Germany: 'Europe United' Must Be Answer To Trump's 'America First'

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

4 minutes ago, Rasmus Jorgensen said:

 You other like like-minded could step up. 

 

But I cannot rebuild Eastern Europe all by myself.  I cannot even make a dent. That is just not realistic. 

I do have a friend of mine, another old Yale guy, in the railroad business, I suggested to him that he think in terms of using Odessa instead of Trieste as a terminal for shipping into and out of the Baltic States, and to get together a pool of capital to build a new rail line from Poland to Odessa.  Other than that, not that much I can do.  I would like to import aircraft engines from the Motor Sich plant in Kiev to North America, but getting the capital together to do that is daunting.  Probably cannot put it together. 

I think Ukraine is a fascinating country.  Take the city of Lviv, which I think at one time was in Poland. It is an architectural and historical masterpiece. Yet it remains ignored by tourist operators.  Such a shame. 

Right now I am focusing on "stepping up" in Vermont,which together with New Hampshire and Maine has this depressed, rural economy.  If I can turn any part of this around and make it prosperous, I shall consider my life's work done. Cheers.

[Guillaume Albasini + 851]

On 11/10/2018 at 5:37 AM, Tom Kirkman said:

In essence, my point is that I tend to view the push for Globalism as a global version of enforced Socialism.  

Example: the U.N. last week "ordering" the U.S. to accept 10,000+ illegal migrants from Central America, with absolutely zero vetting, ignoring legal U.S. immigration protocols, ignoring health screenings, completely ignoring a country's borders, running roughshod over a country's sovereign independence, etc.

Example: the EU "ordering" Hungary to accept vast amounts of illegal migrants.

The UN and the EU are globalist forces attempting to remove the sovereignty of countries, ignore laws of countries, enact a single global government, impose a single global currency, ignore elected officials in every country, and basically force the world to become a muddy mess of enforced Socialism, for "the good of the world".

Trump has upset a heckuva lot of people and countries by placing as his priority the country that he is in charge of.  Reminds me of Putin's nationalism.

That Macron gets upset about Trump's defiant Nationalism is a very good thing.

Even though I no longer live in the U.S. I sure as heck don't want to see the U.S. meekly subservient to EU Socialism by unelected dictator bureaucrats in Brussels, or be led around by the nose by the nuthouse that is the UN.

Clearly, we are not going to agree about Globalism vs. Nationalism.  And I'm perfectly fine with agreeing to disagree.  May the better ideology prevail. 

=============================

Just my opinion; as always, you are free to disagree.

 

“I have always strenuously supported the right of every man to his own opinion, however different that opinion might be to mine. He who denies to another this right, makes a slave of himself to his present opinion, because he precludes himself the right of changing it.”

– Thomas Paine (1737-1809)

 

 Yes there is a battle between nationalism and globalism but I don't see globalism as a global version of socialism. The opposition between capitalism and socialism has defined most of the political battles of the XXth century and the political landscape is still organised on a right-left axis. But now  the battle is increasingly opposing nationalism and globalism putting some strain on the political parties often having nationalists and globalists on the the same group. For instance Viktor Orban and Donald Tusk are both  labeled as members of the European Popular Party but are adopting very diverging agendas.

The UN has not ordered the US to accept the migrants of the caravan. It is just another fake news from Breitbard and the alt right media.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/un-order-migrant-caravan/

I think your vision of the UN and the EU is also heavily tainted by the conspiracy theories.

[Tomasz + 1,608]

The simple fact is that probably Bulgaria and Romania had totally different economic interests than Germany or Denmark. 

As I said I dont see strong economic union with such differences in wages.

There is also big difference in mentality between orthodox, roman catholic, protestant countries and countries like France after 1905.

 Communism was like freeze time for changes in mentality in last 100 years - if you compare postomunist countries they are mostly much more conservative than western one

For example I would suggest not showing openly that you a gay in Poland- you will probably not get attacked but some unpleasant situations may take place especially  outside big cities. Maybe less often than 20 years ago but thats still not accepted by lot of Poles-also by young generation that should be more open.

Edited November 12, 2018 by Tomasz

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

26 minutes ago, Tomasz said:

The simple fact is that probably Bulgaria and Romania had totally different economic interests than Germany or Denmark. 

As I said I dont see strong economic union with such differences in wages.

And yet, the industrial countries of Northern Europe farm quite a bit of business into the East Bloc.  For example, Damen Shipyards of Holland has bought the largest shipyard in Romania, and now builds their hills and sometimes entire ships in that yard, using the low-cost romanian labor. 

Also, Polish shipyards get work building up hulls and hull sections for yards in Germany and Denmark.  You get this situation where the heavy work of building up the hull is done in Poland, and then the finished hull is towed to say Germany for outfitting.  Eventually all the outfitting will also be done in Eastern Europe; the reason it is not done so now is more to do with supply-chain matters than the ability of the Poles or the Romanians or the Turks to do the work.  Short supply chains make for a faster completion of the vessel. Cheers.

[Tomasz + 1,608]

I will explain how this supports nationalism in Poland.

There is Opel factory in Poland in Silesia region= Gliwice. There is also a Opel factory in eastern Germany in Saxony region.

A total distance between them is shorter than 100 kilometers but there is a border between Poland and Germany on Nysa river.

Both factories produce Opel cars and as far as I know polish factory is little more efficient than german one= produces several % more cars per day probably because polish workers are more determined to save their jobs.

The whole difference between them is salary of workers= in polish factory you earn about 3 times less in euros than 100 km more on the west in german factory.

And a lot of people in this factory often ask angrily = why we earn 3 times less in a situation when we do exacly the same job and maybe we are even more efficient because we work harder?

So Kaczynski and Orban have an simple answer = because western companies exploit Poland ang Hungary.

They say that West of course gives a lot of money as european funds but there is also a big capital outflow of money from harworking population in foreign factories on polish territory  and illcit transfers so European Union is not such a great alliance for Poland or Hungary.

This narration is quite effective because its in some aspects true and whats more important its simple explanation why people in Central Europe are still rather poor 15 years after accession to EC.

Its of course much more complicated matter but a quite lot of people see this just like that.

In my opinion in Poland something like 1\3 of total population and maybe even more because half of polish citizens usually dont vote.

 

 

Edited November 12, 2018 by Tomasz

[Guillaume Albasini + 851]

13 hours ago, Tom Kirkman said:

Attached is a United Nations document, for anyone interested.  Relevant to the direction the EU appears to be heading.

Intergovernmental Conference to Adopt the Global Compact for Safe, Orderly and Regular Migration

N1824447.pdf

The Global Compact For Safe, Orderly and Regular Migration has been agreed in July by all UN members except the US and sets out norms for protecting and integrating people who migrate and ways to help them return home.

This pact is non-binding and recognizes each state’s right to its own migration policy, but a growing number of anti-immigration leaders in central Europe (Hungary, Austria, Poland and the Czech Republic) are now rejecting it ahead of next month’s signing ceremony in Morocco.

This opposition is more a political move than based on the content of a text that is non-binding and does not threaten the sovereign rights.

You can clearly read in the document :

Quote

"The Global Compact reaffirms the sovereign right of States to determine their national migration policy and their prerogative to govern migration within their jurisdiction, in conformity with international law"

 

In my opinion these populist leaders are acting irresponsibly. They are trying to undermine a useful text widely approved just in order to appear as tough hardliners on migration policy. But perhaps they also are opposed tothe Compact because at least some of them are prone to violate international law and even their own jurisdiction.

[Rasmus Jorgensen + 1,169]

21 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

I do have a friend of mine, another old Yale guy, in the railroad business, I suggested to him that he think in terms of using Odessa instead of Trieste as a terminal for shipping into and out of the Baltic States, and to get together a pool of capital to build a new rail line from Poland to Odessa.  Other than that, not that much I can do.  I would like to import aircraft engines from the Motor Sich plant in Kiev to North America, but getting the capital together to do that is daunting.  Probably cannot put it together

I am sure you could get some chinese funding for the railroad basis the OBOR program... 

Edited November 13, 2018 by Rasmus Jorgensen

[Rasmus Jorgensen + 1,169]

Seriously though, you seem to be walking my talk. Probably better than me, although with a tad of cynism. 

Edited November 13, 2018 by Rasmus Jorgensen

[Marina Schwarz + 1,576]

19 hours ago, Tomasz said:

The simple fact is that probably Bulgaria and Romania had totally different economic interests than Germany or Denmark. 

Bulgaria and Romania are basically trudging along, surviving, upholding foreign interests and doing nothing more. Romania does have some prospects left, however, it has some pride left. Bulgaria is a failed state, almost exactly like Ukraine, with the only difference it took a lot less blood to fail it and no, it wasn't Russia's fault, it was entirely an inside job in both cases.

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

2 hours ago, Marina Schwarz said:

Bulgaria and Romania are basically trudging along, surviving, upholding foreign interests and doing nothing more. Romania does have some prospects left, however, it has some pride left. Bulgaria is a failed state, almost exactly like Ukraine, with the only difference it took a lot less blood to fail it and no, it wasn't Russia's fault, it was entirely an inside job in both cases.

Do tell more, Marina.  I'm intrigued and basically clueless when it comes to those places.

[Marina Schwarz + 1,576]

My pleasure. It will be a long and not too pleasant blog post but I'll do it when I get the chance.

[jaycee + 348]

21 hours ago, Tomasz said:

I will explain how this supports nationalism in Poland.

There is Opel factory in Poland in Silesia region= Gliwice. There is also a Opel factory in eastern Germany in Saxony region.

A total distance between them is shorter than 100 kilometers but there is a border between Poland and Germany on Nysa river.

Both factories produce Opel cars and as far as I know polish factory is little more efficient than german one= produces several % more cars per day probably because polish workers are more determined to save their jobs.

The whole difference between them is salary of workers= in polish factory you earn about 3 times less in euros than 100 km more on the west in german factory.

And a lot of people in this factory often ask angrily = why we earn 3 times less in a situation when we do exacly the same job and maybe we are even more efficient because we work harder?

So Kaczynski and Orban have an simple answer = because western companies exploit Poland ang Hungary.

They say that West of course gives a lot of money as european funds but there is also a big capital outflow of money from harworking population in foreign factories on polish territory  and illcit transfers so European Union is not such a great alliance for Poland or Hungary.

This narration is quite effective because its in some aspects true and whats more important its simple explanation why people in Central Europe are still rather poor 15 years after accession to EC.

Its of course much more complicated matter but a quite lot of people see this just like that.

In my opinion in Poland something like 1\3 of total population and maybe even more because half of polish citizens usually dont vote.

 

 

Tomaz
just noticed your post about car plants I have experience there. In '99 during an oil price downturn I landed up auditing car plants round Europe for a while and actually audited a couple of Opel plants one in Russelheim Germany the other Elsemere Port in UK. The UK plant produced more cars, 10% I think, compared to Russelhiem, however they had more recalls so the Germans actually produced more working cars. Not saying its the same with Poland and Germany but numbers produced is not the final measure. Regards the difference in costs if there was no difference the car plants would not be in Poland I am afraid so the workers demanding equal pay will only achieve unemployment if they get it. I am guessing though that in Poland working for Opel is a much higher standard and better paid job than most whereas in Germany it is just a job add in the cost of living difference and I would say the Polish workers are doing well comparatively. 
Eastern Europe is being exploited by the West, Germany in particular as per Mein Kampf's objectives oddly, however with higher wages the factories from the West would move further East to lower cost countries. Eastern Europe needs to move their skill sets up the food chain as staying in heavy industry commits them to a race to the bottom but then going back to Mein Kampf the East were to provide the slave labour for the new German Reich or EU as it is now known.