GREEN NEW DEAL = BLIZZARD OF LIES

[notsonice + 1,290]

9 minutes ago, Old-Ruffneck said:

 C'mon man, pm your phone and address so I can show you what a real businessman can do. Diesel is 3.60 a gallon here, the costs get passed on so what the f**k are you yammering about. I've been in business 34 years and still going. 

I can show you what a real businessman can do????

ha ha ha ha ha ...you are nothing but a fraud

 

go beat off in your crawlspace tard under your trailer.

Please tell us all the name of your business....go for it.....

 

$3.60 for diesel ....boooo hoooooo crybaby....Business that bad you can not afford $3.60 a gallon?????

been in business for 34 years and you are still whining like a 12 year old

 

Edited Tuesday at 06:50 PM by notsonice

[notsonice + 1,290]

3 minutes ago, Old-Ruffneck said:

PM your real phone and address. I'll drive and meet with you. 

big man,  you post yours first

 

Edited Tuesday at 06:47 PM by notsonice

[Old-Ruffneck + 1,281]

5 minutes ago, notsonice said:

big man,  you post yours first

 

What I thought, let your mouth overload your ass. I am willing to meet you as I have asked 3 times....now 4. I will give you a call before I show. 

[Ecocharger + 1,532]

It looks like global warming supposedly caused by increasing atmospheric CO2 will end up instigating another ice age in the northern hemisphere, according to our brilliant climate scientists.

That's right, global warming brings about a new ice age, the same guff that many of the climate science folk were attempting to pedal about twenty years ago.

https://oilprice.com/The-Environment/Global-Warming/Scientists-Warn-Gulf-Stream-Slowdown-Could-Begin-as-Early-as-2025.html

"Potential slowdown or collapse of the Gulf Stream could plunge Northern Europe into a colder climate."

"...temperatures might go in the opposite direction in one area of the globe as a direct result of the warming of the Greenland ice sheet, increased rainfall attributed to climate change, and dropping salinity in the tropical waters where the Gulf Stream arises.

The Gulf Stream, also known as the Atlantic Meridional Overturning Circulation (AMOC), moves heat from the tropics, along the U.S. coast, then across the Atlantic to the British Isles and turns back and north to Iceland and Greenland. There, having lost much of its heat, it turns downward into the Atlantic depths to between 6,000 to 9,000 feet and begins a journey back to the equator and along South America.

Just how much heat does the Gulf Stream move? Some 50 times the energy used by all of human civilization. This explains why Northern Europe—a branch of the AMOC flows toward Scandanavia as well—and Iceland are much warmer than their high latitudes would suggest. If the energy transfer were to slow dramatically or stop, it would almost certainly plunge these areas into a much colder climate regime, one for which they are not currently prepared.

Scientists have been tracking the AMOC since 2004 and believe it is slowing. When researchers discovered in their calculations and modeling that the AMOC might start its next collapse as early as 2025, they couldn't believe it. They rechecked the results, and the conclusion was confirmed. Their model suggests that the current could begin collapsing anywhere from 2025 to 2095."

Edited Tuesday at 09:04 PM by Ecocharger

[TailingsPond + 1,029]

20 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

It looks like global warming supposedly caused by increasing atmospheric CO2 will end up instigating another ice age in the northern hemisphere, according to our brilliant climate scientists.

 

Why comment on stuff you do not believe?  You do not believe the climate change scientists so you can't reference them when it's convenient.

Edited Tuesday at 09:21 PM by TailingsPond

[turbguy + 1,556]

On 2/16/2025 at 10:14 PM, notsonice said:

if what you are proposing was possible ......Fossil fueled power plants would have already done your goofy plan........and generated more electricity of the waste heat/steam...instead they have to have massive cooling towers to take the waste steam to condense the vapor back to water to use it again and in the process they use up a bunch of electrical power

Actually, the auxiliary power used to circulate condenser cooling water to a natural draft cooling tower ain't that great.  It's typically less than 1% of the main generator output.  A mechanical draft cooling tower can use more (2%-5%) to operate huge fans.

Also, there's no "waste steam" in a typical fossil plant (unless you want to count deareator pegging steam, which you can see as a small vapor plume with non-condensable gasses, coming out of a high point).   Plants keep as much heat in the cycle as possible.

Now, turbine EXHAUST steam is condensed by heat transfer to the condenser cooling water (the heat sink), and the condensed fluid is returned to the cycle for reheating.  The natural draft cooling tower cools the "heat sink" water solely via evaporation.   A LOT of evaporation!  The make-up of raw cooling water (sourced from a river, or lake, or whatever) to keep the cooling water quantity stable, is approximately equal to the steam throttle flow! That's on the order of about 3 to 5 million pounds of steam (water) per hour for a modest 650 MW supercritical plant. Plus a little more raw water to dilute any contaminants as that don't evaporate, which alters cooling water chemistry.

 

 

Edited Wednesday at 05:06 AM by turbguy

[specinho + 494]

22 hours ago, TailingsPond said:

It is not a novel idea. 

Accept you are not going to revolutionize science or the energy industry.  You are curious but lack basic education.   He is not wrong that you have essentially no understanding of thermodynamics.

There are things that are not possible - listen to the educated. There is No Free Energy.  You can't win, you can't even break even.  These are known laws of physics.  I point you to information yet you retain false beliefs.  So much arrogance to think you know more than the "teachers and professors" when you have clearly not gone to school.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_law_of_thermodynamics

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entropy

From what you have quoted, it means i said:" Only teachers or professors of yours would be shallow enough to dismiss possibility. You are how they taught you to be and what they fed your brain with."

My stand has not changed. 

What do you intend to say with those two links? 

That energy can not be created nor destroyed but transformed?

That energy loss during the process?

And?

[TailingsPond + 1,029]

8 minutes ago, specinho said:

What do you intend to say with those two links? 

 

You should read and try to understand the two links.

 

[notsonice + 1,290]

2 hours ago, turbguy said:

Actually, the auxiliary power used to circulate condenser cooling water to a natural draft cooling tower ain't that great.  It's typically less than 1% of the main generator output.  A mechanical draft cooling tower can use more (2%-5%) to operate huge fans.

Also, there's no "waste steam" in a typical fossil plant (unless you want to count deareator pegging steam, which you can see as a small vapor plume with non-condensable gasses, coming out of a high point).   Plants keep as much heat in the cycle as possible.

Now, turbine EXHAUST steam is condensed by heat transfer to the condenser cooling water (the heat sink), and the condensed fluid is returned to the cycle for reheating.  The natural draft cooling tower cools the "heat sink" water solely via evaporation.   A LOT of evaporation!  The make-up of raw cooling water (sourced from a river, or lake, or whatever) to keep the cooling water quantity stable, is approximately equal to the steam throttle flow! That's on the order of about 3 to 5 million pounds of steam (water) per hour for a modest 650 MW supercritical plant. Plus a little more raw water to dilute any contaminants as that don't evaporate, which alters cooling water chemistry.

 

 

no waste steam???...I am taking about the low pressure exhaust steam after the turbines...that has to be condensed back to water in the condenser(s)...The Exhaust steam does not have enough pressure to run through any more turbines .........Still is pretty hot and is steam (barely with low to no value) but you cannot sent the exhaust steam directly back to reheat IE into a boiler as it has to be condensed first.............lots of lost heat value.......along with the actual temp of the exhaust flue gases from the boiler after all the steps to try to recover any heat after the boiler ......Overall coal fired power plants only get around 30 to 35 percent conversion to electricity  of the BTUs in the coal originally. You know all of this much better than me. From Specinho thinking he thinks that heat of most low concentration heat sources (sunlight) should be able to take say alcohol and be able to vaporize it , run it through turbines, generate electricity , condense the alcohol and come out a winner......if this was the case you would use this on the low temp (100 to 150 Degree c exhaust steam and flue gases) and make a boat load of electricity........as there is 50 to 60 percent or more??? (you tell me)  of the losses in the whole coal fired power plant to low temperature heat losses in steam  cooling/flue gases. 

Specinho was babbling about taking sunlight and using the heat to generate electricity......When one compares it  to solar panels...solar panels are not bad as it is real hard to turn sunlight into high enough temperature to run any type of steam turbine...IE Concentrated Solar Power plants are great on paper but in reality really do not crank out cheap power the same as solar panels. Solar panel farms and Concentrated Solar Power plants are really two very different conversion techs.....What he was proposing might sound good on the back of a napkin but after you do some Thermo calcs on the whole scheme it does not work very well for low temp heat sources.

 

I spent a long time on Thermo calcs IE trying to make something on a napkin turn into a viable process. I got introduced to it all in basic Thermo..which I took over 40 years ago   .in that class I had to  spend half of one semester alone on Steam power plants on the whole steam cycle including all the losses. Much  time was spent on why you have a hard time of getting past that 35 percent conversion no matter how many schemes or gadgets where thrown at the power plant to make it  more efficient. I hated the class  ..I did not retain alot as I was not interested in the subjects they touch upon.   IE the different steam cycles or heat engine cycles. The Prof was world class he knew his shit. From it I did learn one thing.......I did not want to work in a power plant. After that class I ended up taking more 5 semesters of hard core Thermo over time......including Metallurgical thermo (solid/liquid), Chemical Thermo (reaction)...Surface Thermodynamics (Solid/ liguid and vapor) and The most important for me was Electrochemical Thermodynamics (add in electricity to the others and creating new solid/liguids with electrodes (think batteries) . I needed all the different Thermo classes for my thesis work which was on Catalytic surface chemistry (IE how to use Catalyzers on surfaces to enhance bulk chemical reactions in Met/chem  plants and refineries) 

[Ecocharger + 1,532]

With oil prices now soaring upward, there is speculation that peace with Russia would increase oil supplies and reduce price. However, Russia is on baord with the OPEC program to sustain oil prices going forward. No real change would happen.

https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Goldman-Sachs-Ukraine-Peace-Wont-Hike-Russias-Oil-Supply.html

"...Russia’s oil supply to the market constrained by the self-imposed quota due to its participation in the OPEC+ production deal, not by sanctions.

“We believe that Russia crude oil production is constrained by its OPEC+ 9.0 million barrels per day (mbpd) production target rather than current sanctions, which are affecting the destination but not the volume of oil exports,” analysts at Goldman Sachs wrote in a Wednesday note carried by Reuters."

 

"The alliance is considering pushing back the increase in supply despite calls from U.S. President Donald Trump that OPEC needs to lower oil prices, Bloomberg reported on Monday, quoting OPEC+ delegates."

Edited Wednesday at 03:52 PM by Ecocharger

[Boat + 1,331]

I believe your correct. Any drop in oil income by Russia or OPEC is a plus since income turns quickly into weapons. Trump mentioned raising production to take away more market share. He didn’t give Biden credit for the 2 mbpd the OPEC/Russian took off the market. Same with nat gas. The US is going after market share. This is a reaction to war. 
 

The Red Sea and Suez Canal are one of the most provide the fastest and shortest way to travel between Europe and Asia. So why spend US money protecting international cargo. Russia and Iran drive up international inflation with these silly attacks. Let Europe and Asia take care of the Russians and Iran. Or cover all our costs since being the police to Russian and Iranian antics costs money. 

[TailingsPond + 1,029]

33 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

With oil prices now soaring upward, there is speculation that peace with Russia would increase oil supplies and reduce price. However, Russia is on baord with the OPEC programto sustain oil prices goingforward. No real change would happen.

 

Put some numbers and dates on that prediction.

People speculate, you  copy their words; this time put some words of you own on record. 

"Any day now" is meaningless.

Edited Wednesday at 04:26 PM by TailingsPond

[TailingsPond + 1,029]

Still down YOY.

Down is not soaring.

Edited Wednesday at 04:25 PM by TailingsPond

[turbguy + 1,556]

8 hours ago, notsonice said:

no waste steam???...I am taking about the low pressure exhaust steam after the turbines...that has to be condensed back to water in the condenser(s)...The Exhaust steam does not have enough pressure to run through any more turbines .........Still is pretty hot and is steam (barely with low to no value) but you cannot sent the exhaust steam directly back to reheat IE into a boiler as it has to be condensed first.............lots of lost heat value.......along with the actual temp of the exhaust flue gases from the boiler after all the steps to try to recover any heat after the boiler ......Overall coal fired power plants only get around 30 to 35 percent conversion to electricity  of the BTUs in the coal originally. You know all of this much better than me. From Specinho thinking he thinks that heat of most low concentration heat sources (sunlight) should be able to take say alcohol and be able to vaporize it , run it through turbines, generate electricity , condense the alcohol and come out a winner......if this was the case you would use this on the low temp (100 to 150 Degree c exhaust steam and flue gases) and make a boat load of electricity........as there is 50 to 60 percent or more??? (you tell me)  of the losses in the whole coal fired power plant to low temperature heat losses in steam  cooling/flue gases. 

Specinho was babbling about taking sunlight and using the heat to generate electricity......When one compares it  to solar panels...solar panels are not bad as it is real hard to turn sunlight into high enough temperature to run any type of steam turbine...IE Concentrated Solar Power plants are great on paper but in reality really do not crank out cheap power the same as solar panels. Solar panel farms and Concentrated Solar Power plants are really two very different conversion techs.....What he was proposing might sound good on the back of a napkin but after you do some Thermo calcs on the whole scheme it does not work very well for low temp heat sources.

 

I spent a long time on Thermo calcs IE trying to make something on a napkin turn into a viable process. I got introduced to it all in basic Thermo..which I took over 40 years ago   .in that class I had to  spend half of one semester alone on Steam power plants on the whole steam cycle including all the losses. Much  time was spent on why you have a hard time of getting past that 35 percent conversion no matter how many schemes or gadgets where thrown at the power plant to make it  more efficient. I hated the class  ..I did not retain alot as I was not interested in the subjects they touch upon.   IE the different steam cycles or heat engine cycles. The Prof was world class he knew his shit. From it I did learn one thing.......I did not want to work in a power plant. After that class I ended up taking more 5 semesters of hard core Thermo over time......including Metallurgical thermo (solid/liquid), Chemical Thermo (reaction)...Surface Thermodynamics (Solid/ liguid and vapor) and The most important for me was Electrochemical Thermodynamics (add in electricity to the others and creating new solid/liguids with electrodes (think batteries) . I needed all the different Thermo classes for my thesis work which was on Catalytic surface chemistry (IE how to use Catalyzers on surfaces to enhance bulk chemical reactions in Met/chem  plants and refineries) 

Thank you for clarifying that.  In my view, waste steam is steam that you throw away as a consequence of reliable operation (such as to control cycle water chemistry). Then you know that a condensing turbine's exhaust steam, containing the "waste" energy (absolute back-pressure about 1" or 2" Hg) is far from "hot", typically about that 70 degrees F, if not colder if vacuum is really good.   You know that the energy remaining, rejected to the heat sink, is "contained" in the phase change.

That said, I agree the "other member" 's ideas about using alcohol or carbon-tet as a working fluid in a bottoming cycle is a bit far fetched, but would work, to a degree.  I would have to examine the suggested working fluid's property charts. Waste heat recovery in a VEHICLE's engine just complicates overall economic considerations.  A vehicle's waste gasses can contain significant energy "some" of the time, but not ALL of the time.  All the extra moving and stationary parts required is not worth it.

Bottoming cycles have been applied to stationary engines that operate at constant high loads, such as large stationary diesel plants .  A road vehicle's load varies so much that it doesn't make sense.  Perhaps it could provide enough to operate all or most of the electric loads.  

If you need cabin heat, it's much more cost effective to use a small engine coolant-to-air heat exchanger, or an exhaust gas-to-air heat exchanger (a "muff" around the exhaust pipes) in a small air-cooled aircraft engine, where the load is fairly constant in flight. Those are common forms  of using some engine waste heat. 

Concentrated solar works.  The issue is maintaining those mirrors. That's a LOT of moving parts!  Keeping them clean must be a real chore as well. Plus, in a hot dessert, getting access to a cold heat sink is a challenge.  Delta T uber alles!       

Edited Wednesday at 04:33 PM by turbguy

[Boat + 1,331]

45 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

With oil prices now soaring upward, there is speculation that peace with Russia would increase oil supplies and reduce price. However, Russia is on baord with the OPEC program to sustain oil prices going forward. No real change would happen.

https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Goldman-Sachs-Ukraine-Peace-Wont-Hike-Russias-Oil-Supply.html

"...Russia’s oil supply to the market constrained by the self-imposed quota due to its participation in the OPEC+ production deal, not by sanctions.

“We believe that Russia crude oil production is constrained by its OPEC+ 9.0 million barrels per day (mbpd) production target rather than current sanctions, which are affecting the destination but not the volume of oil exports,” analysts at Goldman Sachs wrote in a Wednesday note carried by Reuters."

 

"The alliance is considering pushing back the increase in supply despite calls from U.S. President Donald Trump that OPEC needs to lower oil prices, Bloomberg reported on Monday, quoting OPEC+ delegates."

Biden and 30 other countries  reacted to $100+ oil and drove it down to this 70-80 range by using oil from the reserve. Inspite of the Saudi taking 2 mbpd off the market. He sent the world a message. I don’t know if there are good numbers about exports to China, India etc. But the world is not in shortage. Non OPEC new oil is making an impact along with transporation going electric. 
I recommend shutting down the 720 thousand barrel a day refinery owned by the Saudi in Texas. Why help the enemy. 

[specinho + 494]

23 hours ago, TailingsPond said:

You should read and try to understand the two links.

 

You posted the links, i summarized what is essential. And would like to know where are you heading with them. Kindly elaborate, thanks.

[Ecocharger + 1,532]

Oil prices are soaring as Trump unwinds and removes the assault on oil from the bad old Biden era, refilling the strategic reserves and removing the heavy tax burdens from the oil industry

A new era has arrived.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Crude-Oil/Oil-Prices-Climb-as-Trump-Pledges-to-Refill-Strategic-Petroleum-Reserve.html

"President Trump stated the Strategic Petroleum Reserve would be filled up quickly, as it is currently at a low level.

The Biden administration previously released substantial amounts of oil from the SPR to manage gasoline prices.

Trump also promised tax cuts for oil and gas producers, but drillers are hesitant to increase production without higher global prices."

Edited Thursday at 03:57 PM by Ecocharger

[Ecocharger + 1,532]

Times have changed, Trump has been elected and the age of spouting "NET ZERO" is a thing of the past, a curious black hole in human history.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/Is-the-Era-of-Net-Zero-Pledges-Coming-to-an-End.html

"BP is experiencing a profit slump and is being pressured by investors to reconsider its Net Zero strategy, potentially shifting focus back to oil and gas.

The debate around Net Zero is intensifying, with political parties and investors questioning its economic viability and impact.

The UK government remains committed to Net Zero, but faces challenges and policy adjustments that raise concerns about achieving its climate goals."

"Meanwhile in the UK, the government continues to insist that Net Zero is both vitally important and eminently achievable – but its biggest cheerleader, Ed Miliband, is being forced to swallow policies that rub up against this commitment – not least the expansion of Heathrow which has climate activists up in arms or up trees or doubtless, before too long, sitting in the middle of motorways again.

Politically, Nigel Farage and Reform UK sense a major opportunity to make the pursuit of Net Zero a huge wedge issue and at a speech in the City earlier this week the insurgent party – which now tops the polls – said they would scrap Net Zero, calling the objective “stupid” and pledging to tax wind and solar farms out of existence. They said they were “serving notice” on the renewables industry."

Hurray!

Edited yesterday at 03:46 AM by Ecocharger

[TailingsPond + 1,029]

23 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

Oil prices are soaring

You keep saying that.  I clearly showed you the decline

WTI sitting at time of writing at $71.29.  There is no soaring.

 

Edited yesterday at 03:37 PM by TailingsPond

[TailingsPond + 1,029]

On 2/18/2025 at 11:55 AM, Old-Ruffneck said:

What I thought, let your mouth overload your ass. I am willing to meet you as I have asked 3 times....now 4. I will give you a call before I show. 

I would fight you.  Not because i hate you just because I like fighting. Win or lose it makes you feel alive.

It is actually hard to start a fight when you are crazy depressed.  I challenged 5 rude teenagers to a fight. They responded "you are going to beat up all five of us?"  I said "I'm going to try."  They told me I was crazy and pissed off.

Another time I told a guy who was about 4" taller and 20# of muscle more than me he could give me the first shot for free and stuck my face out. He screwed off.

My brother did pro MMA (not UFC level) and has second dan in Karate and some high level belt in Brazilian jiu-jitsu.

When you have to fight that level of older brother you get good.  We are Danish, Vikings, Warriors.

[TailingsPond + 1,029]

On 2/18/2025 at 11:55 AM, Old-Ruffneck said:

What I thought, let your mouth overload your ass. I am willing to meet you

If you come all the way up here we can eat pizza, drink beer, and you can stay in the guest bedroom after we F* each other up. 

Good times!

[notsonice + 1,290]

On 2/20/2025 at 8:56 AM, Ecocharger said:

Oil prices are soaring as Trump unwinds and removes the assault on oil from the bad old Biden era, refilling the strategic reserves and removing the heavy tax burdens from the oil industry

A new era has arrived.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Crude-Oil/Oil-Prices-Climb-as-Trump-Pledges-to-Refill-Strategic-Petroleum-Reserve.html

"President Trump stated the Strategic Petroleum Reserve would be filled up quickly, as it is currently at a low level.

The Biden administration previously released substantial amounts of oil from the SPR to manage gasoline prices.

Trump also promised tax cuts for oil and gas producers, but drillers are hesitant to increase production without higher global prices."

Oil prices are soaring as Trump unwinds and removes the assault on oil from the bad old Biden era?????
 

you beat your pal the Old -cocksucker as being the Lowest IQ Moron on this forum

Oil prices are soaring??? and you got a degree in Econ..... I do not think so........as you are just a babbling idiot

 

your soaring oil with Old Shit in the pants in charge????
 

WTI is now down to 70.29.............He sure does make a fool out of you......Oil prices are soaring????
 

what a fucking joke you are

 

That is Trumps driving the world into a recession....killing oil demand and sending the price of Crude down down down

at least your pal the Old -Cocksucker will still service you as I see he upvoted your BS post ...Oil prices are soaring....

 

 

Please go ahead and chart the latest WTI price on the chart below........you really do make a fool out of yourself posting

 

[notsonice + 1,290]

On 2/18/2025 at 11:55 AM, Old-Ruffneck said:

What I thought, let your mouth overload your ass. I am willing to meet you as I have asked 3 times....now 4. I will give you a call before I show. 

babbling again old-cocksucker.?????....when you lose all you can do is threaten people??????

I am willing to meet you?????? for what ?????? you can say what ever you want here............

 

You can post your name and address here anytime you want ....of course you won't .......as then you would be exposed as the fraud you are.

You already are threatening others and you even went after one of the Employees of Oilprice..... what did you call her again????
 

I laugh at your claim of even being a ruffneck..........My bet you were just a laborer on clean up for a couple of years at most before they ran you off.........and then you ran back home to hide in your mom's trailer in Illinois. 

In my book you are just a punk that has nothing to offer..........Just a big mouth with dick in it ...........

Old Cocksucker really fits you 

you must really suck at being a businessman.......you can not even afford Diesel at $3.50 a gallon....Whiner.... baby

PS Do you threaten your customers or for that matter anyone that you disagrees with???? Looks like you are trying to pick fights all the time........... The world is full of old -tards such as yourself... 

Meet with you???? boy you are a Tard........who would want anything to do with you??????? You are an old man that is just looking to beat up people????? sounds like you should be locked up with the rest of the Tards

 

 

 

[notsonice + 1,290]

On 2/13/2025 at 6:01 PM, Old-Ruffneck said:

Trump Reverses Biden's Environmental Policies With Assessment Freeze | OilPrice.com

Tell the liberal bitch that wrote this story she needs find another platform to write in. Leftish C**t!!!

this is what kind of person Old -Ruffneck is

he is a big tough man that is into threatening others and name calling...it is what he is all about

 

He writes that one of the employees of this site is .......

the liberal bitch that wrote this story she needs find another platform to write in. Leftish C**t!!!

Then the Old-Ruffneck claims in a later post 

And whom do I bash? Your just another profane keyboard warrior whose life is shallow. 2 lib-tards on here and i have restrained from calling you names like you call others. 

and the worst is his pal Ecocharger upvotes his trash

 

now Old-Ruffneck is stalking forum members

 

 

[notsonice + 1,290]

On 2/19/2025 at 9:27 AM, turbguy said:

Thank you for clarifying that.  In my view, waste steam is steam that you throw away as a consequence of reliable operation (such as to control cycle water chemistry). Then you know that a condensing turbine's exhaust steam, containing the "waste" energy (absolute back-pressure about 1" or 2" Hg) is far from "hot", typically about that 70 degrees F, if not colder if vacuum is really good.   You know that the energy remaining, rejected to the heat sink, is "contained" in the phase change.

That said, I agree the "other member" 's ideas about using alcohol or carbon-tet as a working fluid in a bottoming cycle is a bit far fetched, but would work, to a degree.  I would have to examine the suggested working fluid's property charts. Waste heat recovery in a VEHICLE's engine just complicates overall economic considerations.  A vehicle's waste gasses can contain significant energy "some" of the time, but not ALL of the time.  All the extra moving and stationary parts required is not worth it.

Bottoming cycles have been applied to stationary engines that operate at constant high loads, such as large stationary diesel plants .  A road vehicle's load varies so much that it doesn't make sense.  Perhaps it could provide enough to operate all or most of the electric loads.  

If you need cabin heat, it's much more cost effective to use a small engine coolant-to-air heat exchanger, or an exhaust gas-to-air heat exchanger (a "muff" around the exhaust pipes) in a small air-cooled aircraft engine, where the load is fairly constant in flight. Those are common forms  of using some engine waste heat. 

Concentrated solar works.  The issue is maintaining those mirrors. That's a LOT of moving parts!  Keeping them clean must be a real chore as well. Plus, in a hot dessert, getting access to a cold heat sink is a challenge.  Delta T uber alles!       

That said, I agree the "other member" 's ideas about using alcohol or carbon-tet as a working fluid in a bottoming cycle is a bit far fetched, but would work, to a degree

but would work, to a degree?????? it does not work ........

this back of the napkin engineering and is just garbage as he proposed. This back of the napkin engineering is brought up students in Thermo classes all the time and of course never passes muster as it takes more energy input than what is generated to keep the fantasy cycle running........when you input source of heat has very minimal/minor value (exhaust steam included) you are left a big capital investment/big operating costs with a saleable output of electricity that does not cover the costs IE you end up feeding in outside electricity or money day in and day out just to run the equipment.

His whole proposed scheme is a money pit

I have sat in too many proposed Electricity Generating Schemes on operating plant/refining sites where someone comes up with a plan to lower the Electric bill.......With the newest Director of Operations claiming they will save money by building an on site power plant..............and disconnection from the grid........reconfigure the existing plant to cut usage........take essential reactors off line.....change the feedstock .....etc etc ..My job on these sites was to speak up to stop the back of the napkin people from started crackpot schemes even in planning.......Many times I would get paid to prove the crackpot scheme were money pits.......And sometimes It would be my last day.........and on those sites everyone was bankrupt within a year.....or the newest director was run off 

 

 

If Spec's  scheme was possible you could use a heat pump with a alcohol based turbine and generate electricity (ie extract the heat out of and exhaust cold air in the end)...again in reality ......it does not work.....You do a complete accounting on a BTU basis using equipment that works (not fantasy equipment)  ...it does not work.....

Maybe someday a much much more efficient heat pump will be found in your lifetime?????? Hope you are in your 30's

Concentrated solar works.??? sure at what cost......guess if you stack it up against coal power these days ...it makes some sense........ 

PS The Mohave project of concentrated solar works is going to be converted to Solar panels...the grid and land is all there...just need to get rid of existing tower......the steam turbines....the mirrors.........

Grand project that is being wiped out by more effective solar panels

AP News

11 years after a celebrated opening, massive solar plant faces a bleak future in the Mojave Desert

The world's largest solar power plant of its type appears headed for closure just 11 years after opening, under pressure from cheaper green energy sources.

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3 weeks ago

Environmental Health News

A massive Mojave Desert solar plant may shut down after just 11 years

Once the world's largest solar-thermal power plant, California's Ivanpah facility is on track for closure as cheaper solar technologies...

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2 weeks ago

Adafruit

Ivanpah concentrated solar thermal plant in the California Mohave Desert is shutting down after 11 years

Ivanpah was the largest concentrating solar power plant in the world at the time of its construction. Now this solar plant is partially...

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4 days ago

CNN

This alien-like field of mirrors in the desert was once the future of solar energy. It’s closing after just 11 years

From a distance, the Ivanpah solar plant looks like a shimmering lake in the Mojave Desert. Up close, it's a vast alien-like installation of...

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1 week ago

Straight Arrow News

Massive Calif. solar plant may close years early, saving residents money

The Ivanpah Solar Power Plant may close 13 years early due to competition from newer renewable technologies and environmental concerns.

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3 weeks ago