Paris Is Burning Over Climate Change Taxes -- Is America Next?

[DanilKa + 443]

12 minutes ago, Jan van Eck said:

It sure works for the Chinese.  

Each culture, each society, develops mechanisms for creating wealth.  What the French have done is impose barriers to the classically capitalist formulas for creating societal wealth.  One way they have done that is through their labor laws - in effect, ensuring that nobody will have work, outside of Government bureaucracy jobs.  Another way they have done that is through various land-use laws, preventing the rational allocation of land resources.  In short, the French have totally screwed up their country, mostly the result of vaguely socialist ideas that the ruling elite has jammed into the society, under the rubric of advancing civilization.  All that did was impoverish the place.  Not bright.

And that is why I predict that the revolution will continue until the Macron government falls. Macron cannot fix it, because he does not "get it."  It is a comprehension issue. 

“It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.”― Upton Sinclair, I, Candidate for Governor: And How I Got Licked

Hope you are right and Macron will run for the hills. Not that it'll fix the France problem but stop digging proverbial hole is an important first step.

It works for Chinese - until it doesn't. Lack of feedback loop inevitably leads to inefficiency and miss allocation of (borrowed) capital

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

17 minutes ago, Tom Kirkman said:

Jan, you had me on edge less than an hour ago.  And now you have me tipping the hat to your views.

Dang frustrating.  Well done.

It is all a deliberate scheme of mine to keep you from getting sleepy. 

Never underestimate the Vermonters.  Crafty bunch, to be sure.

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

13 minutes ago, DanilKa said:

It works for Chinese - until it doesn't. Lack of feedback loop inevitably leads to inefficiency and miss allocation of (borrowed) capital

That is certainly true - however, the Chinese do have a feedback loop, albeit one opaque to Westerners.  Their criteria for success are not immediately apparent.  If they build apartment buildings that remain empty because nobody can afford them, that is still a goal accomplishment - it put large numbers of men to work and created money velocity with the salaries paid and the materials purchased.  That works for the Chinese.  Cheers.

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

19 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

It is all a deliberate scheme of mine to keep you from getting sleepy. 

Never underestimate the Vermonters.  Crafty bunch, to be sure.

This was made by Russian trolls:

Aaaaand for those who don't get the joke ...

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

29 minutes ago, Jan van Eck said:

It is all a deliberate scheme of mine to keep you from getting sleepy. 

Never underestimate the Vermonters.  Crafty bunch, to be sure.

Feel free to do a YouTube search for Minor Threat live. I was the lead singer for a Midwest hardcore punk band back in the 80's, and we opened a couple times for Minor Threat.

These days, rather than screaming at the top of my lungs, I attempt to interject a bit of humor via memes to get my point across.  Many times I fail, spectacularly.  But I just pick myself up, dust myself off, and try, try, try again.

If I can nudge someone away from MSM deadthink braindeadening, I chalk it up as a win.

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

31 minutes ago, Tom Kirkman said:

Feel free to do a YouTube search for Minor Threat live. I was the lead singer for a Midwest hardcore punk band back in the 80's, and we opened a couple times for Minor Threat.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1jSrC-2uaY

Back in the days when I was on the volunteer fire department, we would get these calls over the radio and report:  "altered mental state."

Seems to fit. 

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

2 hours ago, Tom Kirkman said:

Jan, you amaze me yet again.  Apologies, I was earlier bouncing back and forth between a tab here and a tab elsewhere that was tackling pedovorism.  My bad.

I thought as much.....

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

@Jan van Eck Do you have a realistic take on the "Fed vs Get Rid of the Fed" argument?  I don't know what is true, or not, in the bigger picture.

One thing that seems pretty obvious to me: The big to-do over the Fed raising rates another 1/4 point yesterday was simply people (read Wall Street and Washington) diverting blame and reality.  My position on that is, 1/4 point did not matter that much, if at all.  Ok, the Fed may be accused of raising the rate too much too fast over the last year or two, but I believe this last 1/4 point and the simple projection that they may, or may not, raise it again 2 or 3 times next year is a healthy measure for the economy in the long run.  I believe it even stands to help the economy become stronger in time for President Trump's re-election run (whether he gets that or not).

What's your take?

[Rasmus Jorgensen + 1,169]

4 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

Europe has been hard at work looting Africa for centuries.  The looting even included its people, with four million slaves surviving the slave trade to the Americas, each trip providing a 100% return of capital to the investors.  You may estimate that another 4 million did not survive the trip.  So that is eight million that have been stripped from Africa in order to provide slave labor and slave sales. 

Take a look at some European countries and how much they profited. Belgium was a sleepy farming backwater until to seized the Congo, and looted and pillaged the place, making the Belgian Crown fabulously wealthy.  That King Leopold was a pig is not admitted to. The French enriched themselves with Algerian gas and Moroccan foodstuffs and grains, and big military (naval) bases to counterpoint the English, nothing to sneeze at.  Italy has for 2,000 years retained Libya and Tunisia as its breadbasket for wheat.  Egypt has not had independence from some foreign ruler since the Romans, until Nasser came along. The British took over South Africa and the diamond trade, plus cattle and grains in Rhodesia and Kenya, and coffee plantations by the Germans in Tanzania and Mozambique.  The Portuguese exploited minerals in Angola, and they all fought each other to see who could steal the most.  

Even with all that, only a very small fraction of the continent's vast wealth has been touched.  Right now there is an effort underway to build a railroad from Kinshasa to the sea, so as to avoid having to send freight via the collapsed rail line at Brazzaville.  To build that new line, the contractor has to cut a railbed through the forest, a vast sea of giant mahogany where the lumber can be milled and shipped as you go.  The profits from the wood alone  repay all the capital costs of building the line and then some. You can rebuild the rail network from Capetown to Cairo and make a profit doing it - if  (big "if") you can keep the corruption under control.  Africa has been imprisoned by garbage leaders, men such as Mobutu Sese Seko and Idi Amin and Robert Mugabe and Laurent Kabila,  all thugs and looters of the people. And the West's contribution to that has been selling them guns and providing mercenaries. 

The West has put up with the looters and the corrupt, to its shame.  every now and then the French Foreign Legion gets called in to deal with the worst of it and remove some particularly egregious miscreant from power, but not often enough.   Once the West gets serious, then Africa can go back to generating vast wealth, this time for the people of Africa.  Long overdue. 

couldn't agree more. I have said several times that Europe has a historic responsibillity to help Africa. For that matter USA too (try to google firestone and Liberia). And America has a responsibillity towards Latin America (it will be interesting to see how Guyana develops)...

Things are connected. We reap what we sow. 

Edited December 21, 2018 by Rasmus Jorgensen

[Rasmus Jorgensen + 1,169]

3 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

The problems in rural France mirror the problems of Rural America, except the ones in France are going to be very, very difficult to turn around.  The reason I say that is due to the peculiarities of France's "socialist" employment laws.  Unless an enterprise entirely shuts down  (and lots have), it is very difficult to lay workers off, without paying a huge penalty, in the form of continuing wages as a form of subsidy to the unemployment-insurance scheme.  The net result is that employers are very reluctant to expand their workforce, preferring instead to contract out work.  Unfortunately, the place where a lot of that contracted-out work is being done is in China. 

In the USA, an employer can speculatively hire more workers and, if the product line takes off,  he keeps them on the payroll.  If not, then he releases the employees, who go off to find other work.  that labor flexibility gives the USA an edge, and most of Europe has been caught up in the ideas of "no firing," so nobody hires either.  At some point the Europeans will have to smarten up, but that requires removal of vast numbers of socialist members of those Parliaments.  And that is the rub. 

Yellow vest protesters have many socialist demands. That the challenge that faces Macron and others - making a managed transition. 

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

3 hours ago, DanilKa said:

Guess what would be the answer in America... Socialism! Pretty good odds for likes of Bernie Sanders to win next election shall nascent bear market turn into full-blown recession

Jeez I hope not.  Socialism is not a workable, long term solution.  Venezuela is a key example of Socialism done correctly.

[shadowkin + 584]

3 hours ago, DanilKa said:

I can relate to that (born in USSR). Same issue in Italy.

Guess what would be the answer in America... Socialism! Pretty good odds for likes of Bernie Sanders to win next election shall nascent bear market turn into full-blown recession

The market is up 30% since Trump was elected. Record low unemployment. A Jew from a small northeastern state who poses as a socialist doesn’t have a hope in hell of being elected president of the United States. Democrats made a show of him in 2016 but everyone knew he wouldn’t be nominated to even contend for the presidency.

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

1 hour ago, Dan Warnick said:

@Jan van Eck Do you have a realistic take on the "Fed vs Get Rid of the Fed" argument?  I don't know what is true, or not, in the bigger picture.

One thing that seems pretty obvious to me: The big to-do over the Fed raising rates another 1/4 point yesterday was simply people (read Wall Street and Washington) diverting blame and reality.  My position on that is, 1/4 point did not matter that much, if at all.  Ok, the Fed may be accused of raising the rate too much too fast over the last year or two, but I believe this last 1/4 point and the simple projection that they may, or may not, raise it again 2 or 3 times next year is a healthy measure for the economy in the long run.  I believe it even stands to help the economy become stronger in time for President Trump's re-election run (whether he gets that or not).

What's your take?

The authority of the US Govt includes the authority to issue money  (paper money)..  Historically, that was the "United States Silver Certificate," backed by an appropriate amount of physical silver held inside the US Treasury vaults.  With the development of fiat currency, the treasury would issue  a "United States Note."    That was a direct issuance by the Treasury.  Some are still around out there. 

Now this Federal Reserve gets created, and the Fed issues its own currency, the Federal Reserve Note,   basically a promissory note of the Federal Reserve Bank to pay you in those US Notes, or perhaps the US Silver Certificates.  Except, they don't.  The Note is nothing more than "fiat currency," except it is not even created by the Treasury, it is a promissory note to issue you a transfer for value in fiat currency of the Treasury.  The only reason it has value is because the US Govt says it has value, and people believe that.  The reality is that the Note has no intrinsic value.  

What the Note system of promises does is transfer control of the money supply, and thus monetary policy, to some unelected men who are answerable to no one, from the govt itself.  Who are those guys to dictate economic policy to the rest of us?  Some old guys who some past president's aide recruited?  It is totally unreal. 

What the Fed system does do well is provide a mechanism for banks to borrow on the overnight discount rate at the Fed window.  That is helpful, but not to the extent that the nation should surrender its monetary policy to those distant relics from previous administrations.  I would scrap the system, or at least the part where the Fed can alter the money supply and dictate interest rates. 

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

Okay.  So, in your opinion, is it simply unnecessary or an impediment, or worse?

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

1 hour ago, Dan Warnick said:

Okay.  So, in your opinion, is it simply unnecessary or an impediment, or worse?

My personal view, it is "worse."  And the reason is, when fiscal or monetary policy implements are placed in the hands of people who are answerable to no one, then you have effectively ceded your sovereignty.  You have created a situation equal to that faced by Greece, which has no control over its own monetary policy, that being held by the controllers of the Euro, the German bankers.

America is not a society that is crafted to be run by anonymous bureaucrats.  I grant you that that is the way it has turned out, but that was never the original intent.  Getting rid of anonymous bureaucrats who dictate to the rest of the society should be the number one priority, as it is apparent that that is the number one problem.

[Illurion + 894]

13 hours ago, Rasmus Jorgensen said:

Have you ever been to Africa? 

I was born in Africa.

[Illurion + 894]

11 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

Oh, please.  Trump's immigration policies are about as mean-spirited as you can get.  Taking infants from mothers?  Locking children in detention cells?  Losing children, after the parents are deported, never to see their children again?  Your little kid is snatched away by some brute with a gun, and that is the last you see of your daughter on the planet earth - because the bureaucracy cannot record her name or keep track of her?  

No thinking person can subscribe to that brutality.  Trump is a con artist, a liar, a scoundrel, and a monster.  The people who support and administer those policies are unfathomably cruel, serious psychopaths, without a shred of decency or empathy.  

None of this is true.

The policy of separating children from their parents was a policy created by OBAMA.   Trump continued it until there were complaints.

Facts show that almost 30% of the "separated children" were actually NOT THE CHILDREN OF THE ADULTS THEY WERE FOUND WITH.  They were unaccompanied children who were taken in tow by the adults in order TO INCREASE THE ADULTS ABILITY TO STAY IN AMERICA.

Facts also show that after Trump killed Obama's separation policy,  and returned the children,   THE PARENTS GAVE OVER 170 OF THEIR CHILDREN BACK TO THE GOVERNMENT WHEN THE PARENTS WERE DEPORTED.   THEY LEFT THEIR KIDS IN FOSTER CARE HERE IN THE USA.

As for con-artists, scoundrels, and monsters,   i can think of many MEDIA PEOPLE THAT FIT THAT DESCRIPTION,   plus a whole bunch of politicians,  and certainly corporate people like ZUCKERBERG & WELCH.   Trump is far more honest than them.

[Red + 252]

15 minutes ago, Illurion said:

None of this is true.

The policy of separating children from their parents was a policy created by OBAMA.   Trump continued it until there were complaints.  Not according to Fact checker: Who lied?

As for con-artists, scoundrels, and monsters,   i can think of many MEDIA PEOPLE THAT FIT THAT DESCRIPTION,   plus a whole bunch of politicians,  and certainly corporate people like ZUCKERBERG & WELCH.   Trump is far more honest than them. Hardly a glowing endorsement: Leader of the Pack (of lies).

 

[Illurion + 894]

11 hours ago, Tom Kirkman said:

Yep.  The next few weeks should be exceedingly interesting, globally.

Have you noticed that quite a number of the previously loudly yapping media celebs are suddenly gone this week / recently?

Enjoy the show.

While the ripple from the French riots and protests will continue outward for some time,  for all intents and purposes,   i think the crisis is pretty much over for now.

Macron will not be resigning,  and the government will not fall at this time.

If you look at history,  COUPS AND SUCCESSFUL REVOLUTIONS ARE VERY QUICK AND SUDDEN.

If the government survives a few weeks,  it will stay in power.

This crisis came and went.

When these protests started 3 weeks ago,  and we discussed it in the other thread that was closed,   i wrote that i felt that FRANCE WILL HAVE A REVOLUTION AND THE GOVERNMENT WILL BE OVERTHROWN IF IT DOES NOT RESOLVE THE MAJOR ISSUES BY THE NEXT ELECTION,  which is several years away.

Those issues are too many incoming migrants,  a failed socialist financial system,  and rising taxes to pay for the migrants falling on already oppressed Native French.

So,  now that the crisis is essentially over,   WHAT IS THE FRENCH GOVERNMENT GOING TO DO ?

If you expect them to correct any of the 3 reasons i listed above,  YOU ARE DREAMING.

The French Government of Elitists will do what they always do.   They will accept no responsibility for what has happened,  and they will begin ATTACKS ON THOSE PEOPLE WHO STOOD UP TO THEM.   

Remember,  to the Elitists,  THEY KNOW EVERYTHING...   So,  they will begin a process to arrest,  and EDUCATE those who protested.

Nothing will change.

Things will only get worse.

So nothing has changed since 3 weeks ago,  i still believe there will be a revolution in France,  and the government will be overthrown if it does not resolve the issues by the next election.

So,  we have another year or two to watch what happens.

 

[Illurion + 894]

34 minutes ago, Red said:

 

Believe what you want to believe.

I believe Trump.

Have a Merry Christmas.

[Red + 252]

1 hour ago, Illurion said:

Believe what you want to believe.

I believe Trump.

Have a Merry Christmas.

I pointed out that what you said was not likely to be true, despite your claims.  Who and what you believe is a mater for you alone.  However if you choose to present facts then it would be good to know that there was a reasoned basis for them, and ascribing Trump hardly offers confidence.

[TXPower + 643]

5 hours ago, Red said:

 

As I have pointed out before, getting to the truth is, well, difficult.  Just when you think you’ve found it....  Fact-check.org is funded by the Annenberg Public Policy Foundation which although founded by a conservative, is not necessarily a conservative foundation any longer.   Obama chaired the Chicago Annenberg Challenge while still in Chicago with great influence over millions of dollars in Annenberg Foundation money.  Foundation money like that isn’t placed under the control of just anyone.  Factcheck may not be as fair and balanced as they’d have us believe.  I’m not exactly sure who to believe and doubt I’m alone.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2923825/posts

 

https://capitalresearch.org/article/obama-annenberg-ayers-2/

 

https://www.factcheck.org/our-funding/

 

 

 

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

Canada might be the next country to boil over.

 

‘Domestic realities,’ not #WelcomeToCanada tweet, to blame for migrants ‘fleeing’ U.S.: Trudeau

Prime Minister Justin Trudeau says it’s not his controversial #WelcomeToCanada tweet driving the thousands of migrants “fleeing” the United States.

Instead, it is the current political situation south of the border that’s to blame.

“If people are in the midst of migration around the world right now, it’s not because of a tweet restating — almost word for word — Canadian policy on refuges, because that’s exactly what it was,” he said in a year-end interview with the West Block’s Mercedes Stephenson.

“And certainly, if people are fleeing the United States right now and are choosing to leave the United States right now, it’s not something I said. It is perhaps domestic realities within the political context in the United States that is driving people to move or to make those certain decisions.”

Roughly 35,000 migrants have crossed the border into Canada at unofficial entry points since early 2017.

The influx came amid the election, inauguration and resulting escalation in anti-immigrant rhetoric and policies of U.S. President Donald Trump.

On Jan. 28, Trudeau posted a tweet that Conservative critics have argued encouraged what turned into a wave of irregular migration. ...

[Rasmus Jorgensen + 1,169]

11 hours ago, Illurion said:

I was born in Africa.

OK. 

When was the last time you were back? I was in Nigeria less than 2 months ago. 

I believe that there is a growing group of younger Africans that actually want to better their countries. Not for altruistic reasons, but because they recognize that stabillity will create a better life for themselfes and their families. We can help by implementing trade policies that give them a chance. Supporting anti-corruption measures etc. This will slowly and surely turn Africa into an economic power-house and stop Africans migrating. They may even want to return voluntarily. 

All it takes is for us (=Europe and US) to stop abusing and pillaging Africa. That needs leadership. The problem is whenever ideas like these are presented they are immediately attacked a pro-immigration, wanting to import votes etc. I am all for discussing. I just cannot understand we cannot start by discussing what we want to achieve. And then discuss how we do it ? And try to do it without resorting to low-bro memes or similar. I will present my ideas and listen openly. 

[Rasmus Jorgensen + 1,169]

22 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

Nobody in France is giving up the Yellow Jackets struggle until the government falls. 

And the reason is that the Macron government just does not "get it."  They, and Mr. Macron  (who incidentally by all reports is brilliant, an IQ probably over 180)  do not grasp the pain that chronic unemployment and shuttering of traditional manufacturing has brought to rural France.  It just seems not to sink in.  I look at the street struggles in the Port city of La Rochelle, and it shows that the once-proud shipyards are standing empty.  Where are the orders for new roll-on ferries and tankers and cargo liners and cruise ships?  Not happening, not there.  The work force is unemployed, nothing to do except drink.  

In China, that would be unacceptable and intolerable.  The Chinese have developed laser strategies to develop and expand those pockets of under-industrialization.  They will pick an entire sector, and an entire product concept  (such as, for example, solar panels), and pur in the capital and the management expertise to make that a rip-roaring success.   The French bureaucrats don't do that - because they cannot grasp  any of it.  The whole situation is beyond their comprehension.  SO the politicians stand around with mouth agape, not comprehending why the rural people revolt.   

What France really needs is an infusion of American entrepreneurs to take over the bureaucracy and turn it around. 

I agree. 

There is only one way forward - inclusive economic growth. Full stop. How to get that is difficult discussion.

ps. there are entrepeneurs in Europe too.