NYT: Mass Immigration Roundups in U.S. to Start Sunday

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

On 7/11/2019 at 9:06 PM, pinto said:

thousands of people will be arrested.. Simple, trauma for everything: for them, for the society and for their families

 

Then they should have remained at home or entered the country by the legally acceptable process.

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

9 hours ago, Wastral said:

Uh, genius: Illegals are not being hired by corporations... I am sure a few rare ones are somewhere...

Want to find your illegal bosses hiring illegal workers?  Go to Home Desperate or SLowes parking lot and watch.  Or any construction site.  Or in Ag. Or handyman jobs on craigslist.  Not hard to find, and I do not see a big problem here.  They work unlike welfare bums whom I would cut off.  When the average people on "welfare" are so fat they can barely walk, have 2 cars, cable tv, internet, cell phones, and live in a big apartment or house.... sorry just no, you should not be on welfare.  Cut welfare 50% to fund the needed more agents to turn the illegals who actually come with families into citizens and to hunt down those on the black market and turn them into citizens or a one way ticket back home. 

The point not mentioned is that these aliens are entering the country illegally, for whatever reason. You do not gratify illegal behavior, whether by the illegal alien or those that employ them.

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,190]

1 hour ago, Douglas Buckland said:

The point not mentioned is that these aliens are entering the country illegally, for whatever reason. You do not gratify illegal behavior, whether by the illegal alien or those that employ them.

True and why I have advocated for an ALL OF THE ABOVE policy.  It is a long standing problem so someone who has been here for 2 years, or 2 days is not the same as someone who has been here for 2 decades and requires different treatment. 

Yes, my solution is messy, but that is life.  There is no one size fits all policy. 

#1, must get rid of anchor babies

#2, crack down on hiring of illegals

#3, get rid of $$$ incentive/excuse to NOT go through legal immigration channels(Becoming a citizen costs around ~$3000/person = UTTERLY ABSURD!!!!!!!!!!!!  Make it Free.  You want them in your country?  They benefit YOU. 

#4, Deport, all criminals(not petty criminals)

#5, Overstaying Visa process

#6, Wall, incentivize your neighbors. 

#7 Address drug problem

[ronwagn + 6,290]

2 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

Ron, you are getting a bit off tangent (OK, so maybe I am!).   The point I was making is that when creating "policy" and then hiring people to implement it, you do have to be cautious in the selection process.  Throughout history, there is this sieve or sifting that goes on, and allows (or perhaps encourages) the pathological to take over.  When that happens, it gets very unpleasant for everybody. 

What happened in Vermont was pretty much a constant.  It was a brutal time. the Stocks were universal, at least in New England.  The punishments of disfigurement were assessed, especially to indentured servants.  what is not widely appreciated is that perhaps as much as 90% of the White labor force in New England and the Middle Atlantic States (including Virginia) were people literally kidnapped on the streets of Wales  (and London), then sentenced to "transportation" by a corrupt magistrate, who took a fee off the back end.  The victim was then sold to a corrupt shipowner, held in the hold in chains for two months until a full load was collected, then re-sold in the America Colonies to Masters who needed cheap labor.  You had to be this indentured servant for perhaps 11 years to be granted "freedom," which was the clothes on your back.  And if you talked back or objected at any point, your "contract" got extended for some more years, and you had no recourse.  IN many ways, being an indentured servant was worse than being a slave from Africa. And if you were a woman - forget it.  Your life was over.  You became your purchaser's personal prostitute. Don't submit?  You get beaten, maimed, branded, or killed. You had nothing to say.  Now, ask yourself, what does that remind you of?

It reminds me of bad parts of early colonial history. It has nothing to do with what is going on at our borders. We are fighting mass illegal immigration and drug cartels. Democrats, and many Republicans are worried about payoffs from large corporate donors, votes from illegals etc. Americans do create the demand for the drugs, but that is another problem. 

I guess you were speaking philosophically, and I would agree that you want GOOD people. But in my experience they are hard to come by, so you have to enforce high standards of behavior. You have to weed out those who do not meet behavioral standards. 

Edited July 16, 2019 by ronwagn

[ronwagn + 6,290]

8 minutes ago, Wastral said:

True and why I have advocated for an ALL OF THE ABOVE policy.  It is a long standing problem so someone who has been here for 2 years, or 2 days is not the same as someone who has been here for 2 decades and requires different treatment. 

Yes, my solution is messy, but that is life.  There is no one size fits all policy. 

#1, must get rid of anchor babies

#2, crack down on hiring of illegals

#3, get rid of $$$ incentive/excuse to NOT go through legal immigration channels(Becoming a citizen costs around ~$3000/person = UTTERLY ABSURD!!!!!!!!!!!!  Make it Free.  You want them in your country?  They benefit YOU. 

#4, Deport, all criminals(not petty criminals)

#5, Overstaying Visa process

#6, Wall, incentivize your neighbors. 

#7 Address drug problem

You missed prosecuting those who hire illegals. I am speaking mainly of corporations and their franchisees, but it should include all contractors of any size. 

I also favor a national identity card which includes DNA, eyescan, and fingerprint. An identity card or passport will be needed to fly in the USA in 2020 anyway. 

[Douglas Buckland + 6,308]

2 hours ago, Wastral said:

True and why I have advocated for an ALL OF THE ABOVE policy.  It is a long standing problem so someone who has been here for 2 years, or 2 days is not the same as someone who has been here for 2 decades and requires different treatment. 

Yes, my solution is messy, but that is life.  There is no one size fits all policy. 

#1, must get rid of anchor babies

#2, crack down on hiring of illegals

#3, get rid of $$$ incentive/excuse to NOT go through legal immigration channels(Becoming a citizen costs around ~$3000/person = UTTERLY ABSURD!!!!!!!!!!!!  Make it Free.  You want them in your country?  They benefit YOU. 

#4, Deport, all criminals(not petty criminals)

#5, Overstaying Visa process

#6, Wall, incentivize your neighbors. 

#7 Address drug problem

I can agree with all but #3. Why do you assume that we "...want them in your country". Generally speaking, most Americans do not, according to recent polls. As with every other country on the planet, we would prefer to be selective and accept those that add value.

Make it free! Passport application, driver's licenses, and other forms of ID are not free for Americans and for an American to get permanent residence in another country is not free. Why should the legal immigration to the US be free? If they cannot afford the application fee, do you honestly think that they will not be a 'burden on society' after they get in?

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,190]

4 hours ago, Douglas Buckland said:

I can agree with all but #3. Why do you assume that we "...want them in your country". Generally speaking, most Americans do not, according to recent polls. As with every other country on the planet, we would prefer to be selective and accept those that add value.

Make it free! Passport application, driver's licenses, and other forms of ID are not free for Americans and for an American to get permanent residence in another country is not free. Why should the legal immigration to the US be free? If they cannot afford the application fee, do you honestly think that they will not be a 'burden on society' after they get in?

I have also raised the question of WHY, anyone wants to become the EU/China/Phillipines/Vienam/S. Korea where there is NOWHERE you can go without hearing another human fart. 

As far as I am concerned, a ZERO immigrant policy of anyone other than wife/husband is ALSO valid. 

As far as passport, drivers license, is less than $100 bucks.  Becoming a US citizen.... $ several thousand which limits those who CAN become citizens to only the rich or true asylum seekers who are permitted and come in FREE anyways.

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,190]

6 hours ago, ronwagn said:

You missed prosecuting those who hire illegals. I am speaking mainly of corporations and their franchisees, but it should include all contractors of any size.

Uh, #2 🤔