Populism Rising in Canada?

[Marina Schwarz + 1,576]

I came across an interesting story about political developments in Canada that suggests the so-called populists, whom I'd rather call conservatives, I guess, are gaining ground in one of the most liberal countries. It's in Bulgarian, so sorry about that if you want to read it (Google Translate is crappy for Bulgarian) but I'd really love to hear some opinions from the field, as it were.

[Rodent + 1,424]

2 hours ago, Marina Schwarz said:

I came across an interesting story about political developments in Canada that suggests the so-called populists, whom I'd rather call conservatives, I guess, are gaining ground in one of the most liberal countries. It's in Bulgarian, so sorry about that if you want to read it (Google Translate is crappy for Bulgarian) but I'd really love to hear some opinions from the field, as it were.

Revolt, revolt, revolt! Just silly me wondering how populism turned into an ugly word. 

Populism in itself is neither good nor bad. 

 

[Marina Schwarz + 1,576]

I've no idea. To me, 99% of politicians are populists. It's part of the job description. The other 1% are idealists who, sadly, have no place in politics.

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

19 minutes ago, Rodent said:

Revolt, revolt, revolt! Just silly me wondering how populism turned into an ugly word. 

 

[Rasmus Jorgensen + 1,169]

2 minutes ago, Tom Kirkman said:

 

I  just did the same. 

2nd search result was the same on both search engines. 

[Rodent + 1,424]

that should be a cautionary Tale against Googling definitions of words. "Let's change some defitions of words to spin sentiment."

As an editor and lover of the English language, I am irritated by this audacity.

kids, please use a proper dictionary.

@Marina Schwarz

https://notbravenewworld.wordpress.com/2018/11/21/top-5-loathsome-words/#more-360

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

3 minutes ago, Rasmus Jorgensen said:

I  just did the same. 

2nd search result was the same on both search engines. 

So did I just now:

 

[Marina Schwarz + 1,576]

What? Seriously, what? Chauvinism? Xenophobia? Synonyms of nationalism? I need to lie down.

@Rodent, thanks! This list could expand to a scary size.

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

Yes, the far right is growing in Canada - or at least they are getting louder.  Thankfully, most are old and will die soon.  The rest are generally poor and uneducated yielding little power.

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

1 hour ago, Enthalpic said:

Yes, the far right is growing in Canada - or at least they are getting louder.  Thankfully, most are old and will die soon.  The rest are generally poor and uneducated yielding little power.

Not quite sure how you define "the far right."   Would those be the Scots Irish migrant descendants that want to scrap the Canadian Declaration of Rights and go back to being a Dominion of the English Crown?  Or the Francophones demanding the undoing of Wolfe v. Montcalm?  The Fields of the Plains of Abraham sown with salt?  The English in Westmount demanding the demolition of Catholic churches?  

OK, so you sit in Alberta with the gas-heated private driveway to your garage.  Is the "far right" out there advocating to the removal of First Nations children from the villages and put up in boarding schools, to receive a "proper British Education"?  How far do you want to go?

OK, I got it:  the original shareholders of the Grand Trunk Railway (OK, their descendants) will have their shares re-issued and the certificates backed by physical rail sections of the CN.  Sounds about fair, all things considered. 

[Enthalpic + 1,496]

12 minutes ago, Jan van Eck said:

Not quite sure how you define "the far right."   Would those be the Scots Irish migrant descendants that want to scrap the Canadian Declaration of Rights and go back to being a Dominion of the English Crown?  Or the Francophones demanding the undoing of Wolfe v. Montcalm?  The Fields of the Plains of Abraham sown with salt?  The English in Westmount demanding the demolition of Catholic churches?  

OK, so you sit in Alberta with the gas-heated private driveway to your garage.  Is the "far right" out there advocating to the removal of First Nations children from the villages and put up in boarding schools, to receive a "proper British Education"?  How far do you want to go?

OK, I got it:  the original shareholders of the Grand Trunk Railway (OK, their descendants) will have their shares re-issued and the certificates backed by physical rail sections of the CN.  Sounds about fair, all things considered. 

It's actually just a nice condominium.

I just mean the pseudo-religious people who think their problems are someone else's fault (e.g. immigrants, climate protectionists, LQBGT, foreign interference, liberal policies).  Like a Trump supporter with half the guns wearing a toque... but with better healthcare. 

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

11 minutes ago, Enthalpic said:

It's actually just a nice condominium.

I just mean the pseudo-religious people who think their problems are someone else's fault (e.g. immigrants, climate protectionists, LQBGT, foreign interference, liberal policies).  Like a Trump supporter with half the guns wearing a toque... but with better healthcare. 

I went shopping for a genuine toque as a Christmas gift, found to my dismay that nobody in the USA ever heard of it.  And I am but 40 miles South of the Border.  Amazing.  But you gave me an Idea:  a package gift of a toque and a 0.41-caliber six-shot long-barrel Colt Thunderer, a great ensemble for high fashion, especially that gun, worn by both Billy the Kid and Doc Holliday, the associate of Wyatt Earp himself at the Shoot-out at the OK Corral.  What a great combo!

Edited November 21, 2018 by Jan van Eck

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

53 minutes ago, Jan van Eck said:

I went shopping for a genuine toque as a Christmas gift, found to my dismay that nobody in the USA ever heard of it.  And I am but 40 miles South of the Border.  Amazing.  But you gave me an Idea:  a package gift of a toque and a 0.41-caliber six-shot long-barrel Colt Thunderer, a great ensemble for high fashion, especially that gun, worn by both Billy the Kid and Doc Holliday, the associate of Wyatt Earp himself at the Shoot-out at the OK Corral.  What a great combo!

We've got a new Ha-ha button.  Woo-hoo!

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

11 hours ago, Marina Schwarz said:

What? Seriously, what? Chauvinism? Xenophobia? Synonyms of nationalism? I need to lie down.

@Rodent, thanks! This list could expand to a scary size.

@Marina Schwarz @Rodent Ok, just now I did a search on a pc (rather than on my mobile phone) for defining "nationalism", both on DuckDuckGo and Google.

Yes, please do try this at home yourself, using a pc (smartphone results are less complete).

Screencaps just now from my pc searches:

[ronwagn + 6,290]

10 hours ago, Marina Schwarz said:

I've no idea. To me, 99% of politicians are populists. It's part of the job description. The other 1% are idealists who, sadly, have no place in politics.

Speaking of the major nations of Europe, all the major politicians are currently ignoring the majority of their citizens. They are also beginning to pay the price. This coincided with President Trump coming to power. 

[Rodent + 1,424]

3 hours ago, Enthalpic said:

I just mean the pseudo-religious people who think their problems are someone else's fault (e.g. immigrants, climate protectionists, LQBGT, foreign interference, liberal policies).  Like a Trump supporter with half the guns wearing a toque... but with better healthcare. 

My eyes are bleeding, and unrelated to that, I had to Google what the heck a toque is, although I no longer can be certain that Google is feeding me accurate information on this or any other front. 

Disillusioned and bloodied. Sigh. 

Now where were we now? I think we were discussing why elitism is meeting resistance in Canada. And bringing it round to energy, I have this to share:

https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/mobile/quebec-pact-to-reduce-carbon-footprint-greeted-with-populist-backlash-1.4185563

I specifically like the headline choices here re:  "pact" vs "backlash". 

[Rasmus Jorgensen + 1,169]

6 hours ago, ronwagn said:

Speaking of the major nations of Europe, all the major politicians are currently ignoring the majority of their citizens. They are also beginning to pay the price. This coincided with President Trump coming to power. 

Are you sure? where do you get your facts? Breitbart? 

whilst it is true that the traditional parties are getting declining support and anti-immigrant parties generally are increasing in support they are still a long ways from majority. Marine Le Pen got defeated in France. AFD in Germany has around 20 % of the votes. Sverige demokraterne in Sweden 18 % - 19%. That is not the majority. Besides - Europe had anti-immigration parties long before Trump. 

Real facts for a serious discussion, please!

[Rasmus Jorgensen + 1,169]

17 hours ago, Marina Schwarz said:

I've no idea. To me, 99% of politicians are populists. It's part of the job description. The other 1% are idealists who, sadly, have no place in politics.

I think we need more idealists. 

[Marina Schwarz + 1,576]

Not in government, I'm afraid. Government needs realists and pragmatics, people who know the difference between ideal and possible, and don't waste time pursuing the former. You only need to look back to the 1917 revolution and its consequences to see how millions of idealists ended up. Both my parents were among them. Disillusionment in the face of reality is far from fun, I can say this much. 

P.S. Googled/DucDuckGoed "nationalism", got the same results as you did. Also googled "toque". A frenchism no doubt?

Did I really see someone use "thankfully" and "people will die" in the same declarative sentence?

Edited November 22, 2018 by Marina Schwarz

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

What happened to the new Ha ha button?  I liked that.....

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

11 hours ago, ronwagn said:

Speaking of the major nations of Europe, all the major politicians are currently ignoring the majority of their citizens. They are also beginning to pay the price. This coincided with President Trump coming to power. 

Trump was and is, to put it mildly, the exception to the impending rule.  Even people with backbone need a leader to speak the obvious first so that they can then stand up and do what's necessary in their own governments.  Are we seeing this in parts of the EU?  Are people in the EU finally asking themselves why they are following a generally dominant German lead?  Are people questioning German motives?  Are people starting to say we're sick and tired of it and we're not going to take it anymore?

[Rodent + 1,424]

2 hours ago, Dan Warnick said:

What happened to the new Ha ha button?  I liked that.....

I am looking into the disappearance of our new friend.

[Rasmus Jorgensen + 1,169]

On 11/22/2018 at 8:30 AM, Marina Schwarz said:

Not in government, I'm afraid. Government needs realists and pragmatics, people who know the difference between ideal and possible, and don't waste time pursuing the former. You only need to look back to the 1917 revolution and its consequences to see how millions of idealists ended up. Both my parents were among them. Disillusionment in the face of reality is far from fun, I can say this much. 

Agree on the realists and pragmatics. They, to me however, are different to populists who doesn't care about what needs to be done. 

[Rodent + 1,424]

33 minutes ago, Rasmus Jorgensen said:

Agree on the realists and pragmatics. They, to me however, are different to populists who doesn't care about what needs to be done. 

Elected officials should theoretically be by the people, for the people. So, "What need to be done", is  exactly whatever the people want done, by definition. 

[Marina Schwarz + 1,576]

13 hours ago, Rasmus Jorgensen said:

Agree on the realists and pragmatics. They, to me however, are different to populists who doesn't care about what needs to be done. 

I have yet to see a politician who doesn't make promises he or she has no intention of keeping after the elections. So, in this sense, almost everyone is a populist. Oddly enough, Trump shouldn't be counted among them under this definition, because he has been sticking to his campaign promises like a slug to a tiled bathroom wall. Populists tend to forget everything they promised on the campaign trail as soon as they're in office. Hmm, I believe a lot of the people we call populists in Europe are not, in fact, populists.