Ecocharger + 1,460 DL March 14 7 minutes ago, Rob Plant said: So EWO's comment is BS then, dont worry they usually are. If, and its an IF, oil grows jobs dont necessarily follow suit as there's these things called improved technology, automation and efficiencies. All of which means increased demand for oil, and helped by a failure of the EV sector. Your beloved Green technology is winding down. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,460 DL March 14 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Rob Plant said: I post FACTS and you post nonsense There is no "harm" from oil and gasoline??? thousands if not millions die each and every year from FF related air pollution in cities around the world. You are seriously deluded and advocate killing people. Air pollution from fossil fuel use is killing 5 million people worldwide every year, a death toll much higher than previously estimated, according to the largest study of its kind. Air pollution from fossil fuels ‘kills 5 million people a year’ | Air pollution | The Guardian Utter rubbish, a concocted estimation model promoted by an anti-fossil fuel enterprise. https://www.bmj.com/content/383/bmj-2023-077784 The numbers of people dying from the proposed elimination fossil fuels would DWARF the claimed deaths of elderly people suggested in this wild projection. Edited March 14 by Ecocharger 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob Plant + 2,756 RP March 14 2 minutes ago, Ecocharger said: Growing to all-time highs, and continuing to grow. That means growth. I guess the failure of EV sales in Britain and Europe has put you off your game, Rob. Calm down, old boy. I am calm, I'm calmly telling you to stop posting opinion and post facts instead! You prefer lies, so I'll put you straight again, thats if youre able to read and comprehend! EU car sales surged by almost 14% in 2023, with over 10.5 million new registrations. Battery-electric sales soared by an impressive 37% and now command close to a 15% market share EU car sales on the up in 2023, with electric models increasingly popular - ACEA - European Automobile Manufacturers' Association 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob Plant + 2,756 RP March 14 Eco so I post the numbers from the European Automobile Manufacturers Association and all you can do is put a laughing face! Its everyone on here laughing at you! You just keep posting BS and cant deal with the numbers that prove your opinions to be nonsense. 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob Plant + 2,756 RP March 14 10 minutes ago, Ecocharger said: Utter rubbish, a concocted estimation model promoted by an anti-fossil fuel enterprise. So you are now saying the British Medical Journal are an anti-fossil fuel enterprise!!! Wow there really is no hope for you!! Do you honestly think thats why it was founded??? The original BMJ was founded in 1840 you buffoon about 130 years before climate change even became a concern Here have a read if you can The BMJ - Wikipedia 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,255 DM March 14 3 hours ago, Ecocharger said: All of which means increased demand for oil, and helped by a failure of the EV sector. Your beloved Green technology is winding down?????? only a Luddite would believe what you post here Question.......do you use Green electricity in your home and support the Green Agenda??? of have you disconnected from the grid .... newsflash next year your green electricity content will grow by 2 percentage points over this year............ We appreciate your support for the Green agenda.......your monthly autopayment for your electricity use is appreciated. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,460 DL March 14 4 hours ago, Rob Plant said: So you are now saying the British Medical Journal are an anti-fossil fuel enterprise!!! Wow there really is no hope for you!! Do you honestly think thats why it was founded??? The original BMJ was founded in 1840 you buffoon about 130 years before climate change even became a concern Here have a read if you can The BMJ - Wikipedia Man, you are really funny. Here is another British publication with a more realistic assessment of your Brave New Dead World. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/consumer-affairs/just-stop-oil-what-happens-six-billion-might-die/#:~:text=But what would happen if,would die within a year. "But what would happen if we literally just stopped oil tomorrow and did without the natural resources on which the world, its economies and populations depend? The answer: most likely six billion people would die within a year. " Or here is another view, https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2023/09/30/end-fossil-fuels-biden/ "Without that power, electricity grids would see widespread blackouts. Within a few weeks, a lack of oil — still the major fuel used for trucking and shipping goods worldwide — would impede deliveries of food and other essential goods." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,460 DL March 14 4 hours ago, Rob Plant said: Eco so I post the numbers from the European Automobile Manufacturers Association and all you can do is put a laughing face! Its everyone on here laughing at you! You just keep posting BS and cant deal with the numbers that prove your opinions to be nonsense. Your numbers are tilted to mask the realities, the YOY numbers for EV sales are down. https://www.acea.auto/pc-registrations/new-car-registrations-13-9-in-2023-battery-electric-14-6-market-share/#:~:text=In December 2023%2C new battery,by 16.9% to 160%2C700 units. "In December 2023, new battery-electric car sales declined for the first time since April 2020 (during the COVID-19 pandemic’s peak), dropping by 16.9% to 160,700 units. This decrease can be attributed to a comparatively robust performance in December 2022 and a significant downturn in Germany (-47.6%), the largest market for this power source. " German EV sales have driven over a steep cliff. https://insideevs.com/news/704440/plugin-car-sales-germany-december2023/ "In December, the total new plug-in electric car registrations amounted to 72,548, which is 58% less than a year ago" That is a 58% decline year on year. A disaster. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TailingsPond + 874 GE March 14 (edited) 8 hours ago, Ecocharger said: Your point is? The complaint that Coe and his group may have paid for publication costs is not a serious complaint, it appears to be a standard practice in the science journal trade. That was the point. They wouldn't have to pay much that publication, They clearly do not require peer review, or editorial review. From receipt to publication less than a month? Too funny. Most people get comments back from the peer review and have to do more research or fix errors the reviewers request. You can try to argue with the reviews but that just slows it down more. The paper was Received: August 2, 2021; Accepted: August 11, 2021; Published: August 23, 2021 You can be upset that nobody cares what Coe thinks just like you can be upset that nobody listens to you. Have you considered writing a letter to the author asking if he believes his paper is groundbreaking? His e-mail address is readily available. I bet he would answer honestly and say "no, it is a simple model." He has probably moved on himself from that paper and may even want to distance himself from it. It looks bad having people flag your paper as junk science. Edited March 14 by TailingsPond 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TailingsPond + 874 GE March 14 (edited) 7 hours ago, Rob Plant said: So you are now saying the British Medical Journal are an anti-fossil fuel enterprise!!! I fairness, they do publish papers reporting the negative health effects that fossil fuels cause. PM 2.5, ground level ozone, benzene, etc. Yum! But of course they are just reporting the current medical science, certainly not a conspiracy against oil like some here will believe. Edited March 14 by TailingsPond 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,460 DL March 15 The trend is clear and growing...EVs are out, fossil fuel cars are in. https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/ford-ev-sales-fall-january-amid-demand-slowdown-2024-02-02/ "Ford Motor (F.N), opens new tab reported an about 11% fall in January sales of electric vehicles (EV) on Friday, as the industry grapples with shrinking demand for the cars that are typically costlier than their gasoline-powered counterparts." "Ford said it would reduce production of its marquee F-150 Lightning electric pickup truck at its Michigan Rouge EV plant, and increase production of gas-powered Bronco SUVs and Ranger pickups. High prices of EVs and concerns about the limited range of these cars, especially in rural areas due to lack of charging infrastructure, have fueled sales of hybrid vehicles." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,460 DL March 15 5 hours ago, TailingsPond said: They wouldn't have to pay much that publication, They clearly do not require peer review, or editorial review. From receipt to publication less than a month? Too funny. Most people get comments back from the peer review and have to do more research or fix errors the reviewers request. You can try to argue with the reviews but that just slows it down more. The paper was Received: August 2, 2021; Accepted: August 11, 2021; Published: August 23, 2021 You can be upset that nobody cares what Coe thinks just like you can be upset that nobody listens to you. Have you considered writing a letter to the author asking if he believes his paper is groundbreaking? His e-mail address is readily available. I bet he would answer honestly and say "no, it is a simple model." He has probably moved on himself from that paper and may even want to distance himself from it. It looks bad having people flag your paper as junk science. Don't you wish. All I hear is silence from the Climate Panic group who have nothing of value to say, no challenge to make. Pathetic. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,460 DL March 15 5 hours ago, TailingsPond said: I fairness, they do publish papers reporting the negative health effects that fossil fuels cause. PM 2.5, ground level ozone, benzene, etc. Yum! But of course they are just reporting the current medical science, certainly not a conspiracy against oil like some here will believe. You really love garbage...removing fossil fuels from the mix would kill billions of people. The Climate Panic folks are a joke. I guess they never heard of "Cost/Benefit Analysis". Reality is beyond their comprehension. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,255 DM March 15 17 minutes ago, Ecocharger said: You really love garbage...removing fossil fuels from the mix would kill billions of people. The Climate Panic folks are a joke. I guess they never heard of "Cost/Benefit Analysis". Reality is beyond their comprehension. removing fossil fuels from the mix would kill billions of people and replacing them with EV's???????? you are such a drama queen....... and yet, today, no one is dying when they get rid of their clunkers 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TailingsPond + 874 GE March 15 (edited) On 3/14/2024 at 9:11 PM, Ecocharger said: You really love garbage...removing fossil fuels from the mix would kill billions of people. Perhaps there would be some socioeconomic damage but highly unlikely as the poor nations are already poor; taking away oil they can't afford isn't a big issue for many people around the world. They are already doing subsistence living with no oil. Is that good? No, but the oil industry hasn't helped bringing them out of poverty; is that going to change now? Regardless, the topic was the health effects of exhaust, socioeconomic damage from the green transition doesn't change the fact PM 2.5 and benzene cause cancer in humans and lab animals. You are the one that loves toxic emissions. Edited March 17 by TailingsPond Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TailingsPond + 874 GE March 15 (edited) 1 hour ago, Ecocharger said: Don't you wish. All I hear is silence from the Climate Panic group who have nothing of value to say, no challenge to make. Pathetic. E-mail the author already and ask him if he believes his paper is groundbreaking, cutting edge, climate science. We have already explained to you the low-quality of that paper, and how papers are judged by the academic community. If you want to stay ignorant that is your prerogative. Maybe I will e-mail the author myself as you seem to lack the gonads. Have you never communicated with scientists before? Most are happy to discuss their work. If the author himself says the model is not state-of-the-art will you STFU about it? Edited March 15 by TailingsPond Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TailingsPond + 874 GE March 15 1 hour ago, Ecocharger said: All I hear is silence from the Climate Panic group who have nothing of value to say, no challenge to make. Pathetic. They probably have plenty too say, you just don't look, or if you find something contrary to your opinion, you actively hide it. You never post full quotations and often hide the link to source. You know you have to actually read the journals to know what they are working on. I suspect you only read stuff that is free online (you get what you pay for). Do you know that public libraries have free journal access? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob Plant + 2,756 RP March 15 12 hours ago, Ecocharger said: Man, you are really funny. I am ??? You think the British Medical Journal is an "anti-fossil fuel enterprise" when it started in 1840!! Man what you been smoking?? To say you look foolish is being very complimentary! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob Plant + 2,756 RP March 15 13 hours ago, Ecocharger said: Man, you are really funny. Here is another British publication with a more realistic assessment of your Brave New Dead World. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/consumer-affairs/just-stop-oil-what-happens-six-billion-might-die/#:~:text=But what would happen if,would die within a year. "But what would happen if we literally just stopped oil tomorrow and did without the natural resources on which the world, its economies and populations depend? The answer: most likely six billion people would die within a year. " Or here is another view, https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2023/09/30/end-fossil-fuels-biden/ "Without that power, electricity grids would see widespread blackouts. Within a few weeks, a lack of oil — still the major fuel used for trucking and shipping goods worldwide — would impede deliveries of food and other essential goods." "But what would happen if we literally just stopped oil tomorrow" Eco who on here or anywhere is advocating thats what we do other than the morons from "just stop oil"??? Its called a transition for a reason, you just dont seem to be able to comprehend that. The world transitioned from the horse and cart to automobiles that ran on FF, why cant automobiles run on electricity? and why cant powergen have a significant mix of renewables when the energy source is free and non pollutive?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob Plant + 2,756 RP March 15 12 hours ago, Ecocharger said: Your numbers are tilted to mask the realities, the YOY numbers for EV sales are down. https://www.acea.auto/pc-registrations/new-car-registrations-13-9-in-2023-battery-electric-14-6-market-share/#:~:text=In December 2023%2C new battery,by 16.9% to 160%2C700 units. "In December 2023, new battery-electric car sales declined for the first time since April 2020 (during the COVID-19 pandemic’s peak), dropping by 16.9% to 160,700 units. This decrease can be attributed to a comparatively robust performance in December 2022 and a significant downturn in Germany (-47.6%), the largest market for this power source. " German EV sales have driven over a steep cliff. https://insideevs.com/news/704440/plugin-car-sales-germany-december2023/ "In December, the total new plug-in electric car registrations amounted to 72,548, which is 58% less than a year ago" That is a 58% decline year on year. A disaster. No they are the factual numbers for 2023 from the European Automobile Manufacturers Association as Ive already told you. I dont take a 1 month snapshot like you do to try and justify my position on this. If in 2024 nobody buys an EV then come and spout off, FACT is they grew by the numbers I posted and actually significantly outperformed ICE by % increase Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,460 DL March 15 9 hours ago, TailingsPond said: E-mail the author already and ask him if he believes his paper is groundbreaking, cutting edge, climate science. We have already explained to you the low-quality of that paper, and how papers are judged by the academic community. If you want to stay ignorant that is your prerogative. Maybe I will e-mail the author myself as you seem to lack the gonads. Have you never communicated with scientists before? Most are happy to discuss their work. If the author himself says the model is not state-of-the-art will you STFU about it? Your idea of important work is flawed. No one has challenged the Coe paper because they can't! Of course everyone in the field is aware of this paper, but there are no challenges coming forward. That is what science is, if a paper's conclusions are not challenged that paper attains higher status. Wake me up when you find some scientist with a serious challenge to this work. Oh, and by the way, I challenged you to tell me whether or not Darwin completed his PhD at Cambridge. Tell me the answer. Surely you are capable of finding that answer. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,460 DL March 15 4 hours ago, Rob Plant said: I am ??? You think the British Medical Journal is an "anti-fossil fuel enterprise" when it started in 1840!! Man what you been smoking?? To say you look foolish is being very complimentary! I challenged your trivial article and now you have nothing to say about its contents. This is an embarrassment for you and for the entire Climate Panic movement. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,460 DL March 15 (edited) 5 hours ago, Rob Plant said: "But what would happen if we literally just stopped oil tomorrow" Eco who on here or anywhere is advocating thats what we do other than the morons from "just stop oil"??? Its called a transition for a reason, you just dont seem to be able to comprehend that. The world transitioned from the horse and cart to automobiles that ran on FF, why cant automobiles run on electricity? and why cant powergen have a significant mix of renewables when the energy source is free and non pollutive?? Transition means eliminate oil...I guess you haven't seen that. Eliminating fossil fuels means billions of people will die. Simple. Here is another British publication with a more realistic assessment of your Brave New Dead World. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/consumer-affairs/just-stop-oil-what-happens-six-billion-might-die/#:~:text=But what would happen if,would die within a year. "But what would happen if we literally just stopped oil tomorrow and did without the natural resources on which the world, its economies and populations depend? The answer: most likely six billion people would die within a year. " Or here is another view, https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2023/09/30/end-fossil-fuels-biden/ "Without that power, electricity grids would see widespread blackouts. Within a few weeks, a lack of oil — still the major fuel used for trucking and shipping goods worldwide — would impede deliveries of food and other essential goods." Edited March 15 by Ecocharger Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,460 DL March 15 4 hours ago, Rob Plant said: No they are the factual numbers for 2023 from the European Automobile Manufacturers Association as Ive already told you. I dont take a 1 month snapshot like you do to try and justify my position on this. If in 2024 nobody buys an EV then come and spout off, FACT is they grew by the numbers I posted and actually significantly outperformed ICE by % increase No, the YOY numbers show a disastrous decline beginning in December 2023 which is continuing. You still have not acknowledged that, so I guess you are not really open to looking at the facts, old boy. While EV sales are declining in both Europe and US, sales of fossil fuel cars are rapidly increasing. The Dream is dead. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob Plant + 2,756 RP March 15 3 minutes ago, Ecocharger said: Transition means eliminate oil...I guess you haven't seen that. Eliminating fossil fuels means billions of people will die. Simple. no it doesnt petrochemicals and fertilisers will be around for centuries powergen and alternative transport in EV's H2 fuel cells etc possibly yes Billions of people will die??? where the hell do you get those numbers from fool? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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