notsonice + 1,154 DM May 29 (edited) 2 hours ago, footeab@yahoo.com said: Here ya go REAL Industrial prices, not LCOE government LIES: https://findenergy.com/la/ Louisiana: 5.6c/kWh --> NG Washington 6.3c/kWh --> Hydro Kentucky: 6.5c/kWh --> Coal Texas: 7c/kWh --> NG/wind North Dakota 6.9c/kWh --> NG New York: 6.9c/kWh--> NG/Nuclear/Hydro Iowa: 7c/kWh Wind/Coal/NG--> offsets costs to Illinois Ohio: 7.1c/kWh ---> NG/Coal W. Virginia 7.2c kWh --> NG/Coal Kansas: 7.9c/kWh --> Coal/NG/Wind Arizona 7.9c/kWh --> NG/Nuclear Illinois 8.3c/kWh--> Nuclear/NG/Wind(from Iowa) By capacity they are next to only Iowa, yet production is pigsty--> No, wind is not cheap. Florida 9.3c/kWh --> NG/Nuclear California: 19 c/ kWh --> Pixi farts NG/solar/nuclear Hawaii: 34.4 c/kWh --> Unicorn farts solar/diesel By far MOST expensive power: Solar Wind partially can work if there is actually wind<<cough Illinois you FOOLS>> and you have LOTS Of dirt cheap NG available. According to brain dead people like you, California/Hawaii has the cheapest power. Stop posting LIES. and you were claiming Texas was 14 cents now you claim Texas: 7c/kWh --> NG/wind go figure you are disputing your own posts now..... now you think NREL is lying???? good luck with your conspiracies enjoy the read https://www.nrel.gov/news/video/lcoss-text.html Levelized Cost of Solar Plus Storage (Text Version) National Renewable Energy Laboratory (NREL) (.gov) https://www.nrel.gov › news › video › lcoss-text https://www.nrel.gov/news/video/lcoss-text.html For LCOSS, we calculated that it varies from $55.00 per megawatt hour to $91.00 per megawatt hour without the ITC in the case of Phoenix and New York, and from .. Edited May 29 by notsonice 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
specinho + 444 May 30 (edited) 23 hours ago, Carlou33 said: I seem to recall that a surge in demand drove the price up. It might be helpful for you to take a few courses in economics to better understand these market dynamics, go here! Hi there... You have fallen way behind to still think market dynamic of academic course "economy" is relevant. Real life condition rarely played by books. Read more to grow out of framework created by ivory tower... All the best. Edited May 30 by specinho Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
footeab@yahoo.com + 2,165 May 30 On 5/29/2024 at 3:23 AM, notsonice said: and you were claiming Texas was 14 cents now you claim Texas: 7c/kWh --> NG/wind go figure you are disputing your own posts now..... now you think NREL is lying???? good luck with your conspiracies enjoy the read https://www.nrel.gov/news/video/lcoss-text.html Levelized Cost of Solar Plus Storage (Text Version) National Renewable Energy Laboratory (NREL) (.gov) https://www.nrel.gov › news › video › lcoss-text https://www.nrel.gov/news/video/lcoss-text.html For LCOSS, we calculated that it varies from $55.00 per megawatt hour to $91.00 per megawatt hour without the ITC in the case of Phoenix and New York, and from .. Baby, you can't read... Typical. Residential is not industrial chump Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,154 DM June 3 (edited) Pesky EVs....majority of Chinese population has now stopped buying new ICE vehicles...guess they like EV's over clunkers and back home GASOLINE • 10 mins 2.343 -0.074 -3.08% US economy is booming and the price of Oil...... like a clunker shoved over a cliff...crash and burn what happened to Echochumps claim of demand demand demand and $100 oil will be the rule in 24'?????????????? By Tom Kool - Jun 03, 2024, 11:16 AM CDT https://oilprice.com/Energy/Oil-Prices/Oil-Prices-Shed-Over-3-As-Market-Digests-OPEC-Move.html Oil Prices Shed Over 3% As Market Digests OPEC+ Move By Tom Kool - Jun 03, 2024, 11:16 AM CDT Brent crude was trading down well over 3% on Monday, marking the first time the global benchmark has been below $80 since February, with the U.S. crude benchmark down over 3.5% following the OPEC+ agreement to start phasing out voluntary cuts in October. On Monday at 11:54 a.m. ET, Brent crude was trading down 3.29% at $78.44, for a loss of $2.67 on the day. West Texas Intermediate (WTI) was down 3.51% at $74.29 per barrel, for a loss of $2.70 per barrel. Edited June 3 by notsonice Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Boat + 1,318 RG June 3 After averaging around 1.5 mbpd in market growth since 1950 oil demand has plateaued since 2019. Is oil out of disfavor or was it Covid. Is it the war from Russia or inflation from massive debt from most countries. One thing for sure. The rise of oil is over. The beginning of the end needs shorting. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,154 DM June 4 (edited) 2 hours ago, Boat said: After averaging around 1.5 mbpd in market growth since 1950 oil demand has plateaued since 2019. Is oil out of disfavor or was it Covid. Is it the war from Russia or inflation from massive debt from most countries. One thing for sure. The rise of oil is over. The beginning of the end needs shorting. are we in to a full blown bear market in oil in 2024?????? $70 Brent in the cards by the 4th of July???? $2.50 gas at the pump? Edited June 4 by notsonice 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Boat + 1,318 RG June 4 I think it’s possible. The rise of the electric car is relentless. Even peak nat gas may be here or close. We’ll see over the next couple of years. 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,154 DM June 4 (edited) 1 hour ago, Boat said: I think it’s possible. The rise of the electric car is relentless. Even peak nat gas may be here or close. We’ll see over the next couple of years. Brent is getting hammered everyday...........options market is going crazy....short sellers are making a killing...45 days ago Traders Bet on $100 Oil at Record Pace By Tsvetana Paraskova - Apr 15, 2024, 6:58 AM CDT Traders flocked to the crude oil options market last week, trading record numbers of call options that Brent would hit $100 per barrel in the coming months, data compiled by Bloomberg showed on Monday. under $70 Brent is very much possible by the 4th........Cheap gasoline on election day can swing an election BRENT CRUDE •10 mins 77.18 -1.18 -1.51% another massacre in Brent today China EV sales are not an oilmans friend , real estate recession in China is not an oilmans friend , The fed not cutting rates while oil is plummeting .....crazy as inflation is heading to zero very fast in the US with cheap energy prices Solar Panels not on an oilmans friend Gasoline at less than $2.50 today in my neck of the woods........... How long will the Fed sit on the sidelines as the number one driver of Inflation , $100 buck, plus oil is nowhere in sight anymore nor in the cards for the next year........ Carnage....China EV Sales is turning into a game changer...BYD and their low cost batteries and EVs Peak Nat gas...........pesky solar panels and the cost of panels still heading lower today 400 watt panel out of China less than $50 ....crazy......down almost 50 percent from a year ago.........Nat gas does not stand a chance Peak Nat gas has happened or will happen in the next 2 years Nikkei Asia China solar panel glut squeezes European suppliers as prices plunge TOKYO -- Solar panel prices have dropped by half over the past year amid a flood of supply from China that has led European manufacturers to... . 4 days ago Panel prices stood at 11.1 cents per watt as of late April, down from 21.6 cents a year earlier, data from BloombergNEF shows. Edited June 4 by notsonice 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,154 DM June 6 Getting rid or wasteful Oil generated electric power stattions one wind turbine at a time and one undersea HVDC line to the mainland Shetland Energy Scottish and Southern Electricity Networks - SSEN https://www.ssen.co.uk › ... › Projects and live works Most of Shetland's electricity is currently supplied by two fossil-fuel power stations, with the remainder being supplied by renewable generators. Shetland's .. Of which one is oil fired reNews Viking achieves first power First power has been produced at the 443MW Viking wind farm on Shetland island, Scotland. The milestone comes as Shetland gears up to be... . 8 hours ago Energy Voice Shetland's Viking wind farm achieves first power as mainland connection nears The Viking wind farm on Shetland has achieved first power as the island gears up for connection to the mainland electricity grid. . 8 hours ago 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turbguy + 1,484 June 6 In other coal "news". "No shows" from coal mine owners? Hmm... https://wyofile.com/coal-industry-a-no-show-at-campbell-county-event-to-rally-against-federal-leasing-ban/?utm_source=WyoFile&utm_campaign=d3097d68e9-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2024_06_06_12_06&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_-d3097d68e9-[LIST_EMAIL_ID] Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,154 DM June 6 53 minutes ago, turbguy said: In other coal "news". "No shows" from coal mine owners? Hmm... https://wyofile.com/coal-industry-a-no-show-at-campbell-county-event-to-rally-against-federal-leasing-ban/?utm_source=WyoFile&utm_campaign=d3097d68e9-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2024_06_06_12_06&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_-d3097d68e9-[LIST_EMAIL_ID] that is wild........do you think all of mine management have their own personal exit plans made out and they see no future in Wyoming due to where the market is heading or the mines already have enough reserves leased that carries them out for the next 30 years so they do not need to fight a battle now or ever???? Looks like Mine management did not want to waste any time??????? or did not want to tell locals getting leases is not the problem??? I see the statement mining companies have not nominated a major new federal coal lease in the Powder River Basin since 2012. sure paints a picture that most of the locals are not coming to grips with reality for Powder River Coal......housing prices in Gillette in a terminal decline??????? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turbguy + 1,484 June 6 (edited) 23 minutes ago, notsonice said: that is wild........do you think all of mine management have their own personal exit plans made out and they see no future in Wyoming due to where the market is heading or the mines already have enough reserves leased that carries them out for the next 30 years so they do not need to fight a battle now or ever???? Looks like Mine management did not want to waste any time??????? or did not want to tell locals getting leases is not the problem??? I see the statement mining companies have not nominated a major new federal coal lease in the Powder River Basin since 2012. sure paints a picture that most of the locals are not coming to grips with reality for Powder River Coal......housing prices in Gillette in a terminal decline??????? Yes, my state is really struggling with the forward-looking loss of severance tax income from coal. It's in the multi-multi millions. .It has been a great fifty-year ride since the EPA fought "acid rain" by encouraging the use of low-sulfur (aka, PRB) coals. Prior to that action, PRB coals were practically worthless. Coal-switching issues at coal-fired generating units (such as ash fusion temperatures, fugitive dusts, pulverizing mill "puffs" (explosions)) were slowly overcome. The locals are understandably concerned. Coal represents a considerable benefit to those communities. This situation is gonna go to the Courts, for sure. That said, there is new interest to re-establish mining Uranium, and also Rare Earths in Wyoming. Stay tuned! Edited June 6 by turbguy 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turbguy + 1,484 June 6 More "coal" news: https://oilprice.com/Alternative-Energy/Renewable-Energy/US-Must-Continue-Solar-Growth-to-Meet-Decarbonization-Goals.html "From 2018 to 2023, solar energy output skyrocketed by 155% according to figures from the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA). Over the same period, the United States cut back its coal usage by a whopping 41%". 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,154 DM June 6 4 minutes ago, turbguy said: Yes, my state is really struggling with the forward-looking loss of severance tax income from coal. It's in the multi-multi millions. .It has been a great fifty-year ride since the EPA fought "acid rain" by encouraging the use of low-sulfur (aka, PRB) coals. Prior to that action, PRB coals were practically worthless. Coal-switching issues at coal-fired generating units (such as ash fusion temperatures, fugitive dusts, pulverizing mill "puffs" (explosions)) were slowly overcome. The locals are understandably concerned. Coal represents a considerable benefit to those communities. This situation is gonna go to the Courts, for sure. That said, there is new interest to re-establish mining Uranium, and also Rare Earths in Wyoming. Stay tuned! This situation is gonna go to the Courts, for sure.???? who will bring a battle???? if you have no market for it and you have plenty of reserves already leased...why would any mining company spend millions on attorneys???? no new coal fired plants and the remaining ones are closing fast .........the market is declining very fast and the end 2040???? it is less than half of the 2008 peak and look like it will be under 50,000,000 tons a year by 2040 for Wyoming Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,397 DL June 7 On 6/4/2024 at 6:07 PM, Boat said: I think it’s possible. The rise of the electric car is relentless. Even peak nat gas may be here or close. We’ll see over the next couple of years. EVs are in trouble...people do not want them. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,397 DL June 7 On 6/3/2024 at 7:31 PM, Boat said: After averaging around 1.5 mbpd in market growth since 1950 oil demand has plateaued since 2019. Is oil out of disfavor or was it Covid. Is it the war from Russia or inflation from massive debt from most countries. One thing for sure. The rise of oil is over. The beginning of the end needs shorting. We see rising demand for oil, not a decline. EVs are in decline, fossil fuel autos are increasing. That is supposed to be bad for oil? Really? 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turbguy + 1,484 June 7 2 hours ago, notsonice said: This situation is gonna go to the Courts, for sure.???? who will bring a battle???? My state government. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,397 DL June 7 3 hours ago, turbguy said: More "coal" news: https://oilprice.com/Alternative-Energy/Renewable-Energy/US-Must-Continue-Solar-Growth-to-Meet-Decarbonization-Goals.html "From 2018 to 2023, solar energy output skyrocketed by 155% according to figures from the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA). Over the same period, the United States cut back its coal usage by a whopping 41%". Percent...percent...percent...all depends on the base number, otherwise meaningless. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,397 DL June 7 (edited) 3 hours ago, notsonice said: that is wild........do you think all of mine management have their own personal exit plans made out and they see no future in Wyoming due to where the market is heading or the mines already have enough reserves leased that carries them out for the next 30 years so they do not need to fight a battle now or ever???? Looks like Mine management did not want to waste any time??????? or did not want to tell locals getting leases is not the problem??? I see the statement mining companies have not nominated a major new federal coal lease in the Powder River Basin since 2012. sure paints a picture that most of the locals are not coming to grips with reality for Powder River Coal......housing prices in Gillette in a terminal decline??????? Looks like the current Prez is campaigning against coal? Or did I miss something? Edited June 7 by Ecocharger Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,154 DM June 7 (edited) 2 hours ago, Ecocharger said: Looks like the current Prez is campaigning against coal? Or did I miss something? no need to campaign ...The Nat Gas biz is doing the work coupled with Solar and Wind....no room for Coal in the US anymore. Game over for Coal in the US......... music chairs...coal is out and next is Nat gas... in just a few more years wind alone will be bigger than coal You will love it in India, they could use your BS as they need someone to try to try to convince people that Coal is pollution free. Edited June 7 by notsonice Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turbguy + 1,484 June 7 1 hour ago, Ecocharger said: Looks like the current Prez is campaigning against coal? Or did I miss something? Yes, you did. The Federal Government will not be issuing any coal mining leases within or on it's property beyond 2041. There is still PLENTY of PRB coal to mine with the existing leases. The coal mining companies themselves appear to be undisturbed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turbguy + 1,484 June 7 (edited) 2 hours ago, Ecocharger said: Percent...percent...percent...all depends on the base number, otherwise meaningless. A 40+% reduction in coal consumption is "otherwise meaningless"? Do you have any idea how many coal fired generating units have been retired (or converted to nat gas, if possible) in the last 5 years? ...and a LOT more retirements coming. Then, Bill Gates has broken ground on the new Natrium Nuclear Plant to be set outside of Kemmerer, WY. Kemmerer has the distinction of being the location of J. C. Penney's first (mother) store. And it is still open today. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._C._Penney_Historic_District Edited June 7 by turbguy 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,397 DL June 7 (edited) 14 hours ago, turbguy said: A 40+% reduction in coal consumption is "otherwise meaningless"? Do you have any idea how many coal fired generating units have been retired (or converted to nat gas, if possible) in the last 5 years? ...and a LOT more retirements coming. Then, Bill Gates has broken ground on the new Natrium Nuclear Plant to be set outside of Kemmerer, WY. Kemmerer has the distinction of being the location of J. C. Penney's first (mother) store. And it is still open today. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._C._Penney_Historic_District Coal demand is now at historic highs...so what you are saying is not understandable. https://www.iea.org/news/global-coal-demand-set-to-remain-at-record-levels-in-2023 "Coal consumption in 2022 rose by 3.3% to 8.3 billion tonnes, setting a new record, according to the IEA’s mid-year Coal Market Update, which was published today. In 2023 and 2024, small declines in coal-fired power generation are likely to be offset by rises in industrial use of coal, the report predicts, although there are wide variations between geographic regions." Edited June 7 by Ecocharger Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turbguy + 1,484 June 8 (edited) 10 hours ago, Ecocharger said: Coal demand is now at historic highs...so what you are saying is not understandable. https://www.iea.org/news/global-coal-demand-set-to-remain-at-record-levels-in-2023 "Coal consumption in 2022 rose by 3.3% to 8.3 billion tonnes, setting a new record, according to the IEA’s mid-year Coal Market Update, which was published today. In 2023 and 2024, small declines in coal-fired power generation are likely to be offset by rises in industrial use of coal, the report predicts, although there are wide variations between geographic regions." There are a lot more coal-fired generating units retiring (or converting to NG if practical) in the next 10 years. A few examples: Duke Energy Corp.: This major utility plans to completely retire their coal fleet by 2035 (though regulatory approval is needed). American Electric Power Co. Inc.: They are actively retiring coal plants with a schedule to remove over 4.7 GW of capacity by 2028. Colstrip Units 1 & 2 (Montana): These units are slated for retirement in 2025, with Unit 4 potentially following in 2032. Cummins Station (Michigan): This plant is scheduled for a phased retirement with the final unit closing by 2025. ...and a little more "evidence" in this chart about the effects of past retirements. If you need assistance parsing the data, let me know. Edited June 8 by turbguy 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,154 DM June 8 (edited) 10 hours ago, Ecocharger said: Coal demand is now at historic highs...so what you are saying is not understandable. https://www.iea.org/news/global-coal-demand-set-to-remain-at-record-levels-in-2023 "Coal consumption in 2022 rose by 3.3% to 8.3 billion tonnes, setting a new record, according to the IEA’s mid-year Coal Market Update, which was published today. In 2023 and 2024, small declines in coal-fired power generation are likely to be offset by rises in industrial use of coal, the report predicts, although there are wide variations between geographic regions." hate to burst your bubble but 2022 was not a record year (this info has been posted before....I do understand your memory is not to good...so please go look at the last energy review published which was on June 20, 2023. now you are praying for a dead cat bounce in 2023 to beat out 2014??????.............going to be tight but no booming output since 2014.....2014 is still the record year and from now on it is all down hill thanks to those pesky solar panels.....billions of them being installed every year now.....billions What is the energy review?????? BP put it out for years now the KPMG puts it out on the web for EI (Energy Institute) the info for 2023 has not been released yet but from what you posted .....2023 and 2024, small declines in coal-fired power generation are likely to be offset by rises in industrial use of coal...means 2023 could also fall short of 2014......... the 2024 review, which contains the numbers for 2023.... will be published??????? The new 2024 edition of the Statistical Review of World Energy will be published on Thursday 20 June 2024, providing free-to-access data on global energy production, consumption, trade and emissions for the full year 2023. just to refresh you in 2014 the world consumption of coal was 161.49 Exajoules and in 2022 it was 161.47......so once again 2022 was not a record year..... I put the table of values back to 2008 below....but you do not have to believe what I post ....just click on the link and read the review yourself...all the historical data for all energy sources is presented. PS the Chinese pumped up tonnage coming out of mine mouths in 2022 meet their mandated totals....Mine tonnage is always based on what comes out of the mine including waste/ash that is contained in what is called raw coal.........More ash and more waste (shale partings, floor and cap rock etc) increases tonnage but does not increase energy content....IE you can mine the crap out of a weak floor and ship crap out with your coal but it earns you nothing but deductions when you settle up with your buyer.......Coal is sold by its energy content......Mining the floor does impress bean counters You would know this if you ever worked at a coal mine or prep plant...... https://kpmg.com/xx/en/home/insights/2023/06/statistical-review-of-world-energy-2023.html World Coal Consumption Year Exajoules 2008 146.81 2009 144.52 2010 150.97 2011 158.03 2012 158.48 2013 160.81 2014 161.49 2015 157.21 2016 153.77 2017 155.27 2018 157.66 2019 156.72 2020 152.04 2021 160.43 2022 161.47 Edited June 8 by notsonice Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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