World’s Longest Elevator Could Trigger New Commodity Race

[SERWIN + 749]

On 9/24/2019 at 3:06 PM, Jan van Eck said:

Sorry to be a wet blanket on this neat idea, but I suspect the reason it would be a failure flows from yet another man-made issue: the total amount of "space junk" floating about at these altitudes.  What has happened is that various satellites have been used as target practice by the Chinese in the past, and upon shredding them with a rocket and warhead, an explosion of parts and pieces are now up there.  Those metal shards will act as scythes to anything that is stationary in the rotating orbit, be it a cable elevator, a space station, or another rocket passing through on the way to Mars  (to drop me off after my diplomatic posting here is completed). (OK, you need to read the other thread about that to get the joke.) 

So why haven't we come up with a space Roomba to run around and start collecting most of this junk. It wouldn't have to necessarily grab it, just give it a little nudge downward and let gravity and the atmosphere do the rest. I know we can track a lot of it, so why not work on getting the bigger stuff "bumped" and help clean up space. We are going to have to do it eventually, might as well start now before we can't even leave the planet... 

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

19 minutes ago, SERWIN said:

So why haven't we come up with a space Roomba to run around and start collecting most of this junk. It wouldn't have to necessarily grab it, just give it a little nudge downward and let gravity and the atmosphere do the rest.

Because there just is so much of that stuff up there.  At one point the Chinese military decided to try out a neat new anti-satellite rocket, shot one up there, and shredded an entire old satellite into some 363,000 new pieces of space junk.  Not very bright of them, now was it?

 

20 minutes ago, SERWIN said:

We are going to have to do it eventually, might as well start now before we can't even leave the planet... 

You are close to that point now.  What needs to be kept in mind is that the particle does not have to be large to do a lot of damage.  Even a tiny speck of space junk will wreck a new satellite, if it hits at the right point  (and there is a lot of vulnerable real estate on a space satellite).  

Earth runs the risk of creating its own Van Allen belt of particles around it, by negligence and stupidity, and trapping us on the planet surface literally forever.  Amazing.   Thank you, China military.  Real smart guys. 

[Papillon + 485]

Even when we discuss debris floating around the Earth, the Chinese come up here? Presumably not one piece of this space junk is due to NASA or the USA at all? Astounding hypocrisy and arrogance here gentlemen, simply bewildering. Anything the USA does or has done is absolutely fine of course. If in doubt, blame China, and at the same time, Americans don't think of China at all apparently. Unless they need someone to blame or compare to of course. Whataboutism as always is entirely fine in these scenarios. Anything to distract from any self analysis. 

''Even a tiny speck of space junk will wreck a satellite'' , and when that happens, it will of course be a Chinese piece? I adore the logic here at times. I wonder what percentage of the dumping ground floating round our planet came from the USA? 

This will be unwelcome news and whataboutism no doubt, as American self reflection is non existent here. What jaw dropping news, most debris is from the USA, but luckily these pieces avoid satellites and we need to just look out for the Chinese ones. Thanks USA, 'real smart guys' (it seems fine to attack the intelligence of China?). More of that selective racism, hypocrisy or just being plain wrong that is fine here? May I suggest a little whataboutusaism with regard to 'negligence' and 'stupidity' or is that just other nations as always?

I shudder to think what this website would look like if Americans ever did think of China. I presume even more racist, ignorant and hypocritical. With respect, Papillon. 

 

• More than 4,600 satellites orbit Earth, along with more than 14,000 old rocket parts and pieces of space junk.
• The US is responsible for the most debris in space, followed by Russia and China.
• Experts worry that not cleaning up space debris could lead to increasing numbers of collisions and a runaway effect that'd make it too dangerous to leave Earth.

Edited December 28, 2019 by Papillon

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

What "papillon," the Chinese Apologist, forgets is that none of the US Debris is caused by the willful sending of a rocket into space to deliberately smash an existing satellite into thousands of pieces  (and a lot more than that written up in the tab he provides).  It is the act of willful maliciousness that so irritates both me and other users.  The guess is that the satellite smashing likely caused over 360,000 pieces.  Right now, some 3,000 pieces are acknowledged.  Either way, that was totally unnecessary, and gratuitously led to the burden of cleaning up in the future. 

While the iron-based materials could likely be scooped up by some floating magnet, it is unclear how aluminum, titanium, and other non-magnetic materials are going to be collected.  You would need some sort of fine-mesh net, floating in orbit, strong enough to not tear as it scoops up pieces of junk.  A formidable challenge, to be sure. 

Edited December 28, 2019 by Jan van Eck

[remake it + 288]

 

27 minutes ago, Jan van Eck said:

What "papillon," the Chinese Apologist, forgets is that none of the US Debris is caused by the willful sending of a rocket into space to deliberately smash an existing satellite into thousands of pieces  (and a lot more than that written up in the tab he provides).  It is the act of willful maliciousness that so irritates both me and other users.  The guess is that the satellite smashing likely caused over 360,000 pieces.  Right now, some 3,000 pieces are acknowledged.  Either way, that was totally unnecessary, and gratuitously led to the burden of cleaning up in the future. 

Both Russia and the USA had used ASATs decades before China and even then it was for China to show that it had a commensurate capability however the real irony here is that Russia China and India are trying to establish international treaties about weaponizing space and the USA is refusing to be part of it - what's new many would ask!

Edited December 28, 2019 by remake it
but.......... what about Russia and errrr ummm huhh what what about the USA surely not

[Papillon + 485]

If someone says something vaguely positive about China they are an apologist are they sir? Or maybe I'm just not a selective racist like many here? Or maybe I can view my own country and its faults before so happily judging others? It is notable you do not mention Russia as being at fault here, just straight to China. Anything but self reflection of course. 

Every single piece floating around, for decades, due to the USA, is perfectly fine of course? (the number of which maybe you do not need to guess?). As always, whataboutism is fine when anti China. This website is laughable in its logic and arrogance. 

Edited December 28, 2019 by Papillon

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

"If someone says something vaguely positive about China they are an apologist are they sir?"

Apologist?  Only you, papillon!   😊

[Papillon + 485]

No sir, most people that defend an entire nation or its people without living there are not apologists. They are simply not racist and ignorant.

I doubt the average American (while never thinking of the Chinese apparently), considers the nation or its population a controversial topic, and so I fear you do not fully understand the definition of an apologist? 

It is also rather notable the specific sections that users here do choose to reply to. Unsurprisingly, you referred to someone having the audacity to defend China in some form, while still avoiding any analysis of the self. It appears the USA to many here is a flawless wonderland.

[remake it + 288]

1 hour ago, Jan van Eck said:

What "papillon," the Chinese Apologist, forgets is that none of the US Debris is caused by the willful sending of a rocket into space to deliberately smash an existing satellite into thousands of pieces  (and a lot more than that written up in the tab he provides).

Papi has produced data and you a lot of porkies especially seeing your willingness to overlook that decades beforehand both Russia and the USA did precisely what you you have accused China of doing and that India has also done it and every one did it to show the rest of the world that they are not to be toyed with and apparently not MAD.

[SERWIN + 749]

On 12/27/2019 at 5:18 PM, Jan van Eck said:

Because there just is so much of that stuff up there.  At one point the Chinese military decided to try out a neat new anti-satellite rocket, shot one up there, and shredded an entire old satellite into some 363,000 new pieces of space junk.  Not very bright of them, now was it?

 

You are close to that point now.  What needs to be kept in mind is that the particle does not have to be large to do a lot of damage.  Even a tiny speck of space junk will wreck a new satellite, if it hits at the right point  (and there is a lot of vulnerable real estate on a space satellite).  

Earth runs the risk of creating its own Van Allen belt of particles around it, by negligence and stupidity, and trapping us on the planet surface literally forever.  Amazing.   Thank you, China military.  Real smart guys. 

I understand about even little pieces, like bullets moving at what, 18000 MPH? get hit by something like that and ouch, it leaves a mark.... We need to figure this one out before we continue, something automated that can track and go after the small parts zooming around.