EU Threatens Sanctions on Companies That Give In to US on Iran Sanctions

[TraderTate + 186]

So, now the EU has threatened to actually sanction companies who comply with the US sanctions on Iran, first round of which went into effect on August 6th. I think the game here is this: The EU is now trying desperately to convince Iran that it's serious about this because it doesn't want Tehran to sit down to the nuclear table with the US and negotiate a new nuclear deal without Europe. That would be very tricky for the Iranian leadership right now, but not outside the realm of possibility. 

[jaycee + 348]

3 hours ago, TraderTate said:

So, now the EU has threatened to actually sanction companies who comply with the US sanctions on Iran, first round of which went into effect on August 6th. I think the game here is this: The EU is now trying desperately to convince Iran that it's serious about this because it doesn't want Tehran to sit down to the nuclear table with the US and negotiate a new nuclear deal without Europe. That would be very tricky for the Iranian leadership right now, but not outside the realm of possibility. 

I think you are misreading this from an American point of view. From a European point of view, they don't want a nuclear Iran and realise the deal they got previously was the best they were going to get and are treating Trump like an inconvenient,noisy child and marginalising him and hoping he will go away soon. Nobody is seriously worried that Trump will strike a deal without them judging by his last couple of deals with NK and Europe he doesn’t get much anyway. Countries are working him out he is playing to American voters. They give him a minor concession and  get more in return. NK got lots of world stage action looking like an equal to the US that will play well at home in return for a few skeletons and closing down a test centre they were going to close anyway. Europe promised to buy more US LNG when they have the facilities which will be after Trump is voted out in return get an indefinite hold on tariffs while they negotiate, the UK is leaving the EU and still has not managed to get a deal I expect Trump will never see one. I am going to bet any deal he gets from Iran will be trivial but heralded as a massive concession in the US and Iran will not change anything as they will pay lip service to any deal and wait for Trump to get voted out just like NK is doing.

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

17 minutes ago, jaycee said:

From a European point of view, they don't want a nuclear Iran and realise the deal they got previously was the best they were going to get and are treating Trump like an inconvenient,noisy child and marginalising him and hoping he will go away soon. 

Jay, your analysis is uncomfortably close to the mark. 

[jaycee + 348]

12 minutes ago, Jan van Eck said:

31 minutes ago, jaycee said:

 

Jay, your analysis is uncomfortably close to the mark. 

For a while they were treating him seriously but his treatment of Macron when Trump treated him like a long lost friend when he went to the White House to try and stop the Iranian sanctions then when he left Trump applied them anyway sealed his fate. Europe decided then I think they cannot do business with him as he is untrustworthy so are just waiting it out. The stunts he pulls may work in business but in politics the people are far sharper. 

Edited August 9, 2018 by jaycee

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

Just now, jaycee said:

For a while they were treating him seriously but his treatment of Macron where he acted like a long lost friend when he went to the White House to try and stop the Iranian sanctions then when he left he applied them anyway sealed his fate. Europe decided then I think they cannot do business with him as he is untrustworthy so are just waiting it out. The stunts he pulls may work in business but in politics the people are far sharper. 

In my experience the Europeans are both formal and reserved, conservative in their approach to politics.  The gunslinger style horrifies them. For the bureaucrats in Brussels, he is anathema.  They view Trump as on the level of Yanukovitch. 

[jaycee + 348]

Just now, Jan van Eck said:

In my experience the Europeans are both formal and reserved, conservative in their approach to politics.  The gunslinger style horrifies them. For the bureaucrats in Brussels, he is anathema.  They view Trump as on the level of Yanukovitch. 

HaHa yes he will have shocked them, he is not all bad then :0)

[Epic + 390]

1 hour ago, jaycee said:

he is playing to American voters

The US president catering to the American voters...what a novel concept!  The last time we've seen something like this was probably Reagan.  

1 hour ago, jaycee said:

I am going to bet any deal he gets from Iran will be trivial 

He is not looking to make a deal, not with Iran, at least.

[ronwagn + 6,290]

I would say that European Union leaders are the opposite of conservative. I would say they are big government fascist bureaucrats that want to strictly control anyone they can while removing their personal freedoms. Fascism is socialism and nationalism combined with crony capitalism. The definition fits quite closely. The idea of the E.U. was to become a United Europe with one currency. Like a European United States. The assumption was that they would remain classically liberal, not fascistic. The people of greater Europe will have a lot to say about what happens next. So far the E.U. leaders are being strongly challenged.

[jaycee + 348]

1 hour ago, Epic said:

The US president catering to the American voters...what a novel concept!  The last time we've seen something like this was probably Reagan.  

Not translating to American very well. 'Playing to' means acting like he cares to get votes.

 

1 hour ago, Epic said:

He is not looking to make a deal, not with Iran, at least.

Oh yes he is. Same game played with NK loads of abuse between two sides, looks like war then bam a deal. He is even suggesting they are welcome to meet him at any time. Same format as NK 'negotiations'.

edit

this is how he does business deals he likes face to face deals at the last minute to scare other side. Apparently on property deals he comes to the table last minute and says he is pulling out unless they sweeten the deal. By now any seller will have committed a lot to the deal so they usually capitulate rather than lose out on money put in already or committed elsewhere. In politics he is trying the same but not getting much but it’s not his money he is playing with all he cares about is looking like the saviour of the world, or at least the United States, so he can get re-elected. 

Edited August 9, 2018 by jaycee
Clarification

[jaycee + 348]

56 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

I would say that European Union leaders are the opposite of conservative. I would say they are big government fascist bureaucrats that want to strictly control anyone they can while removing their personal freedoms

All the words bar facist I agree with. You need to be European to understand they are not facist but actually Liberals. They basically think they know what is best for everyone becasue they are so superior. That is what Liberals are in Europe. They were the ones that opposed Brexit with such fervour in the UK because they know what is best and everyone else is stupid. Very annoying people..

Edited August 9, 2018 by jaycee

[ronwagn + 6,290]

JC, Liberals or leftists are actually progressives and end up being socialists, fascists or communists. on a continuum. 

[jaycee + 348]

25 minutes ago, ronwagn said:

JC, Liberals or leftists are actually progressives and end up being socialists, fascists or communists. on a continuum. 

Have to disagree fascists tend to favour more large corporations that they can control via money and favour extreme left think they know everything and control everything letting nobody else in. The end result is the same though so agree there people have no say but how they make you believe the crap is different. It’s a pH scale not a continuum I would say, both ends can do you a lot of harm.

Edited August 9, 2018 by jaycee

[Qanoil + 116]

3 hours ago, jaycee said:

The stunts he pulls may work in business but in politics the people are far sharper. 

I tend to distrust politicians far more than business people.  And I tend to view successful business people as smarter than politicians.

[Epic + 390]

23 minutes ago, Qanoil said:

And I tend to view successful business people as smarter than politicians.

"Smart" is a relative term.  Everyone is smart at something.  Business people are smart at making deals which create efficiencies that lower costs and thereby benefit their customers (if they are not smart at this, they eventually go out of business).  On the other hand, politicians are smart are making deals that ensure they get re-elected (just look at Xi).  

See, everyone is smart!  

[ronwagn + 6,290]

JC said: Have to disagree fascists tend to favour more large corporations that they can control via money and favour extreme left think they know everything and control everything letting nobody else in. The end result is the same though so agree there people have no say but how they make you believe the crap is different. It’s a pH scale not a continuum I would say, both ends can do you a lot of harm.

What you describe is exactly what has been happening all around the world for several decades. Big governments manage the big corporations indirectly through rules and regulations. The military industrial complex is also a big factor in most countries. I call this fascism. The people gradually lose their freedoms through micromanagement of their lives by laws and local bureaucrats. America has a great Constitution and Bill of RIghts meant to protect individual rights. The left wing is intent on watering down our freedoms and virtually destroying them by ignoring them. 

[jaycee + 348]

13 hours ago, Qanoil said:

I tend to distrust politicians far more than business people.  And I tend to view successful business people as smarter than politicians.

I believe there is very little difference they both tell you as much lies as they legally can usually more.

I would tend to agree business people are smarter than politicians but I only mentioned Trump who with 6 bankrupcies to his name suggests he is not that bright.

[jaycee + 348]

10 hours ago, ronwagn said:

What you describe is exactly what has been happening all around the world for several decades. Big governments manage the big corporations indirectly through rules and regulations. The military industrial complex is also a big factor in most countries. I call this fascism

With you right up to the fascism bit. Facism involves a one party state and a dictator but we still have democracy mind you with the education systems in some countries democracy is pointless.  We are slowly going down the totalitarian state route however as we constantly have politicians taking away our rights in order to protect us from the latest baddie they have found. USSR was followed rather rapidly by Islam. 

[Palloy 0]

I'm surprised that no one thinks it's worth mentioning that Iran doesn't have a nuclear weapons program, as was pointed out by the National Intelligence Estimate (2007) and each one since.  They say the last time there was a program was in 2004, and there is no hard evidence even for that.  This whole US withdrawal from JCPOA is a farce, and only serves to drive Iran into the arms of Russia-China (on their terms of course).  Turkey is virtually being forced into the same thing, and they DO have nukes (US ones stored at Incirlik air base).

The US Empire is being run by a snake-oil salesman with no diplomatic skills, a real Caligula, who may end up going the same way - assassination by the Praetorian Guard.

The Eurpeans are being led, not by fascists, but by elitists, who cannot find the nerve to declare the imperial farce over for fear of a Russian attack, which they have been expecting now for 73 years!