CHINA Economy Disaster - Employee Shortages, Retirement Age, Birth Rate & Ageing Population

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,135]

If you wish to derail into immigration,...

#1 Immigration should be free to those applying, not well over $3000/person even if not accepted, this is disgusting.  (immigrants work harder than those already ensconced in their mcmansions)

#2 A Certain religion of immigrants should drop them instantly from being accepted as they openly admit their religion wishes to overthrow ALL existing governments and enact Sharia law. 

#3 Immigration must be balanced between male/female or close enough.  80% male... uh no. 

#4 Those who graduate from college on a school visa should have ~1yr post graduation to find a job(above poverty line) and become a citizen, not the couple of weeks it currently is.  Beyond dumb. 

#5 Hire a few thousand more application fed employees to get rid of the backlog so applicants know with less than 3 months at most.  Waiting YEARS is beyond absurd.  It is the waiting that allows people to cowardly and disgustingly take advantage of them.  it is despicable forcing people to sit on pins and needles for years wondering if their life will upheaved again. 

#6 Have companies able to post freely, job offerings at the border patrol offices when applying for citizenship. 

#7 Those here on travel visas should get 6 months, not 90 days. 

#8 Green card Visas, cost should be free if the taxes paid while working exceed the cost of the Visa. 

The rest you can wrangle about regarding total number, but otherwise...

[TailingsPond + 476]

53 minutes ago, footeab@yahoo.com said:

If you wish to derail into immigration,...

#2 A Certain religion of immigrants should drop them instantly from being accepted as they openly admit their religion wishes to overthrow ALL existing governments and enact Sharia law. 

#3 Immigration must be balanced between male/female or close enough.  80% male... uh no.

Many of the first colonists came to the "new world" seeking religious freedom.

First Amendment

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Your #3 sounds like it comes from incel loser. 

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,135]

17 minutes ago, TailingsPond said:

Many of the first colonists came to the "new world" seeking religious freedom.

First Amendment

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Your #3 sounds like it comes from incel loser. 

Well, Spain, Portugal, S. Sudan, Ethiopia, and a host of other nation states found out the hard way that Utopia regarding establishment of religion prohibition is an ideal, but not reality.  Senegal, Nigeria, Chad, Kenya etc are all finding out the VERY hard way right now. 

Not all religions are equal nor their cultures. 

#3 So, you do not have children; Good to know.  I do.  They need husbands wives and last I checked, they are still born 50% each.

[Ron Wagner + 649]

On 11/26/2023 at 10:27 PM, Meredith Poor said:

Third:

China from the 1980's to the 2000's had kind of a free-for-all entrepreneurial spirit and people could exploit opportunities. Foreigners could come in, fund businesses, work out contracts, and engage Chinese businesses with massive orders, such as iPhones, appliances, apparel, and so forth. There were, in many cases, quality issues, including some that were deadly, but China was 'outward facing' and functioned reasonably competently in global markets.

The CCP has gotten progressively more draconian since Xi Jinping has taken over. There are a multitude of errors in various dimensions, too numerous to list. The basic issue, however, is that the CPP, and in particular the party leaders, have focused more and more power on themselves. The more power they grab for themselves, the less is available to those in the other ranks of society. For a 20-something with a university degree, 'what is allowed' now is a fraction of what they would have been able to do largely unobstructed in the 1990's. Everywhere someone turns, they are tripped up either with rules, party apparatchiks, or problems with debt or foreign investment. Foreigners are being run off. Trading partners are being either frustrated or threatened. Resources are being focused more on the military and on 'social order' (policing) with pervasive surveillance. 'Suddenly' China has decided they want to 'play nice' with the US, as Chinese capital leaks out through every available orifice. There is, perhaps, a belief that the US can 'save' those in power in China. While Xi is being nice to Biden and others in the G20, his ships are still terrorizing the Philippines and other 'nobodies'.

The West is collectively looking at the behavior of China toward those that are the 'weakest', in particular the most indebted, such as Sri Lanka, Pakistan, and so forth. The assumption for many is that whatever happens to these is how China would treat 'everyone else' if they could afford to. Business relationships with China are not likely to improve until the overall foreign relations philosophy changes course. Similarly, 'hostage diplomacy' means that foreigners are going to be locked up when China is mad at some country (Canada, for example). No one is going to set foot in the country under such circumstances.

The lifeblood of China is likely to continue draining away as long as this culture remains pervasive.

That is why they are fleeing to the West and wherever else. Russians are also. We  fear immigrants but the educated ones are of great value, but also competitors for existing citizens. Time sorts out the races. Cities used to have distinct neighborhoods and they gradually moved to the suburbs leaving the inner cities to the poorest. Now some of the inner cities are being rebuilt for new urbanites and there are complaints from the underclass of rising rents and housing prices.

Edited December 5, 2023 by Ron Wagner

[LaneLong 0]

It's a complex puzzle, isn't it?Speaking of navigating complexities, it brings to mind how crucial it is for individuals to adapt to changing scenarios. Amidst all these economic shifts, one thing that stands out is that you should Hone Your Soft Skills. Whether in the workforce or facing societal changes, being adept at communication, collaboration, and adaptability is like having a superpower.In the face of employee shortages and an aging population, having strong soft skills becomes a game-changer. It not only helps bridge generational gaps but also fosters a more inclusive and productive environment. So, here's a thought: while we ponder global economic shifts, why not also invest in personal growth?

Edited December 28, 2023 by LaneLong

[TailingsPond + 476]

On 11/30/2023 at 1:41 AM, footeab@yahoo.com said:

#3 So, you do not have children; Good to know.  I do.  They need husbands wives and last I checked, they are still born 50% each.

Haha!

First off if your children are well-raised they will have no problem finding spouses.  If they are losers no amount of the opposite sex will fix that. 

"If you need stacked population dynamics to get your children laid, you might be raising a incel loser."

~Jeff Foxworthy 

You should also check again, children are not born 50% each.  More males are conceived and born but they die younger so by old age there are more women than men. Your 50% idea is total fantasy!

[frankfurter + 562]

1/ Per emails from moderators, topics for discussion MUST relate to oil and energy SPECIFICALLY. Perhaps somebody could explain why Wagner's post is allowed? 

2/ Wagner's fixation upon China is indicative of underlying personal issues. At at time when the USA debt is expanding by $2 trillion annually, inflation is rising, poverty increasing, military conflicts increasing, and very much more, one would think Wagner and his ilk would be more concerned with issues in his backyard. 

3/ To say China is collapsing is to be deranged. China's economy grows annually, its technology advances monthly, its currency is used increasingly in trade, and very much more. All countries have social challenges, so why is China so unusual?

4/ The county about to collapse is the USA, for many reasons. Americans delude themselves into thinking theirs is the best and exceptional country. This despite increasing poverty, now at 18% of the entire population. China's rate is so low, it is no longer tracked by the likes of UN, world bank, etc. USA homelessness is 1.5%. China does have 'homeless' people, but in the context of traditional tribes would prefer to have tents or self-made structures. These people live in very remote areas and are at most 0.15% of the total population. 

So, Wagner, please spare us from your vile propaganda and stick to the topics of oil and energy specifically.  Thank you.

 

[notsonice + 1,080]

1 hour ago, frankfurter said:

1/ Per emails from moderators, topics for discussion MUST relate to oil and energy SPECIFICALLY. Perhaps somebody could explain why Wagner's post is allowed? 

2/ Wagner's fixation upon China is indicative of underlying personal issues. At at time when the USA debt is expanding by $2 trillion annually, inflation is rising, poverty increasing, military conflicts increasing, and very much more, one would think Wagner and his ilk would be more concerned with issues in his backyard. 

3/ To say China is collapsing is to be deranged. China's economy grows annually, its technology advances monthly, its currency is used increasingly in trade, and very much more. All countries have social challenges, so why is China so unusual?

4/ The county about to collapse is the USA, for many reasons. Americans delude themselves into thinking theirs is the best and exceptional country. This despite increasing poverty, now at 18% of the entire population. China's rate is so low, it is no longer tracked by the likes of UN, world bank, etc. USA homelessness is 1.5%. China does have 'homeless' people, but in the context of traditional tribes would prefer to have tents or self-made structures. These people live in very remote areas and are at most 0.15% of the total population. 

So, Wagner, please spare us from your vile propaganda and stick to the topics of oil and energy specifically.  Thank you.

 

China is one of the main importers and users of oil...Chinas economic woes greatly affect the Oil markets......

please spare us your personal attacks 

Your support for China is noted.......we also see that you supported the Putin regime over and over again.......

Love those US supplied arms.......

Love the sanctions and ban on Oil exports out of Russia.....

We enjoy watching your beloved Russias oil business falling apart....

and your vile propaganda...goes right along with your support for a vile evil evil man ...Putin ...may he rot in hell for targeting civilians in Ukraine

War crimes.......

[Rob Plant + 2,635]

China's Plunge Protection Team Mulls Trillion Yuan Bailout

China's Plunge Protection Team Mulls Trillion Yuan Bailout | OilPrice.com

[Rob Plant + 2,635]

China’s Monetary Policy: A Tightrope Walk by the PBoC

China’s Monetary Policy: A Tightrope Walk by the PBoC | OilPrice.com

[specinho + 440]

On 11/27/2023 at 12:33 PM, Meredith Poor said:

Keeping in mind that the US fertility rate is 'below replacement' and has been since 1972, and that in the tech sector in particular there are still severe labor shortages, this is not much of a concern. The US needs 'all hands on deck'. US unemployment is, at present, near record lows. The US is having to build factories for work repatriated from overseas (particularly including China), rebuild a lot of its armaments and munitions, build out renewables infrastructure, and so forth. The present political hostility to immigration has reduced the flow of both legal and 'undocumented' workers, leaving to severe shortages in food service, agriculture, and the building trades.

There is something called " adaptation". Pioneers resorted to reduce labour intensive work by designing machines to

a) carry heavy stuff,

b) to harvest big area of fields,

c) to increase efficiency and productivity of many factories

Employment and unemployment have been in a tug of war due to uncontrolled mushrooming of redundant factories, shops,  but of lower quality control. 

 

On 11/29/2023 at 10:22 AM, Meredith Poor said:

Show me where I demanded anything. It does seem to me that any society that is not pretty close to 'replacement' is dysfunctional in some form. A fertility rate of 1.75 is 'close enough' to 2.1 to be long term sustainable. However, 1.3, 1.0, or .7 is so far below replacement that it suggests that people have given up on what have traditionally been family values in most cultures.

How do you get 1.75 or 0.7 baby? The closest proximity of whole number should always be used. 

Old families were labour intensive agricultural based. They needed many hands in the field. Hence, tendency to have big family, particularly male.

Modern society usually have dual income families. Busy lifestyle and high costs of living reduce the affordability to have a big family.

Number of children is not the key issue that has changed family value or culture but changing attitude, ethic in unhealthy competitive society. 

On 11/29/2023 at 12:14 PM, TailingsPond said:

Capitalism collapses without continuous growth.  If you cut the numbers of consumers in half industry would collapse.

Even your "worthless people" play a roll because they consume goods.

FYI you are a sociopath if you think of some people as "[worthless parasites.]"  

 

 

Capitalism collapse when there is not enough money...

People will continue to buy things, especially essential of good quality. Those that would be swept out are usually those products of low or no quality control or of low quality. A healthy turn over to keep wastage low and good things in the market is not always bad. 

On 11/29/2023 at 5:43 PM, Rob Plant said:

 

Discriminate over disabled? 

[TailingsPond + 476]

1 hour ago, specinho said:

Capitalism collapse when there is not enough money...

 

Sure, but you do not understand how money is created in a fractional reserve banking system. 

Money is made from debt, debt carries interest, also inflation devalues money over time.  New money has to be continuously made or everything collapses.

New money is made when a person takes out a loan from a bank and purchases a good.  The seller of the good then deposits that payment in a bank and new money is created.  Without continuous consumption the system quickly collapses. 

Take for example common inflation reduction techniques, if you raise lending rates fewer people purchase goods.  Fewer transactions means less money is created which helps increase the value of the $.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional-reserve_banking

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Money_creation

"However, the majority of the money supply used by the public for conducting transactions is created by the commercial banking system in the form of bank deposits. Bank loans issued by commercial banks expands the quantity of bank deposits."

 

Edited January 26 by TailingsPond

[TailingsPond + 476]

1 hour ago, specinho said:

How do you get 1.75 or 0.7 baby? The closest proximity of whole number should always be used. 

 

You do not understand how averages work. You never get a fraction of a baby in a single data point but the average can certainly be a decimal.

There are other stats you may prefer like median or mode.

[Rob Plant + 2,635]

5 hours ago, specinho said:

Discriminate over disabled? 

eh? what are you talking about?

[specinho + 440]

21 hours ago, TailingsPond said:

Sure, but you do not understand how money is created in a fractional reserve banking system. 

Money is made from debt, debt carries interest, also inflation devalues money over time.  New money has to be continuously made or everything collapses.

New money is made when a person takes out a loan from a bank and purchases a good.  The seller of the good then deposits that payment in a bank and new money is created.  Without continuous consumption the system quickly collapses. 

Take for example common inflation reduction techniques, if you raise lending rates fewer people purchase goods.  Fewer transactions means less money is created which helps increase the value of the $.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional-reserve_banking

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Money_creation

"However, the majority of the money supply used by the public for conducting transactions is created by the commercial banking system in the form of bank deposits. Bank loans issued by commercial banks expands the quantity of bank deposits."

 

Modern banking and accounting system taught by IMF and other financial institutions are highly flawed.

In a course offered by IMF, people were taught

a) cash deposited by the public is a liability,

b) loans are assets and

c) banks lend out as much as 90% of total capital to increase value of assets via loans. 

Do these sound right to you? 

For me, it is most probably mistakes induced by laziness and weak mastery of basic concept.  

Let's put the scenario in simpler laymen form:

1. I give you $1000.

You have cash in your hands to spend.

Is it an asset to you or liability? 

Asset, yes? The money is yours to spend.

But, you owe me $1000. Am i your asset or liability?

Liability. You need to pay back at some points of time.

Therefore:

a) cash is asset to a bank

b) creditor ( someone who lends out money or puts in deposit) is a liability.

Contra account is balanced. 

I presume, owing to too many names and customers involved, some smart personnel innovate it to ommit creditors, cut corner to have cash as liability.

Now you do not have counter balance account for cross checking. Mistakes bound to happen. Accountants and financial manager will need to create financial statements  adjusting the discrepancy, based on respective creativity... 'o' '-'

Great. Right? 

 

2. I borrow $1000 from you.

As a banker, you give away $1000. You are $1000 short in deposit or money of others. You are in debt.

In debt or owing public money, is an asset or liability to you?

Liability, yes?

But being owed money by me, i'm your asset.

Therefore:

a) loan = liability

b) debtor = asset

Let's presume, those smart ashh are taught since debtor is an asset, the more the merrier, right?

Ok.... They simply give out loans to increase the number of debtors aka asset...without stringent inspection if they have the ability to pay back... 'o' +~+ 

Until a point, 90% of capital and cash are lend out. Wonderful, right? All assets are money give away in someone else' pockets. 

When you do not have anyone paying back, cash flow truncated, banks collapsed. 

Edited January 27 by specinho

[notsonice + 1,080]

42 minutes ago, specinho said:

Modern banking and accounting system taught by IMF and other financial institutions are highly flawed.

In a course offered by IMF, people were taught

a) cash deposited by the public is a liability,

b) loans are assets and

c) banks lend out as much as 90% of total capital to increase value of assets via loans. 

Do these sound right to you? 

For me, it is most probably mistakes induced by laziness and weak mastery of basic concept.  

Let's put the scenario in simpler laymen form:

1. I give you $1000.

You have cash in your hands to spend.

Is it an asset to you or liability? 

Asset, yes? The money is yours to spend.

But, you owe me $1000. Am i your asset or liability?

Liability. You need to pay back at some points of time.

Therefore:

a) cash is asset to a bank

b) creditor ( someone who lends out money or puts in deposit) is a liability.

Contra account is balanced. 

I presume, owing to too many names and customers involved, some smart personnel innovate it to ommit creditors, cut corner to have cash as liability.

Now you do not have counter balance account for cross checking. Mistakes bound to happen. Accountants and financial manager will need to create financial statements  adjusting the discrepancy, based on respective creativity... 'o' '-'

Great. Right? 

 

2. I borrow $1000 from you.

As a banker, you give away $1000. You are $1000 short in deposit or money of others. You are in debt.

In debt or owing public money, is an asset or liability to you?

Liability, yes?

But being owed money by me, i'm your asset.

Therefore:

a) loan = liability

b) debtor = asset

Let's presume, those smart ashh are taught since debtor is an asset, the more the merrier, right?

Ok.... They simply give out loans to increase the number of debtors aka asset...without stringent inspection if they have the ability to pay back... 'o' +~+ 

Until a point, 90% of capital and cash are lend out. Wonderful, right? All assets are money give away in someone else' pockets. 

When you do not have anyone paying back, cash flow truncated, banks collapsed. 

Modern banking and accounting system taught by IMF and other financial institutions are highly flawed.????

yet it all works.........

you grow up poor.....

you go to school

you get a job

you want to buy a house

you do not have to pay in cash if you do not want to work for 20 years to save up the money

you ask for a loan on you background and you good name

you get the loan and you get your house

banks have reasonable interest rates

[specinho + 440]

21 hours ago, TailingsPond said:

Take for example common inflation reduction techniques, if you raise lending rates fewer people purchase goods.  Fewer transactions means less money is created which helps increase the value of the $.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional-reserve_banking

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Money_creation

"However, the majority of the money supply used by the public for conducting transactions is created by the commercial banking system in the form of bank deposits. Bank loans issued by commercial banks expands the quantity of bank deposits."

 

This statement is probably loop-sided... 

1. If interest rate is 2%,

Saving of $100,000 would give 2000 per year or ~ 160 per month.

Increase that to 4%, one gets $4000 per year or ~ $330 per month.

During inflation, higher interest rate would help more than 40 to 60% of people receiving additional money from interest, provided they have the basic $100,000 in their account. With more spare money, cash flow for markets selling daily essential will not be affected but flourished. 

To help the poor, grant the old and needy  veterans the basic $100,000 or more and they can live comfortably. 

 

2. On the other hand, if it is business loan, car loan, housing loan, etc,  not for purchasing of daily essential,

- the higher the interest rate, the more money one needs to pay back. 

- when they are ready to take loans, they would not care about interest rate but do it anyway.

- if fewer purchasing houses, cars, the slow down of these markets might not always be not good. For example, cooling down prevents overheated market selling overpriced things.

3. Was involved in real estate for awhile. It was a chaotic market condition messed up by some greedy and selfish agents or improper procedure and basic knowledge.

a) Someone would like to buy a million bungalow with cash ( upon conversion, it is still cheap in comparison).

But the senior agent insisted the customer to take loan. The housing price doubled at the end of payback period. I asked why doing this? He said the commission can not be received without loan.

Bullshitter of decade of experience.

b) stamp duty was mentioned in the briefing as $10. Since developer is involved, lawyer fees, documentation and such are exempted with company lawyers managing those for free.

Yet, during explanation to customers, these agents would include all those fees reaching $30k to $50k. Discounts of $5000 for early birds and such.

Therefore, modern ethic and working culture has degraded much. Entering Real estate for profit might no longer be worthy... 

[specinho + 440]

22 minutes ago, notsonice said:

Modern banking and accounting system taught by IMF and other financial institutions are highly flawed.????

yet it all works.........

you grow up poor.....

you go to school

you get a job

you want to buy a house

you do not have to pay in cash if you do not want to work for 20 years to save up the money

you ask for a loan on you background and you good name

you get the loan and you get your house

banks have reasonable interest rates

What are you trying to say? You should not work so hard because there is always loan available? In case you default, it's the bank who would be in trouble, not you? 

 

It is because of this mentality " living on borrow money" that the society is in so much problem.

The government is the worst example. The youth might have already be in debt before they earn a dime. 

There is a concept called " hire-purchase" . One pays rent as if it is installment. At the end of term, one can decide if one were to own it or not. 

 

[TailingsPond + 476]

7 minutes ago, specinho said:

This statement is probably loop-sided... 

1. If interest rate is 2%,

Saving of $100,000 would give 2000 per year or ~ 160 per month.

Increase that to 4%, one gets $4000 per year or ~ $330 per month.

 

Do not confuse lending rates with investment rates...

Do your math in reverse.

[specinho + 440]

On 1/27/2024 at 11:39 AM, TailingsPond said:

Do not confuse lending rates with investment rates...

Do your math in reverse

If not mistaken, they are not far from each other, if not the same.

For example:

Fixed deposit - with other investment plans e.g. mutual fund, shares, etc or without, interest rate is 4%.

Lending rate e.g. housing loan, car loan, 4% to 4.5%.

But there is a difference with credit card. Overdraft beyond payback date would have interest rate of more than 10% per month. The range might be 10 % - 20%, depends on company and type of card.

Same with housing loan that paid with credit card. Delay in payment would be charged 10% interest rate by the developer, not the bank. Odd as it may seem. 

Official loan sharks permitted by the governments? 

And if anyone wonders why modern lifestyle give youth so much pressure. To look good, to impress the rich or the network, they feel the need to spend beyond their means. Many bad things grow from here. 

 

 

[turbguy + 1,405]

Uh-oh...

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/evergrande-shares-halted-hong-kong-court-orders-liquidation-rcna136103

 

I guess the CCP is gonna print some money to spread around to "those in need"...

 

Edited January 29 by turbguy

[notsonice + 1,080]

34 minutes ago, turbguy said:

Uh-oh...

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/evergrande-shares-halted-hong-kong-court-orders-liquidation-rcna136103

 

I guess the CCP is gonna print some money...

 

oh my, oil and coal demand going down the toilet in China??????

 

Brent $75 is more likely than Brent $100 in 2024

2024 is shaping up to be a disaster in China....stock markets are already down sharply

In January so far, mainland China’s CSI 300 Index has dropped by 6 percent, the Shanghai Composite Index has dropped by 7 percent, and Hong Kong’s Hang Seng Index—where most large Chinese firms are listed—has fallen by more than 12 percent, reaching its lowest level in two decades. China is attempting to stabilize the yuan in response.

The slide has dampened Beijing’s recent efforts to paint a rosy picture of economic recovery. The government reports that China’s GDP grew by 5.2 percent in 2023, a low figure compared with its decades of high growth but a respectable one. But analysts outside China aren’t so sure, with skeptics at Rhodium Group and elsewhere estimating last year’s GDP growth at as low as 1.5 percent. China’s usual official data fudging seems to have been especially prevalent last year.

Economic disaster in both real estate and stocks ..............and a population in decline.........

 

can China's internal consumer demand keep the country from entering a depression??????

 

China needs to find jobs for all if its youth (so sad the youth in China are all college bound ...and no prospect for new desk jobs)

At least solar panel installers in China are in high demand......

Analysis: Clean energy was top driver of China’s economic growth in 2023

the article below is well worth the read

https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-clean-energy-was-top-driver-of-chinas-economic-growth-in-2023/#:~:text=Back to top-,Solar power,% year-on-year.

Solar powerSolar was the largest contributor to growth in China's clean-technology economy in 2023. It recorded growth worth a combined 1tn yuan of new investment, goods and services, as its value grew from 1.5tn yuan in 2022 to 2.5tn yuan in 2023, an increase of 63% year-on-year.4 days ago

 

Analysis: Clean energy was top driver of China's economic ...

 

In addition, in response to the slowdown in the real-estate sector, the central government introduced a new policy at the start of 2023, to encourage the development of solar power industries on unused and existing construction lands.

Meanwhile, during the annual legislative meetings in the spring of 2023, 15 provinces prioritised solar industry development in their government work agendas.

Detailed data on the growth in China’s solar installations in the first 11 months of the year is shown in the figure below. (An estimated 200GW was added across the country during 2023 as a whole, more than doubling from the record of 87GW set in 2022.)

 

Edited January 29 by notsonice

[frankfurter + 562]

On 1/24/2024 at 4:28 PM, notsonice said:

China is one of the main importers and users of oil...Chinas economic woes greatly affect the Oil markets......

please spare us your personal attacks 

Your support for China is noted.......we also see that you supported the Putin regime over and over again.......

Love those US supplied arms.......

Love the sanctions and ban on Oil exports out of Russia.....

We enjoy watching your beloved Russias oil business falling apart....

and your vile propaganda...goes right along with your support for a vile evil evil man ...Putin ...may he rot in hell for targeting civilians in Ukraine

War crimes.......

uh, I see many instances, proven so, where the govt of Ukraine has deliberately targeted civilians in the Donbass and Crimea; residences, schools, hospitals, etc. In fact, the Ukros use civilians as human shields, and the Ukros have summarily executed POWs. I have not yet seen proof that Putin has done likewise.

uh, the Ukraine war stems from the basic human right people have to be free of oppression and to choose and form their own country and government.  Are you disputing such right?

 

[frankfurter + 562]

9 hours ago, notsonice said:

oh my, oil and coal demand going down the toilet in China??????

 

Brent $75 is more likely than Brent $100 in 2024

2024 is shaping up to be a disaster in China....stock markets are already down sharply

In January so far, mainland China’s CSI 300 Index has dropped by 6 percent, the Shanghai Composite Index has dropped by 7 percent, and Hong Kong’s Hang Seng Index—where most large Chinese firms are listed—has fallen by more than 12 percent, reaching its lowest level in two decades. China is attempting to stabilize the yuan in response.

The slide has dampened Beijing’s recent efforts to paint a rosy picture of economic recovery. The government reports that China’s GDP grew by 5.2 percent in 2023, a low figure compared with its decades of high growth but a respectable one. But analysts outside China aren’t so sure, with skeptics at Rhodium Group and elsewhere estimating last year’s GDP growth at as low as 1.5 percent. China’s usual official data fudging seems to have been especially prevalent last year.

Economic disaster in both real estate and stocks ..............and a population in decline.........

 

can China's internal consumer demand keep the country from entering a depression??????

 

China needs to find jobs for all if its youth (so sad the youth in China are all college bound ...and no prospect for new desk jobs)

At least solar panel installers in China are in high demand......

Analysis: Clean energy was top driver of China’s economic growth in 2023

the article below is well worth the read

https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-clean-energy-was-top-driver-of-chinas-economic-growth-in-2023/#:~:text=Back to top-,Solar power,% year-on-year.

Solar powerSolar was the largest contributor to growth in China's clean-technology economy in 2023. It recorded growth worth a combined 1tn yuan of new investment, goods and services, as its value grew from 1.5tn yuan in 2022 to 2.5tn yuan in 2023, an increase of 63% year-on-year.4 days ago

 

Analysis: Clean energy was top driver of China's economic ...

 

In addition, in response to the slowdown in the real-estate sector, the central government introduced a new policy at the start of 2023, to encourage the development of solar power industries on unused and existing construction lands.

Meanwhile, during the annual legislative meetings in the spring of 2023, 15 provinces prioritised solar industry development in their government work agendas.

Detailed data on the growth in China’s solar installations in the first 11 months of the year is shown in the figure below. (An estimated 200GW was added across the country during 2023 as a whole, more than doubling from the record of 87GW set in 2022.)

 

The general situation in Europe and USA is far worse.

But, true, the China financial markets will be affected by the exit of speculators and the contraction of the shadow banking sector. Frankly, this is a good thing. Unlike the USA, China is allowing a wholesale cleansing to occur, which will strengthen the economy in the longer term. A 12% adjustment to HangSeng may be dire for the speculators, but means nothing for the private investors in the multitude of new tech currently in development. 

Fear not, China and the Chinese are here to stay for the next 1000 years. 

[TailingsPond + 476]

On 11/30/2023 at 12:20 AM, footeab@yahoo.com said:

 

#2 A Certain religion of immigrants should drop them instantly from being accepted as they openly admit their religion wishes to overthrow ALL existing governments and enact Sharia law. 

 

That is unconstitutional.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

"The First Amendment (Amendment I) to the United States Constitution prevents the government from making laws that: regulate an establishment of religion; prohibit the free exercise of religion"

But hey if you want to abandon the constitution and all the rights there within feel free to vote trump. 

Edited January 29 by TailingsPond