Hydrogen balloon still deflating

[markslawson + 1,053]

At the risk of annoying the many hydrogen-is-the-answer-to-everything brigade there has been further bad news on the hydrogen front. This is an article from the Australian Financial Review (down under Wall Street, my old newspaper). I can't link the article as it's behind a pay wall but I've cut and paste most of it. When Andrew Forrest says the sector is not growing as quickly as he hoped he probably means its been a disaster.... 

Big organisations like Fortescue, Cleanaway, Wesfarmers, Korea Zinc and the Royal Automobile Club of Victoria have been caught up in the collapse of the Australian division of a controversial US hydrogen vehicle manufacturer.

Hyzon Motors aimed to become the Tesla of hydrogen trucks when it listed on Nasdaq in July 2021, but has since lost 99 per cent of its value and is now making a low-ball offer to acquire its failed Australian subsidiary out of administration.

The collapse of Hyzon’s Australian subsidiary was triggered when the parent refused to extend financial support in July, and comes as the struggling US company is on track to exhaust its cash reserves within seven months at the current rate of spending.

The demise of Hyzon Motors Australia is the latest setback for the struggling hydrogen sector and comes after Fortescue chairman and hydrogen enthusiast Andrew Forrest conceded in July that the sector would not grow as quickly as he originally hoped.

It also comes after Fortescue-backed hydrogen plane developer Universal Hydrogen collapsed in the US in July after burning through almost $150 million of investor capital.

Hyzon had delivered 10 hydrogen buses to Fortescue and was also working on hydrogen-powered rubbish trucks for Cleanaway when its Australian subsidiary was placed in administration on July 11.

The subsidiary collapsed owing $29.9 million to its creditors, and the list of creditors included 45 local employees.

[TailingsPond + 645]

"Behind a paywall" means the authors want to get paid for their work.  You should respect that as you consider yourself an author.

As for the article so what?  Lots of startups fail in all industries. Lots of technologies fail on the first attempts.  If failures stopped people from trying we would not have airplanes.

 

 

[markslawson + 1,053]

8 hours ago, TailingsPond said:

As for the article so what?  Lots of startups fail in all industries. Lots of technologies fail on the first attempts.  If failures stopped people from trying we would not have airplanes.

It's just a section... you can quote sections. I also note you would not be so particular if it was in favour of hydrogen. As for your point, sure there are failures in any industry but it is part of a trend where the H2 hype is shown for what it is, hype. H2 has its uses but as part of the energy cycle it is a non-starter and green propaganda should be exposed for the nonsense that it is...  

[TailingsPond + 645]

5 hours ago, markslawson said:

 I also note you would not be so particular if it was in favour of hydrogen.

Try to find some quotes of me supporting hydrogen.

I primarily am against air pollution (think PM2.5 not greenhouse gasses) from dirty fossil fuel sources like coal.

[markslawson + 1,053]

16 hours ago, TailingsPond said:

Try to find some quotes of me supporting hydrogen.

I primarily am against air pollution (think PM2.5 not greenhouse gasses) from dirty fossil fuel sources like coal.

Oh right ... okay, my apologies. Probably we should leave it at that...

[Rob Plant + 2,733]

On 8/24/2024 at 8:14 AM, markslawson said:

At the risk of annoying the many hydrogen-is-the-answer-to-everything brigade there has been further bad news on the hydrogen front. This is an article from the Australian Financial Review (down under Wall Street, my old newspaper). I can't link the article as it's behind a pay wall but I've cut and paste most of it. When Andrew Forrest says the sector is not growing as quickly as he hoped he probably means its been a disaster.... 

Big organisations like Fortescue, Cleanaway, Wesfarmers, Korea Zinc and the Royal Automobile Club of Victoria have been caught up in the collapse of the Australian division of a controversial US hydrogen vehicle manufacturer.

Hyzon Motors aimed to become the Tesla of hydrogen trucks when it listed on Nasdaq in July 2021, but has since lost 99 per cent of its value and is now making a low-ball offer to acquire its failed Australian subsidiary out of administration.

The collapse of Hyzon’s Australian subsidiary was triggered when the parent refused to extend financial support in July, and comes as the struggling US company is on track to exhaust its cash reserves within seven months at the current rate of spending.

The demise of Hyzon Motors Australia is the latest setback for the struggling hydrogen sector and comes after Fortescue chairman and hydrogen enthusiast Andrew Forrest conceded in July that the sector would not grow as quickly as he originally hoped.

It also comes after Fortescue-backed hydrogen plane developer Universal Hydrogen collapsed in the US in July after burning through almost $150 million of investor capital.

Hyzon had delivered 10 hydrogen buses to Fortescue and was also working on hydrogen-powered rubbish trucks for Cleanaway when its Australian subsidiary was placed in administration on July 11.

The subsidiary collapsed owing $29.9 million to its creditors, and the list of creditors included 45 local employees.

Mark youre becoming incredibly tedious with all of your BS, and refer to 1 tiny little poxy car company nobody has ever heard of!

Hydrogen Fuel - Q2 2024 Green Economy Outlook | J.P. Morgan (jpmorgan.com)

Have a read and learn something for a change!

Yes there are teething troubles with legislation approvals and tech in general in this sector, but huge advances have been achieved this year, and as Tailings Pond says if you dont keep improving tech we would never have developed aircraft or space travel.

For once try to have an open mind to the possibilities of its use not just what is wrong currently with it. You might find the experience enlightening!

 

[markslawson + 1,053]

12 hours ago, Rob Plant said:

Have a read and learn something for a change!

Yes there are teething troubles with legislation approvals and tech in general in this sector, but huge advances have been achieved this year, and as Tailings Pond says if you dont keep improving tech we would never have developed aircraft or space travel.

For once try to have an open mind to the possibilities of its use not just what is wrong currently with it. You might find the experience enlightening!

Rob - instead of growling at me and quoting totally meaningless statistics - H2 is used extensively in industrial projects, I'm talking about its use in transport and power for which is it clearly completely unsuited - why don't you invest in the sector? You'll lose your money then have to take a second job and won't have time to for these posts. Better yet, join a university and teach students about the benefits of H2. You won't have to worry about reality. I've picked apart your 'statistics' before and made no impression. When H2 starts playing an actual, appreciable role in energy and transport then you can talk about people keeping an open mind. At present it has no role, nor is it likely to despite your statistics. 

[Rob Plant + 2,733]

11 hours ago, markslawson said:

Rob - instead of growling at me and quoting totally meaningless statistics - H2 is used extensively in industrial projects, I'm talking about its use in transport and power for which is it clearly completely unsuited - why don't you invest in the sector? You'll lose your money then have to take a second job and won't have time to for these posts. Better yet, join a university and teach students about the benefits of H2. You won't have to worry about reality. I've picked apart your 'statistics' before and made no impression. When H2 starts playing an actual, appreciable role in energy and transport then you can talk about people keeping an open mind. At present it has no role, nor is it likely to despite your statistics. 

Mark I feel sorry for you having such a closed mind!

The title of your thread is "hydrogen balloon still deflating" when I have shown you it isnt

I have several investments all doing exceptionally well thanks, in fact so well I am retiring this December at 55.

How about you?

Edited September 3 by Rob Plant

[Ron Wagner + 682]

On 8/24/2024 at 2:14 AM, markslawson said:

At the risk of annoying the many hydrogen-is-the-answer-to-everything brigade there has been further bad news on the hydrogen front. This is an article from the Australian Financial Review (down under Wall Street, my old newspaper). I can't link the article as it's behind a pay wall but I've cut and paste most of it. When Andrew Forrest says the sector is not growing as quickly as he hoped he probably means its been a disaster.... 

Big organisations like Fortescue, Cleanaway, Wesfarmers, Korea Zinc and the Royal Automobile Club of Victoria have been caught up in the collapse of the Australian division of a controversial US hydrogen vehicle manufacturer.

Hyzon Motors aimed to become the Tesla of hydrogen trucks when it listed on Nasdaq in July 2021, but has since lost 99 per cent of its value and is now making a low-ball offer to acquire its failed Australian subsidiary out of administration.

The collapse of Hyzon’s Australian subsidiary was triggered when the parent refused to extend financial support in July, and comes as the struggling US company is on track to exhaust its cash reserves within seven months at the current rate of spending.

The demise of Hyzon Motors Australia is the latest setback for the struggling hydrogen sector and comes after Fortescue chairman and hydrogen enthusiast Andrew Forrest conceded in July that the sector would not grow as quickly as he originally hoped.

It also comes after Fortescue-backed hydrogen plane developer Universal Hydrogen collapsed in the US in July after burning through almost $150 million of investor capital.

Hyzon had delivered 10 hydrogen buses to Fortescue and was also working on hydrogen-powered rubbish trucks for Cleanaway when its Australian subsidiary was placed in administration on July 11.

The subsidiary collapsed owing $29.9 million to its creditors, and the list of creditors included 45 local employees.

It is really stupid to go hydrogen when natural gas is far cheaper, is nearly as clean, and is already established as a dependable fuel, which is safer than hydrogen. It has fueling networks in many countries and is easily transportable by pipeline or truck, ship, rail, etc. when in the form of CNG. 

[Ron Wagner + 682]

On 9/3/2024 at 4:58 AM, Rob Plant said:

Mark I feel sorry for you having such a closed mind!

The title of your thread is "hydrogen balloon still deflating" when I have shown you it isnt

I have several investments all doing exceptionally well thanks, in fact so well I am retiring this December at 55.

How about you?

Why do you think it is preferable and competitive with natural gas and CNG? 

[Ron Wagner + 682]

On 9/3/2024 at 4:58 AM, Rob Plant said:

Mark I feel sorry for you having such a closed mind!

The title of your thread is "hydrogen balloon still deflating" when I have shown you it isnt

I have several investments all doing exceptionally well thanks, in fact so well I am retiring this December at 55.

How about you?

Well it sounds like a loser to me. I saw a hydrogen auto at the Pan Pacific Auditorium in Los Angeles in 1965. I was more impressed with the Wagoneer. It is still on the market today, though probably not for long as it is owned by Stellantis. 

Why do you think it is coming online so long. Natural gas has been used in vehicles since WW!. Today there are pipelines all over the world with natural gas and CNG can be easily transported by ships, trains, and trucks. 

Edited 11 hours ago by Ron Wagner

[Rob Plant + 2,733]

8 hours ago, Ron Wagner said:

Well it sounds like a loser to me. I saw a hydrogen auto at the Pan Pacific Auditorium in Los Angeles in 1965. I was more impressed with the Wagoneer. It is still on the market today, though probably not for long as it is owned by Stellantis. 

Why do you think it is coming online so long. Natural gas has been used in vehicles since WW!. Today there are pipelines all over the world with natural gas and CNG can be easily transported by ships, trains, and trucks. 

Ron I have no problem with NG or CNG use and agree currently its the go to fuel in the transition.

However my point is to Mark (and others) not to dismiss other potential forms of energy and its uses just because its a fledgling industry.

To start a thread stating "hydrogen balloon still deflating" is not just misleading and totally incorrect when you consider the ramp up in investment year on year as I have shown in a previous post. It actually shows a degree of ignorance.