US-backed coup in Venezuela not so smooth

[Maxim Androsov + 31]

42 minutes ago, Enthalpic said:

Dear Russia,

I argue with fools for fun - send money.

I wish my arguments are paid..

Have to probably start seriously thinking about it after not so "honest Serhii" called me "a troll".

[Maxim Androsov + 31]

27 minutes ago, TXPower said:

Russian Troll Detected.

Hmmm. You are.. that.. simple person?  

Ok then.

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

2 hours ago, Serhii Li said:

 

Hi, all real and honest members of Oilprice, 

those 2 members (Observatus Geopoliticus, Maxim Androsov)  above are clearly just paid russian trolls. They use different nicknames, but post same info everywhere: 

I'm from Donetsk, Ukrainian city occupied and controlled by Russia since 2014. Since Russian invasion in Ukraine in 2014 I have seen literally thousands of these accounts with proven links to known paid-troll-factories in Russia. Moreover, due to Russian propaganda being so waste, some people became persuaded that this information from troll-factory is true, so these people became free-trolls. 

 

Hi, Serhii, and thank you for posting.  I am so sorry for what has happened to Ukraine - being dismembered by that Russian Army, to be left to rot and ruin.  It is, unfortunately, going to take a long time, possibly a very long time, before the Russian mercenaries can be pushed out of the Donesk and Luhansk. To no surprise, the real force that can do that quickly is the American Army and their Abrams battle tanks.  I am pushing for 500 tanks to be sent to the Ukrainian Army.  You have already received top-notch military gear including anti-tank missiles.  We will push them out.  Freedom is unstoppable.

Meanwhile, back to the trolls.  Mr. "Androsov" tells us that he sits there (what, at the dinner table?) with his Swedish friends and his laptop and the best conversation they can have is to read posts from Oilprice and guffaw about them.  Yet Sunday night here in America we had dinner and had an interesting and intelligent discussion about The Merchant of Venice.  I was remarking on how Portia outfoxed Shylock in the trial before the Dutchess. The play encapsulated how medieval Christians related to the Jews that had settled among them  (not very well). I think that dinner discussion was superior to Androsov's where the best he can do is go "he, heee!" on his troll posts.  Assuming, of course, that the mythical Swedes are not part of his fertile imagination. 

In any event, trolls are best ignored.  Since Oilprice is a world forum, hard to keep them out, unfortunately.   

Be of good cheer.  The Americans are coming. 

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

2 hours ago, Maxim Androsov said:

That's so funny!

Serhii (or whoever you are in real life), I don't know who you are. Maybe you are someone,  but maybe you are nobody.

Contrary to your allusions, I'm not a troll but a real name with 25 years of experience in oil shipping industry (one can always check my FB profile that I used when I registered on this site). 

Every time when ukrainian like you, with no ability to hold a discussion, sees russian on forum he applies one and only tactic - to start calling russian "a troll" and appeal to the audience to come to the rescue pretending he is a victim (personally) of a Russian aggression. How pathetic!

We are not discussing Ukraine-Russia relations here Serhii. This topic is about something else. You don't need to always bring your Ukrainian questionable agenda everywhere you go on this planet thinking that people should start immediately feeling pity and sorry for you and give you a candy or two.

Just grow some balls before you enter serious talk and don't start with fishing for a sympathy instead. 

That is a disgusting post.  A truly disgusting post.  "Just grow some balls"?   "Fishing for sympathy"?  How dare you have the effrontery, after your master sends in anti-aircraft missile batteries and you Russians shoot down and murder an entire 777 planeload of civilians, most of whom I remind you were Dutch.  Russia - homeland of Putin, the murdering blackheart of the planet.  

If anyone richly deserves death by hanging, it is Putin.  He is an Outlaw, a gangster at war with the civilized world.  And that includes the Ukranian peoples. 

[Rodent + 1,424]

7 hours ago, Enthalpic said:

Sigh, you have an outdated opinion of where women fit in this world.  Women are far more than wives and baby factories nowadays...

I can't imagine any calling higher than wife and mother. 

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

8 minutes ago, Rodent said:

I can't imagine any calling higher than wife and mother. 

And Rodi, in ten words you have said it all. 

I genuflect in awe. 

[Jouhou + 24]

9 hours ago, Observatus Geopoliticus said:

What you don't get is that the world is fed up with US imperialism. We just don't care what you like or not...

I directed that at other americans, I understand that other nationalities don't share our views. I was pointing out we are more alike than different in how receptive of other cultures and governments we are, we just use different words to characterize them.

Also, what country are you from anyways? You used a weird word earlier that when I Google searched turned up mostly Indian sites.

Also: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero_Hedge 

Edited February 26, 2019 by Jouhou

[Observatus Geopoliticus + 96]

11 hours ago, Zhong Lu said:

 Iraq had to be invaded because of a humanitarian crisis thanks to the horror of Saddam Hussein.

If US invades Venezuela, it would be at the behest of its legitimate president, Mr. Guiado against a pretender (Maduro).  

In Vietnam the Americans were invited in by the legitimate president of Vietnam at the time. But both China and Russia interfered in South Vietnam's internal affairs by sending support to the Viet Cong to start a civil war.  

No humanitarian crisis in Iraq. Just a brutal but stable dictator or anarchy and civil war. The US choosed the latest. The only problem is the US supported Saddam when he was commiting his crimes against Kurds and Iran, even helping him with satellite imagery when he gased the Iranians :

http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82

When they no longer needed him, they dropped and attacked him. So the US cared about iraqi humanitarian situation as I care about cricket in Antartica...

Guaido isn't legitimate and Maduro, for better or worst, is.

In Vietnam, there was a coup orchestrated by the US to give power to Diem. He was not the legitimate president. Check your history.

Edited February 26, 2019 by Observatus Geopoliticus

[Observatus Geopoliticus + 96]

11 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

Americans are overwhelmingly decent people.

Tell the millions they killed. Tell the millions they made suffer with a coup.

Easy to be pro-american in Europe because, it's true, they helped nurture democracy there against the Soviet Union. But in other continents, they helped military dictatures (Latin America), they armed islamic terrorists (Asia) and they even supported Pol Pot's Khmers rouges and his maoist murderous gang.

So no, sorry sir, they're not decent at all. They're a huge problem for the world, not a solution...

Edited February 26, 2019 by Observatus Geopoliticus

[Observatus Geopoliticus + 96]

7 hours ago, Serhii Li said:

those 2 members (Observatus Geopoliticus, Maxim Androsov)  above are clearly just paid russian trolls. They use different nicknames, but post same info everywhere

You can just post "Russian troll detected"

Usual answer by a troll who doesn't state a single fact/argument. I sum up your mindset : ''You doesn't agree with me but I have no clue nor argument to oppose, so you're a Russian troll''.

Poor guy...

[Observatus Geopoliticus + 96]

5 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

I am so sorry for what has happened to Ukraine - being dismembered by that Russian Army, to be left to rot and ruin.  It is, unfortunately, going to take a long time, possibly a very long time, before the Russian mercenaries can be pushed out of the Donesk and Luhansk.

Ukraine has been dismenbered by the US'backed Maidan coup. Disagree ? Even George Friedman admits it :

http://us-russia.org/2902-in-ukraine-us-interests-are-incompatible-with-the-interests-of-the-russian-federation-stratfor-chief-george-friedman-on-the-roots-of-the-ukraine-crisis.html

As he calls it, THE MOST BLATANT COUP IN HISTORY.

So you can rant all you want about bad Russians, mercenaries or illuminati if you want. One responsible for the Ukraine crisis : the US, as usual...

[Observatus Geopoliticus + 96]

3 hours ago, Jouhou said:

I directed that at other americans, I understand that other nationalities don't share our views. I was pointing out we are more alike than different in how receptive of other cultures and governments we are, we just use different words to characterize them.

Also, what country are you from anyways? You used a weird word earlier that when I Google searched turned up mostly Indian sites.

Most Democrats and Republicans are of the same imperialist brand and for the outside world, there's no difference between war criminal Bush Jr and so called Nobel peace prize but war mongering Obama.

The hope of the world is that an american peacefull leadership comes to power. Fisrt hope was Trump and his ''Drain the swamp'' programme. Yet, he finally bowed down to the Deep State as we see in the Venezuelan case. I wish everything best for Tulsi in 2020 but the imperial presstitute is at her already.

Other US politicians I like : Ron Paul , Rand Paul, Pat Buchanan and somehow Bernie Sanders. Their common point : say f.... to the Deep State and stop US imperialist wars.

As for my nationality, I'm French living abroad for a long time.

Edited February 26, 2019 by Observatus Geopoliticus

[Jouhou + 24]

17 minutes ago, Observatus Geopoliticus said:

Most Democrats and Republicans are of the same imperialist brand and for the outside world, there's no difference between war criminal Bush Jr and so called Nobel peace prize but war mongering Obama.

The hope of the world is that an american peacefull leadership comes to power. Fisrt hope was Trump and his ''Drain the swamp'' programme. Yet, he finally bowed down to the Deep State as we see in the Venezuelan case. I wish everything best for Tulsi in 2020 but the imperial presstitute is at her already.

Other US politicians I like : Ron Paul , Rand Paul, Pat Buchanan and somehow Bernie Sanders. Their common point : say f.... to the Deep State and stop US imperialist wars.

As for my nationality, I'm French living abroad for a long time.

OK, makes sense, you didn't otherwise come off Indian so I was confused.

As for the entities labeled as the "deep state" they don't want us intervening in Venezuela. It's a damn trap. I don't like it and I don't trust it, and most of our "imperialist" politicians don't either. Except for Marco Rubio, he seems to be getting hot and bothered at the thought of it. But he's Cuban, American Cubans really hate anything they associate with Cuba.

[Maxim Androsov + 31]

8 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

That is a disgusting post.  A truly disgusting post.  "Just grow some balls"?   "Fishing for sympathy"?  How dare you have the effrontery, after your master sends in anti-aircraft missile batteries and you Russians shoot down and murder an entire 777 planeload of civilians, most of whom I remind you were Dutch.  Russia - homeland of Putin, the murdering blackheart of the planet.  

If anyone richly deserves death by hanging, it is Putin.  He is an Outlaw, a gangster at war with the civilized world.  And that includes the Ukranian peoples. 

I don't have any "masters". I'm self-employed businessman of Russian descent who live and work in Sweden since 25 years. As to your statement that we "Russians shot down 777" I can definitely tell you that I personally didn't do it. It's like for me to say that you, dutch, were all nazi collaborators during the WWII. I'm intelligent enough to not start accusing all dutch in the atrocities they carried out in Russia together with nazis. Despite the fact that there were, indeed, more collaborators and those who joined Waffen-SS among the dutch than those, who were in the resistance movement.

https://www.historynet.com/in-the-uniform-of-the-enemy.htm    

I feel sorry for MH-17 and all people, including the dutch, who died in that terrible crash. And my sympathy goes to those dead and their families. However, not everyone in the world is entirely convinced in the findings of the dutch JIT just because the findings of that commission are based on the evidence provided by the Ukraine and the United States which both are certainly biased parties. There are plenty suspicious circumstances that preclude everyone to accept the official version of the story. Among those suspicious facts are:

- Why the flight was rerouted by the Ukrainian flight control from the original flight path further eastward, i.e. deeper into the zone of military conflict?

- Why so "conveniently" exactly on that day (according to own JIT findings) the ukrainian radar station which was supposed to monitor the trajectories of flights in that area was out of order, and another station was being repaired?

- Why ukrainian "other data" was not released due to "security reasons"?

- Why the US has not publicly released her own radar data citing "security reasons"?

There are few more dark holes into all this story.

Yes, the Dutch inquiry found that it was a Russian-made BUK missile that hit the plane. But that's all. 

Needless to remind you that those missiles' batteries were at that time in possession by the ukrainian army as well as Russian.

I'm not implying that the ukrainian army did, in fact, down MH-17. I'm just saying I'm not entirely convinced, judging the facts, that it could not have been a more sinister scenario, than the one that was officially presented to us.

What kind of scenario? - I don't know. I just know about one particular recently declassified event that I find truly disgusting: Operation Northwoods, if you don't know about it. 

https://allgovernmentslie.com/lie/operation-northwoods

https://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662&page=1

It was a terrible murderous plot. All generated in the evil minds of that time US military and CIA. Among the other sickness in it, it contained a plan when a US civil plane was supposed to be shot down by the US pilots flying Russian MIGs to blame Castro air forces in it. Thanks to John Kennedy for not OK-ing all that madness. Unfortunately he didn't live long since that.

 

Edited February 26, 2019 by Maxim Androsov

[Jouhou + 24]

 

It makes me angry every time Russia fails to take responsibility for MH17. See, that's what I mean about cultural differences that can't be reconciled. 

Does the Kremlin really think they have us fooled in their denials? I doubt it. They seem to think they're being clever though. It's by some bizarre cultural thing that they think they are better off denying it than just saying "whoops, sorry about that" to the countries whose people they killed (come on, the Dutch are one of Russia's biggest trading partners). 

 

[Maxim Androsov + 31]

7 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

Hi, Serhii, and thank you for posting.  I am so sorry for what has happened to Ukraine - being dismembered by that Russian Army, to be left to rot and ruin.  It is, unfortunately, going to take a long time, possibly a very long time, before the Russian mercenaries can be pushed out of the Donesk and Luhansk. To no surprise, the real force that can do that quickly is the American Army and their Abrams battle tanks.  I am pushing for 500 tanks to be sent to the Ukrainian Army.  You have already received top-notch military gear including anti-tank missiles.  We will push them out.  Freedom is unstoppable.

Meanwhile, back to the trolls.  Mr. "Androsov" tells us that he sits there (what, at the dinner table?) with his Swedish friends and his laptop and the best conversation they can have is to read posts from Oilprice and guffaw about them.  Yet Sunday night here in America we had dinner and had an interesting and intelligent discussion about The Merchant of Venice.  I was remarking on how Portia outfoxed Shylock in the trial before the Dutchess. The play encapsulated how medieval Christians related to the Jews that had settled among them  (not very well). I think that dinner discussion was superior to Androsov's where the best he can do is go "he, heee!" on his troll posts.  Assuming, of course, that the mythical Swedes are not part of his fertile imagination. 

In any event, trolls are best ignored.  Since Oilprice is a world forum, hard to keep them out, unfortunately.   

Be of good cheer.  The Americans are coming. 

"I am so sorry for what has happened to Ukraine - being dismembered by that Russian Army, to be left to rot and ruin."

and at the same time

"Be of good cheer. The Americans are coming."

What a profound hypocrisy! Don't you understand that had the US not destabilised the Ukraine and not sponsored a bloody coup d'etat there (there is 1000+ sources of proof on that in international media, admitted by everyone), and had they not instigated their fascist puppet regime to move the ukrainian troops into the rebel territories to start a civil war there killing innocent citizens, then there would be no need for you to even feel "so sorry"? I'm not even saying abt MH-17.

Instead of engaging in "intelligent discussion about The Merchant of Venice" you better be checking the facts. At least if you want to discuss the events in Ukraine or how it all started there. You may say that the source I provide below isn't credible because it is Russian, but at least it describes the Russian view on all this. There are plenty of publications of exactly same facts in international media.

http://www.ft.lk/international/Russia-on-the-situation-in-Ukraine-post-coup-d-état-of-2014/49-673363

So, I quote you once again - "Be of good cheer. The Americans are coming."

Yes, sure. One definitely need to cheer-up when Americans are coming! Because they are bringing with them long history of bloody US imperialism, wars, drone killings, black sites, tortures, coups, regime change, contras, mujahedeen, ISIS, meddling, refugees, migrants, US-fueled violence, political instability and poverty. And certainly, all this is Russia’s fault. And their trolls'.

At least it is how Jan van Eck sees it in between intelligent discussions about Portia and Shylock.

Cheers!

[Jouhou + 24]

You know better, don't you? Shame on you for spreading lies and agitprop even as an expat.

The French guy might be fooled, but there isn't a doubt in my mind that affluent Russians living abroad know better. You know exactly what you're saying.

Edited February 26, 2019 by Jouhou

[Maxim Androsov + 31]

49 minutes ago, Jouhou said:

 

It makes me angry every time Russia fails to take responsibility for MH17. See, that's what I mean about cultural differences that can't be reconciled. 

Does the Kremlin really think they have us fooled in their denials? I doubt it. They seem to think they're being clever though. It's by some bizarre cultural thing that they think they are better off denying it than just saying "whoops, sorry about that" to the countries whose people they killed (come on, the Dutch are one of Russia's biggest trading partners). 

 

 

49 minutes ago, Jouhou said:

 

Yes, the Dutch inquiry found that it was a Russian-made BUK missile that hit the plane. But that's all. Those missiles' batteries were at that time in possession by the ukrainian army as well as Russian. As well as in some NATO countries.

Too many questions are still left unanswered.

- Why the flight was rerouted by the Ukrainian flight control from the original flight path further eastward, i.e. deeper into the zone of military conflict?

- Why so "conveniently" exactly on that day (according to own JIT findings) the ukrainian radar station which was supposed to monitor the trajectories of flights in that area was out of order, and another station was being repaired?

- Why ukrainian "other data" was not released due to "security reasons"?

- Why the US has not publicly released her own radar data citing "security reasons"?

So, what if Russia isn't really responsible for downing MH-17? 

I hope one day those questions will be answered and we all know the truth.

Edited February 26, 2019 by Maxim Androsov

[Maxim Androsov + 31]

34 minutes ago, Jouhou said:

You know better, don't you? Shame on you for spreading lies and agitprop even as an expat.

The French guy might be fooled, but there isn't a doubt in my mind that affluent Russians living abroad know better. You know exactly what you're saying.

You know better, don't you?

- Better than who? Better than biased US and Ukraine? And you supposed to know the truth?

"The French guy might be fooled"

- He doesn't sound like he is fooled. He just sound more intelligent and informed than you are, which I find perfectly possible.

"there isn't a doubt in my mind that affluent Russians living abroad know better."

- Not every "doubt in your mind" is true perception of the world events. Just accept the reality.

"You know exactly what you're saying".

- I don't know "exactly what I am saying". Neither you do. I'm just expressing my thoughts. Same way as you do. It doesn't mean that you are right and I am wrong. That's how any discussion goes. 

Edited February 26, 2019 by Maxim Androsov

[Jouhou + 24]

MH chose a flight path they shouldn't have. That's why their business tanked after this and MH370. As for why the US doesnt release images from defense satellites. DUH those are for us. Not for foreign nationals. And blah blah lots of questions deflecting from the obvious. We know the truth. It will be a festering wound until the Kremlin can man up and admit to it and apologize.

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

13 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

 

xxx, so there!

[Maxim Androsov + 31]

1 minute ago, Jouhou said:

 We know the truth. 

Ha-ha!

It's been a while since you ever known the truth in your country. And when the truth finally comes out, it doesn't always sound pleasant to you. Like this one: 

https://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662&page=1

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

12 hours ago, Serhii Li said:

 

Hi, all real and honest members of Oilprice, 

those 2 members (Observatus Geopoliticus, Maxim Androsov)  above are clearly just paid russian trolls. They use different nicknames, but post same info everywhere: 

- Maduro is legitimate, anything else is US Coup

- Russian invasion in Georgia and annexation of Abkhazia was legitimate, Geourgia was a victime of US Coup. 

- Russian invation in Ukraine and annexation of Crimea and part of Donbass was legitimate (US Coup bla-bla-bla). 

 

I'm from Donetsk, Ukrainian city occupied and controlled by Russia since 2014. Since Russian invasion in Ukraine in 2014 I have seen literally thousands of these accounts with proven links to known paid-troll-factories in Russia. Moreover, due to Russian propaganda being so waste, some people became persuaded that this information from troll-factory is true, so these people became free-trolls. 

 

Thus, I would advise to to save your valuable time and do not argue with dishonest people - since they are paid based on amount of comments on their posts, you are just helping them to earn their dirty money. 

You can just post "Russian troll detected"

Or I can just block them.  Thanks, Serhii!  I had my suspicions...

[Jouhou + 24]

12 minutes ago, Maxim Androsov said:

Ha-ha!

It's been a while since you ever known the truth in your country. And when the truth finally comes out, it doesn't always sound pleasant to you. Like this one: 

https://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662&page=1

That's literally history. We were all set with ending the cold war, we drastically cut our forces, my mom was out of job. But, oh, it was a trick, surprise. The Kremlin is no one's ally. I wouldn't be surprised if Putin was goading Trump to invade venezuela. Just because it would weaken us. These stupid games they want to play. The U.S. Doesn't want to play anymore but like a serial killer they'll just keep causing chaos until we play. Blech.

[Maxim Androsov + 31]

2 hours ago, Jouhou said:

 We know the truth. 

If you always "know the truth" how come you didn't know about this one?

qte

In the early 1960s, America's top military leaders reportedly drafted plans to kill innocent people and commit acts of terrorism in U.S. cities to create public support for a war against Cuba. Code named Operation Northwoods, the plans reportedly included the possible assassination of Cuban émigrés, sinking boats of Cuban refugees on the high seas, hijacking planes, blowing up a U.S. ship, and even orchestrating violent terrorism in U.S. cities. 

The Joint Chiefs even proposed using the potential death of astronaut John Glenn during the first attempt to put an American into orbit as a false pretext for war with Cuba, the documents show. Should the rocket explode and kill Glenn, they wrote, "the objective is to provide irrevocable proof … that the fault lies with the Communists et all Cuba [sic]."

unqte

- In view of the above revealed terrible (and hard) facts many instances of "truth" coming from your country should look damn suspicious..

Edited February 26, 2019 by Maxim Androsov