Memorize date 05/15/2018 cause Huawei ban is the most important single event in world history after 9/11/2001.

[Marcin + 519]

There are moments in the world history that are symbolic for they are the sign of the profound changes in momentum the global affairs are going.

Will give you a few examples, my list:

07/28/1914 formal start of Word War the 1^st. Culmination of the process that started in 1880s when major blocks of Great Powers started their rivalry.

11/11/1918 formal end of WW1. Near this date map of Europe changed very much & Russia became communist Soviet Union. The peace was very fragile and already had seeds for the next war. The strongest global power the United States was in isolationism, it did not want to participate in incomprehensible bloodsheds erupting constantly between European countries.

09/01/1939 formal start of WW the 2^nd. Culmination of European rivalry since 1920s and extreme political movements that led to totalitarian communist (Soviet Union) or fascist (Germany, Japan, Italy) totalitarianisms. Great Depression was a good growing ground for them. This is a symbolic date cause war in Asia (Japanese invasion of Manchuria) or in Europe (German annexation of Czechoslovakia) was already brewing. Important dates for specific countries could be also: 06/22/1941 German attack on Soviet Union when it was forced to switch sides from Axis to Allies and 12/07/1941 Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor when US formally joined Allies.

05/08/1945 formal end of WW the 2^nd in Europe, the major theater. Early after the war the two competing blocks of countries: NATO vs Soviet block emerged and Cold War started. Period characterized by many proxy wars, because the main countries United States and Soviet Union could not fight directly as both have nuclear weapons (MAD). Countries not directly part of 2 blocks could be part of Non-Alignment Movement or switch sides like China and make the most out of the rivalry for themselves.

12/08/1991 accord of formal dissolution of Soviet Union. End of bilateral world order and the beginning of unilateral world order with United States as sole superpower. Other significant events that are used by some to describe end of post WW2 era: Autumn 1989 revolutions in Eastern Europe, 10/3/1990 German Unification.

09/11/2001 terrorist attacks in the United States. End of relatively peaceful decade. As the consequence of attacks United States became party to a series of violent and costly wars in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and Syria. Other significant events that mark end of this era: 07/05/2000 Putin takes over as ruler of Russia, return to Soviet type dictatorship but on the other hand the country becomes much stronger and again active on the world scene, 12/11/2001 entry of China to WTO in return of Chinese backing of Bush’s War on Terror.

05/15/2019 United States embargo on Huawei, formal start of Technology War against China. End of era of unilateral world order led by United States, and start of bilateral US vs China competition for global hegemony. End of US-China engagement, start of confrontation. Many other processes led to this event  and could be also seen as symbolic end of an era : US pivot to Asia, Chinese Belt and Road Initiative, start of Trump presidency and tariffs, but none of them was so dramatic.

 

Why Huawei embargo is so important ?

It is a very, very violent escalation.

It is the strongest weapon, nearly act of war, that United States could use at present against China.

One small notch above is global embargo on crude oil which effectively means shooting war US vs China/Russia and nuclear WW the 3^rd.

I do not feel very comfortable when politicians risk lives of millions of people for such distant goal.

Huawei action is the move that you cannot reverse,"undo" and both Trump administration and Xi Jinping administration are aware of this.

It sets the stage for US-China relations and global relations for next decades.

By trying to cripple Chinese technology development, it actually made any trade agreement or future China-US cooperation a moot point.

What is your take on this ?

Could US do anything more against China and not risk global war ?

What is the sentiment in the US, would you risk nuclear annihilation of Your city&home

to win over China in hegemony war?

And please instead of writing that this is a stupid conspiracy theory etc. give at least 1 argument or historical precedent that I am wrong.

[Guest]

I was just gonna say ''don't they just make phones?'' haha but don't wanna wind you up. 

It's a little tough to give a historical precedent on 5G and so on as it's kinda the future.

I agree the Huawei situation is an important one to settle but saying ''it is the strongest weapon, almost an act of war from the USA'' is being slightly hysterical. Also talk of 'nuclear annihilation' and 'very very violent escalation'. They are still talking yes?  These things will take time. Probably years. Huawei will be the last thing they sort out I imagine. They can barely sort out things like soybeans. 

As I've said before, this is the 2 biggest economies trying to come to a deal on hundreds of things without looking like either backed down. Good luck with that.

Chinese technological development is not being 'crippled' as you say, just because the USA has an issue with Huawei. The USA would simply like a country to abide by a bunch of rules that they agreed to in the first place. This isn't a lot to ask. If China played by the rules for the last few decades this wouldn't be happening. You can't turn all this around to ''well now the USA have done it. Just watch, we are all doomed.''

Once in a while, it would be nice for China to consider 'maybe we are not faultless'. Or, for people to not be so quick in blaming the USA for doing what the whole world should have years ago. Does Trump get credit? Nope. In fact you said this. 

1 hour ago, Marcin said:

start of Trump presidency and tariffs, but none of them was so dramatic.

P.S -  Not having a pop, but not once did you mention WHY the USA has an issue with Huawei? Just ''well now they've gone and done it''. 

Edited September 22, 2019 by Guest

[Hotone + 412]

10 minutes ago, DayTrader said:

The USA would simply like a country to abide by a bunch of rules that they agreed to in the first place. This isn't a lot to ask. If China played by the rules for the last few decades this wouldn't be happening. You can't turn all this around to ''well now the USA have done it. Just watch, we are all doomed.''

And what are said rules? Please elaborate.

[Guest]

Hope that's a joke. And a bad one at that. 

3 hours ago, Hotone said:

And what are said rules?

This is from 2015. Enjoy. 

P.S South China Sea. 

After almost 15 years in the World Trade Organization (WTO), China has still failed to follow through on many of the trade-liberalizing commitments it made in order to convince free trade-oriented nations to approve its membership in 2001. These broken promises have harmed the global trading system as well as both economic growth and the health of innovative industries across the United States and Europe. Here are nine commitments China made, but never lived up to:

1. Refraining from requiring technology transfer as a condition of market access

Although its WTO accession agreement included rules forbidding China from tying foreign direct investment or market access to technology-transfer requirements, it remains commonplace for China to compel firms to hand over their technology in exchange for the privilege of investing, operating, or selling in China.

2. Significantly reducing intellectual property (IP) theft and violations

Joining the WTO required China to recognize the Agreement on Trade-Related Aspects of Intellectual Property Rights (TRIPS), which provides protections for patents, copyrights, trademarks, service marks, industrial designs, digital content, and other intangible property. Unfortunately, Chinese IP theft grows unabated. The IP Commission Report on the Theft of U.S. Intellectual Property found that China accounted for nearly 80 percent of all IP thefts from U.S.-headquartered organizations in 2013, amounting to an estimated $300 billion in lost business annually.

3. Substantially reducing production and/or export subsidies

Despite the fact that the Chinese government committed to eliminating or substantially reducing production and  export subsidies (and particularly those for loss-making state enterprises) as a condition of its WTO accession deal, since 2000 it has issued over $118 billion in subsidies to just four industries ―steel, glass and glass products, paper, and auto parts. And, if that’s for just four industries, then it’s just scratching the surface of the real extent of continuing industrial subsidization.

4. Liberalizing foreign film distribution

When China joined the WTO, it committed to allowing “20 films to be imported on a revenue-sharing basis in each of the three years after accession” and to permitting U.S. firms to “form joint ventures to distribute videos, software entertainment, and sound recordings and to own and operate cinemas.” However, as the U.S. Trade Representative (USTR) reports, “China has not yet fully implemented its … commitment to open up film distribution opportunities for imported films that are distributed in China on a flat-fee basis rather than a revenue-sharing basis.”

5. Joining the Government Procurement Agreement

In joining the WTO, China agreed to move quickly join the Government Procurement Agreement, which prohibits restrictions on government purchases between member countries. China has yet to make a credible offer for coverage under this agreement.

6. Requiring state-owned enterprises to make purchases based on commercial considerations

China agreed that it would “ensure that state-owned and state-invested enterprises will make purchases and sales based solely on commercial considerations.” In other words, they are supposed to buy the best tools the world has to offer for their needs; they aren’t supposed to have preferences for or against any particular vendor or nationality. Yet these commitments fly in the face of explicit Chinese efforts to keep Chinese government agencies and state-owned enterprises from buying U.S. enterprise-developed or -manufactured information and communications technology products.

7. Giving foreign banks national treatment

While China committed to giving foreign banks the benefits of “national treatment” within five years of WTO accession (i.e., treating foreign competitors no less favorably than domestic enterprises), USTR reports, “China still does not seem to have fully implemented particular commitments, such as with regard to Chinese-foreign joint banks and bank branches.”

8. Opening the telecommunications market to foreign producers

China made a number of commitments in the telecommunications sector, including liberalizing foreign investment, agreeing to implement “pro-competitive regulatory principles,” and agreeing “to allow foreign suppliers to use any technology they choose to provide telecommunications services.” As USTR notes, however, “China’s restrictions on basic telecommunications services, such as informal bans on new entry, a requirement that foreign suppliers can only enter into joint ventures with state-owned enterprises, and exceedingly high capital requirements, have blocked foreign suppliers from accessing China’s basic [telecommunications] services market.”

9. Abiding by the Technical Barriers to Trade Agreement and not manipulating technology standards

In joining the WTO, China agreed to abide by the Agreement on Technical Barriers to Trade, which prevents WTO members from using certifications and standards as a barrier to trade. But China has made the development of indigenous technology standards, particularly for information and communications technology products, a core component of its industrial development and economic growth strategy, as ITIF reports in “The Middle Kingdom Galapagos Island Syndrome: The Cul-De-Sac of Chinese Technology Standards.”

 

'Elaborated' enough for you?  

Anyway, this is about Huawei apparently? 

China are not angels in my opinion. You are free to disagree. You clearly do. 

@Marcin , apologies for the partial thread take over.

Edited September 22, 2019 by Guest

[Marcin + 519]

35 minutes ago, DayTrader said:

1. I agree the Huawei situation is an important one to settle but saying ''it is the strongest weapon, almost an act of war from the USA'' is being slightly hysterical. Also talk of 'nuclear annihilation' and 'very very violent escalation'. They are still talking yes?  These things will take time. Huawei will be the last thing they sort out I imagine. They can barely sort out things like soybeans. 

2. Chinese technological development is not being 'crippled' as you say, just because the USA has an issue with Huawei. The USA would simply like a country to abide by a bunch of rules that they agreed to in the first place. This isn't a lot to ask. If China played by the rules for the last few decades this wouldn't be happening. You can't turn all this around to ''well now the USA have done it. Just watch, we are all doomed.''

Once in a while, it would be nice for China to consider 'maybe we are not faultless'. Or, for people to not be so quick in blaming the USA for doing what the whole world should have years ago. Does Trump get credit? Nope. In fact you said this. 

3.P.S -  Not having a pop, but not once did you mention WHY the USA has an issue with Huawei? Just ''well now they've gone and done it''. 

1. You have not answered the question, what more US could do against China and still not have nuclear war ?

2. The main problem is that simple existence of developing China is now against the United States rules. Major Strategic Goal of US: To not allow any power arise to be on par or superior in strength to the United States. And the major fault of China is that it has 4 times the US population and developing fast so it will be in 7-8 years the strongest economy.  It is about this not WTO rules, United States wants to cripple also WTO by preventing the appointment of judges.

3. Huawei ban is because it is threat to US national security, they have 5G technology that any US company does not have yet, so could not stole it from US. China already is 2nd in R&D in the world. Look at point 2 unfortunately the very existence of China is now threat to the United States national security.

And it means China caves in (I do not know technically how they could do it, I think the only things US can do is to  ban Chinese from attending Chinese universities or making scientific research on some technologies at these Chinese universities), or we have

next steps in escalation:

- oil embargo against China and right after this the shooting nuclear war.

[Guest]

There were about 6 questions in fairness. 

So they're 2nd in R and D in the world, yet being 'crippled' by the US?

So your main question is what more can the USA do to China without there being a nuclear war? Would China like a nuclear war? Would you? Or would they like to make a deal and we all live happily ever after?

Why are you wording it in such a way that what the USA has done so far is pointless, but there will be a breaking point, and then it's all out war?

As you say, China caves in, but if not, WAR. Just straight to oil embargo and WAR. 

1 hour ago, Marcin said:

shooting nuclear war.

The shooty kind. 

I hear what you're saying, I think, just think it's all a bit dramatic considering current situation and developments.

Edited September 22, 2019 by Guest

[Marcin + 519]

54 minutes ago, DayTrader said:

So your main question is what more can the USA do to China without there being a nuclear war? Would China like a nuclear war? Would you? Or would they like to make a deal and we all live happily ever after?
 

It would be great to live happily ever after but again I wrote:

"The main problem is that simple existence of developing China is now against the United States rules.

Major Strategic Goal of US: To not allow any power arise to be on par or superior in strength to the United States.

And the major fault of China is that it has 4 times the US population and developing fast so it will be in 7-8 years the strongest economy."

There is general consensus among strategists, analysts etc. (US based too) that China will easily develop to 50% of current US GDP per capita,that means 200% of the US GDP, even under current CPC regime, and Pentagon guys are not going to let this happen.

[Guest]

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/us-military-starting-use-china-bad-guys-during-war-games

Potential bangy shooty all over the place.

Edited September 22, 2019 by Guest

[Hotone + 412]

2 hours ago, DayTrader said:

Hope that's a joke. And a bad one at that. After all @Marcin and I said, all you can say is this..?

This is from 2015. Enjoy. 

P.S South China Sea. 

After almost 15 years in the World Trade Organization (WTO), China has still failed to follow through on many of the trade-liberalizing commitments it made in order to convince free trade-oriented nations to approve its membership in 2001. These broken promises have harmed the global trading system as well as both economic growth and the health of innovative industries across the United States and Europe. Here are nine commitments China made, but never lived up to:

1. Refraining from requiring technology transfer as a condition of market access

Although its WTO accession agreement included rules forbidding China from tying foreign direct investment or market access to technology-transfer requirements, it remains commonplace for China to compel firms to hand over their technology in exchange for the privilege of investing, operating, or selling in China.

2. Significantly reducing intellectual property (IP) theft and violations

Joining the WTO required China to recognize the Agreement on Trade-Related Aspects of Intellectual Property Rights (TRIPS), which provides protections for patents, copyrights, trademarks, service marks, industrial designs, digital content, and other intangible property. Unfortunately, Chinese IP theft grows unabated. The IP Commission Report on the Theft of U.S. Intellectual Property found that China accounted for nearly 80 percent of all IP thefts from U.S.-headquartered organizations in 2013, amounting to an estimated $300 billion in lost business annually.

3. Substantially reducing production and/or export subsidies

Despite the fact that the Chinese government committed to eliminating or substantially reducing production and  export subsidies (and particularly those for loss-making state enterprises) as a condition of its WTO accession deal, since 2000 it has issued over $118 billion in subsidies to just four industries ―steel, glass and glass products, paper, and auto parts. And, if that’s for just four industries, then it’s just scratching the surface of the real extent of continuing industrial subsidization.

4. Liberalizing foreign film distribution

When China joined the WTO, it committed to allowing “20 films to be imported on a revenue-sharing basis in each of the three years after accession” and to permitting U.S. firms to “form joint ventures to distribute videos, software entertainment, and sound recordings and to own and operate cinemas.” However, as the U.S. Trade Representative (USTR) reports, “China has not yet fully implemented its … commitment to open up film distribution opportunities for imported films that are distributed in China on a flat-fee basis rather than a revenue-sharing basis.”

5. Joining the Government Procurement Agreement

In joining the WTO, China agreed to move quickly join the Government Procurement Agreement, which prohibits restrictions on government purchases between member countries. China has yet to make a credible offer for coverage under this agreement.

6. Requiring state-owned enterprises to make purchases based on commercial considerations

China agreed that it would “ensure that state-owned and state-invested enterprises will make purchases and sales based solely on commercial considerations.” In other words, they are supposed to buy the best tools the world has to offer for their needs; they aren’t supposed to have preferences for or against any particular vendor or nationality. Yet these commitments fly in the face of explicit Chinese efforts to keep Chinese government agencies and state-owned enterprises from buying U.S. enterprise-developed or -manufactured information and communications technology products.

7. Giving foreign banks national treatment

While China committed to giving foreign banks the benefits of “national treatment” within five years of WTO accession (i.e., treating foreign competitors no less favorably than domestic enterprises), USTR reports, “China still does not seem to have fully implemented particular commitments, such as with regard to Chinese-foreign joint banks and bank branches.”

8. Opening the telecommunications market to foreign producers

China made a number of commitments in the telecommunications sector, including liberalizing foreign investment, agreeing to implement “pro-competitive regulatory principles,” and agreeing “to allow foreign suppliers to use any technology they choose to provide telecommunications services.” As USTR notes, however, “China’s restrictions on basic telecommunications services, such as informal bans on new entry, a requirement that foreign suppliers can only enter into joint ventures with state-owned enterprises, and exceedingly high capital requirements, have blocked foreign suppliers from accessing China’s basic [telecommunications] services market.”

9. Abiding by the Technical Barriers to Trade Agreement and not manipulating technology standards

In joining the WTO, China agreed to abide by the Agreement on Technical Barriers to Trade, which prevents WTO members from using certifications and standards as a barrier to trade. But China has made the development of indigenous technology standards, particularly for information and communications technology products, a core component of its industrial development and economic growth strategy, as ITIF reports in “The Middle Kingdom Galapagos Island Syndrome: The Cul-De-Sac of Chinese Technology Standards.”

 

'Elaborated' enough for you?  

Anyway, this is about Huawei apparently? 

China are not angels in my opinion. You are free to disagree. You clearly do. 

@Marcin

Thanks for the elaboration. I don't disagree with you. China have bad practices, but I believe that they at least cosmetically comply with the WTO rules, i.e. by letter and not by spirit.  Whatever the issue, the USA is known to exaggerate and overstate the seriousness of the problem.  I have been a pre-sales director of a Nasdaq listed technology company in the past.  I know how we exaggerate in order to close sales.

I live in a developing country and all the above are practiced in my country, and apparently allowed under international trade rules.  For my own interest, I will research this a bit more. Thanks.

Ps. It seems a shooting war is inevitable. Hope it doesn't go nuclear. Careful with your daytrading and go long on gold.

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, Hotone said:

Thanks for the elaboration. I don't disagree with you.

No problem. Numbers 1 and 2 are the ones that get the most coverage obviously and admittedly I had to Google it as I didn't know whole list, but I know it's been years of 'bending' rules / 'by letter not by spirit' as you say. 

12 minutes ago, Hotone said:

Careful with your daytrading and go long on gold.

Haha thanks, yes will do when the time is right. 

Edited September 22, 2019 by Guest

[ronwagn + 6,290]

4 hours ago, Marcin said:

There are moments in the world history that are symbolic for they are the sign of the profound changes in momentum the global affairs are going.

 

Will give you a few examples, my list:

07/28/1914 formal start of Word War the 1^st. Culmination of the process that started in 1880s when major blocks of Great Powers started their rivalry.

 

11/11/1918 formal end of WW1. Near this date map of Europe changed very much & Russia became communist Soviet Union. The peace was very fragile and already had seeds for the next war. The strongest global power the United States was in isolationism, it did not want to participate in incomprehensible bloodsheds erupting constantly between European countries.

 

09/01/1939 formal start of WW the 2^nd. Culmination of European rivalry since 1920s and extreme political movements that led to totalitarian communist (Soviet Union) or fascist (Germany, Japan, Italy) totalitarianisms. Great Depression was a good growing ground for them. This is a symbolic date cause war in Asia (Japanese invasion of Manchuria) or in Europe (German annexation of Czechoslovakia) was already brewing. Important dates for specific countries could be also: 06/22/1941 German attack on Soviet Union when it was forced to switch sides from Axis to Allies and 12/07/1941 Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor when US formally joined Allies.

 

05/08/1945 formal end of WW the 2^nd in Europe, the major theater. Early after the war the two competing blocks of countries: NATO vs Soviet block emerged and Cold War started. Period characterized by many proxy wars, because the main countries United States and Soviet Union could not fight directly as both have nuclear weapons (MAD). Countries not directly part of 2 blocks could be part of Non-Alignment Movement or switch sides like China and make the most out of the rivalry for themselves.

 

12/08/1991 accord of formal dissolution of Soviet Union. End of bilateral world order and the beginning of unilateral world order with United States as sole superpower. Other significant events that are used by some to describe end of post WW2 era: Autumn 1989 revolutions in Eastern Europe, 10/3/1990 German Unification.

09/11/2001 terrorist attacks in the United States. End of relatively peaceful decade. As the consequence of attacks United States became party to a series of violent and costly wars in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and Syria. Other significant events that mark end of this era: 07/05/2000 Putin takes over as ruler of Russia, return to Soviet type dictatorship but on the other hand the country becomes much stronger and again active on the world scene, 12/11/2001 entry of China to WTO in return of Chinese backing of Bush’s War on Terror.

 

 

05/15/2019 United States embargo on Huawei, formal start of Technology War against China. End of era of unilateral world order led by United States, and start of bilateral US vs China competition for global hegemony. End of US-China engagement, start of confrontation. Many other processes led to this event  and could be also seen as symbolic end of an era : US pivot to Asia, Chinese Belt and Road Initiative, start of Trump presidency and tariffs, but none of them was so dramatic.

 

 

Why Huawei embargo is so important ?

 

It is a very, very violent escalation.

 

It is the strongest weapon, nearly act of war, that United States could use at present against China.

 

One small notch above is global embargo on crude oil which effectively means shooting war US vs China/Russia and nuclear WW the 3^rd.

 

I do not feel very comfortable when politicians risk lives of millions of people for such distant goal.

 

Huawei action is the move that you cannot reverse,"undo" and both Trump administration and Xi Jinping administration are aware of this.

It sets the stage for US-China relations and global relations for next decades.

By trying to cripple Chinese technology development, it actually made any trade agreement or future China-US cooperation a moot point.

What is your take on this ?

 

Could US do anything more against China and not risk global war ?

 

What is the sentiment in the US, would you risk nuclear annihilation of Your city&home

 

to win over China in hegemony war?

 

And please instead of writing that this is a stupid conspiracy theory etc. give at least 1 argument or historical precedent that I am wrong.

 

We can have a full blown trade war with China. We are just working toward fair trade right now. The escalation has all been from China IMHO. Their escalation has been on multiple fronts.

1. Claiming control of vast areas of ocean that other nations have more legitimate claims to.

2. Stealing technology and forcing foreign corporations to give up technology to do business in China.

3. Allowing extremely potent Fentanyl to be produced in China and smuggled all over the world.

4. Widespread abuses in the process of their Belt and Road projects.

5. Allowing President Xi to become president for life. Abusing large sectors of the Chinese populace and eliminating freedoms that were formerly allowed. ( I believe that our trade policy should include trading with free countries more so than with dictatorships).  

6. Extensive and aggressive espionage against America and other countries. 

Unless the above factors are negotiable we should consider a trade competition ( avoid the use war) against China and any other nations that act in a similar way. I would prefer that all trade disputes be solved amicably and patiently however. 

[fozzir + 68]

7 hours ago, Marcin said:

There are moments in the world history that are symbolic for they are the sign of the profound changes in momentum the global affairs are going.

 

Will give you a few examples, my list:

07/28/1914 formal start of Word War the 1^st. Culmination of the process that started in 1880s when major blocks of Great Powers started their rivalry.

 

11/11/1918 formal end of WW1. Near this date map of Europe changed very much & Russia became communist Soviet Union. The peace was very fragile and already had seeds for the next war. The strongest global power the United States was in isolationism, it did not want to participate in incomprehensible bloodsheds erupting constantly between European countries.

 

09/01/1939 formal start of WW the 2^nd. Culmination of European rivalry since 1920s and extreme political movements that led to totalitarian communist (Soviet Union) or fascist (Germany, Japan, Italy) totalitarianisms. Great Depression was a good growing ground for them. This is a symbolic date cause war in Asia (Japanese invasion of Manchuria) or in Europe (German annexation of Czechoslovakia) was already brewing. Important dates for specific countries could be also: 06/22/1941 German attack on Soviet Union when it was forced to switch sides from Axis to Allies and 12/07/1941 Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor when US formally joined Allies.

 

05/08/1945 formal end of WW the 2^nd in Europe, the major theater. Early after the war the two competing blocks of countries: NATO vs Soviet block emerged and Cold War started. Period characterized by many proxy wars, because the main countries United States and Soviet Union could not fight directly as both have nuclear weapons (MAD). Countries not directly part of 2 blocks could be part of Non-Alignment Movement or switch sides like China and make the most out of the rivalry for themselves.

 

12/08/1991 accord of formal dissolution of Soviet Union. End of bilateral world order and the beginning of unilateral world order with United States as sole superpower. Other significant events that are used by some to describe end of post WW2 era: Autumn 1989 revolutions in Eastern Europe, 10/3/1990 German Unification.

09/11/2001 terrorist attacks in the United States. End of relatively peaceful decade. As the consequence of attacks United States became party to a series of violent and costly wars in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and Syria. Other significant events that mark end of this era: 07/05/2000 Putin takes over as ruler of Russia, return to Soviet type dictatorship but on the other hand the country becomes much stronger and again active on the world scene, 12/11/2001 entry of China to WTO in return of Chinese backing of Bush’s War on Terror.

 

 

05/15/2019 United States embargo on Huawei, formal start of Technology War against China. End of era of unilateral world order led by United States, and start of bilateral US vs China competition for global hegemony. End of US-China engagement, start of confrontation. Many other processes led to this event  and could be also seen as symbolic end of an era : US pivot to Asia, Chinese Belt and Road Initiative, start of Trump presidency and tariffs, but none of them was so dramatic.

 

 

Why Huawei embargo is so important ?

 

It is a very, very violent escalation.

 

It is the strongest weapon, nearly act of war, that United States could use at present against China.

 

One small notch above is global embargo on crude oil which effectively means shooting war US vs China/Russia and nuclear WW the 3^rd.

 

I do not feel very comfortable when politicians risk lives of millions of people for such distant goal.

 

Huawei action is the move that you cannot reverse,"undo" and both Trump administration and Xi Jinping administration are aware of this.

It sets the stage for US-China relations and global relations for next decades.

By trying to cripple Chinese technology development, it actually made any trade agreement or future China-US cooperation a moot point.

What is your take on this ?

 

Could US do anything more against China and not risk global war ?

 

What is the sentiment in the US, would you risk nuclear annihilation of Your city&home

 

to win over China in hegemony war?

 

And please instead of writing that this is a stupid conspiracy theory etc. give at least 1 argument or historical precedent that I am wrong.

 

Yes, we are in a cyber war with China but that started way, way before the Hauwei ban. All that (the ban) did was close one door.  The PROBLEM: How to you close all the doors that have been opened already? For the laymen, what has China hardcoded in the devices that they manufacture for use in the US that "phones home"? Once we figure that part out, how do you remove those devices from our inventory? Sadly, with Apple, who knows how much damage has been done since Apple is such a huge partner of China. Imagine how many networks Apple devices connect to? I don't know the # but it's a lot and if you can phone home from there, that's all you need  

[4cryingoutloud + 21]

Rubbish.