AdrianC + 42 AC February 12, 2019 Nicolas Maduro has asked OPEC to support one of its founding members Venezuela against the U.S. sanctions on the Latin American country’s oil industry citing their impact on oil prices and potential risks for other members of the producer group. He asked that OPEC denounce the “shameless dispossession” of Venezuelan assets, but Maduro’s call for help has fallen on deaf ears because of the OPEC's policy of avoiding political disputes involving individual members. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom Kirkman + 8,860 February 12, 2019 OPEC will ignore Maduro. 3 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dan Warnick + 6,100 February 12, 2019 Venezuelan oil out of the equation works for OPEC. OPEC might not be the best at some things, but they get that. 3 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jill Schottenstein + 6 February 12, 2019 OPEC is considering a US public relations campaign including boosting the US Energy industry. They might be moving a bill through Congress to allow the Justice Dept to sue member countries for antitrust violations. 2 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nafiu Sulyman + 4 NS February 12, 2019 I don't think there's much help OPEC can offer Maduro's Venezuela. The US always get what they want, don't they? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dan Warnick + 6,100 February 12, 2019 8 minutes ago, Nafiu Sulyman said: I don't think there's much help OPEC can offer Maduro's Venezuela. The US always get what they want, don't they? Yeah, it's funny how being on the right side of the law and having people's best interests in one's sights tends to make one a winner. No, the U.S. is not perfect, far from it, but who's better and more capable? 3 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nafiu Sulyman + 4 NS February 14, 2019 On 2/12/2019 at 9:37 PM, Dan Warnick said: Yeah, it's funny how being on the right side of the law and having people's best interests in one's sights tends to make one a winner. No, the U.S. is not perfect, far from it, but who's better and more capable? Russia should have been able to step in on this sort of scenario surrounding Venezuelean politics.. I mean.. The Russians have stakes and investment in PVSDA.. But unfortunately, Russia becomes passive in times like this like a deer. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
panditji + 1 RP February 14, 2019 I really hope the Russians step up and sort out the Venezuelan crisis.. Putin and China combined can stop the US from meddling as usual.. 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TXPower + 643 TP February 14, 2019 23 minutes ago, panditji said: I really hope the Russians step up and sort out the Venezuelan crisis.. Putin and China combined can stop the US from meddling as usual.. Nope, not on their best days could they. Not in a humanitarian, economic or military context. Not even close. 5 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Illurion + 894 IG February 17, 2019 On 2/11/2019 at 8:30 PM, AdrianC said: Nicolas Maduro has asked OPEC to support one of its founding members Venezuela against the U.S. sanctions on the Latin American country’s oil industry citing their impact on oil prices and potential risks for other members of the producer group. He asked that OPEC denounce the “shameless dispossession” of Venezuelan assets, but Maduro’s call for help has fallen on deaf ears because of the OPEC's policy of avoiding political disputes involving individual members. After all of the foreign owned oil assets that Chavez and Maduro have "NATIONALIZED" over time, it is really very "HYPOCRITICAL" for Maduro to use the words "SHAMELESS DISPOSSESSION OF VENEZUELAN ASSETS" to describe anyone...! 1 1 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Illurion + 894 IG February 17, 2019 On 2/14/2019 at 1:53 PM, panditji said: I really hope the Russians step up and sort out the Venezuelan crisis.. Putin and China combined can stop the US from meddling as usual.. The Russians can barely take care of themselves. The Russians are far too smart to get involved with Venezuela, as the country has just too many needs, and Maduro is a despot that even the Russians look unfavorably toward.. Putin has used the situation as an opportunity to move some of his military in and out of Venezuela, BUT, he does that just to annoy the United States, not because he wants to help Maduro. The Chinese would no doubt love to get control of Venezuela through a default on "ONE ROAD" loans, but Trump has explained to China that they can LOAN money to anyone they want, but that under the MONROE DOCTRINE, the United States will not allow China to take over Venezuela if it defaults on such loans... So China is putting most of their "One Road" money in Africa instead... The USA isn't meddling, and is trying to keep others from meddling also. It is hoped that the Venezuelan military will take out Maduro and resolve the problem internally. 3 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Illurion + 894 IG February 17, 2019 On 2/12/2019 at 3:27 PM, Nafiu Sulyman said: I don't think there's much help OPEC can offer Maduro's Venezuela. The US always get what they want, don't they? The USA usually does get what it wants, and that has historically been a good thing for most of the peoples involved around the world.... But the USA did not put Venezuela onto the path of the destruction that it has reaped. Chavez did that when he NATIONALIZED, AND STOLE THE ASSETS OF PRACTICALLY EVERY FOREIGN COMPANY THAT EVER INVESTED IN VENEZUELA... Maduro continued what Chavez started. They have reaped what they sowed... NO ONE TRUSTS VENEZUELA ANYMORE... You are right that OPEC is unwilling to help Maduro, as at its core, OPEC is a "club of competitive wolves". Each wolf would "gladly kill its rivals" if it could, but they find the "pickings" better if they run as a "pack." By letting Venezuela slide into anarchy, the OPEC wolves are killing off one of their rivals.... 4 1 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gchakko + 8 GC February 18, 2019 Saudi Arabia and Russia alone has 21 pc of world oil reserves and OPEC has over 40 pc of world oil sales apart from potential reserves. But U.S. believes, it is the largest producer, and can control oil sales, hence world economy, on what factual basis,? ISo conquer Venezuela, is that it? t is time U.S. kneels down and confess its pretension. Principally OPEC can ask U.S. to go to hell. But the U.S. under Trump is so stupid, that it wants cheap coal earning you a lung smog to substitute boosting alternative energy research for tangible alternatives to oil. Energy future for the long shot otherwise, U.S. is bleak. George Chakko, Vienna (Austria), 18/ 02/ ’19 02:47hrs CET 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Illurion + 894 IG February 18, 2019 3 hours ago, gchakko said: Saudi Arabia and Russia alone has 21 pc of world oil reserves and OPEC has over 40 pc of world oil sales apart from potential reserves. But U.S. believes, it is the largest producer, and can control oil sales, hence world economy, on what factual basis,? ISo conquer Venezuela, is that it? t is time U.S. kneels down and confess its pretension. Principally OPEC can ask U.S. to go to hell. But the U.S. under Trump is so stupid, that it wants cheap coal earning you a lung smog to substitute boosting alternative energy research for tangible alternatives to oil. Energy future for the long shot otherwise, U.S. is bleak. George Chakko, Vienna (Austria), 18/ 02/ ’19 02:47hrs CET I disagree with most everything you said with the exception of the "reserves" figures... YOU SEEM TO CONFUSE "CONTROL" with "INFLUENCE"... What you are failing to take into account is the POLITICAL aspect of the oil industry...... NO ONE ENTITY "CONTROLS" THE OIL INDUSTRY..... BUT MANY ENTITIES HAVE "INFLUENCE" OVER WHAT HAPPENS IN THE OIL INDUSTRY....... The USA has historically been the largest CONSUMER of oil products, and because of that, oil products are EXCHANGED IN USA DOLLARS.... So, yes, the USA has great influence over the oil industry in general because of the USA dollar...... OPEC , operating as a cartel / monopoly, has MANIPULATED OIL PRICES TO BE ARTIFICIALLY MUCH HIGHER than they would be without the intervention of OPEC for the last 40 years...... That has given OPEC influence also...... But OPEC exists because the USA, and the other OIL CONSUMING ENTITIES "allow" OPEC to exist...... Saudi Arabia exists as an independent country because it is protected by the USA...... Now that OPEC is in disarray, for the moment, the USA has even MORE influence over the oil industry in general... The USA did not bankrupt Venezuela, as that countries own leaders did that by nationalizing (STEALING) the assets of foreign companies... The USA has no interest in "conquering" Venezuela, and is patiently waiting for the Venezuelan people to stand up and resolve their own problems...... Coal has many uses, and the USA does not have any SMOG problems like Europe, China, and Russia, etc....... The only "air quality" problems we do have have nothing to do with COAL...... The USA "LEADS THE WORLD" in the application of "alternative energy" sources such as SOLAR, and HYDRO, however, until better BATTERY AND STORAGE TECHNOLOGIES ARE DEVELOPED, "alternative energy" sources are a "pipe-dream".... Only a fool thinks otherwise.... So, GCHAKKO in Vienna, i hope you enjoy your winter heating bill, most likely supplied by Natural Gas from Russia......... or COAL... Given the political situation with Russia and their natural gas pipelines, it may be that it is YOUR FUTURE IN VIENNA that is "bleak." 3 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bhimsen Pachawry + 72 February 19, 2019 On 2/12/2019 at 7:08 AM, Tom Kirkman said: OPEC will ignore Maduro. OPEC never intervenes in political matter. But the member states will help. KSA has already shipped Naphtha to Venezuela, UAE has purchased gold and so on already in last 30 days. On 2/13/2019 at 12:54 AM, Dan Warnick said: Venezuelan oil out of the equation works for OPEC. OPEC might not be the best at some things, but they get that. OPEC doesn't mind Venezuela out of equation but does mind Venezuela oil under USA control. It is not that if Venezuela oil goes out, it will.not come back up again in future. On 2/13/2019 at 1:57 AM, Nafiu Sulyman said: I don't think there's much help OPEC can offer Maduro's Venezuela. The US always get what they want, don't they? This time it is not the case. There will be help offered by many. But unlike USA, others are more mature and simply do what is needed instead of giving statements On 2/13/2019 at 1:49 AM, Jill Schottenstein said: OPEC is considering a US public relations campaign including boosting the US Energy industry. They might be moving a bill through Congress to allow the Justice Dept to sue member countries for antitrust violations OPEC has oil to offer. USA is still a net importer if oil. Why will someone with resources beg for a consumer? Only people with luxury or recreation goods need to market. People with critical goods like oil or food don't need to market. Do you see farmers marketing their milk and grains by waging PR campaign? On 2/13/2019 at 2:07 AM, Dan Warnick said: Yeah, it's funny how being on the right side of the law and having people's best interests in one's sights tends to make one a winner. No, the U.S. is not perfect, far from it, but who's better and more capable? It is funny that USA makes Venezuelan law. How about Venezuela making USA law and appointing USA government ij exile? On 2/15/2019 at 12:49 AM, TXPower said: Nope, not on their best days could they. Not in a humanitarian, economic or military context. Not even close. Giving some arms and air defence items like S400 is not a hard thing for anyone. On 2/17/2019 at 3:33 PM, Illurion said: The Russians can barely take care of themselves. The Russians are far too smart to get involved with Venezuela, as the country has just too many needs, and Maduro is a despot that even the Russians look unfavorably toward.. Putin has used the situation as an opportunity to move some of his military in and out of Venezuela, BUT, he does that just to annoy the United States, not because he wants to help Maduro. The Chinese would no doubt love to get control of Venezuela through a default on "ONE ROAD" loans, but Trump has explained to China that they can LOAN money to anyone they want, but that under the MONROE DOCTRINE, the United States will not allow China to take over Venezuela if it defaults on such loans... So China is putting most of their "One Road" money in Africa instead... The USA isn't meddling, and is trying to keep others from meddling also. It is hoped that the Venezuelan military will take out Maduro and resolve the problem internally Why should China accept Monroe doctrine? Isn't USA propping up Taiwan? Why would China accept USA terms when USA doesn't accept Chinese terms? Things work on give and take. If one tries to take everything without giving back anything, it will not work. Even Russia holds a grudge against USA. Why will Russia keep quiet when the USA has not kept quiet whenever it got an opportunity to trouble Russia? 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bhimsen Pachawry + 72 February 19, 2019 On 2/18/2019 at 11:08 AM, Illurion said: The USA has historically been the largest CONSUMER of oil products, and because of that, oil products are EXCHANGED IN USA DOLLARS Petrodollar was a political deal during cold war against atheist USSR by USA & Islamist. It has nothing to do with huge consumption. It is not that other countries don't like to consume oil. Everyone loves excess. On 2/18/2019 at 11:08 AM, Illurion said: The USA did not bankrupt Venezuela, as that countries own leaders did that by nationalizing (STEALING) the assets of foreign companies.. The very act of giving Natural resources to foreign companies was theft. Venezuela just reclaimed the stolen goods back. How did it end up making Venezuela bankrupt? If any, it should impoverish the foreign countries 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Illurion + 894 IG February 19, 2019 5 hours ago, Bhimsen Pachawry said: OPEC never intervenes in political matter. But the member states will help. KSA has already shipped Naphtha to Venezuela, UAE has purchased gold and so on already in last 30 days. OPEC doesn't mind Venezuela out of equation but does mind Venezuela oil under USA control. It is not that if Venezuela oil goes out, it will.not come back up again in future. This time it is not the case. There will be help offered by many. But unlike USA, others are more mature and simply do what is needed instead of giving statements OPEC has oil to offer. USA is still a net importer if oil. Why will someone with resources beg for a consumer? Only people with luxury or recreation goods need to market. People with critical goods like oil or food don't need to market. Do you see farmers marketing their milk and grains by waging PR campaign? It is funny that USA makes Venezuelan law. How about Venezuela making USA law and appointing USA government ij exile? Giving some arms and air defence items like S400 is not a hard thing for anyone. Why should China accept Monroe doctrine? Isn't USA propping up Taiwan? Why would China accept USA terms when USA doesn't accept Chinese terms? Things work on give and take. If one tries to take everything without giving back anything, it will not work. Even Russia holds a grudge against USA. Why will Russia keep quiet when the USA has not kept quiet whenever it got an opportunity to trouble Russia? You seem to like to back losers....! Maduro is toast, and Venezuela will be free soon when Democracy is restored, and history will show that the OPEC members did nothing TO HELP THE VENEZUELAN PEOPLE... OPEN YOUR EYES.. The Venezuelan Parliament chose their new President after Maduro rigged the election and killed his opponents to get re-elected.... Once freedom is restored in Venezuela, and the Oil Industry is back on it's feet, DO NOT BE SURPRISED IF VENEZUELA WANTS NOTHING TO DO WITH OPEC IN THE FUTURE....... As for China accepting the Monroe Doctrine, THEY DO NOT HAVE A CHOICE.........! The USA does not PROP UP Taiwan, as Taiwan has been quite successful at taking care of itself, with the USA protecting it from China... China would be really foolish to attack Taiwan...... Russia has never had a reason to hold a GRUDGE against the USA, as the USA SAVED RUSSIA'S ASS IN WORLD WAR ONE, WORLD WAR TWO, and after the CCCP collapsed at the end of the cold war, WHO CAME TO RUSSIA'S AID WITH OVER A TRILLION DOLLARS IN AID, THATS RIGHT, THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA........! The United States of America has always been there when Russia was in danger of falling......... We even sent in a force of troops to try to save the Romanov Family, but were too late to save them...... Russia has always been an UNGRATEFUL child when it comes to what it owes to the USA....... 1 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Illurion + 894 IG February 19, 2019 5 hours ago, Bhimsen Pachawry said: The very act of giving Natural resources to foreign companies was theft. Venezuela just reclaimed the stolen goods back. How did it end up making Venezuela bankrupt? If any, it should impoverish the foreign countries You are deluded.. No one GAVE anything to foreign companies, THE VENEZUELAN GOVERNMENT SIGNED CONTRACTS, AND WAS "PAID" BY FOREIGN COMPANIES TO BUILD FACILITIES IN VENEZUELA........... THEN, AFTER THEY WERE BUILT, WHEN CHAVEZ TOOK OVER THE GOVERNMENT, HE VOIDED THE CONTRACTS, AND NATIONALIZED "stole" THOSE FACILITIES.... Maduro continued when Chavez died.... The only people that are "IMPOVERISHED" are the Venezuelan people, and that was done to them by Chavez, and Maduro...... GOD killed Chavez, but i expect Maduro will be killed by the "impoverished" Venezuelan people he has tortured and enslaved....... Soon Maduro and his helpers will find themselves hanging upside down with their throats cut.......... 2 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bhimsen Pachawry + 72 February 19, 2019 51 minutes ago, Illurion said: The Venezuelan Parliament chose their new President after Maduro rigged the election and killed his opponents to get re-elected... How do you know that Venezuelan elections were rigged? It was the opposition that shouted for elections and Maduro held it. Then the demand was to give extra time which Maduro refused as the decision to hold elections was already taken. So, after losing elections, it was called as rigged. How was it rigged? Why should not one say that USA elections were also rigged? 51 minutes ago, Illurion said: The USA does not PROP UP Taiwan, as Taiwan has been quite successful at taking care of itself, with the USA protecting it from China Taiwan was propped by USA. After civil war in China between CCP & KMT, CCP won but USA propped up KMT and helped them establish in Taiwan. So, if USA can antagonize China, China can antagonize USA. Same with all countries like Russia, India, middle east etc who also have been troubled by USA 52 minutes ago, Illurion said: Russia has never had a reason to hold a GRUDGE against the USA, as the USA SAVED RUSSIA'S ASS IN WORLD WAR ONE, WORLD WAR TWO, and after the CCCP collapsed at the end of the cold war, WHO CAME TO RUSSIA'S AID WITH OVER A TRILLION DOLLARS IN AID, THATS RIGHT, THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA........! Russia was not helped by USA. It was just coincidence that UK and Russia had to fight the same enemy and USA being english state, had to ally with Russia. USA dis not save Russia in 1990s but strangled Russia taking advantage of Gorbachev weakness. The loans were political tool to contain Russia rather than help it. Russia realised this later as the benefits of the loans was outshadowed by costs 50 minutes ago, Illurion said: No one GAVE anything to foreign companies, THE VENEZUELAN GOVERNMENT SIGNED CONTRACTS, AND WAS "PAID" BY FOREIGN COMPANIES TO BUILD FACILITIES IN VENEZUELA........... THEN, AFTER THEY WERE BUILT, WHEN CHAVEZ TOOK OVER THE GOVERNMENT, HE VOIDED THE CONTRACTS, AND NATIONALIZED "stole" THOSE FACILITIES That was not stealing. The private companies were indulging in unfair practices and interfering in politics. They were organising strikes and protests despite calling themselves as business. Hence they had to be treated like political outfits rather than private business 1 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Illurion + 894 IG February 19, 2019 (edited) 9 hours ago, Bhimsen Pachawry said: Russia was not helped by USA. It was just coincidence that UK and Russia had to fight the same enemy and USA being english state, had to ally with Russia. You have a different view of the world from my point of view..... Nationalizing is stealing...... As for Russia never having been helped by the USA, when i next visit my Great-Grandfather's grave, i will tell him what you said... I am sure he will be surprised to hear that the USA never helped Russia, given that during World War One, he was a crewman on an American Merchantman that was sunk by a German U-Boat while transporting tanks to the Russian port of Murmansk...... After his ship went down, he was rescued. i am glad he was, as otherwise, neither i, my Parents, or my Grand-Parents would ever have been born... You obviously know little about how the USA has helped what is now called Russia over the last 100 years or so...... The sad thing is, that no matter what we do for them, they still consider us to be the enemy........ Edited February 20, 2019 by Illurion 2 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Catfishvodka + 7 AC February 20, 2019 (edited) On 2/19/2019 at 3:21 AM, Bhimsen Pachawry said: "Why should China accept Monroe doctrine? Isn't USA propping up Taiwan? Why would China accept USA terms when USA doesn't accept Chinese terms? Things work on give and take. If one tries to take everything without giving back anything, it will not work." China has no choice The US and the West have paved the way for China to extract raw materials from Africa and Afghanistan. The Chinese were gifted the raw materials and trade routes at the expense of the US courtesy of treasonous politicians. China cannot maintain this relationship without US cooperation. China has done all of the taking. Now things are being negotiated. China has no leverage outside of its influence on traitorous US politicians. We shall see... Edited February 20, 2019 by Catfishvodka 4 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bhimsen Pachawry + 72 February 20, 2019 54 minutes ago, Catfishvodka said: China has no choice The US and the West have paved the way for China to extract raw materials from Africa and Afghanistan. The Chinese were gifted the raw materials and trade routes at the expense of the US courtesy of treasonous politicians. China cannot maintain this relationship without US cooperation. China has done all of the taking. Now things are being negotiated. China has no leverage outside of its influence on traitorous US politicians. We shall see... China gets nothing in Afghanistan. Also, China grew because of its own Natural resources. Only after it became big, it started getting others resources. USA has no say in that. In fact USA itself survives on Arabs petrodollar deal which USA deceptively acquired creating a sense of fear of USSR 'atheists' who would destroy Islam if left unchecked. Speaking of USA largesse is a fallacy 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sukumar Ray + 52 February 20, 2019 On 2/15/2019 at 12:23 AM, panditji said: I really hope the Russians step up and sort out the Venezuelan crisis.. Putin and China combined can stop the US from meddling as usual.. No body wants to bell the cat 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Catfishvodka + 7 AC February 20, 2019 24 minutes ago, Bhimsen Pachawry said: China gets nothing in Afghanistan. Also, China grew because of its own Natural resources. Only after it became big, it started getting others resources. USA has no say in that. In fact USA itself survives on Arabs petrodollar deal which USA deceptively acquired creating a sense of fear of USSR 'atheists' who would destroy Islam if left unchecked. Speaking of USA largesse is a fallacy You should start here... Who do you think wins all the bids? Metallurgical Corporation of China 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bhimsen Pachawry + 72 February 20, 2019 23 hours ago, Illurion said: Nationalizing is stealing Stealing from thieves is not theft but reclaiming. In Venezuela, the private companies were interfering in politics which they were not supposed to do. Otherwise they become criminals, not business. About USA helping Russia, USA simply wanted to avoid bolshevik revolution and hence helped Russia. But USA was dead against USSR after the revolution. Only when forced to side with USSR due to WW2 where UK & USSR were against Germany, USA again joined the waron USSR side. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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