Ecocharger + 1,374 DL January 4, 2022 14 hours ago, notsonice said: Most of the market can’t afford a $15,000 EV????? what are you babbling about? in April of 2019 the average price of a new car in the US was $36,270. and the average loan was $30,000. The average cost of a new car climbing to $38,723 as of September 2020. a 50 KWH battery (Tesla Model 3 comes with a 50 kWh battery and 263 miles of range) at $130 to $135 per KWH capacity estimate for 2022) runs $6500 which is not going to place upcoming midsize cars out of the $30,000 to $40000 range at all. Battery costs have falling hard in the last couple of years....try to keep up with reality The only cars selling for $15000 new now are tiny subcompact no frills cars. Average New Car Price by Vehicle Segment Vehicle Segment Average Price Compact car $21,783 Compact SUV/crossover $31,027 Electric vehicle $42,620 Entry-level luxury car $42,016 Full-size car $36,487 Full-size pickup truck $51,424 Full-size SUV/crossover $66,811 High-performance car $97,481 High-end luxury car $92,800 Hybrid/alternative energy car $27,722 Luxury car $58,174 Luxury compact SUV/crossover $46,563 Luxury full-size SUV/crossover $89,524 Luxury mid-size SUV/crossover $57,390 Luxury subcompact SUV/crossover $39,882 Mid-size car $27,545 Mid-size pickup truck $36,203 Mid-size SUV/crossover $39,969 Minivan $33,495 Sports car $36,147 Subcompact car $16,511 Subcompact SUV/crossover $25,197 Van $40,484 Battery costs are going to be moving upward with higher input costs going forward. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,374 DL January 4, 2022 15 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said: That is completely based on Democrat initiated projects at the Department of Energy. All Trump ever did was open up wilderness areas to drilling, rollback clean air and clean water rules, fight renewable energy projects, etc,. etc. No one cares about trying to convince him of anything. He is unneeded, we are getting it done. Supporting Trump and calling yourself an environmentalist is the height of hypocrisy or delusion, you pick. Your analysis above that our economy is reliant on fossil fuel exports is definitely not the environmentalist or technologist answer. Actually we should close down our fossil fuel exports like we did up until 6 years ago. Our efforts need to be focused on mining and more importantly refining elements for renewable energy systems as well as using technology to bring manufacturing back by undercutting the cost of imports through the use of robotics and implementation of a universal basic income as well as a carbon tax. Then as the article suggests we can begin exporting green hydrogen if CCS ever actually works. No need for a carbon tax. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,374 DL January 4, 2022 19 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said: I agree, the recall rate for ICE cars is not good. The recall rate for EVs is worse. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,374 DL January 4, 2022 (edited) 17 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said: By supporting a guy who doesn't believe in democracy or the environment? That isn't very rational. "A guy who doesn't believe in democracy or the environment"? You mean the guy in office right now? Edited January 4, 2022 by Ecocharger 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,374 DL January 4, 2022 (edited) 15 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said: That is completely based on Democrat initiated projects at the Department of Energy. All Trump ever did was open up wilderness areas to drilling, rollback clean air and clean water rules, fight renewable energy projects, etc,. etc. No one cares about trying to convince him of anything. He is unneeded, we are getting it done. Supporting Trump and calling yourself an environmentalist is the height of hypocrisy or delusion, you pick. Your analysis above that our economy is reliant on fossil fuel exports is definitely not the environmentalist or technologist answer. Actually we should close down our fossil fuel exports like we did up until 6 years ago. Our efforts need to be focused on mining and more importantly refining elements for renewable energy systems as well as using technology to bring manufacturing back by undercutting the cost of imports through the use of robotics and implementation of a universal basic income as well as a carbon tax. Then as the article suggests we can begin exporting green hydrogen if CCS ever actually works. A complete waste of unnecessary effort. No need to reduce CO2. We need CO2 to keep alive and breathing, although some of that breath is wasted on misguided hysteria by misinformed climate activists. Edited January 4, 2022 by Ecocharger Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ronwagn + 6,290 January 4, 2022 Learn one of the principles of Mind Control which is used by the establishment to push Agenda 21 Green Extremism and COVID dictatorial directives etc. https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/01/shocking-video-melbourne-man-lights-fire-victorias-vaccine-mandates/?ff_source=Gab&ff_medium=PostTopSharingButtons&ff_campaign=websitesharingbuttons To learn more see: https://drive.google.com/drive/search?q=ukraine Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,374 DL January 4, 2022 15 hours ago, notsonice said: Most of the market can’t afford a $15,000 EV????? what are you babbling about? in April of 2019 the average price of a new car in the US was $36,270. and the average loan was $30,000. The average cost of a new car climbing to $38,723 as of September 2020. a 50 KWH battery (Tesla Model 3 comes with a 50 kWh battery and 263 miles of range) at $130 to $135 per KWH capacity estimate for 2022) runs $6500 which is not going to place upcoming midsize cars out of the $30,000 to $40000 range at all. Battery costs have falling hard in the last couple of years....try to keep up with reality The only cars selling for $15000 new now are tiny subcompact no frills cars. Average New Car Price by Vehicle Segment Vehicle Segment Average Price Compact car $21,783 Compact SUV/crossover $31,027 Electric vehicle $42,620 Entry-level luxury car $42,016 Full-size car $36,487 Full-size pickup truck $51,424 Full-size SUV/crossover $66,811 High-performance car $97,481 High-end luxury car $92,800 Hybrid/alternative energy car $27,722 Luxury car $58,174 Luxury compact SUV/crossover $46,563 Luxury full-size SUV/crossover $89,524 Luxury mid-size SUV/crossover $57,390 Luxury subcompact SUV/crossover $39,882 Mid-size car $27,545 Mid-size pickup truck $36,203 Mid-size SUV/crossover $39,969 Minivan $33,495 Sports car $36,147 Subcompact car $16,511 Subcompact SUV/crossover $25,197 Van $40,484 Here is a recent report on one dissatisfied EV customer. Ouch!! https://www.motortrend.com/news/aggrieved-tesla-owner-obliterates-model-s-dynamite/ 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ronwagn + 6,290 January 4, 2022 On 12/31/2021 at 9:00 PM, Boat said: Take for example Afghanistan. We should know from Vietnam you can control a country with ground troops only at a high price of troops and treasure. But any area can be controlled by air. Drones, missiles and aircraft is much cheaper and safer. Ground troops are so 1944. So why have ground troops sitting as ducks world wide? We have wasted enormous amounts of blood and money in the Middle East. Our leaders talked us into destroying countries and then trying to rebuild them in our own image. We may have spent as much trying to rebuild and hold them as we did taking them over to start with. Our reward for "freeing" these people was few or no economic benefits and the people not becoming any more free but possibly much worse off in some cases. 911 led us from retaliation to insanity in policy. We probably attacked the wrong people anyway. No one seems to have that figured out yet but the Saudis seem to have been the real perpetrators. Our "intelligence" organizations seemed to be a total failure, with the FBI at the forefront by ignoring (or pretending to ignore) the Saudis training to fly large passenger planes but not wanting to learn to land them. The "military industrial complex" made hundreds of billions while many of their contracts were "no bid" contracts. Dick Cheney was at the center of the whole thing and seemed to be directing it. Liz Cheney seems to want to carry on the family business somehow. The establishment in both parties supported all the wars and fed the public a lot of misinformation. We broke military law with torture that was never legal before. Then we let almost all the prisoners go or let them escape in incidents with hundreds of prisoners escaping at a time. More recently Biden ended our war in Afghanistan by having our military flee in the night without notice, leaving billions of dollars of high quality military hardware to our enemies, as will as hundreds of our allied linguists and even our own citizens. We have lost credibility with our allies and potential allies in the future. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ronwagn + 6,290 January 4, 2022 23 hours ago, Wombat One said: Yes indeed Eric. Am not sure if you have been following the launch of the Webb space telescope, but I can assure you that the technology involved is also being applied by the USAF in the pursuit of "space mirrors" that will send concentrated beams of microwaves to power remote bases, anywhere, anytime. Green dreams are for the future. ICE is all we should use except where there are established charging points or generators that are mobile. Primarily that would be in the West only. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
QuarterCenturyVet + 312 JL January 4, 2022 15 hours ago, notsonice said: Most of the market can’t afford a $15,000 EV????? what are you babbling about? in April of 2019 the average price of a new car in the US was $36,270. and the average loan was $30,000. The average cost of a new car climbing to $38,723 as of September 2020. a 50 KWH battery (Tesla Model 3 comes with a 50 kWh battery and 263 miles of range) at $130 to $135 per KWH capacity estimate for 2022) runs $6500 which is not going to place upcoming midsize cars out of the $30,000 to $40000 range at all. Battery costs have falling hard in the last couple of years....try to keep up with reality The only cars selling for $15000 new now are tiny subcompact no frills cars. Average New Car Price by Vehicle Segment Vehicle Segment Average Price Compact car $21,783 Compact SUV/crossover $31,027 Electric vehicle $42,620 Entry-level luxury car $42,016 Full-size car $36,487 Full-size pickup truck $51,424 Full-size SUV/crossover $66,811 High-performance car $97,481 High-end luxury car $92,800 Hybrid/alternative energy car $27,722 Luxury car $58,174 Luxury compact SUV/crossover $46,563 Luxury full-size SUV/crossover $89,524 Luxury mid-size SUV/crossover $57,390 Luxury subcompact SUV/crossover $39,882 Mid-size car $27,545 Mid-size pickup truck $36,203 Mid-size SUV/crossover $39,969 Minivan $33,495 Sports car $36,147 Subcompact car $16,511 Subcompact SUV/crossover $25,197 Van $40,484 You're always such an American-centric mind. The world market, genius, can't quite afford $15K. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 January 4, 2022 40 minutes ago, ronwagn said: We have lost credibility with our allies and potential allies in the future. Especially when Trump sold out our Kurdish allies. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 January 4, 2022 16 minutes ago, QuarterCenturyVet said: You're always such an American-centric mind. The world market, genius, can't quite afford $15K. Good thing there are sub $15K EVs. The best selling EV in China costs $5K 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 January 4, 2022 58 minutes ago, Ecocharger said: Here is a recent report on one dissatisfied EV customer. Ouch!! https://www.motortrend.com/news/aggrieved-tesla-owner-obliterates-model-s-dynamite/ Yep, he made a lot of money off of the clicks. You are mighty gullible. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 January 4, 2022 1 hour ago, QuarterCenturyVet said: The last 2 election cycles, more minorities voted than ever before. Wtf are you taking about? Oh, like the democrats didn't declare Trump an illegitimate president first and then try to remove him via the completely fabricated Russia-gate inquiry and two ridiculous and unfounded impeachments? The left doesn't have any standards except for double standards. The impeachments were legal constitutional processes based on the clearly unconstitutional acts of Trump. Particularly the second impeachment which was for the unconstitutional attempted coup. 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,374 DL January 4, 2022 (edited) Thanks to wild hysterical Green ideas and government Green policies, energy prices are on a skyrocket upward move, https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Energy-Prices-Rose-59-In-2021.html "Energy prices at the end of 2021 were 59% higher than they were at the beginning of the year, according to a new report by the Energy Information Administration (EIA). The boom in energy prices—which was more than the gains seen by other commodities—was largely the result of economic recovery from the Covid-19 pandemic. Most other commodity prices in the S&P Goldman Sachs Commodity Index (GSCI) saw about a 20% increase, with the exception of precious metals, which saw a decline. Within the energy portion of the commodity index that tracks the performance of global commodities markets, RBOB (wholesale gasoline) saw the largest gain at 67%, followed by heating oil, then WTI and Brent. Gasoil and natural gas rounded out the energy segment of the GSCI. WTI and Brent saw a 62% and 55% gain, respectively." Edited January 4, 2022 by Ecocharger Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,374 DL January 4, 2022 43 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said: Yep, he made a lot of money off of the clicks. You are mighty gullible. Bad news for Tesla on that, highlights the problems with EVs. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ronwagn + 6,290 January 4, 2022 47 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said: Especially when Trump sold out our Kurdish allies. Maybe so, I guess you think that the massive failures of Biden are comparable. I am sure that Trump took advice on his decision with his Secretary of State. Please tell me why you think you know the pros and cons and all the details. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ronwagn + 6,290 January 4, 2022 46 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said: The impeachments were legal constitutional processes based on the clearly unconstitutional acts of Trump. Particularly the second impeachment which was for the unconstitutional attempted coup. Bullshit set up by the FBI. The same FBI that did not investigate the bombers of 911. Who Invaded the Capitol Building? https://docs.google.com/document/d/19qLxuaWqyPKPsE7xyT2ATV6-I9J_BhfvkChb3E-NL4o/edit Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ronwagn + 6,290 January 4, 2022 7 minutes ago, Ecocharger said: Bad news for Tesla on that, highlights the problems with EVs. Musk has been selling billions of dollars of stock. I am not sure that he thinks he can continue to compete against the other companies. If not, the stock will fall. I wish him well though, he is a genius. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,374 DL January 4, 2022 More bad road tests coming in for the Tesla, supposedly gets 263 miles per charge, but in this test below only 109 miles. And with the current global cooling phase in force, this will only get worse. https://insideevs.com/news/498554/tesla-model-3-range-extreme-cold/?fbclid=IwAR07219mo1tTl4QXtKBxmwxj40HMTH4gUBLNmlLDrpN_HRzoo0NpdLDTCEw Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 January 4, 2022 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Ecocharger said: More bad road tests coming in for the Tesla, supposedly gets 263 miles per charge, but in this test below only 109 miles. And with the current global cooling phase in force, this will only get worse. https://insideevs.com/news/498554/tesla-model-3-range-extreme-cold/?fbclid=IwAR07219mo1tTl4QXtKBxmwxj40HMTH4gUBLNmlLDrpN_HRzoo0NpdLDTCEw You are really scraping the bottom of the barrel. The 10 people who live in such ridiculous places are welcome to keep driving their plug in hybrids. The number one EV market in the world is Norway, not exactly tropical. Edited January 4, 2022 by Jay McKinsey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,062 DM January 4, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, QuarterCenturyVet said: You're always such an American-centric mind. The world market, genius, can't quite afford $15K. Do you have a brain, car/truck prices in the US pretty much the same all through North and South America and Europe and in Japan...South Korea, Africa etc etc etc .......When is the last time you left your trailer park ???? They selling cars in Canada on the cheap??? 15k new Pickups in Calgary???? did not think so..... Autos is a world market and the prices are pretty much the same everywhere for the same style vehicle unless you are buying a golf cart in China or a car with only one seat. The cost of batteries has fallen and the cost is no longer a reason there will be a big difference in price between an EV and an ICE vehicle. Edited January 4, 2022 by notsonice 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,062 DM January 4, 2022 13 hours ago, Ecocharger said: More bad road tests coming in for the Tesla, supposedly gets 263 miles per charge, but in this test below only 109 miles. And with the current global cooling phase in force, this will only get worse. https://insideevs.com/news/498554/tesla-model-3-range-extreme-cold/?fbclid=IwAR07219mo1tTl4QXtKBxmwxj40HMTH4gUBLNmlLDrpN_HRzoo0NpdLDTCEw what a joke , the goof ball ran the car for 7.3 hours and drove only 109 Miles.. 2:09 Starting the drive3:52 50% charge dissipated8:02 90% charge dissipated9:27 End of drive He traveled 109 miles in 7.3 hours???? How many miles ,to the gallon ,do you get sitting in your car for 7.3 hours in bitter cold temp with the heat blasting away while parked? 10? How long does a full tank of gas last while parked,running and in the bitter cold? 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,062 DM January 4, 2022 New solar shingle debuting at CES 2022 can be nailed directly to your roof Timberline Solar Energy Shingles from GAF Energy go in place with just a nail gun. Installing solar could be faster than ever. Andrew Blok Jan. 3, 2022 2:00 p.m. PT Timberline Solar Energy Shingles can be nailed directly to the roof. GAF This story is part of CES, where CNET covers the latest news on the most incredible tech coming soon. People looking to add rooftop solar to their homes are getting a new option from a company with a long track record in roofing. GAF Energy, sister company to the roofing giant GAF, is expanding its rooftop solar offerings with a new solar shingle garnering awards at CES 2022. The new solar shingle can be incorporated with GAF shingles to create a solar roof that GAF Energy is calling Timberline Solar. Timberline Solar Energy Shingles can be easily installed with traditional shingles since both are put up with the same tool, a nail gun. That means installation should be faster. A spokesperson said the company has "consistently seen install times that are half that required for rack-mounted solar." Installation is typically the largest expense for residential solar energy systems. Timberline Solar will be cheaper than other solar roofs (about half of what Tesla's solar roof costs) and be comparable to the cost of a new roof with rack-mounted solar panels, a spokesperson said. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ronwagn + 6,290 January 4, 2022 3 minutes ago, notsonice said: New solar shingle debuting at CES 2022 can be nailed directly to your roof Timberline Solar Energy Shingles from GAF Energy go in place with just a nail gun. Installing solar could be faster than ever. Andrew Blok Jan. 3, 2022 2:00 p.m. PT Timberline Solar Energy Shingles can be nailed directly to the roof. GAF This story is part of CES, where CNET covers the latest news on the most incredible tech coming soon. People looking to add rooftop solar to their homes are getting a new option from a company with a long track record in roofing. GAF Energy, sister company to the roofing giant GAF, is expanding its rooftop solar offerings with a new solar shingle garnering awards at CES 2022. The new solar shingle can be incorporated with GAF shingles to create a solar roof that GAF Energy is calling Timberline Solar. Timberline Solar Energy Shingles can be easily installed with traditional shingles since both are put up with the same tool, a nail gun. That means installation should be faster. A spokesperson said the company has "consistently seen install times that are half that required for rack-mounted solar." Installation is typically the largest expense for residential solar energy systems. Timberline Solar will be cheaper than other solar roofs (about half of what Tesla's solar roof costs) and be comparable to the cost of a new roof with rack-mounted solar panels, a spokesperson said. A nice ad. This technology has been "coming" for many years. I hope it has finally arrived. Real references would be nice. Facts. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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