Biden threatens Putin " If . . . . no longer a Nord Stream 2 . . bring end to it"

[notsonice + 1,255]

7 hours ago, bobo88 said:

What NATO will do (and U.S. will pay for as in an additional $30 billion/year to defend Europe) is build/increase and man military bases in all the former Soviet states that joined NATO (Poland, Romania, Hungry, Balkans, etc).

I think Putin will consider that a win with Ukraine.  I think he knows attacking a NATO member could not be ignored at this time.  Maybe sometime in the future after Russia, China and Germany weaken the United States even more. 

(NOTE: Germany is much closer to Russia and China than they are to the U.S.   Germany is the only EU economy that counts )

 

U.S. will pay for as in an additional $30 billion/year??? drop in the bucket....and today the dollar strengthened around the world against all currencies...guess there is plenty of room for the Fed to print some more......

 

The Dollar is King, The Ruble is toiletpaper. 

[kshithij Sharma + 78]

8 hours ago, Boat said:

War may end nat gas for Europe from Russia. If I was Ukraine that would be job 1.

 

Oil and gas are not luxury items to be stopped. They are basic necessities. Stopping oil and gas to Europe will only collapse Europe. Russia will remain unscathed as it has its own industry and produces most of the essential goods. Russia still can trade with China, India, Middle East, Turkey etc to get additional supplies.

8 hours ago, Boat said:

China did one thing positive. Their attack on Taiwan fear has over 60 billion in chip manufacturing going up in Arizona. Does Russia use chips yet?

It has nothing to do with attack of China. Taiwan even now relies on ASML for supplying fabrication equipments. ASML in turn relies on USA suppliers for key parts. Taiwan is just a bodyshop for cheap labour.

6 hours ago, bobo88 said:

Biden did not include Russian Energy in today's sanctions. 

Price of oil pulled back.

The one sanction that would have produce the greatest damage to Russia's economy would be kick Russia off of the Banking Transaction System called SWIFT.  Germany told Biden ," don't you dare".  Biden backed down. 

Markets comeback shows the smart money thinks this whole Ukraine situation won't be that bad.

When the Fox Whitehouse correspondent asked Biden about the affect of a long lasting conflict Biden responded, " This won't last long".  He actually said that.

Some people called this all along.

Russia does not care for SWIFT. Russia exports more than it imports. Most of Russian exports are critical goods like oil, gas, coal, fertilisers, rare-earth, minerals etc. Those who buy Russian goods will have to pay Russia or Russia will stop selling. So, it is the headache of the buyers to find a channel of payment if they want Russian goods.

[notsonice + 1,255]

4 minutes ago, kshithij Sharma said:

Oil and gas are not luxury items to be stopped. They are basic necessities. Stopping oil and gas to Europe will only collapse Europe. Russia will remain unscathed as it has its own industry and produces most of the essential goods. Russia still can trade with China, India, Middle East, Turkey etc to get additional supplies.

It has nothing to do with attack of China. Taiwan even now relies on ASML for supplying fabrication equipments. ASML in turn relies on USA suppliers for key parts. Taiwan is just a bodyshop for cheap labour.

Russia does not care for SWIFT. Russia exports more than it imports. Most of Russian exports are critical goods like oil, gas, coal, fertilisers, rare-earth, minerals etc. Those who buy Russian goods will have to pay Russia or Russia will stop selling. So, it is the headache of the buyers to find a channel of payment if they want Russian goods.

Russia does not care for SWIFT???, however it is essential for global trading. 

Noone wants Rubles (printed or digital) and you need international banks and SWIFT to make the swaps. Since almost all money is digital you have to have SWIFT to electronically move the digital money. SWIFT is headquartered in Belgium (nice that it is a NATO country and very loyal to the UK for freeing them from the Nazis and to the US. So sad for Putin...ha ha ha Unless he wants to unload his gold.....ha ha  ha 

 

 

Stopping oil and gas to Europe will only collapse Europe.??? nope....Spring is on the way and gas usage decreases in the spring...oil is available everywhere. You can bet that the US will do its best to help fill up Europe Nat Gas storage facilities this summer. 

 

[Boat + 1,324]

6 hours ago, surrept33 said:

Ok, fine, let's send them Governor of Texas Greg Abbott to take down Russia's power grids.   🧐

Lol. Abbott the mastermind. Build a wall but hire every illegal that makes it. Then have the cops profile all brown people to find them for deportation. But never look for them at job sites. Those businesses need workers. This is the current brain power in Texas.

[bobo88 + 58]

15 hours ago, notsonice said:

Russia does not care for SWIFT???, however it is essential for global trading. 

Noone wants Rubles (printed or digital) and you need international banks and SWIFT to make the swaps. Since almost all money is digital you have to have SWIFT to electronically move the digital money. SWIFT is headquartered in Belgium (nice that it is a NATO country and very loyal to the UK for freeing them from the Nazis and to the US. So sad for Putin...ha ha ha Unless he wants to unload his gold.....ha ha  ha 

 

 

Stopping oil and gas to Europe will only collapse Europe.??? nope....Spring is on the way and gas usage decreases in the spring...oil is available everywhere. You can bet that the US will do its best to help fill up Europe Nat Gas storage facilities this summer. 

 

Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't Russia part of the U.S. negotiations with Iran on the nuclear deal ?  Strange bedfellows.  

Strange bedfellows.

[notsonice + 1,255]

37 minutes ago, bobo88 said:

Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't Russia part of the U.S. negotiations with Iran on the nuclear deal ?  Strange bedfellows.  

Strange bedfellows.

I doubt if Russia will be part of anything in the Future. They can wall themselves off or we can do it for them. NATO rocks, Putin blows.

[surrept33 + 609]

OpEd from the PM of Poland: https://archive.fo/rgUvd#selection-2031.0-2097.0

Polish PM: Europe must abandon all illusions about Russia

Putin has shown his true face by invading an independent Ukraine

 

The writer is prime minister of Poland

The Russian invasion of Ukraine ends once and for all an era of illusions about the west’s relations with Moscow. What has been clear to Poland for years must now surely be clear to all western countries. Russian aggression against independent Ukraine has shown President Vladimir Putin’s true face.

Russia can be stopped only by western solidarity with Ukraine. There is no room for doubt here. The EU and Nato cannot allow for a moment the impression to form that they are willing to sacrifice the future of Ukraine to restore peace.

Between November and December last year, I held consultations with several EU countries. At the time, we were in the middle of a gas crisis and Poland was struggling with provocations from Belarus, which is heavily dependent on Russia. I warned then that this could be a prelude to something much bigger and far more dangerous. On Thursday, the worst-case scenario came true.

Russia’s actions are like dominoes, with one move triggering another. And Putin’s ultimate goal is clear: rebuilding Russia’s imperial power. Russia has turned its longing for the days of Stalinist domination of the Soviet Union into aggression in international politics. In Putin’s vision, the reassertion of Russian power requires the subordination of former Soviet republics, which are now independent states.

The ruthless attack on Ukraine is another chapter in this story of the restoration of Russia’s imperial status. Putin has been implementing this plan for years. He started with an attack on Georgia in 2008, followed by the occupation of Crimea in 2014. And today he intends to subordinate all of Ukraine. And we should be under no illusions: this could be just the beginning. Tomorrow Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia, as well as Poland, could be next in line.

Transatlantic security is indivisible. A threat to one state in the Euro-Atlantic community is a threat to every member of Nato and the EU. All for one, and one for all. It was on this foundation, of solidarity and unity, that Europe built peace and prosperity after 1945. Now Putin is trying to blow up the entire postwar security architecture.

Putin has so far succeeded in his pursuit of this goal because he has not faced proper countermeasures for some time. His long-term strategy has been based not only on shameless violence, but just as much on insidious propaganda and building up networks of economic dependency.

Russia has set a trap for Europe in the form of energy dependence. The construction of the Nord Stream 2 gas pipeline connecting Russia and Germany has shown how many politicians in the EU are prepared to sell out western values for the chance to make a good deal. Germany’s decision to suspend the approval process was needed and expected, but this pipeline should be shut down completely. And, as I said at Thursday’s EU Council meeting, we should also talk about Nord Stream 1.

Today, we are seeing that the price of European naivete over Russia is Ukrainian blood. For more than 30 years of relative peace, the west has clung to the illusion that the fall of the Berlin Wall and the collapse of the Soviet Union had brought about the “end of history”. Today, however, history is returning with all the force it can muster, including war — which is why politics, and politicians, must once again be serious. The blood of our Ukrainian neighbours, friends and brothers demands that we react decisively.

The war that Putin has unleashed on Ukraine is also a battle for the soul of the west. This is the moment for us in the west to show that we will not submit to tyranny. It is time for us to show that values such as freedom and the right of the self-determination of peoples are not merely things we talk about, but also things we are willing to fight for.

Poland stands side by side with Ukraine and its people. We will not countenance any compromise with Russia that would undermine the territorial integrity and independence of the Ukrainian state. There is only one way to prevent this from happening. A united west — the EU shoulder to shoulder with the US, UK and other allies — must impose economic sanctions on Russia that will completely dismantle the Putin regime’s operational capabilities. The package of sanctions that I and the other 26 EU leaders agreed on Thursday evening is welcome.

The time for negotiation is over. Putin has broken every promise he has made in recent weeks. He must therefore face a response that is stronger than ever.

The end of the era of illusions opens up a completely new chapter in the history of the EU, Nato and the west as a whole. This must be an era of responsibility. Russia must be made to bear the cost of breaking the fundamental principles of international law. All peace-loving nations must unite in sanctions against Russia, which should be aimed primarily at its political leadership and associated business elites.

We must send a clear message to these individuals that there will be no return to “business as usual” until Ukraine is secure and sovereign within its internationally recognised borders. It is time to abandon the illusion that the world will become a safe place without our effort. Peace must always be fought for. It must always be earned.

[ronwagn + 6,290]

11. Russia

• 2020 Nominal GDP in Current U.S. Dollars: $1.48 trillion59
• 2020 PPP Adjusted GDP in Current International Dollars: $4.13 trillion60
• 2020 GDP Growth: -3%61
• 2020 Nominal GDP Per Capita in Current U.S. Dollars: $10,126.762

 

Russia is the world’s 11th largest economy, with a GDP of $1.48 trillion as of 2020, 3% lower than in 2019.1

 

Russia has moved toward a more market-based economy over the 30 years since the collapse of the Soviet Union, but government ownership of and intervention in business is still common. As a leading exporter of oil and gas, as well as other minerals and metals, Russia’s economy is highly sensitive to swings in world commodity prices.63

[bobo88 + 58]

On 2/25/2022 at 2:51 PM, notsonice said:

I doubt if Russia will be part of anything in the Future. They can wall themselves off or we can do it for them. NATO rocks, Putin blows.

Iran determines who is part of their nuke deal negotiations. 

Putin won't be invited to Joe's 80th B-Day party but he will be busy in China, Europe and Middle East.

He will be involved in exporting a million bbls/day of oil/product to the U.S. because Joe is taking down the U.S. oil and gas business. (Putin makes more money as U.S. oil producers die)

Putin is a thug . But he won thanks to incompetent Joe.

He made Joe look like a fool (that's not very hard) 

This all could have been avoided just saying Ukraine will not be allowed in NATO.  Joe had to be "tough guy".  How many thousands of Ukrainians die as a result.

 

Edited February 27, 2022 by bobo88

[notsonice + 1,255]

5 hours ago, bobo88 said:

 

Knucklehead 

Iran determines who is part of their nuke deal negotiations. 

Putin won't be invited to Joe's 80th B-Day party but he will be busy in China, Europe and Middle East.

He will be involved in exporting a million bbls/day of oil/product to the U.S. because Joe is taking down the U.S. oil and gas business. (Putin makes more money as U.S. oil producers die)

Putin is a thug . But he won thanks to incompetent Joe.

He made Joe look like a fool (that's not very hard) 

This all could have been avoided just saying Ukraine will not be allowed in NATO.  Joe had to be "tough guy".  How many thousands of Ukrainians die as a result.

 

You must love to appease The USA enemies, it is what weak cowardly fools , such as yourself does. I bet you love watching Trump appeasing Putin. Such a disgrace. Russian Americans that support Putin should be deported. I will pay for one way tickets.

Edited February 26, 2022 by notsonice

[surrept33 + 609]

Good article from the AP on how Putin has lost all of the formerly pro-Kremlin countries in central Europe:

https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-russia-hungary-prague-czech-republic-dfe9b03ce3553e899da79e4974fd93d7

Other analysts have suggested Putin may have been expecting a less unified response from Europe. All the official rhetoric has been that the West has been shown up as "weak" and divided, but everyone from Europe to Kazakhstan to even the Taliban have disapproved of the invasion.

Edited February 26, 2022 by surrept33

[bobo88 + 58]

11 hours ago, notsonice said:

You must love to appease The USA enemies, it is what weak cowardly fools , such as yourself does. I bet you love watching Trump appeasing Putin. Such a disgrace. Russian Americans that support Putin should be deported. I will pay for one way tickets.

My thoughts have come full circle.

Attached is a post from a month ago.  It theorized Russia wanted the eastern oblasts for the oil/gas potential, agriculture (increase Russia's agriculture production by at least 50% wheat, corn, barley), control of all Azov Sea , dominance of Black Sea, control of industrial center in Donbas, control of all deep water ports and expanded territory.

* Putin offers negotiations with Zelenskyy if he surrender first.

* Zelenskyy offers to negotiate , no surrender (buy time to get more weapons/amo)

Ukraine committed a major portion of their troops to their version of "Marginot Line" in the east just west of the Donbas.  Thus, South, North and Capital vulnerable.

Doesn't look like Zelenskyy will ever surrender. 

 

PREVIOUS POST

Simple: Putin just takes oblast directly on the border from Luhansk to Kherson . . . . 

1. They then own the Azov Sea 

2. They control the Port of Mariupol (BIG )

3. They control City of Kherson in oblast Kherson on the Dnieper River. A choke point.  

They control the 70% of Ukraine economy by controlling ports.  

4. Russia has control of any new natural gas or oil resources in Azov Sea or off coast of the Southern oblasts.

Could go for Odessa, but would be costly.

End Result : Russia controls Ukraine. Eventually , gets a Russian friendly govt and Ukraine is in Russian sphere of influence and talk of joining NATO is dead.

Of courß all those corporations that wanted to do business in Ukraine, oil companies and defense contractors that contributed to the Biden campaign lose.  Not the U.S. problem. 

Ukraine can put all their troops a defense on the Eastern front then Russia will walk into Ukraine from Belarus, Russia Kursk oblast and Odessa.

Separatist in Donetsk start to increase fight. Russia feels it "has to" help. Ukraine responses and finds itself in a three front warThe map below depicts potential oil/gas reserves around Crimea, Southern Ukraine, and Azov Sea.  Why does Russia now want eastern and Southern Ukraine ?

Natural Resources oil/gas.  Productive Eastern Ukraine Farmland (10% of global grain exports)

Quote from 2019 article , "Why Putin wants Crimea anyway"

"But there’s another theory as to why Russia wants Crimea: oil and gas. Gaining control over this Ukrainian land would give Russia access to the hydrocarbons that could be found in maritime zones around Crimea. Large energy companies have expressed interest in helping Kyiv explore the area. It’s possible that the region contains a large amount of wealth, and some intriguing deposits have already been located in Russia’s Black Sea zone. Having control of the energy in the region would give Russia a monopoly on energy exports."

THIS ARTICLE WAS WRITTEN IN 2014.  IF YOU DIDN'T KNOW BETTER YOU WOULD HAVE THOUGHT IT WAS WRITTEN LAST MONTH.

 

Second article ,2014, "Why Putin wanted Crimea" with map   detailing potential oil and gas  reserves in Southern/Eastern Ukraine's Azov Sea and Black Sea.

ARTICLE

https://euobserver.com/opinion/123496 

 

My guess is Putin wants the resources as in Oil , Gas , Agriculture in Eastern/Southern Ukraine and Azov Sea.  I don't buy the NATO Kabuki dance bull.

MY GUESS IS PUTIN WOULD SETTLE FOR ALL OR PART OF THESE OBLASTS WHICH MAY BE HIS ORIGINAL GOAL. 

 2014 MAP WHERE AT LEAST 50% OF THE OBLASTS WERE PRO RUSSIA AND PROTESTED OR FOUGHT.  RUSSIA MIGHT ANNEX SOME OR ALL OF THESE AND LET A PUTIN INSTALLED PRO RUSSIA GOVERNMENT CONTROL THE REST.

MAP

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/79/2014_pro-Russian_unrest_in_Ukraine.png

Edited February 26, 2022 by bobo88

[notsonice + 1,255]

Is Nordstream 2 running today???? Most likely it is just rusting away as moisture is attacking it with no gas moving through it. A one way tube lying on the sea floor , I give it 5 years before the sea fills it and destroys it. Maybe sooner? ha ha ha

[Boat + 1,324]

On 2/25/2022 at 2:23 PM, surrept33 said:

OpEd from the PM of Poland: https://archive.fo/rgUvd#selection-2031.0-2097.0

Polish PM: Europe must abandon all illusions about Russia

Putin has shown his true face by invading an independent Ukraine

 

The writer is prime minister of Poland

The Russian invasion of Ukraine ends once and for all an era of illusions about the west’s relations with Moscow. What has been clear to Poland for years must now surely be clear to all western countries. Russian aggression against independent Ukraine has shown President Vladimir Putin’s true face.

Russia can be stopped only by western solidarity with Ukraine. There is no room for doubt here. The EU and Nato cannot allow for a moment the impression to form that they are willing to sacrifice the future of Ukraine to restore peace.

Between November and December last year, I held consultations with several EU countries. At the time, we were in the middle of a gas crisis and Poland was struggling with provocations from Belarus, which is heavily dependent on Russia. I warned then that this could be a prelude to something much bigger and far more dangerous. On Thursday, the worst-case scenario came true.

Russia’s actions are like dominoes, with one move triggering another. And Putin’s ultimate goal is clear: rebuilding Russia’s imperial power. Russia has turned its longing for the days of Stalinist domination of the Soviet Union into aggression in international politics. In Putin’s vision, the reassertion of Russian power requires the subordination of former Soviet republics, which are now independent states.

The ruthless attack on Ukraine is another chapter in this story of the restoration of Russia’s imperial status. Putin has been implementing this plan for years. He started with an attack on Georgia in 2008, followed by the occupation of Crimea in 2014. And today he intends to subordinate all of Ukraine. And we should be under no illusions: this could be just the beginning. Tomorrow Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia, as well as Poland, could be next in line.

Transatlantic security is indivisible. A threat to one state in the Euro-Atlantic community is a threat to every member of Nato and the EU. All for one, and one for all. It was on this foundation, of solidarity and unity, that Europe built peace and prosperity after 1945. Now Putin is trying to blow up the entire postwar security architecture.

Putin has so far succeeded in his pursuit of this goal because he has not faced proper countermeasures for some time. His long-term strategy has been based not only on shameless violence, but just as much on insidious propaganda and building up networks of economic dependency.

Russia has set a trap for Europe in the form of energy dependence. The construction of the Nord Stream 2 gas pipeline connecting Russia and Germany has shown how many politicians in the EU are prepared to sell out western values for the chance to make a good deal. Germany’s decision to suspend the approval process was needed and expected, but this pipeline should be shut down completely. And, as I said at Thursday’s EU Council meeting, we should also talk about Nord Stream 1.

Today, we are seeing that the price of European naivete over Russia is Ukrainian blood. For more than 30 years of relative peace, the west has clung to the illusion that the fall of the Berlin Wall and the collapse of the Soviet Union had brought about the “end of history”. Today, however, history is returning with all the force it can muster, including war — which is why politics, and politicians, must once again be serious. The blood of our Ukrainian neighbours, friends and brothers demands that we react decisively.

The war that Putin has unleashed on Ukraine is also a battle for the soul of the west. This is the moment for us in the west to show that we will not submit to tyranny. It is time for us to show that values such as freedom and the right of the self-determination of peoples are not merely things we talk about, but also things we are willing to fight for.

Poland stands side by side with Ukraine and its people. We will not countenance any compromise with Russia that would undermine the territorial integrity and independence of the Ukrainian state. There is only one way to prevent this from happening. A united west — the EU shoulder to shoulder with the US, UK and other allies — must impose economic sanctions on Russia that will completely dismantle the Putin regime’s operational capabilities. The package of sanctions that I and the other 26 EU leaders agreed on Thursday evening is welcome.

The time for negotiation is over. Putin has broken every promise he has made in recent weeks. He must therefore face a response that is stronger than ever.

The end of the era of illusions opens up a completely new chapter in the history of the EU, Nato and the west as a whole. This must be an era of responsibility. Russia must be made to bear the cost of breaking the fundamental principles of international law. All peace-loving nations must unite in sanctions against Russia, which should be aimed primarily at its political leadership and associated business elites.

We must send a clear message to these individuals that there will be no return to “business as usual” until Ukraine is secure and sovereign within its internationally recognised borders. It is time to abandon the illusion that the world will become a safe place without our effort. Peace must always be fought for. It must always be earned.

I agree with about all of that. But look this is how it will work until we blow each other up. The Chinas, the Russians the N Koreans will always be disruptive. The rest of the world just has to much greed to ignore the money they can make off them. Large corporations just don’t care about morality. Our schools teach how to separate money from their fellow man. Not feed and clothe them. 
When wars happen, the good guys seem to pull their heads out of there butt though. Even the Germans are sending leathel arms to the Ukraine now. 
a woke West would be more proactive years earlier and sanctioned over cyber attacks and general behavior and threats. They be big on threats. But hey, we’re not woke and under the influence of corruption and leaders like Trump. But commonsense does seem to rise to the level of cooperation when a guy like Putin goes to far.

[notsonice + 1,255]

1 minute ago, Boat said:

I agree with about all of that. But look this is how it will work until we blow each other up. The Chinas, the Russians the N Koreans will always be disruptive. The rest of the world just has to much greed to ignore the money they can make off them. Large corporations just don’t care about morality. Our schools teach how to separate money from their fellow man. Not feed and clothe them. 
When wars happen, the good guys seem to pull their heads out of there butt though. Even the Germans are sending leathel arms to the Ukraine now. 
a woke West would be more proactive years earlier and sanctioned over cyber attacks and general behavior and threats. They be big on threats. But hey, we’re not woke and under the influence of corruption and leaders like Trump. But commonsense does seem to rise to the level of cooperation when a guy like Putin goes to far.

One thing for certain. Putin has unified NATO stronger than ever before...... The newer members are seeing NATO step up to the task and beefing up all the defenses everywhere. 

[Boat + 1,324]

3 hours ago, notsonice said:

Is Nordstream 2 running today???? Most likely it is just rusting away as moisture is attacking it with no gas moving through it. A one way tube lying on the sea floor , I give it 5 years before the sea fills it and destroys it. Maybe sooner? ha ha ha

They in theory, could crank up Nordstream 2 indefinitely. I think Putins threats added years to that not happening soon. The mastermind is an idiot. 

[Boat + 1,324]

1 minute ago, notsonice said:

One thing for certain. Putin has unified NATO stronger than ever before...... The newer members are seeing NATO step up to the task and beefing up all the defenses everywhere. 

Sweden and Finland is considering joining NATO now. A potential big win for the good guys. 

[notsonice + 1,255]

Just now, Boat said:

Sweden and Finland is considering joining NATO now. A potential big win for the good guys. 

yep NATO keeps getting bigger and Putin keeps getting more desperate. 

[notsonice + 1,255]

3 minutes ago, Boat said:

They in theory, could crank up Nordstream 2 indefinitely. I think Putins threats added years to that not happening soon. The mastermind is an idiot. 

hope they left some of those little silicon packs/and added galvanic protection in the tube to nowhere. Condensation and corrosion is a bitch even if they think it is sealed perfectly.

[Boat + 1,324]

Personally I would like to see the US take over the air and make it a fairer fight. I mean no plane flies in Russia. None. I bet the master negotiator Putin would have a mouthful to say, EH?

[notsonice + 1,255]

2 minutes ago, Boat said:

Personally I would like to see the US take over the air and make it a fairer fight. I mean no plane flies in Russia. None. I bet the master negotiator Putin would have a mouthful to say, EH?

I think the Stingers and Javelins (and a lot of C4) in the hands of the Ukrainians are real game changers. Impossible to stop 2 man teams with the right stuff. And C4....Ukrainian grandmas can take out anything. The US can make an endless supply of all 3 and unless Russia builds a wall around Ukraine ....ha ha ha good luck. Ukraine will always have a lethal underground resistance....

[Boat + 1,324]

So France intercepts a Russia bound cargo ship. That’s kinda a suprise.

[notsonice + 1,255]

1 minute ago, Boat said:

So France intercepts a Russia bound cargo ship. That’s kinda a suprise.

game on

[Boat + 1,324]

So why are Ukrainian nat gas fields not developed years ago. Seems they have iron ore and missiles launched other natural resources as well. 

Edited February 26, 2022 by Boat

[surrept33 + 609]

6 hours ago, Boat said:

So why are Ukrainian nat gas fields not developed years ago. Seems they have iron ore and missiles launched other natural resources as well. 

wasn't that long ago that the (massive) ng fields were discovered near the black sea:

 

see this video starting at the linked time

https://youtu.be/If61baWF4GE?t=752

 

Edited February 27, 2022 by surrept33