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Investment in renewables tanking

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5 hours ago, Ron Wagner said:

No blackouts but unaffordable prices for many! Modern coal plants are not as depicted. Of course you know that. They give off puffy white clouds of steam etc. The residue left over is more of a problem possibly. 

unaffordable prices for many......????? caused by outrageous prices for Nat gas ......

 

Of course you know this...

 

yep your great Nat Gas caused prices in the US for electricity to nearly double last year...........

cost of wind and sun last year???? same price as usual .....free....

renewables kept the average price down

Of course you know this...

 

Modern coal plants burn coal ....they have a typical solid waste  (flyash that is toxic) output of 20 percent of the coals original weight that needs to be disposed of . Have you ever worked on a Haz waste cleanup...???? I bet no...and that you have no idea how much flyash piles litter the US

 

How will these sites get cleaned up??? higher electricity rates thanks to the Coal idiots

Nov 3, 2022  New Report: Most Power Plants Violating Federal Rules Mandating Cleanup of Toxic Coal Ash Dumps. November 3, 2022.
 
 
Nov 20, 2022  The Coal Ash Rule requires the cleanup of both the source of pollution (coal ash) and the groundwater. However, the report authors found ...
 
May 17, 2023  The proposal requires safe management of coal ash that was dumped in currently unregulated areas, including inactive power plants with surface ...
 
now some of the other coal related problems

Waste heat from burning coal......massive amounts...burning coal to create electricity....30 percent efficiency.......

Underground coal mines.........never backfilled ...just allowed to cave in and this screws up everything above the mine......

Strip mines......never put back to anything close to pre existing

 

your little puffy white clouds of steam.......that is all you can think of???

Pathetic.... 

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7 hours ago, Ron Wagner said:

You are avoiding the fact that Great Britain and Europe have not developed THEIR natural gas, biogas, ethanol, or anything other than wind turbines. That left both Britain and Europe dependent on Russian Gas. Putin saw his opportunity to raise his prices drastically, and simultaneously invade Ukraine for the second time in recent history. 

The electrical costs have raised drastically along with dependence on wind turbines, rather than go down because of them. That should work out well over time, but it has not proven itself cost effective apparently. A mixture of all potential energy sources is just common sense, as is developing your own natural resources and biomass including waste products. 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/u-k-energy-bills-set-to-jump-as-country-awaits-new-leader-11661532660

U.K. Energy Bills Set to Jump as Country Awaits New Leader

Energy regulator announces an 80% rise in energy prices, prompting promises of government help for consumers

By 

Paul Hannon
Follow
 

Aug. 26, 2022 12:51 pm ET

 
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(4 min)

 
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Rising gas prices in Europe are expected to push U.K. inflation higher; a decommissioned natural-gas storage facility in London. PHOTO: NEIL HALL/SHUTTERSTOCK

U.K. households will see the prices they pay for energy rise by 80% in October, a new blow to spending power that is likely to push the world’s fifth-largest economy into contraction in the final months of the year.

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Ron again NO just NO!

The UK has developed their NG and roughly 50% of the UK's NG comes from domestic production. the vast majority of the balance comes from Norway. In fact its so developed that unless there are new discoveries our NG will literally be all gone by 2030!

https://www.theecoexperts.co.uk/blog/uk-gas-sources

Your post is from August last year when NG prices were ridiculously high and why the UK and the rest of Europe had massive bills. Fortunately now NG is low the cost of NG to the average houshold is falling dramatically.

Your presumption that its because we havent developed the NG fields is about as wrong as you could get.

The Dutch are in a similar position with their Groningen gas field as its causing very large earthquakes so the government there has had to cease production due to safety concerns.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groningen_gas_field

Edited by Rob Plant
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On 6/19/2023 at 10:30 PM, notsonice said:

Oh Mr. Magoo......what is your IQ these days ....mid 80's????? and I am being nice....

Clean Coal????? does not exist......

Love that all you have to post is a computer generated rendering of something that does not exist...Like a Unicorn

Do you believe in Unicorns???????

again when you start babbling about clean coal you are truly just babbling BS

 

I was laughing at your pals posting the Bill Gates is a trader.....

does your pal know how to spell???? rhetorical question...you do not need to answer it

why do you not give him a lesson in spelling...He sure could use one....or are you too busy posting garbage on clean coal.......

PS I do not see any photos on your post of the ash piles generated or all of the waste products generated by the so called  clean coal process or the affects of mining that Unicorn clean coal...... good luck....as you would know if you ever worked at a coal mine or at a coal fired power plant there is no such thing as clean coal.....Only thing left after mining and burning  coal is coal mine remediations and ash pile remeditations....lots of toxic waste and toxic water and toxic air...

 

so much easier to not burn coal these days

Renewables with storage .........are the answer

Does Air Pollution Cause Atopic Dermatitis?

 

It would appear the triggered phenomenon is still quite prevalent in some sectors of society. You really need to get a handle on such behavioral aborations...it is quite unhealthy that leads to unintended consequence.

A good example would be a small group of emotional unbalanced activists have somehow persuaded the EU down the Green Path of ruin. Germany once a capital rich country is being reportedly near bankruptcy. All of Europe is in a energy crisis mode...once the darling of Green Energy is now a shameful failure.

https://www.dw.com/en/germany-fears-a-wave-of-insolvencies/a-63059812

Germany fears wave of insolvencies

 

Prices for gas and electricity are exploding, driving companies into bankruptcy. As recession looms large, Economy Minister Robert Habeck has announced protection measures for German companies.

 
 
 

China has been impacted deeply by such events. I do believe by now they build more coal fired generators than all the world combined. Frankly there coal fired power generation is stunning..

https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/chinas-new-coal-plants-set-become-costly-second-fiddle-renewables-2023-03-22/

The construction of 106 gigawatts of coal-fired power was approved last year - four times more than in 2021 and the highest amount since 2015, according to research published last month by the Centre for Research on Energy and Clean Air (CREA) and Global Energy Monitor (GEM).

That's equivalent to about a hundred large coal-fired plants and enough to supply the whole of Britain. At least 50 GW of that capacity began construction in 2022, the report said

https://www.statista.com/statistics/859266/number-of-coal-power-plants-by-country/

 

Screenshot_20230623-165807.jpg

Edited by Eyes Wide Open

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1 hour ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

It would appear the triggered phenomenon is still quite prevalent in some sectors of society. You really need to get a handle on such behavioral aborations...it is quite unhealthy that leads to unintended consequence.

A good example would be a small group of emotional unbalanced activists have somehow persuaded the EU down the Green Path of ruin. Germany once a capital rich country is being reportedly near bankruptcy. All of Europe is in a energy crisis mode...once the darling of Green Energy is now a shameful failure.

https://www.dw.com/en/germany-fears-a-wave-of-insolvencies/a-63059812

Germany fears wave of insolvencies

 

Prices for gas and electricity are exploding, driving companies into bankruptcy. As recession looms large, Economy Minister Robert Habeck has announced protection measures for German companies.

 
 
 

China has been impacted deeply by such events. I do believe by now they build more coal fired generators than all the world combined. Frankly there coal fired power generation is stunning..

https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/chinas-new-coal-plants-set-become-costly-second-fiddle-renewables-2023-03-22/

The construction of 106 gigawatts of coal-fired power was approved last year - four times more than in 2021 and the highest amount since 2015, according to research published last month by the Centre for Research on Energy and Clean Air (CREA) and Global Energy Monitor (GEM).

That's equivalent to about a hundred large coal-fired plants and enough to supply the whole of Britain. At least 50 GW of that capacity began construction in 2022, the report said

https://www.statista.com/statistics/859266/number-of-coal-power-plants-by-country/

 

Screenshot_20230623-165807.jpg

Chinese demographics are collapsing and companies are moving out. Their economy is about to collapse. The current generation is over 40% smaller than their parents. Their coal and electricity needs will be decreasing soon. 

China’s 2022 total fertility rate is estimated to be 1.18 children per woman – down substantially from earlier decades and significantly below the “replacement rate” of 2.1 children per woman. 

China population pyramid as projected of 8th National Census day on November 1, 2030, in scenario of constant TFR at 2021 level and continued improvements in mortality 

 

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Ford Gets $9.2B Loan From US Government To Build 3 EV Battery Factories (msn.com)

"All three sites are expected to go online in 2025 when they will have a combined capacity of 129 gigawatt-hours annually which will go toward Ford’s plan of assembling around two million EVs per year by 2026 – a massive ramp-up compared to the roughly 132,000 units it made last year."

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11 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Chinese demographics are collapsing and companies are moving out. Their economy is about to collapse. The current generation is over 40% smaller than their parents. Their coal and electricity needs will be decreasing soon. 

China’s 2022 total fertility rate is estimated to be 1.18 children per woman – down substantially from earlier decades and significantly below the “replacement rate” of 2.1 children per woman. 

China population pyramid as projected of 8th National Census day on November 1, 2030, in scenario of constant TFR at 2021 level and continued improvements in mortality 

 

 

7qfyza.jpg

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7 hours ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

 

7qfyza.jpg

Their birth rate is in freefall. They will be below 1 billion in 50 years. Their economy is headed down for the count. So the demand for electricity and thus coal drops dramatically.  That is how reality works.

image.png.dbf684b838bcc31860c4539a05f23597.png

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On 6/22/2023 at 8:01 PM, Ron Wagner said:

You are avoiding the fact that Great Britain and Europe have not developed THEIR natural gas, biogas, ethanol, or anything other than wind turbines. That left both Britain and Europe dependent on Russian Gas. Putin saw his opportunity to raise his prices drastically, and simultaneously invade Ukraine for the second time in recent history. 

The electrical costs have raised drastically along with dependence on wind turbines, rather than go down because of them. That should work out well over time, but it has not proven itself cost effective apparently. A mixture of all potential energy sources is just common sense, as is developing your own natural resources and biomass including waste products. 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/u-k-energy-bills-set-to-jump-as-country-awaits-new-leader-11661532660

U.K. Energy Bills Set to Jump as Country Awaits New Leader

Energy regulator announces an 80% rise in energy prices, prompting promises of government help for consumers

By 

Paul Hannon
Follow
 

Aug. 26, 2022 12:51 pm ET

 
Save
 

Listen

(4 min)

 
image

Rising gas prices in Europe are expected to push U.K. inflation higher; a decommissioned natural-gas storage facility in London. PHOTO: NEIL HALL/SHUTTERSTOCK

U.K. households will see the prices they pay for energy rise by 80% in October, a new blow to spending power that is likely to push the world’s fifth-largest economy into contraction in the final months of the year.

Copyright ©2023 Dow Jones & Company, Inc. All Rights Reserved. 87990cbe856818d5eddac44c7b1cdeb8

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No argument denying the article's premise though. 

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On 6/23/2023 at 2:47 AM, Rob Plant said:

Ron again NO just NO!

The UK has developed their NG and roughly 50% of the UK's NG comes from domestic production. the vast majority of the balance comes from Norway. In fact its so developed that unless there are new discoveries our NG will literally be all gone by 2030!

https://www.theecoexperts.co.uk/blog/uk-gas-sources

Your post is from August last year when NG prices were ridiculously high and why the UK and the rest of Europe had massive bills. Fortunately now NG is low the cost of NG to the average houshold is falling dramatically.

Your presumption that its because we havent developed the NG fields is about as wrong as you could get.

The Dutch are in a similar position with their Groningen gas field as its causing very large earthquakes so the government there has had to cease production due to safety concerns.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groningen_gas_field

The "earthquakes" mentioned were very minor and the overreaction was a mistake. A 3.6 temblor on the Richter Scale is about like having a big truck drive by your house. Even minor damage is unlikely at that level. 

Using the Richter Scale to Measure Earthquakes - Geology In

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On 6/23/2023 at 2:12 AM, notsonice said:

unaffordable prices for many......????? caused by outrageous prices for Nat gas ......

 

Of course you know this...

 

yep your great Nat Gas caused prices in the US for electricity to nearly double last year...........

cost of wind and sun last year???? same price as usual .....free....

renewables kept the average price down

Of course you know this...

 

Modern coal plants burn coal ....they have a typical solid waste  (flyash that is toxic) output of 20 percent of the coals original weight that needs to be disposed of . Have you ever worked on a Haz waste cleanup...???? I bet no...and that you have no idea how much flyash piles litter the US

 

How will these sites get cleaned up??? higher electricity rates thanks to the Coal idiots

Nov 3, 2022  New Report: Most Power Plants Violating Federal Rules Mandating Cleanup of Toxic Coal Ash Dumps. November 3, 2022.
 
 
Nov 20, 2022  The Coal Ash Rule requires the cleanup of both the source of pollution (coal ash) and the groundwater. However, the report authors found ...
 
May 17, 2023  The proposal requires safe management of coal ash that was dumped in currently unregulated areas, including inactive power plants with surface ...
 
now some of the other coal related problems

Waste heat from burning coal......massive amounts...burning coal to create electricity....30 percent efficiency.......

Underground coal mines.........never backfilled ...just allowed to cave in and this screws up everything above the mine......

Strip mines......never put back to anything close to pre existing

 

your little puffy white clouds of steam.......that is all you can think of???

Pathetic.... 

You are again misrepresenting my statements. I specifically said that the ash can be a problem. That is if it is not safely contained. It can be made into cinder blocks etc. It is true that it is a major problem due to mishandling. I have always promoted natural gas over coal and you should know that. Coal is primarily a problem in China, India, and all third world countries. There is a very modern plant in Springfield, Illinois the state capital. We have plenty of natural gas in the ground that is undeveloped. 

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(edited)

51 minutes ago, Ron Wagner said:

No argument denying the article's premise though. 

Your article is nearly a year old.

Here is what has happened to the price of natural gas in UK since then:

image.png.e14329e8c705f17e5d3e0e0a91bd7a45.png

If you didn't have out of date and wrong information you wouldn't have any information at all. 

image.thumb.png.d97813bc222748a488a1dacb355b2df4.png

Edited by Jay McKinsey
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9 hours ago, Rob Plant said:

China Is Quietly Building A Green Energy Empire In Latin America

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/China-Is-Quietly-Building-A-Green-Energy-Empire-In-Latin-America.html

So China spend $546b on reneweable energy in 2022, can we really agree with Mark on the title of his thread? Or shall we dismiss it for the garbage that it is?

I must ask...why does China have more coal fired infrastructure than the entire western civilization? Asking for a Friend of course.

Screenshot_20230623-165807.jpg

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2 hours ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

I must ask...why does China have more coal fired infrastructure than the entire western civilization? Asking for a Friend of course.

Screenshot_20230623-165807.jpg

China does not have much nat gas........

China is playing catch up in renewables

China has over 1.4  billion people (4 times as many as the US)  notice they have 4 times the coal plants as the US......

Mr Magoo get new glasses

 

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25 minutes ago, notsonice said:

China does not have much nat gas........

China is playing catch up in renewables

China has over 1.4  billion people (4 times as many as the US)  notice they have 4 times the coal plants as the US......

Mr Magoo get new glasses

 

Indeed Mr. Notsobright....indeed.

China is building six times more new coal plants than other countries, report finds

March 2, 20236:00 AM ET

 

https://www.npr.org/2023/03/02/1160441919/china-is-building-six-times-more-new-coal-plants-than-other-countries-report-fin

China permitted more coal power plants last year than any time in the last seven years, according to a new report released this week. It's the equivalent of about two new coal power plants per week. The report by energy data organizations Global Energy Monitor and the Centre for Research on Energy and Clean Air finds the country quadrupled the amount of new coal power approvals in 2022 compared to 2021.

That's despite the fact that much of the world is getting off coal, says Flora Champenois, coal research analyst at Global Energy Monitor and one of the co-authors of the report.

"Everybody else is moving away from coal and China seems to be stepping on the gas," she says. "We saw that China has six times as much plants starting construction as the rest of the world combined."

Edited by Eyes Wide Open

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2 minutes ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

backup for renewables.....

utilization of coal fired power in China is at an all time low of 46 percent and decreasing over time

enjoy the fact that coal is playing second fiddle to renewables

 

Enjoy the Green Agenda.....ha ha ha ha

Edited by notsonice

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(edited)

51 minutes ago, notsonice said:

utilization of coal fired power in China is at an all time low of 46 percent and decreasing over time

Ya Don't Say....here we go again...Might you have some Proof of this statement?

 

 

Edited by Eyes Wide Open

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(edited)

1 hour ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

Ya Don't Say....here we go again...Might you have some Proof of this statement?

 

 

This?

https://ourworldindata.org/energy/country/china

To be more realistic, they may be retiring smaller, old, inefficient "units", and building large, higher efficiency "units" to replace them.

Does a "Unit" count as a plant?

OR...does a multi-unit "site" count as a plant?

 

Clipboard1.jpg

 

Edited by turbguy

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(edited)

How's about this..

 

https://energyandcleanair.org/record-rise-in-chinas-coal-production-and-imports/

What is causing the record rise in both China’s coal production and imports?

A new perplexing trend has emerged this year in China’s coal market. The country’s coal imports reached a new record for March and April this year. This seems paradoxical because domestic coal supply has increased sharply recently. This article uses data to identify the drivers of the increase in imports, and the implications for China’s energy security policies.

In the first four months of the year, China’s coal imports increased no less than 89% year-on-year. The increase continued in April with a 73% increase year-on-year. This seems paradoxical because domestic coal supply has increased sharply recently, growing 10.5% in 2022 and 5.5% in the first quarter of 2023. At the same time, total coal consumption increased by 4.3% in 2022 and 3.6% in the first quarter of 2023. Thermal power generation, the main user of imported coal, increased 1.4% year-on-year in 2022 and 1.7% in the first quarter of 2023.

And graphics included! Now that's proof is it not? LMAO 

 

image-24-768x557.png

Edited by Eyes Wide Open

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Investment in renewables tanking????
 

who post this garbage????

2023 and investments in renewables is at an all time high...A trillion dollars WOW

Coal..........good bye...........

2014 coal peaked ....2022 a bust 

2023 the slow ones are waiting for a dead cat bounce

 

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2 hours ago, notsonice said:

Investment in renewables tanking????
 

who post this garbage????

2023 and investments in renewables is at an all time high...A trillion dollars WOW

Coal..........good bye...........

2014 coal peaked ....2022 a bust 

2023 the slow ones are waiting for a dead cat bounce

 

 

01d4f66cc47c087293a51789a5209c5e1c9735295639da1a81844a0e465879e0.gif

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(edited)

another 

 

VikreNEWSing Link installs final cable section

Construction work on 765km interconnector between Denmark and England will complete in late 2023

 

e last element of the submarine cable belonging to the 1400MW Viking Link interconnector, between Denmark and the UK, has now been installed on the seabed in the North Sea.
 

 

The construction work on the 765km Viking Link, the world's longest direct current submarine cable, between Denmark and England is nearing completion, which is scheduled for the end of 2023.

 

The project represents a Dkr13bn investment and constitutes an important part of Denmark's efforts to ensure long-term security of supply of green energy.

Together with its English partner National Grid, Energinet has spent 10 years planning and building an electricity connection between the two countries.

 

The work of laying and connecting the cable in the North Sea has been carried out throughout the project by the Italian cable manufacturer Prysmian.

 

The last section of the submarine wire was installed 172km off the Danish coast in German and Dutch waters and took several days to complete.

 

It involved a cable laying process, where a section of the link is taken up from the seabed and connected to a new section – wire by wire – before the complete piece is reinstalled on the seabed by flushing it under the sand so it lies at a depth where it is safely protected.

 

Senior project manager for the cable project at Viking Link, Daniel Johan Brøndum, said: "The cable installation at sea is a highly specialized and technically difficult process to carry out, and there have therefore been many skills and many people involved in such a task.

 

“Both the concrete task of installing the last connecting section of the cable, but also in the overall project.

 

“Over a period of three years, we have installed and connected more than 615km of submarine cable – sometimes the waves have been high and we have been under time pressure from the beginning.

 

“I am therefore immensely proud of the work we have done as a team and that we have been all hands on deck – so to speak – over a long period of time."

 

The cable is now fully established from Revsing ved Vejen, through the Jutland soil, across the seabed, and all the way to Bicker Fen in northern England.

 

The chief executive of electricity transmission at Energinet, Henrik Riis, said: “The completion of the cable laying at Viking Link is a fantastic moment for both the UK and Denmark.

 

“After years of planning and construction, we are fully connected – from one grid to another – and one step closer to sharing green energy with each other for the first time.

 

"When Viking Link is ready to go into operation at the turn of the year, the link will contribute to ensuring security of supply in both countries, as well as in the rest of Europe.”

Edited by notsonice

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invew

investments picking up...the death of coal one turbine at a time

 

reNEWS

Gross additions in the first half of 2023 are already 65% of the additions for 2022 as a whole

 18 July 2023

Germany installs 1.5GW onshore wind in H1

Gross additions in the first half of 2023 are already 65% of the additions for 2022 as a whole

 

 

In the first half of 2023, 331 onshore wind turbines with a cumulative capacity of 1565MW were installed in Germany.

 

Deutsche WindGuard on behalf of BWE and VDMA Power Systems has gathered the data.

 

Gross additions in the first half of 2023 are already 65% of the additions for 2022 as a whole.

Despite the existing challenges, the upper range of the association forecast of 2.7GW to 3.2GW is expected to be achieved.

 

The associations are positive about the measures taken by the federal government to date and the current dynamics in terms of expansion and approvals but stated they are “still far from sufficient” to meet the expansion path of 10GW per year from 2025.

 

Bärbel Heidebroek, President of the German Wind Energy Association BWE, said: "The current expansion is mainly based on the permits of previous years. Schleswig-Holstein, Lower Saxony and North Rhine-Westphalia lead the expansion ranking at a subdued level and benefit from the weakness of other federal states in terms of expansion.

 

“In southern Germany in particular, expansion continues to falter, but there is also considerable room for improvement in the leading countries.

 

“The sharp increase in permits is based on North Rhine-Westphalia, Schleswig-Holstein, Lower Saxony and, to a lesser extent, Brandenburg.

 

“These are too few countries! Significantly more speed is now needed in all countries.

 

“In order to achieve the targeted annual expansion of 10GW, at least 12GW must be newly approved.”

 

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(edited)

14 hours ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

I must ask...why does China have more coal fired infrastructure than the entire western civilization? Asking for a Friend of course.

Screenshot_20230623-165807.jpg

Your friend seems incredibly clueless!

China have had more coal plants than anywhere else for decades.Their transition to renewables is happening faster than even they predicted!

China on course to hit wind and solar power target five years ahead of time

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/jun/29/china-wind-solar-power-global-renewable-energy-leader

1200GW of solar and wind by 2025!!! Wow thats doubing where they are at currently in 2 years. Just think EWO thats 1200GW of NON coal fired powergen. Do you think they are building all that because coal is the future?

Edited by Rob Plant
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