthalpic said:

I would like a fancy gas range with a huge hood someday - choice of pros.

Although, my flat-top electric is easy to clean...

Hi Enthalpic, Yeah we got stuck with one when we bought the house. I doubt the natural gas use is very sizeable though. New natural gas ranges are now illegal in , at least, parts of California and other states often follow California. Once you get used to taking the pot or pan off, instead of just turning the handle off, you are OK IMHO. 

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

3 hours ago, ronwagn said:

I worked for Tidewater Oil, Getty Oil, and Phillips 66 when I first got out of the army. . I was a retail furniture salesman, sales manager, an manager for fifteen years before I went into a second career. Not long after I retired I started advocating natural gas after studying all the options. With the price of natural gas at record lows, it is a better option than ever! All I hear is groaning and moaning and pessimism while the advocates of so called renewables and batteries spout off like they are the only game in town. Where are the salesmen for natural gas?! You have to have maximum usage to have maximum demand. What percentage of their income is spent on marketing?! 

For years I participated in an engineers site although I am no engineer at all. I just did it to learn more about energy.

OK, so WHY is the natural gas industry not trying to sell new and old uses of natural gas?! Especially when it is at all time abundance and all time low cost?!  How about natural gas dryers and natural gas air conditioners or chillers? Below is a question I posed on the engineering site cr4.globalspec.com back about 2013. Dryers were mentioned positively by one poster although. 

Everyone on Oilprice.com knows that I promote (as a volunteer), natural gas vehicles, ships, locomotives et all. 

https://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/77350/Natural-Gas-Air-Conditioners-Cons-and-Pros

This site shows various options for using a natural gas air conditioner depending on your need. https://www.alpinehomeair.com/viewproduct.cfm?productID=453058740&linkfrom=froogle&campaign=53167777&content=&keyword=&msclkid=112f002d2a171dd192965f3592845a30&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=GOODMAN PLA&utm_term=4576992030740044&utm_content=Goodman

Natural Gas Dryers versus Electric Dryers.

https://www.alpinehomeair.com/viewproduct.cfm?productID=453058740&linkfrom=froogle&campaign=53167777&content=&keyword=&msclkid=112f002d2a171dd192965f3592845a30&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=GOODMAN PLA&utm_term=4576992030740044&utm_content=Goodman

 

 

Interesting isn't it, questions such as these about products and/or markets that never seem to take off, even when the evidence seems so overwhelming?  I've seen it first hand with products and services in the aviation industry as well.

But the answer seems obvious when you back up and look at the bigger picture, or perhaps more accurately: the bigger players (including financiers, OEMs and governments).  Both aviation and oil are similarly boom or bust industries.  When they make money, they make LOTS of money; when they lose money, they lose lots of money too, but then they change hands and someone else takes over.  Rarely does a company (employees, assets, properties, etc.) cease to exist, they just change hands.

Then you think about what would happen if you replaced oil with a consistent low cost supply of natural gas, locally procurable and cheep to extract, refine(?) and transport.  Even though costs and profits might be consistent with say 2.5-15% profit on $1.00, that won't make anyone rich!  Or not too many people anyway.  Oil is different because the worldwide market is rather opaque and because of this it can be, and is, manipulated continuously.  The opacity of the industry allows for manipulation that makes a LOT of people rich, or at least allows many players to achieve dominance in areas we've never even thought of.

Just my thoughts.  Your mileage, as they say, may differ.

[ronwagn + 6,290]

On 7/22/2020 at 9:32 PM, Dan Warnick said:

Interesting isn't it, questions such as these about products and/or markets that never seem to take off, even when the evidence seems so overwhelming?  I've seen it first hand with products and services in the aviation industry as well.

But the answer seems obvious when you back up and look at the bigger picture, or perhaps more accurately: the bigger players (including financiers, OEMs and governments).  Both aviation and oil are similarly boom or bust industries.  When they make money, they make LOTS of money; when they lose money, they lose lots of money too, but then they change hands and someone else takes over.  Rarely does a company (employees, assets, properties, etc.) cease to exist, they just change hands.

Then you think about what would happen if you replaced oil with a consistent low cost supply of natural gas, locally procurable and cheep to extract, refine(?) and transport.  Even though costs and profits might be consistent with say 2.5-15% profit on $1.00, that won't make anyone rich!  Or not too many people anyway.  Oil is different because the worldwide market is rather opaque and because of this it can be, and is, manipulated continuously.  The opacity of the industry allows for manipulation that makes a LOT of people rich, or at least allows many players to achieve dominance in areas we've never even thought of.

Just my thoughts.  Your mileage, as they say, may differ.

You are way over my head on that logic, but it would make total sense for the plutocrats around the world. The politicians can also gain a lot of benefit by wheeling and dealing on other technology versus the simplistic natural gas industry.

I am an idealist and logical thinker that is not interested in great riches. I feel rich with a middle class lifestyle in a nice area which is somewhat rural. I would have a much more expensive home if I had stayed in California, but I love the green countryside of the Midwest and have enjoyed life here more. No traffic, no congestion. Simpler society and lifestyle. My acre and home here would be worth beyond the average in California, although they might scrape the house and build a McMansion.

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

8 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

 

I am an idealist and logical thinker that is not interested in great riches. I feel rich with a middle class lifestyle in a nice area which is somewhat rural. I would have a much more expensive home if I had stayed in California, but I love the green countryside of the Midwest and have enjoyed life here more. No traffic, no congestion. Simpler society and lifestyle. My acre and home here would be worth beyond the average in California, although they might scrape the house and build a McMansion.

I've never understood chasing excessive wealth. 

Money is artificial - land is real, enjoy. 

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

2 hours ago, ronwagn said:

You are way over my head on that logic, but it would make total sense for the plutocrats around the world. The politicians can also gain a lot of benefit by wheeling and dealing on other technology versus the simplistic natural gas industry.

I am an idealist and logical thinker that is not interested in great riches. I feel rich with a middle class lifestyle in a nice area which is somewhat rural. I would have a much more expensive home if I had stayed in California, but I love the green countryside of the Midwest and have enjoyed life here more. No traffic, no congestion. Simpler society and lifestyle. My acre and home here would be worth beyond the average in California, although they might scrape the house and build a McMansion.

Oh, the examples I could give you in aviation...

I agree with your way of thinking and, maybe because I have never risen to those guys' level of gamesmanship, would prefer to see more people better off than a few hundred or a few thousand rich.  But like I say, I have never risen to their level, so maybe I would feel differently if I had.  Logic says I am probably right where I should be, and so are you.  That's ok, because I also prefer my own acre and house (that's not too big but very well appointed and will be easy for my wife to maintain long after I'm gone) in an almost rural setting (think Taylorville, right at the edge of town).

I'd like a bit more money and security into the future, but I always do well enough to sustain a good life for my family, extended family, and myself.  I keep my integrity and honor and I take pride in those attributes.  In fact, I'd say it is somewhat safe to say that if I didn't hold those attributes so dearly, I'd get more money.  Not saying the "big" guys don't have the same attributes; I'm sure many of them do.  I guess what I'm really saying is I suppose I never was really willing to stretch those attributes to the extent that others may have.

Have a great day my friend and say hello to the black dirt for me.

[ronwagn + 6,290]

12 hours ago, Dan Warnick said:

Oh, the examples I could give you in aviation...

I agree with your way of thinking and, maybe because I have never risen to those guys' level of gamesmanship, would prefer to see more people better off than a few hundred or a few thousand rich.  But like I say, I have never risen to their level, so maybe I would feel differently if I had.  Logic says I am probably right where I should be, and so are you.  That's ok, because I also prefer my own acre and house (that's not too big but very well appointed and will be easy for my wife to maintain long after I'm gone) in an almost rural setting (think Taylorville, right at the edge of town).

I'd like a bit more money and security into the future, but I always do well enough to sustain a good life for my family, extended family, and myself.  I keep my integrity and honor and I take pride in those attributes.  In fact, I'd say it is somewhat safe to say that if I didn't hold those attributes so dearly, I'd get more money.  Not saying the "big" guys don't have the same attributes; I'm sure many of them do.  I guess what I'm really saying is I suppose I never was really willing to stretch those attributes to the extent that others may have.

Have a great day my friend and say hello to the black dirt for me.

My acre doesn't have the great black soil like I had in Mt. Auburn.  It is shaded by 155 year old Burr Oaks, Silver and one Blaze Maple (I planted in front of our new home) one remaining Hickory, multiple Eastern White Pines etc. I have planted a lot of Rose of Sharon and Black eyed Susan. Our garden is now taking off under my wife's care. Great to have fresh stuff that tastes great but I am sure it cost more than we save. It is in partial shade too. My fruit trees have given little fruit, probably due to poor soil and shade. I had great peaches in Mt. Auburn.

[Prometheus1354 + 178]

On 7/23/2020 at 9:34 PM, ronwagn said:

You are way over my head on that logic, but it would make total sense for the plutocrats around the world. The politicians can also gain a lot of benefit by wheeling and dealing on other technology versus the simplistic natural gas industry.

I am an idealist and logical thinker that is not interested in great riches. I feel rich with a middle class lifestyle in a nice area which is somewhat rural. I would have a much more expensive home if I had stayed in California, but I love the green countryside of the Midwest and have enjoyed life here more. No traffic, no congestion. Simpler society and lifestyle. My acre and home here would be worth beyond the average in California, although they might scrape the house and build a McMansion.

I hope you are enjoyin the fruits of your labor!  Certainly sounds like it.  I'm still here in NorCal for the time being.

Shortly after getting out of the Corps I was talkin with one of my best friends from.  He was griping about how much he had just paid for the home he an his new bride had purchased.  Now this was 1991 and we'd both been out for about 2 1/2 yrs.  He lived in Eau Claire, WI at the time.  They've since moved too NM to be closer too Dale's Mom after her Dad passed.  I digress, they paid (at the time) a whopping $54,725 for a 5 yr old 3/2.  I literally burst out laughin at him, I said "Ted, that $54K would barely buy you a garage here in Silicon Valley"! Again, 1991; not 2020 by any means!  lol   I sent him a full page add from the following Sunday SJ Merc News housing sect.  He called me after gettin my letter an attached...  He was like "How the Hell do you afford a $220K home"?!?!  I said you just do or you drive in from places like Richmond or Pinole Valley in the East Bay. Or (shuddering at the memory) even as far away as Sacramento.  Yes, I did the Kesttle Run for a very long 3 mo right after being hired by a company in the Valley as my folks live in the 916 and I was stayin with them.  I finally bit the bullet an moved to Mtn. View when gas hit $1.10 per gallon!  Those were the days!

I certainly would love to get away from this mess, buy a small plot (1-2 acres) with a home for my one daughter an my Granson Noah 2-22-14. He's Autistic (non verbal) Plenty of rm ta run around with the pup an be safe from the gaggle of cars racin up an down the street every day now...  Just have to make sure there's a good Children's Hospital for him.   Sorry, didn't mean to let my thoughts wonder all over the page...   Have a great day!!

[ronwagn + 6,290]

4 hours ago, Prometheus1354 said:

I hope you are enjoyin the fruits of your labor!  Certainly sounds like it.  I'm still here in NorCal for the time being.

Shortly after getting out of the Corps I was talkin with one of my best friends from.  He was griping about how much he had just paid for the home he an his new bride had purchased.  Now this was 1991 and we'd both been out for about 2 1/2 yrs.  He lived in Eau Claire, WI at the time.  They've since moved too NM to be closer too Dale's Mom after her Dad passed.  I digress, they paid (at the time) a whopping $54,725 for a 5 yr old 3/2.  I literally burst out laughin at him, I said "Ted, that $54K would barely buy you a garage here in Silicon Valley"! Again, 1991; not 2020 by any means!  lol   I sent him a full page add from the following Sunday SJ Merc News housing sect.  He called me after gettin my letter an attached...  He was like "How the Hell do you afford a $220K home"?!?!  I said you just do or you drive in from places like Richmond or Pinole Valley in the East Bay. Or (shuddering at the memory) even as far away as Sacramento.  Yes, I did the Kesttle Run for a very long 3 mo right after being hired by a company in the Valley as my folks live in the 916 and I was stayin with them.  I finally bit the bullet an moved to Mtn. View when gas hit $1.10 per gallon!  Those were the days!

I certainly would love to get away from this mess, buy a small plot (1-2 acres) with a home for my one daughter an my Granson Noah 2-22-14. He's Autistic (non verbal) Plenty of rm ta run around with the pup an be safe from the gaggle of cars racin up an down the street every day now...  Just have to make sure there's a good Children's Hospital for him.   Sorry, didn't mean to let my thoughts wonder all over the page...   Have a great day!!

Apparently our value systems are somewhat similar. I grew up in the Crenshaw District of Los Angeles when it was White. We then moved to Inglewood to a better area with better schools. It was turning mildly Black when I went into the army. The old areas look even better than when I lived there, but the Crenshaw district is high crime and Inglewood is probably a high crime district too now. The real estate is very valuable. 

When I bought my first home at the end of the 60 freeway in southern West Covina It was $23,500. 42 months later I sold it for $40,500 and moved to Auburn northeast of Sacramento into a beautiful pine studded area of the Gold Country at 4,000 feet. Both of those homes are probably $500,000 right now. I lost out financially but gained in overall lifestyle eventually. A transfer with a management job moved me to Bakersfield where housing was still cheap (But interest rates were sky high then). I tried Seattle later but ended up in my wifes tiny hometown in central Illinois. I have been here for 34 years and would not change a thing. I might have been very happy staying in Auburn, CA though. Around Decatur we have a high crime urban core and lots of very desirable suburbs plus rural areas all around. Good liveable homes start at $ 25,000 in sketchy neighborhoods of Decatur. (Not bad neighborhoods, but not good either). An average home in an average neighborhood is about $100,000. For $250,000 you can can get a very nice big home on a large lot or a few acres, maybe even on Lake Decatur. We bought houses for two of our daughters who needed the help. 

Illinois is now run by Chicago and taxes are high and will go higher. I would recommend a Redder state like Missouri, Tennessee, Idaho, Utah,  or wherever but some of those may go Blue in the future too. Make your money where you can and move to a cheaper area when you don't need a high income. Many Californians can live off of their excess equity but may pay an extremely high tax penalty. 

I forgot to mention that I have a high functioning autistic grand daughter who lives in one of the two extra houses we bought. She needs help keeping it neat and clean but that is the way it is. We adopted her after her mom died of leukemia. 

Edited August 8, 2020 by ronwagn
addition