Don't sneeze. Coronavirus is a threat to oil markets and global economies

[Zhong Lu + 845]

17 hours ago, James Regan said:

3M for example 🤔

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/3m-sees-coronavirus-boosting-demand-for-face-masks-as-china-projected-to-return-to-growth-2020-01-28

 

Corona beer not a good idea...

Most of them are dropping like a rock after the initial run up.  Pump and dump.  INO, APT, etc. Glad I sold in time from the virus trade with profit.  Equity market's saying it's not a big deal.  

Been encouraging the conspiracy people to bet on these stocks. LOL.  

Edited February 8, 2020 by Zhong Lu

[Otis11 + 551]

8 hours ago, Enthalpic said:

That is because you are right, there is nothing remotely close.

Slander, libel, false claims (especially when it comes to medicines) are enforced.  In many other countries disorderly conduct and disturbing the peace laws are stronger - not just communist nations.

Certainly, leaking classified information is illegal - and I'm sure the USA has plenty. " Should it have been classified" is a separate question. 

For example spilling the beans on most of these would have been punishable:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentation_in_the_United_States

 

But in slander and libel, the onerous is in the accuser to show the speaker knew, or reasonably should have known their words were false. Even reasonable claims of 'I thought it was true I heard it from a friend' are sufficient to get you off in most cases.

Leaking classified information for the purpose of whistleblowing is also protected... so no, spilling the beans on that would still be protected. 

This is EXTREMELY different than in China, where you can be punished for sharing information that even turns out to be true!

(If you work in defense they teach you what those protections are and when they apply... or at least the company I worked for years ago did.)

Again, your comments (especially the original) come across as trying to justify China's actions (original) and make the US look bad (some of those things are awful,  but the acts themselves were illegal, not blowing the whistle on them as you state). 

Edited February 8, 2020 by Otis11

[GunnysGhost + 157]

9 hours ago, Enthalpic said:

That is because you are right, there is nothing remotely close.

Slander, libel, false claims (especially when it comes to medicines) are enforced.  In many other countries disorderly conduct and disturbing the peace laws are stronger - not just communist nations.

Certainly, leaking classified information is illegal - and I'm sure the USA has plenty. " Should it have been classified" is a separate question. 

For example spilling the beans on most of these would have been punishable:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentation_in_the_United_States

 

 

Journalists and civilians would typically get off scot-free if they broke news of any of those US examples, even going back to the 60s.  And even so, they get a trial.  Unlike China where they can be thrown into the back of a truck and never seen again.  Very different standard of 'arrest'. 

'Classified' is a regulation that gov't workers sign on to and know the risks.

 

I think you are aware that it appears that you are trying to draw a false equivalency (again) to life in the US being similar to life in China. 

They are not similar.

Countries With The Most Jailed Journalists - 2017

Rank	Country	Jailed Journalists
1	Turkey	73
2	China	41
3	Egypt	20
4	Eritrea	15
5	Azerbaijan	10
6	Vietnam	10
7	Uganda	8
8	Saudi Arabia	7
9	Syria	7
10	Bahrain	6

 

"They are now praising the doctor they first punished." 

I feel so much better that they are praising him now after arresting him for reporting on the virus.  Or it could be because he's dead and they can't put the cat back in the bag. 

Edited February 8, 2020 by GunnysGhost

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

12 hours ago, Anthony Okrongly said:

There's a word for this virus... for those who actually know something about viruses. It's called a "Polemic" virus. SARs was Polemic as well. That means that the virus does not have pool required to maintain itself. Once the proper social measures are taken to isolate the cases the virus quickly disappears and never recurs. What should I say?  That the Coronavirus made the stock market go up to the highest levels in history?  Are you blaming oil prices on this tiny virus.  Weren't oil prices already going down before it ever happened.  So it's just an excuse?  Planes not flying to Hunan or where ever is the difference between oil going up or down?

Anyone in America who is scared of this virus is an idiot. Anyone in Europe who is scared of this virus is an idiot. People in South America have more important things to worry about. Australia... they have wildfires. The Middle East?  Do you think this virus affect OPEC?  The news of the world economy's demise over this virus has been greatly exaggerated.

Why did I not come back to this thread?  The same reason I don't go back to threads about how we didn't go to the moon after saying WTF?  So, yea... you're still idiots. I don't have to watch you be idiots in order to know it's true.  

That's not what "Polemic" means. This is what it means: 

Quote

a strong verbal or written attack on someone or something.

"his <b>polemic against</b> the cultural relativism of the Sixties"

synonyms: critical, hostile, bitter, polemical, virulent, vitriolic, venomous, waspish, corrosive, biting, caustic, trenchant, cutting, acerbic, sardonic, sarcastic, scathing, acid, sharp, keen, tart, pungent, stinging, astringent, incisive, devastating, piercing, acidulous, mordacious, diatribe, invective, denunciation, denouncement, rant, tirade, broadside, attack, harangue, verbal onslaught, condemnation, brickbats, criticism, admonishment, admonition, abuse, stream of abuse, stricture, tongue-lashing, castigation, reprimand, rebuke, reproof, reproval, upbraiding, knocking, blast, slating, philippic, argumentation, argument, debate, contention, dispute, disputation, discussion, controversy, altercation, faction, wrangling, contestation

So while you've written a polemic response the virus is a lot closer to pandemic. 

Over 50,000 flights per day in China been cancelled and that's fuel that isn't being consumed. Are you a pilot? I am and jets use fuel by the tons per hour. Entire industries are shut down in China and they've declared force majure on shipments of everything from crude oil to aluminum scrap. While you might want to write off 1.4 billion humans, even if the virus never left the mainland, that's still a pandemic. 

I'm sure there's an idiot here and I'm equally sure it's you. Carry on 

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

12 hours ago, Gerry Maddoux said:

With 35,000 new cases in two months, and 720 deaths reported by the Chinese, I'd have to surmise that this virus--no matter the polemic--has found a fairly effective gene pool in which to replicate and maintain itself. 

There have always been viruses that jump genus and species lines. Some (rabies, for example) do this routinely--back and forth--living in squirrels without harm, but causing hydrophobia in dogs and humans. Others run amok for awhile and then disappear, as you say, like the SARS virus. I'm not at all sure that there's a good way to determine which category this particular coronavirus falls into.

I began doing virus research in 1966. Even then, we were petrified at so-called zoonotic viruses coming from the DNA replication machinery of say bats, spending some interim time in a different host, say rabbits, with this intermediate host experience conferring the ability to cozy into humans' DNA. Since we had bats, rabbits and humans all living together in our research wing, sharing the same air, this was no idle concern. Put dozens of exotic wildlife--all harboring viruses--in a wet market and the odds go up that something bizarre will happen. 

Theoretically, any virus that has a DNA or RNA sequence that will fit into the stoichiometry of the host DNA can replicate using host machinery and render the host sick or dead. That reproductive ability has forever been called R Naught. Polio has an R Naught of 4. This new virus had one of 2.2 at the beginning. That's not to be sneezed at.

After three years of research on viruses, I went in a different direction, so I am not the last word on this. For example, I must confess that I am not familiar with the term, "polemic virus." I have no idea how someone could possibly predict whether a new rogue virus will "learn" to fit in, like the rabies virus, the Herpes viruses, or the HIV viruses. Or whether, when they try to wedge back into their original host genome, they find that they no longer "fit. It would seem that this latter encounter was the way of the SARS virus.

Maybe I've gotten so out of touch that I no longer know the lingo, much less the mechanism. However, I do know that this particular zoonotic virus is one mean sucker. If it was tinkered with, making its glycoprotein spicules more malevolent, then it may be around for a very long time. If it jumped, from a bat or a snake or even a pangolin (which apparently houses a virus with a 99% genetic match), then it could potentially just put itself out of commission via replication and/or mutation, never to be seen again. 

Having acquired a strong respect for the poliovirus, which causes a sore throat in some, but paralyzes others (and killed my brother of bulbar polio) I would be slow to dismiss this current specimen as a harmless traveler in the genes of man. The stakes are a bit too high.

I'm fairly certain "wrongly" is talking out his ash. 

Meanwhile the Chinese government health officer "admitted" the death rate is almost 5%

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3873016

Edited February 8, 2020 by Ward Smith

[Gerry Maddoux + 3,627]

1 hour ago, Ward Smith said:

I'm fairly certain "wrongly" is talking out his ash. 

Meanwhile the Chinese government health officer "admitted" the death rate is almost 5%

HaHa, I am too. Maybe his pig bit him on the nose. 

This virus is scary as all get out. Reminds me of the Marburg virus, which lives inside the African fruit bat without causing illness. When it first jumped lines, it didn't seem so bad in primates, but then it got meaner and nastier, now has a 50% mortality rate. 

The upshot is that it is nigh impossible to tell whether one of these zoonotic viruses will quickly fade away, like SARS, or come out of its usual host from time to time, like Marburg, and kill people. 

I've nothing whatsoever against the Chinese people, but man, they've got to put this wildlife fetish away. If President Xi doesn't mandate something like that, he's toast in the eyes of the world. The New York Times headlined Xi's response to the epidemic this morning, saying that the WHO had gotten a cold shoulder, but that the CDC (the finest) had not even received a response to its request to enter and help out. Xi's refusal of aid merely lends credence to the possibility of wrongdoing in his lab.

I am beginning to worry that, similar to the Killing Fields of Pol Pot, the world is going to be mortified when something like the true body count comes from Wuhan. Think about it: if just about any country had 35,000 sick, its leaders would be begging for foreign aid in the form of medical think-tanks and supplies. The only reason I can think of to turn down foreign aid is to try to hide a humanitarian disgrace. 

[Otis11 + 551]

1 hour ago, Gerry Maddoux said:

HaHa, I am too. Maybe his pig bit him on the nose. 

This virus is scary as all get out. Reminds me of the Marburg virus, which lives inside the African fruit bat without causing illness. When it first jumped lines, it didn't seem so bad in primates, but then it got meaner and nastier, now has a 50% mortality rate. 

The upshot is that it is nigh impossible to tell whether one of these zoonotic viruses will quickly fade away, like SARS, or come out of its usual host from time to time, like Marburg, and kill people. 

I've nothing whatsoever against the Chinese people, but man, they've got to put this wildlife fetish away. If President Xi doesn't mandate something like that, he's toast in the eyes of the world. The New York Times headlined Xi's response to the epidemic this morning, saying that the WHO had gotten a cold shoulder, but that the CDC (the finest) had not even received a response to its request to enter and help out. Xi's refusal of aid merely lends credence to the possibility of wrongdoing in his lab.

I am beginning to worry that, similar to the Killing Fields of Pol Pot, the world is going to be mortified when something like the true body count comes from Wuhan. Think about it: if just about any country had 35,000 sick, its leaders would be begging for foreign aid in the form of medical think-tanks and supplies. The only reason I can think of to turn down foreign aid is to try to hide a humanitarian disgrace. 

Now imagine the true infected count is over 90k is just Wuhan alone, and that there's a 16% mortality rate 1 month after infection. (Mortality statistics are looking low because infections are doubling every 4-6 days, but it takes 4 weeks to kill. Theyre using deaths/infections, not deaths over recoveries. Estimates I'm hearing are closer to 300-350k nationwide in China. Granted, some of these are milder cases...)

Mortality is likely to be much lower in places with good medical as long as they don't get overwhelmed, but in china right now, their focus is on containment, not care.

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

4 hours ago, Gerry Maddoux said:

HaHa, I am too. Maybe his pig bit him on the nose. 

This virus is scary as all get out. Reminds me of the Marburg virus, which lives inside the African fruit bat without causing illness. When it first jumped lines, it didn't seem so bad in primates, but then it got meaner and nastier, now has a 50% mortality rate. 

The upshot is that it is nigh impossible to tell whether one of these zoonotic viruses will quickly fade away, like SARS, or come out of its usual host from time to time, like Marburg, and kill people. 

I've nothing whatsoever against the Chinese people, but man, they've got to put this wildlife fetish away. If President Xi doesn't mandate something like that, he's toast in the eyes of the world. The New York Times headlined Xi's response to the epidemic this morning, saying that the WHO had gotten a cold shoulder, but that the CDC (the finest) had not even received a response to its request to enter and help out. Xi's refusal of aid merely lends credence to the possibility of wrongdoing in his lab.

I am beginning to worry that, similar to the Killing Fields of Pol Pot, the world is going to be mortified when something like the true body count comes from Wuhan. Think about it: if just about any country had 35,000 sick, its leaders would be begging for foreign aid in the form of medical think-tanks and supplies. The only reason I can think of to turn down foreign aid is to try to hide a humanitarian disgrace. 

The wet market story is a red herring. You and I both know this thing got cooked up in the Wuhan level 4 lab, but still managed to escape. Xi is having the Premier take point on this so when it fails the stench won't stay on Xi and he can blame the poor schmuck. Letting outsiders in who aren't compelled to follow CCP orders? No chance. Just like Stalin, Xi is perfectly willing to break a few million eggs to create his "omelette". Overpopulation and power consolidation solved in one fell swoop. 

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

3 hours ago, Otis11 said:

Mortality is likely to be much lower in places with good medical as long as they don't get overwhelmed, but in china right now, their focus is on containment, not care.

Key to surviving the pneumonia phase of the disease is getting oxygen. There isn't enough oxygen for that many patients. If you manage to avoid the pneumonia, you'll likely survive. 

[Gerry Maddoux + 3,627]

11 minutes ago, Ward Smith said:

The wet market story is a red herring. You and I both know this thing got cooked up in the Wuhan level 4 lab, but still managed to escape. Xi is having the Premier take point on this so when it fails the stench won't stay on Xi and he can blame the poor schmuck. Letting outsiders in who aren't compelled to follow CCP orders? No chance. Just like Stalin, Xi is perfectly willing to break a few million eggs to create his "omelette". Overpopulation and power consolidation solved in one fell swoop. 

I agree completely. I strongly suspect that the folks of Wuhan are living a nightmare--with many more people dead in their homes than the figures state. They have inadequate facilities and equipment and staff for this, yet they're barely letting WHO in, and actually declining entry by the CDC (probably the only outfit in the world that can get this under control). I suspect Xi is doing this to try to block worldwide horror at the angst and destruction the Wuhan Level 4 lab has wrought. 

Soon, if not now, nations are going to shun China. It's hard to buy anything that doesn't have at least one component made in China. This could conceivably wreck the global economy. Who in their right mind, for example, is going to want to buy a $1200 Canada Goose jacket made in China. Or for that matter, nestle a new iPhone up to their mouth. This humanitarian debacle is going to stick to Xi, no matter how hard he tries to rub it off onto someone else. The truth always prevails, so while I'm hoping to be debunked as just another conspiracy theorist, I rather suspect the truth is going to make us all sick to our stomachs.

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

1 hour ago, Gerry Maddoux said:

I agree completely. I strongly suspect that the folks of Wuhan are living a nightmare--with many more people dead in their homes than the figures state. They have inadequate facilities and equipment and staff for this, yet they're barely letting WHO in, and actually declining entry by the CDC (probably the only outfit in the world that can get this under control). I suspect Xi is doing this to try to block worldwide horror at the angst and destruction the Wuhan Level 4 lab has wrought. 

Soon, if not now, nations are going to shun China. It's hard to buy anything that doesn't have at least one component made in China. This could conceivably wreck the global economy. Who in their right mind, for example, is going to want to buy a $1200 Canada Goose jacket made in China. Or for that matter, nestle a new iPhone up to their mouth. This humanitarian debacle is going to stick to Xi, no matter how hard he tries to rub it off onto someone else. The truth always prevails, so while I'm hoping to be debunked as just another conspiracy theorist, I rather suspect the truth is going to make us all sick to our stomachs.

Found this. I'm guessing it's where Mr wrongly went wrongest

Xi is definitely hiding in his bunker right now. No one has seen him for a week. We won't see him until this is over. Any video of him we see from here out is Memorex. 

Sad thing is Chinese who aren't associated with this terror are implicated by association (racially). My wife is Taiwanese but worried about showing her face in public. She's not alone. 

[Gerry Maddoux + 3,627]

39 minutes ago, Ward Smith said:

Found this. I'm guessing it's where Mr wrongly went wrongest

Xi is definitely hiding in his bunker right now. No one has seen him for a week. We won't see him until this is over. Any video of him we see from here out is Memorex. 

Sad thing is Chinese who aren't associated with this terror are implicated by association (racially). My wife is Taiwanese but worried about showing her face in public. She's not alone. 

That would explain why I had never heard the term, Polemic Virus. I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer, but neither am I the dullest.  

I'm sorry about the discrimination this thing has caused. This too shall pass, but it's not right to ever have to worry about one's heritage.

This is Xi's doing, and will quite possibly become his undoing. Zoonotic viruses are just about as scary and unpredictable as it gets, but I doubt this was just another zoonotic virus--as it just happened to crop up in the weeds around the level 4 lab.

The only good news is that Tony Fouci has his crew on it. They've totally unzipped this thing in the laboratory. Our very own CDC knows within a narrow band of probability whether or not this thing was tampered with. And Francis Collins, head of the NIH, is on it too. To share his curriculum vitae, Dr. Collins was head of the human genome project. If the virus contains spliced genomic sequences to weaponize it, that means President Trump knows about it by now. If that was the case, Xi may ultimately realize that he's in Hitler's bunker.

[frankfurter + 562]

26 minutes ago, Gerry Maddoux said:

That would explain why I had never heard the term, Polemic Virus. I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer, but neither am I the dullest.  

I'm sorry about the discrimination this thing has caused. This too shall pass, but it's not right to ever have to worry about one's heritage.

This is Xi's doing, and will quite possibly become his undoing. Zoonotic viruses are just about as scary and unpredictable as it gets, but I doubt this was just another zoonotic virus--as it just happened to crop up in the weeds around the level 4 lab.

The only good news is that Tony Fouci has his crew on it. They've totally unzipped this thing in the laboratory. Our very own CDC knows within a narrow band of probability whether or not this thing was tampered with. And Francis Collins, head of the NIH, is on it too. To share his curriculum vitae, Dr. Collins was head of the human genome project. If the virus contains spliced genomic sequences to weaponize it, that means President Trump knows about it by now. If that was the case, Xi may ultimately realize that he's in Hitler's bunker.

Free speech is one thing. Libel and Slander are other things.  The fact is nothing you write is fact: it is all your bigoted opinion.  

Bunker?  Hiding?  The man has taken control of a crisis. This requires work. You expect him to control a crisis by having lunch with the media?  Feb 7, Xi and Trump had a rather extensive telephone conversation. You expect this to be done on the street using a mobile phone? 

The first country to develop, deploy, and continue bio-weapons is the USA.  This virus can come from 2 sources only: animal or lab. At this time, NOBODY knows how or where this virus originated.  We cannot yet rule out the possibility the virus was planted by a US operative.

Fear mongering will resolve nothing. 

[Otis11 + 551]

2 hours ago, Ward Smith said:

Found this. I'm guessing it's where Mr wrongly went wrongest

Xi is definitely hiding in his bunker right now. No one has seen him for a week. We won't see him until this is over. Any video of him we see from here out is Memorex. 

Sad thing is Chinese who aren't associated with this terror are implicated by association (racially). My wife is Taiwanese but worried about showing her face in public. She's not alone. 

Give your wife a hug for me! I'd say if she ever sees a 6'3" 200 lb German in the airport,  say hi... but I'm afraid that's not too unique of a description, and not sure how to make it such, haha!

This too shall pass. In the mean time make sure she knows that good people stand with her, her family, and friends.

51 minutes ago, frankfurter said:

Free speech is one thing. Libel and Slander are other things.  The fact is nothing you write is fact: it is all your bigoted opinion.  

Bunker?  Hiding?  The man has taken control of a crisis. This requires work. You expect him to control a crisis by having lunch with the media?  Feb 7, Xi and Trump had a rather extensive telephone conversation. You expect this to be done on the street using a mobile phone? 

The first country to develop, deploy, and continue bio-weapons is the USA.  This virus can come from 2 sources only: animal or lab. At this time, NOBODY knows how or where this virus originated.  We cannot yet rule out the possibility the virus was planted by a US operative.

Fear mongering will resolve nothing. 

Doubtful that anything he said can be cast as libel... (and slander had to be spoken, so wrong there too).

Funny how you always turn to calling everyone a bigot when they say something you don't like... I've torn apart every arguement you've posted in this thread and shown you, in fact, are the one posting utter crap.

Amazing how you accuse others of libel, say we don't know anything yet (when we do, in fact, have quite a but of - granted circumstantial - evidence) and then accuse the US of wrongdoing by throwing communist propaganda around... (yes, that is communist propaganda- for anyone unaware, the CCP started floating rumors that the US was planning a Bio attack back in December - after this escaped but before they acknowledged it existed... just to make sure they had a foundation to blame someone else.)

So please, if you wish to actually have a discussion, by all means respond to my previous fact based posts (or Tom's... ).  Otherwise, feel free to stop posting your drivel.

[frankfurter + 562]

34 minutes ago, Otis11 said:

Give your wife a hug for me! I'd say if she ever sees a 6'3" 200 lb German in the airport,  say hi... but I'm afraid that's not too unique of a description, and not sure how to make it such, haha!

This too shall pass. In the mean time make sure she knows that good people stand with her, her family, and friends.

Doubtful that anything he said can be cast as libel... (and slander had to be spoken, so wrong there too).

Funny how you always turn to calling everyone a bigot when they say something you don't like... I've torn apart every arguement you've posted in this thread and shown you, in fact, are the one posting utter crap.

Amazing how you accuse others of libel, say we don't know anything yet (when we do, in fact, have quite a but of - granted circumstantial - evidence) and then accuse the US of wrongdoing by throwing communist propaganda around... (yes, that is communist propaganda- for anyone unaware, the CCP started floating rumors that the US was planning a Bio attack back in December - after this escaped but before they acknowledged it existed... just to make sure they had a foundation to blame someone else.)

So please, if you wish to actually have a discussion, by all means respond to my previous fact based posts (or Tom's... ).  Otherwise, feel free to stop posting your drivel.

escaped?  uh, what has escaped?  you?  if you have proof of an escape, please show it. 

hearsay is not evidence.  yet, you wish to use it: and your purpose is clear to see. only bigots use hearsay for evidence.  fact: innocent people are now the brunt of racial hatred respecting this virus.

if you wish to discuss facts, please present one or two.

 

 

[GunnysGhost + 157]

On 2/5/2020 at 5:51 AM, GunnysGhost said:

- in a forum about a Chinese outbreak, this became 'the vile United State's fault'

- The Chinese Communist Party is excellent in all instances, free of all blame

- Criticizing the Communist Party is 'bigotry'. 

🤣

You are all wrong to criticize the CCP you bigots! 

All arguments will become circular and end up here. 

 

I called this 4 days ago.  ^^^

You can't change the programming on a cliche or an NPC.

Edited February 9, 2020 by GunnysGhost

[GunnysGhost + 157]

Chinese Gov't is so awesome. &nbsp;They are handling this so well. &nbsp;

So much better getting sick in Communist China than elsewhere

 

China may actually be the worst nation in the world when it comes to how this was responded to.  Their sense of 'the CCP does no wrong' actually encouraged them to lie as opposed to raise the red flag (no pun intended) immediately.

Even Ebola-stricken west africa handled their outbreaks better than China.

Socialism causes people to have wrong ideas. 

 

 

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by GunnysGhost

[Ward Smith + 6,615]

13 hours ago, frankfurter said:

We cannot yet rule out the possibility the virus was planted by a US operative.

First you accuse others of libel and slander, then you proceed to libel and slander. 

We get it, you're all proud card carrying members of the CCP and collect your wumaodang pay. But don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. Smarter people than you are on this forum

Edited February 9, 2020 by Ward Smith

[GunnysGhost + 157]

3 minutes ago, Ward Smith said:

First you accuse others of libel and slander, then you proceed to libel and slander. 

We get it, you're all proud card carrying member of the CCP and collect your wumaodang pay. But don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining.  Exclusively Smarter people than you are on this forum

Fixed. 

[Otis11 + 551]

15 hours ago, frankfurter said:

escaped?  uh, what has escaped?  you?  if you have proof of an escape, please show it. 

hearsay is not evidence.  yet, you wish to use it: and your purpose is clear to see. only bigots use hearsay for evidence.  fact: innocent people are now the brunt of racial hatred respecting this virus.

if you wish to discuss facts, please present one or two.

As I, and many others have show circumstantial evidence to support... the virus escaped. For me to repost all the evidence would be equivalent to reposting most of this thread. Feel free to go back and reread.

If you disagree, that's fine, but tell WHY you disagree. Cite the evidence you disagree with and explain why it's not what everyone here sees it as.

Calling everyone on the forum a bigot accomplishes nothing... and from where we're standing, you're the one who looks like the bigot.

bigot (noun)
a person who is intolerant toward those holding different opinions.

We've all been very tolerant and have been willing to engage and discuss other ideas. You're the one showing intolerance. 

As for personally, the only racial hatred I've seen because if this virus and on this thread has been directed at AMERICANS. So yes,  I agree with you, innocent AMERICANS are bearing the brunt if racial hatred because if this - though we've done nothing wrong.

(I do not attempt to minimize the discomfort people such as Ward's wife and any other Asian feels going out in public. They should not feel this way... the virus can spread just as easily from any race, it's purely based on exposure.)

Criticizing the CCP isnt racist, nor is it hatred.

To be clear, I stand WITH the great people of China through this challenge, pray for them, and support them in the ways I can. And with that, I stand FIRMLY OPPOSED to the CCP and their utter subjugation of the people they claim to help as they continue to sacrifice their own people to avoid risking catching the blame.

So again, I invite you to post anything factual or even resembling a coherent position (other than that every American/anyone who criticizes the CCP is a bigot/racist) and I'm confident you will be respectfully engaged by a number of people... 

[Otis11 + 551]

4 hours ago, GunnysGhost said:

 

I called this 4 days ago.  ^^^

You can't change the programming on a cliche or an NPC.

Yes, its disapointingly predictable...  but sadly to ignore it is to allow uninformed lurkers to wonder who's right. He's trying to turn it into a shouting match so that everyone sides with the opinion the came with and we accomplish nothing.

Only by remaining calm and having a civil discussion (or in this case politely pointing out repeatedly that the guy has absolutely no arguement whatsoever and is just trying to sow discourse) can we reach those who are open and willing to learn...

[Gerry Maddoux + 3,627]

17 hours ago, frankfurter said:

it is all your bigoted opinion.  

I don't think I have a bigoted bone in my body. I have worked closely with every nationality known to man. If you canvassed them all, there'd be lots of adjectives to describe me. I don't believe bigoted would be one of them. 

Look, the virus either came out of the lab or from the placing of many wild and exotic animals in close proximity to each other at the wet market. I'm not the one originating that; the Chinese are. Plain and simple, that's the area on the grid--lab, market-- that has been designated ground zero. 

This is not the first zoonotic virus to come out of China. One is a fluke of nature. Two is troubling. One a year is disturbing. Whatever the source, zoonosis from China is repeatedly putting the world community at risk. That means my family, and I take that personally.

I feel for the nice people of China. I have never met a bad one, that I know of. And I think they're getting riled up--the larger populace. They don't want this kind of life. Who would?

This outbreak, which turned into an unnecessary epidemic, is on Xi. He could have closed down all the wet markets with one little red stamp, and he certainly knows what is going on in a dedicated state-owned biosafety laboratory.

If you can spin this differently, be my guest. But please, Frank, since I'm so bigoted, don't spin it so I hate all Germans too.

[Tom Kirkman + 8,860]

20 hours ago, frankfurter said:

Free speech is one thing. Libel and Slander are other things.  The fact is nothing you write is fact: it is all your bigoted opinion.  

Apparently, questioning China's official narrative is now officially racist.

... what Tiankai was concerned about is that the possibility that China created a plague that is now killing its own population, could cause a panic: "For one thing, this will create panic,” Cui said, adding that it would also "fan up racial discrimination and xenophobia."

Here one also wonders what will create a bigger panic: the fact that China is arresting "whistleblower doctors", drags away and sequesters anyone who refuses to be put under forced quarantine, and appears to fabricate data involving the epidemic, or cracks down on anyone asking the most reasonable question - did China's top bioweapon institute, located in Wuhan, spark the deadliest pandemic in decades, which started in... Wuhan?

But yes, we are delighted to see that China has now also stooped to using the oldest trick in the liberal playbook: "...but it's racist."

And just like that, anyone accusing China's Level-4 lab, which as Nature wrote in 2017 was studying the "world's most dangerous pathogens", of sparking what may be the world's worst pandemic in decades, is now a racist, and subject to immediate and permanent suspension by the free speech overlords at twitter such as the company's associate General Counsel, Jeff Rich (his LinkedIn page is here) who one week ago urged his 1,400 followers to "cull" and "excise" the "cancerous" president Trump from the herd. One wonders, Rich, does this violate Twitter's "Abuse and harassment" rules?  ...

 

... We'll conclude with what we said earlier today, namely that "there have been serious questions on whether this Wuhan coronavirus outbreak was due to a leak or mishandling of laboratory animals used in coronavirus studies. This is a reasonable public inquiry regarding the source of the outbreak and it warrants a transparent investigation from the Chinese authorities and foreign disease control and laboratory operation experts. This is not just about the accountability of medical ethics or laboratory safety operations, it is directly related to the current endeavors to contain the virus outbreak.

While the animal host of 2019-nCoV is yet to be identified, the data and information from possible animal hosts and potential zoonic infection is imperative for prevention and controlling disease on an international scale.

The Huanan seafood market has a high potential of harboring the animal host. Animal data and profiling results from the Huanan seafood market need to be disclosed immediately by Chinese authorities even if they are negative results. It is imperative for U.S. CDC and WHO officers to demand that Chinese authorities release the information about animal testing data.

If Chinese authorities refuse to disclose testing data for animal samples, it could imply an intentional cover-up of the true origin of the 2019-nCoV outbreak.

Sadly, we doubt we will ever get an answer to this question, because - as the Chinese ambassador made it clear - any line of inquiry into whether there was an "intentional cover-up of the true origin of the 2019-nCoV outbreak" is now, well... racist.

[notsonice + 1,074]

Monday, February 10

WHO expresses concern about virus among people with no China travel history

WHO chief Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus said there had been "concerning instances" of coronavirus among people who had no history of travelling to China and urged all countries to prepare for the possible arrival of the virus.

"The detection of a small number of cases may indicate more widespread transmission in other countries; in short, we may only be seeing the tip of the iceberg," Tedros said in a series of tweets on Monday morning.

Announcing an advance team for a WHO-led international expert mission to China led by Dr Bruce Aylward, a "veteran of past public health emergencies" was on its way to the country, he urged countries to share their knowledge about the virus with the agency in real-time and to remain calm.

 

Good luck to everyone and stay away from the ones who are hacking up a lung full

[frankfurter + 562]

4 hours ago, Gerry Maddoux said:

I don't think I have a bigoted bone in my body. I have worked closely with every nationality known to man. If you canvassed them all, there'd be lots of adjectives to describe me. I don't believe bigoted would be one of them. 

Look, the virus either came out of the lab or from the placing of many wild and exotic animals in close proximity to each other at the wet market. I'm not the one originating that; the Chinese are. Plain and simple, that's the area on the grid--lab, market-- that has been designated ground zero. 

This is not the first zoonotic virus to come out of China. One is a fluke of nature. Two is troubling. One a year is disturbing. Whatever the source, zoonosis from China is repeatedly putting the world community at risk. That means my family, and I take that personally.

I feel for the nice people of China. I have never met a bad one, that I know of. And I think they're getting riled up--the larger populace. They don't want this kind of life. Who would?

This outbreak, which turned into an unnecessary epidemic, is on Xi. He could have closed down all the wet markets with one little red stamp, and he certainly knows what is going on in a dedicated state-owned biosafety laboratory.

If you can spin this differently, be my guest. But please, Frank, since I'm so bigoted, don't spin it so I hate all Germans too.

Cambridge Dictionary. Bigot. A person who has strong BELIEFS and will not tolerate those who oppose those beliefs.  [This means a bigot will ignore or reject facts to suit his beliefs].

Now, let's review your comments to see if this definition applies. Shall we? 

"This is not the first zoonotic virus to come out of China. One is a fluke of nature. Two is troubling. One a year is disturbing. Whatever the source, zoonosis from China is repeatedly putting the world community at risk."

In black and white, you accuse China of sources, repeated risk to the world, at the frequency of one per year. 

Now, let's review some facts about viruses and their sources. Shall we?  The following outbreaks are for animal to human transmission. [Kindly note; Viruses and their variants number in the thousands. The ones noted are those made popular in the western media].

Avian Flu H5N1
1997 Hong Kong SAR  [note, HK is independent from mainland China, respecting disease control]
2006 Sumatra
Avian Flu H7N9  [note: H7N9 is a variant of H5N1, which itself is a variant of others prior]
2013 China  [7 years ago, contained and resolved]

Swine Flu H1N1   [note the absence of China]
1918 global pandemic, origin Iberian peninsula
1976 U.S. outbreak
1988 U.S. outbreak
2007 Philippine outbreak
2009 Northern Ireland outbreak
2009 USA, Mexico
2015 and 2017 India outbreaks
2015 Nepal outbreak
2016 Pakistan outbreak
2017 Maldives outbreak

SARS SARS-CoV
2002 Hong Kong  [18 years ago]

MERS MERS-CoV
2012 Middle East region

EBOLA EBOV
1976-1995 Zaire
1990 USA
2007-2020 Congo and other African countries
2015 Philippines

ASFV affects pigs only. Though irrelevant, I include here because the MSM propaganda confuses H1N1 with ASFV.
African Swine Flu ASFV 
1921 Kenya
1971 Cuba
1957 Western Europe
2007 Eastern and Northern Europe
2018 China
2019 Vietnam. South Korea, East Timor
2020 remains present in all areas noted above

From the above cases, please show me how China [PRC] ONLY has repeatedly put the world at risk and has done so annually. 

The facts are rather clear, no?  This new nCoV virus is the first time where the alleged epicentre for a deadly contagion has occurred in PRC.  [contrary to your accusation].

In fact, the H1N1 swine virus has killed over 50 million people globally, it continues to this day, AND THE USA HAS HAD 3 OUTBREAKS MAKING THE USA THE WORST REPEAT "OFFENDER"/VICTIM.  In fact, by numbers, H1N1 is by far the most deadly virus on record.

Thus your spin comes from your beliefs, not facts. Be not overly offended, for you started this tripe and you are in the company of many millions.