China Producing Half of the Worlds Electrical Vehicle Batteries is Experiencing Explosive Pollution

[ronwagn + 6,290]

6 hours ago, RichieRich216 said:

Whatever helps you sleep at night, EV’s are going to be so technical that your average mechanic’s will not have the necessary equipment to work on, This is not by accident, Auto Manufacturer’s make dealers, licensed dealers train and purchase specific equipment to work on new models for a reason, same reason Steve Jobs wanted End to End on motherboards!

It is all about built in failures that will irritate you enough to buy a new vehicle. They build them in. Things like automatic seats that fail. My dealer did not have staff smart enough to fix the driver side automatic seat and it was stuck in a cramped forward position. It took several visits and a major effort to get them to fix it for free. They had tried to fix it but failed when the warranty wore out. Finally they decided to put in a new computer module that had burned out. I have also had plastic parts wear out on the driver side window lift. Makes you wish for the old turning handle. It is a major expense to fix. 

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

21 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

Here are the real sources of energy in Australia with up to date figures. You like to make it sound like Australia is some greenie paradise. It is actually using common sense. https://www.energy.gov.au/sites/default/files/Australian Energy Statistics 2020 Energy Update Report_0.pdf

Fossil fuel use is 93.6 %  Renewables 6.4%

 

The 2021 Australian Energy Statistics for electricity generation shows that 24 per cent of Australia’s electricity came from renewable energy last year, up from 21 per cent in 2019. https://www.minister.industry.gov.au/ministers/taylor/media-releases/2021-australian-energy-statistics-electricity

Solar has a 50% per year growth rate:

 

Edited July 18, 2021 by Jay McKinsey

[ronwagn + 6,290]

4 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

The 2021 Australian Energy Statistics for electricity generation shows that 24 per cent of Australia’s electricity came from renewable energy last year, up from 21 per cent in 2019.

Solar has a 50% per year growth rate:

 

There you go again with your speculations. My figures are NEW. It is a lot harder to live up to them then to make them! Good luck though! Just give us good cost to benefits without taxpayers subsidizing them! Good things take time.  

Edited July 18, 2021 by ronwagn
add

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

2 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

There you go again with your speculations. It is a lot harder to live up to them then to make them! Good luck though! Just give us good cost to benefits without taxpayers subsidizing them! Good things take time.  

Speculations!?? What are you talking about? I'm reporting the government numbers.

https://www.minister.industry.gov.au/ministers/taylor/media-releases/2021-australian-energy-statistics-electricity

Edited July 18, 2021 by Jay McKinsey

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

24 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

We are not close to 2030 and good decisions are not made with speculation. The consumers will pay the price for green fairy tales.

Well the "speculation" is being made by the people in charge of the grid. You know, the ones who plan years in advance to make sure there are adequate resources. Ron, do you even know what is going on ?

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

10 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

There you go again with your speculations. My figures are NEW. It is a lot harder to live up to them then to make them! Good luck though! Just give us good cost to benefits without taxpayers subsidizing them! Good things take time.  

My figures are newer. 

[ronwagn + 6,290]

1 minute ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Well the "speculation" is being made by the people in charge of the grid. You know, the ones who plan years in advance to make sure there are adequate resources. Ron, do you even know what is going on ?

I know what the Australian government said. I am just giving their statistics dated September 2020. You are using some greenie speculation as usual.

[ronwagn + 6,290]

4 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Well the "speculation" is being made by the people in charge of the grid. You know, the ones who plan years in advance to make sure there are adequate resources. Ron, do you even know what is going on ?

I know you like to talk a good game but please try to use facts rather than speculation. 

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

Just now, ronwagn said:

I know what the Australian government said. I am just giving their statistics dated September 2020. You are using some greenie speculation as usual.

Look dopey, go to https://www.minister.industry.gov.au/ministers/taylor/media-releases/2021-australian-energy-statistics-electricity  and you will see this official page from the renewable hating Minister of Energy Angus Taylor! The guy in charge of Australian Energy.

 

[ronwagn + 6,290]

1 minute ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Look dopey, go to https://www.minister.industry.gov.au/ministers/taylor/media-releases/2021-australian-energy-statistics-electricity  and you will see this official page from the renewable hating Minister of Energy Angus Taylor! The guy in charge of Australian Energy.

 

When you start name calling you are giving up with logic. My figures are from the Australian government. You are only talking about electrical production, total energy usage is far more important to look at. Please try to be civil. 

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

5 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

When you start name calling you are giving up with logic. My figures are from the Australian government. You are only talking about electrical production, total energy usage is far more important to look at. Please try to be civil. 

You were the one lying and denigrating me about not using official numbers! My numbers are from the Australian government.

Edited July 18, 2021 by Jay McKinsey

[ronwagn + 6,290]

32 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

You were the one lying and denigrating me about not using official numbers! My numbers are from the Australian government.

There you go again. I did not say you did not use official numbers. Just that they were different numbers and were speculation. You are out of bounds. 

Edited July 18, 2021 by ronwagn

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

Ron here is some more greenie speculation for you from some hippie who thinks he is in charge:

100 per cent renewables by 2025: Australia Grid operator pushes clean energy revolution

 

Australia’s energy market operator has set an ambitious target for the country to surge ahead of the rest of the world with an electrical grid ready to handle 100 per cent renewable energy by 2025.

The operator’s new chief executive, Daniel Westerman, will use his first public address to outline the goal for a big increase in investment and collaboration to wean the power market further away from coal and prepare for a clean energy revolution.The head of Australia’s coal-dominated power grid is making preparations to handle 100 per cent renewable energy by 2025.

Increased output from wind, large-scale and rooftop solar, which cannot generate power unless it’s sunny or windy, is complicating the grid operator’s job of supplying power to consumers, while the loss of the continuous power traditionally provided by coal and gas could pose risks to the reliability of the network.

Mr Westerman said stronger transmission infrastructure, big batteries, pumped hydro and gas plants providing on-demand energy would be vital to ensuring a smooth transition. However, if successful, Mr Westerman says the east-coast electricity grid, which is usually powered 70 per cent by coal, should be able to handle 100 per cent renewable energy at a single moment in time by 2025.

 

“There are already points in time when renewable energy contributes to more than half of all electricity supply,” he will say in a speech to be delivered at a Committee for Economic Development of Australia event in Melbourne on Wednesday"

Falling cost of renewables creates coal test for federal government

“That puts us at the front of the pack for renewables penetration for any large grid in the world.”

Mr Westerman, who took over as head of the Australian Energy Market Operator two months ago, said the accelerating pace of change in Australia had prompted him to set the bold target and seek to harness capabilities and experience across the industry through collaboration.

Mr Westerman insists the push is necessary to cater for a rapid influx of wind and solar farms and rooftop solar panels nationwide as more coal-fired power stations close down.

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/100-per-cent-renewables-by-2025-grid-operator-pushes-clean-energy-revolution-20210713-p589ap.html

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

44 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

I know what the Australian government said. I am just giving their statistics dated September 2020. You are using some greenie speculation as usual.

 

43 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

I know you like to talk a good game but please try to use facts rather than speculation. 

2 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

There you go again. I did not say you did not use official numbers. Just that they were different numbers and were speculation. You are out of bounds. 

 

Yes you did, twice!!

[ronwagn + 6,290]

2 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Ron here is some more greenie speculation for you from some hippie who thinks he is in charge:

100 per cent renewables by 2025: Australia Grid operator pushes clean energy revolution

 

Australia’s energy market operator has set an ambitious target for the country to surge ahead of the rest of the world with an electrical grid ready to handle 100 per cent renewable energy by 2025.

The operator’s new chief executive, Daniel Westerman, will use his first public address to outline the goal for a big increase in investment and collaboration to wean the power market further away from coal and prepare for a clean energy revolution.The head of Australia’s coal-dominated power grid is making preparations to handle 100 per cent renewable energy by 2025.

Increased output from wind, large-scale and rooftop solar, which cannot generate power unless it’s sunny or windy, is complicating the grid operator’s job of supplying power to consumers, while the loss of the continuous power traditionally provided by coal and gas could pose risks to the reliability of the network.

Mr Westerman said stronger transmission infrastructure, big batteries, pumped hydro and gas plants providing on-demand energy would be vital to ensuring a smooth transition. However, if successful, Mr Westerman says the east-coast electricity grid, which is usually powered 70 per cent by coal, should be able to handle 100 per cent renewable energy at a single moment in time by 2025.

 

“There are already points in time when renewable energy contributes to more than half of all electricity supply,” he will say in a speech to be delivered at a Committee for Economic Development of Australia event in Melbourne on Wednesday"

Falling cost of renewables creates coal test for federal government

“That puts us at the front of the pack for renewables penetration for any large grid in the world.”

Mr Westerman, who took over as head of the Australian Energy Market Operator two months ago, said the accelerating pace of change in Australia had prompted him to set the bold target and seek to harness capabilities and experience across the industry through collaboration.

Mr Westerman insists the push is necessary to cater for a rapid influx of wind and solar farms and rooftop solar panels nationwide as more coal-fired power stations close down.

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/100-per-cent-renewables-by-2025-grid-operator-pushes-clean-energy-revolution-20210713-p589ap.html

Very funny. 

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

1 hour ago, ronwagn said:

There you go again. I did not say you did not use official numbers. Just that they were different numbers and were speculation. You are out of bounds. 

You claimed that the official numbers I used for last years production were "greenie speculation" and that I was not using "facts". Please explain how official government numbers for previous production can be speculation? Then please explain how official government numbers are not facts?

I am definitely in bounds.

Edited July 18, 2021 by Jay McKinsey

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,190]

8 hours ago, RichieRich216 said:

Whatever helps you sleep at night, EV’s are going to be so technical that your average mechanic’s will not have the necessary equipment to work on, This is not by accident, Auto Manufacturer’s make dealers, licensed dealers train and purchase specific equipment to work on new models for a reason, same reason Steve Jobs wanted End to End on motherboards!

Nothing difficult about an EV.  In fact, they are far simpler than an ICE.  The fact you think they are difficult speaks volumes.  What we will agree on: Now someone can purposefully make them very hard to work on, and never underestimate greed and countries allowing said greed to flourish, but all this means in EV land is a 3rd party revamp of the onboard computer(probably replacement) is required so a generic components can be used and you get speed, battery percentage and a battery charge profile which.... is generic enough anyone can do that...

[turbguy + 1,544]

On 7/14/2021 at 8:59 PM, markslawson said:

No - because they don't. Oil is produced through oil wells, mostly, without anything like  the environmental issues of rare earth and mineral mines (think treatment plants) - and production in this area has swung back to the west. Both the US and Canada are now major oil producers. Australia is the main exporting power in coal. India is developing mines in Australia to feed its growing power habit. In LNG both Australia and the US are major exporters. Rare earths mainly come from China, and the Chinese only care about the environment to the extent that they can fool Western activists into thinking that they do. As matters stand the Chinese will continue to run coal mines while at the same time developing polluting Lithium mines to feed the Western demand for the stuff all while binge-build coal power plants as they have been doing. This whole renewable energy-electric car trend is seriously messed up. 

You are speaking to the extraction of fuel for generation, not materials used in generation itself.

Where does the nickle, chromium, moly, copper, vanadium, tungsten, etc, come from for construction of fossil plants??

Edited July 18, 2021 by turbguy

[-trance + 114]

8 hours ago, ronwagn said:

It is all about built in failures that will irritate you enough to buy a new vehicle. They build them in. Things like automatic seats that fail. My dealer did not have staff smart enough to fix the driver side automatic seat and it was stuck in a cramped forward position. It took several visits and a major effort to get them to fix it for free. They had tried to fix it but failed when the warranty wore out. Finally they decided to put in a new computer module that had burned out. I have also had plastic parts wear out on the driver side window lift. Makes you wish for the old turning handle. It is a major expense to fix. 

Clearly ICE cars are just as full of computers and useless features as EVs.

Arguing that a ICE vehicle is simpler is just showing your age folks. Do you think your gas pedal still mechanically actuates a throttle cable? 

You drive by wire even with a ICE.

Luddites complaining about technology using a computer...

Edited July 18, 2021 by -trance

[Eyes Wide Open + 3,555]

8 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Well the "speculation" is being made by the people in charge of the grid. You know, the ones who plan years in advance to make sure there are adequate resources. Ron, do you even know what is going on ?

Would that be Bernice Sanders attempting to extort 5 trillion dollars in the halls of Congress to finance this new green deal?.   Lol failure is imminent.

[RichieRich216 + 454]

9 hours ago, ronwagn said:

It is all about built in failures that will irritate you enough to buy a new vehicle. They build them in. Things like automatic seats that fail. My dealer did not have staff smart enough to fix the driver side automatic seat and it was stuck in a cramped forward position. It took several visits and a major effort to get them to fix it for free. They had tried to fix it but failed when the warranty wore out. Finally they decided to put in a new computer module that had burned out. I have also had plastic parts wear out on the driver side window lift. Makes you wish for the old turning handle. It is a major expense to fix. 

I’m not talking about minor items, good luck replacing the battery pack! 

[RichieRich216 + 454]

7 hours ago, footeab@yahoo.com said:

Nothing difficult about an EV.  In fact, they are far simpler than an ICE.  The fact you think they are difficult speaks volumes.  What we will agree on: Now someone can purposefully make them very hard to work on, and never underestimate greed and countries allowing said greed to flourish, but all this means in EV land is a 3rd party revamp of the onboard computer(probably replacement) is required so a generic components can be used and you get speed, battery percentage and a battery charge profile which.... is generic enough anyone can do that...

Generic replacement parts? Manufacturer’s don’t make there money on the selling of the vehicles, the real money is in the parts and repair of vehicle! 
 

They have such a mark up it’s insane, I had the opportunity to visit a 80,000 square foot regional Major U.S. brand parts depot for a meeting on how to destroy parts, believe it or not they put all car parts on a self life just like food and I’m talking chrome rimes to CPU’s to floor mats. My first question was Why then Why not ship to other regional that need them. The answer was the cost aka labor, tracking, shipping was more expensive ten ordering new parts so I designed a system that destroyed everything that they wanted destroyed before it left the building to a recycling center or landfill. They wanted nothing to end up on secondary market period. This is how they think and anyone believing they won’t push back on non certified repair facilities is dreaming. But hey what do I know……

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

2 hours ago, RichieRich216 said:

Generic replacement parts? Manufacturer’s don’t make there money on the selling of the vehicles, the real money is in the parts and repair of vehicle! 
 

They have such a mark up it’s insane, I had the opportunity to visit a 80,000 square foot regional Major U.S. brand parts depot for a meeting on how to destroy parts, believe it or not they put all car parts on a self life just like food and I’m talking chrome rimes to CPU’s to floor mats. My first question was Why then Why not ship to other regional that need them. The answer was the cost aka labor, tracking, shipping was more expensive ten ordering new parts so I designed a system that destroyed everything that they wanted destroyed before it left the building to a recycling center or landfill. They wanted nothing to end up on secondary market period. This is how they think and anyone believing they won’t push back on non certified repair facilities is dreaming. But hey what do I know……

The problems you have been raising are damming critiques on modern capitalism but they are not specific to EVs and renewables, they apply equally to ICE and fossil fuel.

 

[ronwagn + 6,290]

13 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said:

You claimed that the official numbers I used for last years production were "greenie speculation" and that I was not using "facts". Please explain how official government numbers for previous production can be speculation? Then please explain how official government numbers are not facts?

I am definitely in bounds.

First, you are just talking about electricity generation, not all fossil fuel needs. 

Second, I don't think it is doable by 2025.

Third, Australia depends on coal rather than using its own abundant natural gas to the fullest.

Fourth, the cost of renewables will be a great burden to Australia and Australians while India and China will benefit in commerce. 

Fifth, the agency you are using as a source is a promoter of renewable schemes and is automatically suspect. 

I invite anyone to read your report and then mine to get the real picture of energy use in Australia. The taxpayers will definitely foot the bill with excess taxes first and then with higher rates. 

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

19 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

 

Fifth, the agency you are using as a source is a promoter of renewable schemes and is automatically suspect. 

 

It is the same agency you are citing. The Department of Industry, Science, Energy and Resources. 

Australian Energy Statistics, Table O Electricity generation by fuel type 2019-20 and 2020

 

Publisher

 

Department of Industry, Science, Energy and Resources

Date

 

Table O of the Australian Energy Statistics has been updated to include estimates for 2019‑20 and calendar year 2020 using the latest data available on Australia’s total electricity generation.

These statistics cover all electricity generation in Australia, including by power plants and by businesses and households for their own use. 

Total electricity generation in Australia was estimated to be 265,232 gigawatt hours (GWh) in calendar year 2020, remaining materially unchanged since 2019.

Thermal sources contributed 200,566 GWh (76%) of total electricity generation in 2020.

Coal accounted for the majority of electricity generation, at 54% of total generation in 2020.

Renewable sources contributed an estimated 64,667 GWh, making up 24% of Australia’s total electricity generation.

Edited July 18, 2021 by Jay McKinsey