GREEN NEW DEAL = BLIZZARD OF LIES

[Ecocharger + 1,384]

3 hours ago, Boat said:

You missed Putin with missiles eh? Nord stream 2 was not a renewable problem. When the Chinese started the trend called “let it rot” did you drop in for a nap? So the Saudi say let’s drop production, your brain thinks, must be renewables at fault. Production drops in oil cannot be called intermittent. When the Chinese got mad at Australia and slowed coal purchases, was that intermittent? Me thinks your bs is just that. Lol If the Chinese use more coal to build larger and cheaper tvs. Ok I can accept that. 

You will have to accept large increases in Chinese coal output, if electricity in China is to be made available for the carbon-intense EV sector.

[Ecocharger + 1,384]

5 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said:

The electricity market requires a 100% match between production and demand. End of story. It does not work any other way.

Oh and solar requires no weatherization whatsoever and turbines are consistently provided with weatherization everywhere but the moronic state of Texas.

Production and demand are not constants, and levels of  production can be adjusted. Not a zero-sum market.

[Jay McKinsey + 1,489]

4 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

Production and demand are not constants, and levels of  production can be adjusted. Not a zero-sum market.

Zero-sum game is a mathematical representation in game theory and economic theory of a situation that involves two sides, where the result is an advantage for one side and an equivalent loss for the other.^[1] In other words, player one's gain is equivalent to player two's loss, with the result that the net improvement in benefit of the game is zero.

This is the definition of the electricity industry. You don't get to have an opinion.

[turbguy + 1,422]

3 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

Production and demand are not constants, and levels of  production can be adjusted. Not a zero-sum market.

Except in Texas, February, 2021.

For every watt-hour put in, a watt-hour is consumed. 

Sounds like in = out to me.

Something like:  IN + OUT = ZERO

Fossil Fuels?  There's these things called "coal piles" and "inventory".

Edited July 1, 2023 by turbguy

[specinho + 441]

Ahheermmmm..... 

Those officers in charged have gotten a new theory on productive work days.... 

[bloodman33 + 20]

Ecocharger are you a Russian bot trying to destroy the United States and the world with your oil industry loving gibberish?  By the way I am not being verbal, I am writing and I apologize for nothing.  It is time you donate your life savings to AOC.

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,141]

4 hours ago, turbguy said:

For every watt-hour put in, a watt-hour is consumed. 

Sounds like in = out to me.

Something like:  IN + OUT = ZERO

Uh?  Hell No

Consumed = Produced - balance loading(inertia + phase) - wasted power(multiple ways)

[Jay McKinsey + 1,489]

1 hour ago, footeab@yahoo.com said:

Uh?  Hell No

Consumed = Produced - balance loading(inertia + phase) - wasted power(multiple ways)

So you say hell no and then you say hell yes every watt consumed is a watt put in. Your dumb knows no limits.

[turbguy + 1,422]

18 hours ago, footeab@yahoo.com said:

Uh?  Hell No

Consumed = Produced - balance loading(inertia + phase) - wasted power(multiple ways)

Wasted power (transmission losses, etc) is still consumed within the system.  That's the "price" of delivery. Conservation of energy.

How much rotating inertia (stored energy) is actually available FOR USE, if synchronous machines trip (or, load starts to auto-shed) at an underfrequency of 1% speed?  That's only 36 RPM in a 3600 RPM machine.  It's not much, compared to the total inertial energy stored from 0 to 3564 RPM.

Then, just look at this chart, and tell me "what was the lion's share of lost generation in the Texas Event, February, 2021".

Edited July 2, 2023 by turbguy

[Ron Wagner + 649]

On 6/23/2023 at 4:38 AM, Rob Plant said:

no i mean a decline in pollution

Do you think that CO2 is the cause of pollution? What percentage of pollution?

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,141]

Fertilizer for plant and crustaceans, yum.  I like Lobster.  CO2, great fertilizer.

[Ecocharger + 1,384]

On 6/30/2023 at 8:34 PM, Jay McKinsey said:

Zero-sum game is a mathematical representation in game theory and economic theory of a situation that involves two sides, where the result is an advantage for one side and an equivalent loss for the other.^[1] In other words, player one's gain is equivalent to player two's loss, with the result that the net improvement in benefit of the game is zero.

This is the definition of the electricity industry. You don't get to have an opinion.

No, the electricity market is not a fixed quantity, Jay, you again have misunderstood the application of game theory.

It is like dividing an apple pie into sections, if you increase one piece of pie, another piece of pie must be reduced, or at least a group of other pieces of pie must be reduced.

But if the pie itself is growing or shrinking, the calculations are different. You could have several pieces of pie growing while the other pieces are not reduced, or you could have all pieces of pie increasing while the pie is growing.

Zero-sum is a static analysis, not applied into a dynamic context.

Edited July 2, 2023 by Ecocharger

[Ecocharger + 1,384]

On 7/1/2023 at 10:05 AM, turbguy said:

Wasted power (transmission losses, etc) is still consumed within the system.  That's the "price" of delivery. Conservation of energy.

How much rotating inertia (stored energy) is actually available FOR USE, if synchronous machines trip (or, load starts to auto-shed) at an underfrequency of 1% speed?  That's only 36 RPM in a 3600 RPM machine.  It's not much, compared to the total inertial energy stored from 0 to 3564 RPM.

Then, just look at this chart, and tell me "what was the lion's share of lost generation in the Texas Event, February, 2021".

You mean after the Texas authorities shut down the electric supply to the backup fossil fuel generators? That was the result of failure in the wind/solar sector.

[Ecocharger + 1,384]

On 7/1/2023 at 4:23 AM, Jay McKinsey said:

So you say hell no and then you say hell yes every watt consumed is a watt put in. Your dumb knows no limits.

Again, you are thinking in terms of static analysis, the market for supply and demand of electricity is not a fixed quantity, but can be decreased or increased by decisions made by the authorities.

Edited July 2, 2023 by Ecocharger

[Ecocharger + 1,384]

On 7/1/2023 at 3:08 AM, bloodman33 said:

Ecocharger are you a Russian bot trying to destroy the United States and the world with your oil industry loving gibberish?  By the way I am not being verbal, I am writing and I apologize for nothing.  It is time you donate your life savings to AOC.

Are you Russian?

[Ecocharger + 1,384]

On 6/30/2023 at 10:18 PM, turbguy said:

Except in Texas, February, 2021.

For every watt-hour put in, a watt-hour is consumed. 

Sounds like in = out to me.

Something like:  IN + OUT = ZERO

Fossil Fuels?  There's these things called "coal piles" and "inventory".

The parameters of electricity supply and demand are not fixed constants, but are the result of decisions made by authorities.

Edited July 2, 2023 by Ecocharger

[Jay McKinsey + 1,489]

3 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

Again, you are thinking in terms of static analysis, the market for supply and demand of electricity is not a fixed quantity, but can be decreased or increased by decisions made by the authorities.

The grid requires that supply and demand are equal or else the grid fails. It does not work any other way, It is a brutal all or nothing market. Power plants do not run at 50% output because they would be losing money. They run at 100% or 0%. You don't get to have an opinion. 

The Texas authorities decreased production because they were idiotic morons and people died. They barely missed crashing the entire grid and killing 10x as many people. The electricity market is a zero sum game. 

The difference in US electrical production between 2007 and 2022 is less than 1%. Try dealing with reality.

Edited July 2, 2023 by Jay McKinsey

[turbguy + 1,422]

6 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Power plants do not run at 50% output because they would be losing money. They run at 100% or 0%. You don't get to have an opinion. 

 

To be honest, only nuc plants are operated "pedal to the metal" almost all the time.  Many fossil resources (coal, oil, NG) cycle.  Some operate at 100% if they are fully "in the market" (have the next cheapest price).  Some coal plants cycle between 100% to "min load" daily. Many, many units operate on AGC (Automatic Generation Control) from signals sent from the grid operator to raise or lower generation, and cycle up and down all during the day, to balance generation with demand in a "Balancing Area". 

This cycling is typically in a rather narrow band, so that the operators don't have to start-stop plant equipment (coal mills, boiler feed pumps, etc) frequently.

And...yes, cycling load looses them some revenue, and increases wear and tear.

Edited July 3, 2023 by turbguy

[AlBub + 14]

On 6/30/2023 at 3:05 PM, notsonice said:

softball sized is baseball sized

this happened in the last few days

 

 

Thank you! That is exactly the instance I was thinking of. Their have been a lot of hail storms in my area. I am sure their has been some damage to an few solar farms around here, just no as bad so easy to hide. I have had 4 hail storms here this year, only pea-sized to marble-sized though.

Thank you for posting picture.

[AlBub + 14]

On 7/2/2023 at 2:28 PM, Jay McKinsey said:

The grid requires that supply and demand are equal or else the grid fails. It does not work any other way, It is a brutal all or nothing market. Power plants do not run at 50% output because they would be losing money. They run at 100% or 0%. You don't get to have an opinion. 

The Texas authorities decreased production because they were idiotic morons and people died. They barely missed crashing the entire grid and killing 10x as many people. The electricity market is a zero sum game. 

The difference in US electrical production between 2007 and 2022 is less than 1%. Try dealing with reality.

The idiots at ERCOT that screwed up the system in 2021 screwed it up because the members weren't from Texas and had no skin in the game along with not having to answer to anyone. To do so much wrong, I wouldn't be surprised if their wasn't a little maliciousness involved.

The stupidest thing was the ERCOT members not being from Texas.

[notsonice + 1,098]

6 minutes ago, AlBub said:

Thank you! That is exactly the instance I was thinking of. Their have been a lot of hail storms in my area. I am sure their has been some damage to an few solar farms around here, just no as bad so easy to hide. I have had 4 hail storms here this year, only pea-sized to marble-sized though.

Thank you for posting picture.

the planes areas of three states, Texas, Colorado, or Nebraska, that one should not put panels on ones roof (expensive to replace compared to solar farms)

IE in the areas that are prone to heavier tornadoes plus prone to hail (This excludes the rocky mountains and the foothills)

What you need to know about solar power hail damage

Updated 02/03/2023

 

Image source: The Tribune

 

Rough weather, from hurricanes to blizzards to high winds, is a major risk for solar panels. Out of all the types of extreme weather conditions, hail is of the utmost concern for many homeowners looking to protect their long-term investment.

This is because the impact of hail is very direct and damaging to solar panels on rooftops. The sound of hailstones falling on the surface of solar panels may make you cringe in horror (insert money flying away emoji), but we’re here to provide you with some peace of mind.

Fortunately, severe hail storms are uncommon around the country and most solar panels can withstand a good amount of light-to-moderate impact. According to a National Renewable Energy Laboratory (NREL) study, the chances of hail damaging solar panels is less than five percent.

The chances of incurring solar panel hail damage are very low, but never zero.

For people living in areas prone to receiving hail every year, such as Texas, Colorado, or Nebraska, it is helpful to understand what exactly happens to solar panels when exposed to hail. This information can help you decide on what measures to take in protecting your solar panels during these extreme weather events.

[notsonice + 1,098]

3 minutes ago, AlBub said:

The idiots at ERCOT that screwed up the system in 2021 screwed it up because the members weren't from Texas and had no skin in the game along with not having to answer to anyone. To do so much wrong, I wouldn't be surprised if their wasn't a little maliciousness involved.

The stupidest thing was the ERCOT members not being from Texas.

10 out of 15 were from Texas.......

now you would think the 10 would speak up.......nope just a room full of idiots

[TailingsPond + 501]

Large hail damages car hoods and windshields. Therefore, people should stop buying them.

Edited July 3, 2023 by TailingsPond

[notsonice + 1,098]

7 minutes ago, TailingsPond said:

Large hail damages car hoods and windshields.  People should stop buying them.

Park them in your garage when possible...stop using your garage as a storage unit for junk

 

and get yourself a decent car cover and use it during hail season

 

Edited July 3, 2023 by notsonice

[TailingsPond + 501]

22 minutes ago, notsonice said:

Park them in your garage when possible...stop using your garage as a storage unit for junk

 

and get yourself a decent car cover and use it during hail season

 

Sad we have such a homelessness problem while cars have a roof over their head. 

I have underground parking, not even a tornado could harm my car.  Where I sleep is much less protected...

Edited July 3, 2023 by TailingsPond