GREEN NEW DEAL = BLIZZARD OF LIES

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

11 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

Here is where the rubber meets the road, a supply shortage for the proposed EV revolution. End of the road, guys.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/UK-Electric-Vehicle-Plans-Hit-Lithium-Supply-Roadblock.html

"The UK will need between 53,000 and 70,000 tonnes of lithium per year to meet EV demand by 2030, but is currently on track to secure only around 35,000 tonnes, according to energy research firm Rystad.

Industry experts have called for increased government investment in domestic lithium processing capabilities, and the establishment of new trading agreements with countries abundant in lithium to ensure a stable supply for the UK's EV industry.

As China dominates the global lithium processing market, the UK is urged to enhance its domestic lithium processing capabilities and secure trade agreements with major lithium exporters like Australia and South American nations to meet its EV ambitions."

And any UK deficit will just be made up by importing batteries from elsewhere, usually already installed in cars made elsewhere.

Edited June 21, 2023 by Jay McKinsey

[Ecocharger + 1,474]

7 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

And any UK deficit will just be made up by importing batteries from elsewhere, usually already installed in cars made elsewhere.

Show us your data, old boy. Dreams do not count.

You skipped this, Jay.

"And while the UK published a Critical Minerals Strategy in July last year, the only tangible developments since then have been the launch of a new intelligence centre, to study the minerals the UK is sorely lacking, and the meeting of a new taskforce which does not appear to have done anything.

Mike Hawes, chief executive of the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders told City A.M. that although the UK has some lithium supply, this is “not enough to sustain our current, or indeed future, electric vehicle battery production ambitions.”"

The writing is on the wall.

Edited June 21, 2023 by Ecocharger

[turbguy + 1,544]

On 6/19/2023 at 12:38 PM, Eyes Wide Open said:

Ahh it seems you might be missing something here. Ok let us try it this way..perhaps you do a quick Google search. Make a list of the just who is there...At that point if the lights do not illuminate a "thought"  you might very well be suffering a green energy blackout...or the air is quite thin up there today.

Now the serious question would how does one fit so many egos into one visit..That is a extraordinary accomplishment!

That is not even close to anything that could answer my question.

WHAT ACTIONS are they playing out?

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

20 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

Show us your data, old boy. Dreams do not count.

It is just how the global market works. The UK imports almost 60% of their cars. So 35K tons of lithium would keep them at about the same percentage of import vs domestic production according to the numbers you provided..

According to the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders (SMMT), approximately 58% of the UK automobile market is imported.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Jay McKinsey

[Ecocharger + 1,474]

1 hour ago, Jay McKinsey said:

It is just how the global market works. The UK imports almost 60% of their cars. So 35K tons of lithium would keep them at about the same percentage of import vs domestic production according to the numbers you provided..

According to the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders (SMMT), approximately 58% of the UK automobile market is imported.

Here is the reality,

"And while the UK published a Critical Minerals Strategy in July last year, the only tangible developments since then have been the launch of a new intelligence centre, to study the minerals the UK is sorely lacking, and the meeting of a new taskforce which does not appear to have done anything.

Mike Hawes, chief executive of the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders told City A.M. that although the UK has some lithium supply, this is “not enough to sustain our current, or indeed future, electric vehicle battery production ambitions.”"

Edited June 22, 2023 by Ecocharger

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

10 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

Here is the reality,

"And while the UK published a Critical Minerals Strategy in July last year, the only tangible developments since then have been the launch of a new intelligence centre, to study the minerals the UK is sorely lacking, and the meeting of a new taskforce which does not appear to have done anything.

Mike Hawes, chief executive of the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders told City A.M. that although the UK has some lithium supply, this is “not enough to sustain our current, or indeed future, electric vehicle battery production ambitions.”"

Yes they need to make more investments if they want to produce their domestic production goals. Now watch them start to make those investments. But again, 60% of UK cars are imported and that isn't likely to change.

The US is making huge investments to meet our EV production goals. That is just how the economy works. 

The reality is that the UK is a basket case because of Brexit. Ireland is picking up all the business between the US and Europe. Their GDP has doubled since Brexit.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Jay McKinsey

[bloodman33 + 22]

Big oil is killing the planet.  It is hot! Hot! HOT!  Who is paying the people on this thread defending big oil?  Pathetic!

[Ecocharger + 1,474]

3 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Yes they need to make more investments if they want to produce their domestic production goals. Now watch them start to make those investments. But again, 60% of UK cars are imported and that isn't likely to change.

The US is making huge investments to meet our EV production goals. That is just how the economy works. 

The reality is that the UK is a basket case because of Brexit. Ireland is picking up all the business between the US and Europe. Their GDP has doubled since Brexit.

The reality is that no one wants the dirty mining associated with lithium, so that future is cloudy.

[Ecocharger + 1,474]

1 hour ago, bloodman33 said:

Big oil is killing the planet.  It is hot! Hot! HOT!  Who is paying the people on this thread defending big oil?  Pathetic!

Why don't you drive an EV and help the planet? Hmm?

Because of the climate panic lies which you yourself believe are nonsense?

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

14 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

The reality is that no one wants the dirty mining associated with lithium, so that future is cloudy.

Lithium mining is cleaner than coal or oil. 

Nothing dirty about about an evaporation pond:

or a geothermal well that is completely green:

California’s Imperial Valley contains some of the largest lithium deposits in the world, specifically underground near the Salton Sea – a region also known as Lithium Valley.

Experts believe Lithium Valley could provide enough lithium to meet all of America’s future demand and more than one-third of global demand – supercharging the transition to zero-emission vehicles.

Governor Newsom Visits Lithium Valley to Highlight Momentum on Becoming Global Source for Battery Production

Published: Mar 20, 2023

Since you probably can't figure it out that is just pure clean geothermal steam coming out of that well.

What Governor Newsom said: “We’re building a hub for global innovation while ensuring this transformation benefits communities right here in Imperial Valley. California is poised to become the world’s largest source of batteries, and it couldn’t come at a more crucial moment in our efforts to move away from fossil fuels. The future happens here first – and Lithium Valley is fast-tracking the world’s clean energy future.”

Edited June 22, 2023 by Jay McKinsey

[bloodman33 + 22]

The truth will set you free.  Undeniable. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/21/senate-budget-committee-dark-money-climate-action

[specinho + 470]

3 hours ago, bloodman33 said:

Big oil is killing the planet.  It is hot! Hot! HOT!  Who is paying the people on this thread defending big oil?  Pathetic!

You must keep up with the discussion... Have you seen this image posted? What does it tell you? 

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

14 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

Not realistic...your article states that India is "a country that currently relies on coal for around 75% of its electricity."

That's a lot of coal.

Yes but their poltical direction on powergen production is now renewable and not coal.

That means no increase in coal use, in fact it will lead to a steafy decline which pretty much every industrial commentator agrees on.

that means there NOT a lot of coal.

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

14 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

Again, this is a model for massive government subsidization and economic deterioration for those unfortunate countries which adopt this approach.

Read your own material here,

"Already more than 250,000 homes in Paris rely on geothermal heating and the German government has committed to spending €1bn (£860m) before 2035 to create 100 geothermal projects.

Rishi Sunak said the report would help the government decide whether there was a bigger role for deep geothermal energy in the UK economy.

“We have made rapid progress on switching to homegrown renewable electricity and have made energy security a key priority. Success is going to depend on pulling all the levers at our disposal,” the prime minister said."

Purely the result of massive government spending. Not efficient or realistic.

Ground source heat pumps for homes are expensive initially but once installed you basically have free energy for the lifespan of that heat pump. The UK are adopting air source heat pumps as a cheaper alternative to ground source pumps. The use of ground source heat pumps in Scandinavia is commonplace for example.

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

8 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

Here is where the rubber meets the road, a supply shortage for the proposed EV revolution. End of the road, guys.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/UK-Electric-Vehicle-Plans-Hit-Lithium-Supply-Roadblock.html

"The UK will need between 53,000 and 70,000 tonnes of lithium per year to meet EV demand by 2030, but is currently on track to secure only around 35,000 tonnes, according to energy research firm Rystad.

Industry experts have called for increased government investment in domestic lithium processing capabilities, and the establishment of new trading agreements with countries abundant in lithium to ensure a stable supply for the UK's EV industry.

As China dominates the global lithium processing market, the UK is urged to enhance its domestic lithium processing capabilities and secure trade agreements with major lithium exporters like Australia and South American nations to meet its EV ambitions."

End of the road??? Thats 7 years away Eco!!

have you not heard of increasing production to compensate for growth? Thats exactly what industry experts are saying to do and it will get done in that timeframe.

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

4 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

The reality is that no one wants the dirty mining associated with lithium, so that future is cloudy.

But its OK in your world to mine coal and burn that and pollute the atmosphere and the water table etc etc.?

Double standards Eco

[Ecocharger + 1,474]

7 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Lithium mining is cleaner than coal or oil. 

Nothing dirty about about an evaporation pond:

or a geothermal well that is completely green:

California’s Imperial Valley contains some of the largest lithium deposits in the world, specifically underground near the Salton Sea – a region also known as Lithium Valley.

Experts believe Lithium Valley could provide enough lithium to meet all of America’s future demand and more than one-third of global demand – supercharging the transition to zero-emission vehicles.

Governor Newsom Visits Lithium Valley to Highlight Momentum on Becoming Global Source for Battery Production

Published: Mar 20, 2023

Since you probably can't figure it out that is just pure clean geothermal steam coming out of that well.

What Governor Newsom said: “We’re building a hub for global innovation while ensuring this transformation benefits communities right here in Imperial Valley. California is poised to become the world’s largest source of batteries, and it couldn’t come at a more crucial moment in our efforts to move away from fossil fuels. The future happens here first – and Lithium Valley is fast-tracking the world’s clean energy future.”

How clean is lithium?

https://nj.gov/health/eoh/rtkweb/documents/fs/1119.pdf

Edited June 22, 2023 by Ecocharger

[Ecocharger + 1,474]

3 hours ago, Rob Plant said:

But its OK in your world to mine coal and burn that and pollute the atmosphere and the water table etc etc.?

Double standards Eco

Clean burning of coal causes insignificant problems.

CO2 is not a pollutant.

[Ecocharger + 1,474]

3 hours ago, Rob Plant said:

End of the road??? Thats 7 years away Eco!!

have you not heard of increasing production to compensate for growth? Thats exactly what industry experts are saying to do and it will get done in that timeframe.

Lithium is a problem to produce.

[Ecocharger + 1,474]

3 hours ago, Rob Plant said:

Ground source heat pumps for homes are expensive initially but once installed you basically have free energy for the lifespan of that heat pump. The UK are adopting air source heat pumps as a cheaper alternative to ground source pumps. The use of ground source heat pumps in Scandinavia is commonplace for example.

And expensive.

[Ecocharger + 1,474]

5 hours ago, bloodman33 said:

The truth will set you free.  Undeniable. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/21/senate-budget-committee-dark-money-climate-action

A complete lack of scientific analysis of the climate causes...just panic rhetoric.

That is all that is enabling the idiotic Global Warming hysteria.

[Ecocharger + 1,474]

3 hours ago, Rob Plant said:

Yes but their poltical direction on powergen production is now renewable and not coal.

That means no increase in coal use, in fact it will lead to a steafy decline which pretty much every industrial commentator agrees on.

that means there NOT a lot of coal.

We will see, it is difficult to replace 75% of the energy source in a short time. 

I say it will not happen without a drastic reduction in India's current standard of living.

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

1 hour ago, Ecocharger said:

Lithium is a problem to produce.

nope not really its quite straightforward

Lithium obtained from salars is recovered in the form of lithium carbonate, the raw material used in lithium ion batteries. The production process is fairly straightforward and requires only natural evaporation, which leaves behind not only lithium, but also magnesium, calcium, sodium, and potassium.

The lithium content of ocean water is far lower, hovering around 0.17 parts per million. However, about 20 percent of the lithium in seawater can be recovered using a combination of membranes, filters, and ion-exchange resins.

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

1 hour ago, Ecocharger said:

And expensive.

Only initially then its free

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

1 hour ago, Ecocharger said:

We will see, it is difficult to replace 75% of the energy source in a short time. 

I say it will not happen without a drastic reduction in India's current standard of living.

I agree that will take some time but the point is it will reduce and I believe I posted recently that it would be a steady decline from 2025