E-car Sales Collapse

[Ron Wagner + 706]

On 5/29/2023 at 10:45 PM, lexington green said:

An electric Mustang costs about $9 to "fill the tank", i.e. charge it to a range of 230 miles or more.

No ICE power train can compete.

End of story . . . 

https://www.jacksonford.net/searchnew.aspx?Make=Ford&Model=Mustang+Mach-E

The average person will not pay these prices $63,000 +.  Some will buy them and will get lots of speeding tickets and have more accidents. There are far more options with more room and lower prices with ICE vehicles. 

Edited June 12, 2023 by Ron Wagner

[lexington green + 22]

On 6/9/2023 at 9:27 PM, Ron Wagner said:

https://www.jacksonford.net/searchnew.aspx?Make=Ford&Model=Mustang+Mach-E

The average person will not pay these prices $63,000 +.  Some will buy them and will get lots of speeding tickets and have more accidents. There are far more options with more room and lower prices with ICE vehicles. 

GM has already built, and sold, an EV with starting price of $26,500.   The main reason an "average person" wouldn't buy an EV is charging availability.  Not everyone lives in a house with a driveway.   EV and ICE can coexist, but cost of operation of an EV is far lower.  Competition will decide.  As it is, the "muscle car" is already dead.

[Ron Wagner + 706]

20 hours ago, lexington green said:

GM has already built, and sold, an EV with starting price of $26,500.   The main reason an "average person" wouldn't buy an EV is charging availability.  Not everyone lives in a house with a driveway.   EV and ICE can coexist, but cost of operation of an EV is far lower.  Competition will decide.  As it is, the "muscle car" is already dead.

EV's are the new muscle cars IMHO. Electricity can run heavy trucks on local routes but is not a good idea for long hauls because of them carrying their own weight around. Hybrids of all scales are possible, even in large ships, they just need to use fuel to produce the electricity to run the drive train. Locomotives are a good example. They can run from diesel as usual, or cleaner LNG. Diesel is a carcinogen, natural gas is not. The price of LNG in America is probably about the same. Most natural gas vehicles run on CNG which is compressed natural gas, which is cheaper. 

Edited June 13, 2023 by Ron Wagner

[specinho + 465]

On 6/3/2023 at 3:23 AM, notsonice said:

14 million out of an expected 69 million this year and increasing every day

what does that work out to be?????......

 

I will help you on this one as you seem to be mathematically challenged

20 percent

and 2024

expected to be

27.5 percent

and 2025

expected to be

36 percent

2030

over 50 percent

the niche market for the wealthy?????? must be all the new wealthy people in the US thanks to sleepy Joe's job creation machine'

enjoy the transition , I am

Image below shows how often we would draw out an impression the way we think,  despite what we see, ... in modern era. 

 

[Ecocharger + 1,450]

On 6/12/2023 at 2:48 AM, lexington green said:

GM has already built, and sold, an EV with starting price of $26,500.   The main reason an "average person" wouldn't buy an EV is charging availability.  Not everyone lives in a house with a driveway.   EV and ICE can coexist, but cost of operation of an EV is far lower.  Competition will decide.  As it is, the "muscle car" is already dead.

The enormous social costs of EVs make them unaffordable to society in the final reckoning.

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

4 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

The enormous social costs of EVs make them unaffordable to society in the final reckoning.

"social costs"?

Please elaborate

Edited June 14, 2023 by Rob Plant

[turbguy + 1,537]

13 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

The enormous social costs of EVs make them unaffordable to society in the final reckoning.

Huh?  Perhaps you can provide some further clarity for this?

There are "social costs" with private transport of any type.

Edited June 14, 2023 by turbguy

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,188]

On 5/31/2023 at 5:21 PM, Ron Wagner said:

Tesla seems to be the only profitable manufacturer in the USA and a strong competitor worldwide. Theoretically, the Chinese could win the top slot worldwide but that would depend on getting rid of the CCP.  India could be a big competitor worldwide if it has a good foreign policy. It is trying to eliminate Christians and all non Hindus on the sly. That and it has a traditional affinity with Russia, probably due to Marxists within. 

If one looks at the stats, TESLA is the ONLY car company actually turning a profit anywhere in the world.

Everyone else is BURIED in debt and all their so called "profits" are not profits at all where they at best get government subsidies to roll over the debt. 

PS: If anyone thinks any current Chinese car can actually be driven legally in the USA/Europe.. they can't as they cannot pass the safety tests.  The only way it is happening is via blatant corruption where the tests are bypassed currently.

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,188]

On 6/11/2023 at 11:48 PM, lexington green said:

GM has already built, and sold, an EV with starting price of $26,500.   The main reason an "average person" wouldn't buy an EV is charging availability.  Not everyone lives in a house with a driveway.   EV and ICE can coexist, but cost of operation of an EV is far lower.  Competition will decide.  As it is, the "muscle car" is already dead.

The "muscle car" has always been dead.  Only the affluent ever afforded them.  Everyone else(VAST MAJORITY) bought for convenience/comfort/Affordability.  Being able to "fuel up at home" is amazing.  Far lower maintenance costs is also amazing.  Of course this has other MASSIVE problems for Christmas and other major travel holiday's, but keep the ICE cars around for that.  Trucks?  Yea, not applicable currently.  Short haul trucking?  Ok, but most of a trucks maintenance is not its engine anyways. 

[Rob Plant + 2,756]

16 hours ago, footeab@yahoo.com said:

If one looks at the stats, TESLA is the ONLY car company actually turning a profit anywhere in the world.

I smell some proper BS here.

Again your opinion backed up by..... yes wait for it...... NOTHING.

BMW have a range of ICE, Hybrid and EV's, they had a revenue of over €142b last year with an EBIT of €13,999m, seems very healthy to me!

https://www.statista.com/statistics/264340/global-revenue-of-bmw-group/

This shows GM made $9.9b net profit in 2022 so your statement is false

https://www.topcarstesla.com/blogs/news/tesla-becomes-the-most-profitable-car-company-in-2022-as-traditional-giants-accelerate-electrification#:~:text=Specifically%2C Tesla earned %2412.583 billion in 2022 net,net profit in 2021 was about %2417.937 billion.

GM, Byd, Volkswagen, Toyota, Hyundai etc etc are all turning a healthy profit.

Please stop posting BS. The lies you spout to try to uphold your own agenda are just that, lies, you're embarrassing yourself.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Rob Plant

[notsonice + 1,255]

on of the highlight of this new article....

EVs are expected to account for nearly one-fifth of global car sales in 2023, the International Energy Agency (IEA) said in its annual report in April.

Last year, EV sales accounted for 14% of all new cars sold globally, up from around 9% in 2021 and less than 5% in 2020

Choooo Choooo...........the EV Train is picking up speed

 

anyone want to guess at 2024.............20 Million EV's or more than 30 percent????

2025????? 25 million EVs or more than 38 percent?????

 

now who started this thread of E-Car Sales Collapse?????? A confused person living in denial??????

 

 

The U.S. Becomes The World’s Second-Largest EV Market After China

By Tsvetana Paraskova - Jun 16, 2023, 7:00 AM CDT

Tax credits led to a surge in U.S. electric vehicle sales in the first quarter of 2023, making the United States the world’s second-largest EV market after China, Counterpoint Technology Market Research said in new research.

U.S. passenger electric vehicle (EV) sales jumped by over 79% year-on-year in Q1 2023, helping the U.S. surpass Germany to become the world’s second-largest EV market.   

Battery EVs (BEV) accounted for 81% of all passenger EV sales in the U.S. between January and March, while plug-in hybrid EVs (PHEVs) made up the rest.

The undisputed leader in the BEV market was Tesla, which sold more EVs than the next 18 automotive groups combined, the research showed.

Tesla held a 63% market share in BEV sales, followed by GM with a 7.6% share at a distant second. Tesla Model Y was the best-selling BEV model, followed by Tesla Model 3, Chevrolet Bolt EUV, Volkswagen ID.4, and Chevrolet Bolt, Counterpoint’s research found.  

The EV tax credits have played a critical role in lifting EV sales this year, while sales of conventional passenger vehicles remain flat, Research Analyst Abhik Mukherjee said. Currently, around 20 models in total offered by Tesla, GM, Ford, Stellantis, Rivian, and Volkswagen are eligible for the tax credit, Mukherjee added.

Going forward, the U.S. EV market is set to rise if economic conditions improve, Counterpoint’s analysts say.

“Tax credits for new and even used EVs are helping consumers, while investments in streamlining the EV battery supply chain, the establishment of a robust network of EV charging stations and the setting up of battery recycling plants nationwide will all support EV sales growth,” Research Director Jeff Fieldhack said.

“Therefore, we expect US EV sales to reach around 1.5 million units in 2023 if economic conditions continue improving.”

 

China, Europe, and the United States continue to dominate EV sales, with China the frontrunner once again, accounting for around 60% of global electric car sales, the IEA noted.

By Tsvetana Paraskova for Oilprice.com

[specinho + 465]

On 6/14/2023 at 1:24 PM, Ecocharger said:

The enormous social costs of EVs make them unaffordable to society in the final reckoning.

Saw an EV produced back in the 60s. The body of car is not made from metal but reinforced carbon or fiber carbon or something in that line....

Suddenly a thought hit......

Metal is a conductor,

high voltage battery in EV  is a conductor..

But tyres are insulator......

What if lightning strikes? 😯

Do they have a metal trailer to decharge or something like that? 😟

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

US plug-in EV sales up 68.1% YoY in May:

https://www.anl.gov/esia/light-duty-electric-drive-vehicles-monthly-sales-updates

Edited June 19, 2023 by Jay McKinsey

[Ecocharger + 1,450]

On 6/18/2023 at 8:03 PM, Jay McKinsey said:

US plug-in EV sales up 68.1% YoY in May:

https://www.anl.gov/esia/light-duty-electric-drive-vehicles-monthly-sales-updates

Out of context with the general market.

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

Just now, Ecocharger said:

Out of context with the general market.

That is the general market. 

[Ecocharger + 1,450]

On 6/16/2023 at 2:07 PM, notsonice said:

on of the highlight of this new article....

EVs are expected to account for nearly one-fifth of global car sales in 2023, the International Energy Agency (IEA) said in its annual report in April.

Last year, EV sales accounted for 14% of all new cars sold globally, up from around 9% in 2021 and less than 5% in 2020

Choooo Choooo...........the EV Train is picking up speed

 

anyone want to guess at 2024.............20 Million EV's or more than 30 percent????

2025????? 25 million EVs or more than 38 percent?????

 

now who started this thread of E-Car Sales Collapse?????? A confused person living in denial??????

 

 

The U.S. Becomes The World’s Second-Largest EV Market After China

By Tsvetana Paraskova - Jun 16, 2023, 7:00 AM CDT

Tax credits led to a surge in U.S. electric vehicle sales in the first quarter of 2023, making the United States the world’s second-largest EV market after China, Counterpoint Technology Market Research said in new research.

U.S. passenger electric vehicle (EV) sales jumped by over 79% year-on-year in Q1 2023, helping the U.S. surpass Germany to become the world’s second-largest EV market.   

Battery EVs (BEV) accounted for 81% of all passenger EV sales in the U.S. between January and March, while plug-in hybrid EVs (PHEVs) made up the rest.

The undisputed leader in the BEV market was Tesla, which sold more EVs than the next 18 automotive groups combined, the research showed.

Tesla held a 63% market share in BEV sales, followed by GM with a 7.6% share at a distant second. Tesla Model Y was the best-selling BEV model, followed by Tesla Model 3, Chevrolet Bolt EUV, Volkswagen ID.4, and Chevrolet Bolt, Counterpoint’s research found.  

The EV tax credits have played a critical role in lifting EV sales this year, while sales of conventional passenger vehicles remain flat, Research Analyst Abhik Mukherjee said. Currently, around 20 models in total offered by Tesla, GM, Ford, Stellantis, Rivian, and Volkswagen are eligible for the tax credit, Mukherjee added.

Going forward, the U.S. EV market is set to rise if economic conditions improve, Counterpoint’s analysts say.

“Tax credits for new and even used EVs are helping consumers, while investments in streamlining the EV battery supply chain, the establishment of a robust network of EV charging stations and the setting up of battery recycling plants nationwide will all support EV sales growth,” Research Director Jeff Fieldhack said.

“Therefore, we expect US EV sales to reach around 1.5 million units in 2023 if economic conditions continue improving.”

 

China, Europe, and the United States continue to dominate EV sales, with China the frontrunner once again, accounting for around 60% of global electric car sales, the IEA noted.

By Tsvetana Paraskova for Oilprice.com

Again, this tells us nothing about the overall market. New cars are only about one-third or one-quarter  of the personal vehicle market.

Edited June 21, 2023 by Ecocharger

[Ecocharger + 1,450]

1 minute ago, Jay McKinsey said:

That is the general market. 

Not.

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

Just now, Ecocharger said:

Not.

It is the US car market. There is only one and those are the current numbers. 

[Ecocharger + 1,450]

1 minute ago, Jay McKinsey said:

It is the US car market. There is only one and those are the current numbers. 

There is only one U.S., but new cars are only one-third to one-quarter of the personal vehicle market.

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

Just now, Ecocharger said:

There is only one U.S., but new cars are only one-third to one-quarter of the personal vehicle market.

All used cars come from the new car market. I see that you are still challenged with reality.

[Ecocharger + 1,450]

On 6/14/2023 at 5:25 AM, Rob Plant said:

"social costs"?

Please elaborate

Government subsidies, punitive taxes on alternative transportation options, etc.

[Ecocharger + 1,450]

1 minute ago, Jay McKinsey said:

All used cars come from the new car market. I see that you are still challenged with reality.

You are challenged with numbers, old boy.

Consumers prefer to spend their money on used fossil fuel cars rather than new EVs.

Edited June 21, 2023 by Ecocharger

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

1 minute ago, Ecocharger said:

You are challenged with numbers, old boy.

Consumers prefer used fossil fuel cars to new EVs.

Used EV Sales Are Thriving As Prices Continue To Fall

Sales of second-hand electric cars rose 32% in Q1 2023.

 

Sales of used electric vehicles are growing at a rapid rate. Per a new report from industry analysts Cox Automotive, sales of pre-owned EVs rose 32% in Q1 2023. EVs now account for 7% of the used American automotive market, up from 3.1% in 2021.

 

Over 225,000 used EVs exchanged hands in the US last quarter, a new record. According to the most recent data, the average price of a used EV was $43,400.

So EVs are almost as large a percentage of the US used market as they are in the new market.

[Ecocharger + 1,450]

7 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Used EV Sales Are Thriving As Prices Continue To Fall

Sales of second-hand electric cars rose 32% in Q1 2023.

 

Sales of used electric vehicles are growing at a rapid rate. Per a new report from industry analysts Cox Automotive, sales of pre-owned EVs rose 32% in Q1 2023. EVs now account for 7% of the used American automotive market, up from 3.1% in 2021.

 

Over 225,000 used EVs exchanged hands in the US last quarter, a new record. According to the most recent data, the average price of a used EV was $43,400.

So EVs are almost as large a percentage of the US used market as they are in the new market.

Well, that is clearly hyperbole, with 93% of the used market still fossil fuel cars, according to this report.

And 100% of the rail, airplane, trucking, shipping industries fossil fuel.

Transportation is still close to completely fossil fuel.

And with the Climate Panic receding, this trend will continue.

Edited June 21, 2023 by Ecocharger

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

1 minute ago, Ecocharger said:

Well, that is clearly hyperbole, with 93% of the used market still fossil fuel cars, according to this report.

And 100% of the rail, airplane, trucking, shipping fossil fuel.

Transportation is still close to completely fossil fuel.

EV share of the used market more than doubled in two years. That is Moore's Law exponential growth and it will double again over the next two years and the two years after that...  EVs will be 50% of the used market in 6 or 7 years.