GREEN NEW DEAL = BLIZZARD OF LIES

[Ecocharger + 1,446]

The oil industry is beginning to take up the attack on the pernicious CO2 junk science which has stampeded the political classes into a mindless rush into renewable energy. The fragile foundations of the CO2 theory of climate change are being exposed for all to see, and it is a pathetic sight.

We will now see legal action over the matter.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/Climate-Crisis-Tide-Turns-For-Big-Oil.html

"French TotalEnergies was quick to take legal action against none other than one of the icons of the environmental movement: Greenpeace. After the organization issued a report claiming that TotalEnergies was underreporting its emissions, the supermajor acted swiftly and slammed Greenpeace for spreading misinformation, filing a lawsuit against the organization.

“The Greenpeace report follows a methodology that is dubious, to say the least,” TotalEnergies said at the time, adding that “the dissemination by Greenpeace of misleading information in this matter is serious.”

Edited February 9, 2023 by Ecocharger

[Ron Wagner + 702]

19 minutes ago, turbguy said:

I believe you have ignored a rather important input term and interim steps in that process diagram.  The Calvin cycle has some real neat tricks up it's sleeve!

I am certain you can discern what that missing input term might be.

It is a pity that humankind cannot seem to replicate the process, without invoking other forms of life.

The origin of life on Earth is a subject of some considerable controversy, ranging from the "waving of a magic wand" by a grand deity, to the deposition of materials from an arrival of something from outer space, to the chance formation arising out of "just the right combination" of the right energy and right organic compounds.  That origin may never be nailed down. 

Leave it to say, life is a chaotic system, living within chaos.

Totally wrong IMHO. Look up theistic evolution. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theistic_evolution#:~:text=Theistic evolution (also known as,of modern science%2C including evolution.

[turbguy + 1,535]

On 2/7/2023 at 12:27 PM, notsonice said:

not failing renewables or failing gas power plant issues

 

Ice storms cause transmission line failures/transformer station issues

which then takes generation off line

 

Ice storms very rarely directly cause HV transmission line and substation failures.

Ice storms frequently DO cause considerable DISTRIBUTION line failures (think, the wires running though your neighborhood, subject to vegetation-caused damage).  Lineman repairs are delayed by the storm as well.

Ice storms and deep freezing weather CAN cause coal-fired plant de-rates and even full unit outages when the stored coal becomes frozen, or coal cannot be unloaded from rail cars. Have you ever been in a coal-fired plants that has now iced over/defrosted, and very wet coal attempting to exit the coal bunker?  Trust me, you don't wanna be there...

Deep-freezing weather CAN cause natural gas supply issues to natural gas fired plants.  Without sufficient fuel at pressures well above a CT's compressor discharge pressure, it ain't gonna run.

[turbguy + 1,535]

1 minute ago, Ron Wagner said:

Totally wrong IMHO. Look up theistic evolution. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theistic_evolution#:~:text=Theistic evolution (also known as,of modern science%2C including evolution.

Another "view".  And it might not be wrong!

Got evidence?

[Ron Wagner + 702]

1 minute ago, turbguy said:

Another "view".  And it might not be wrong!

Got evidence?

Evolution is widely supported by science. I am sure you would agree with that. I do have my own evidence that God actually exists but you have to have "eyes to see and ears to hear" in order to see that truth and hear from Holy Spirit. I hope you have an encounter with him before you die. 

“Of them, Jesus said: '[B]lessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear'" (Matthew 13:16). Christ promised His disciples, “He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father” (John 14:12).Oct 4, 2015

[turbguy + 1,535]

8 minutes ago, Ron Wagner said:

Evolution is widely supported by science. I am sure you would agree with that. I do have my own evidence that God actually exists but you have to have "eyes to see and ears to hear" in order to see that truth and hear from Holy Spirit. I hope you have an encounter with him before you die. 

“Of them, Jesus said: '[B]lessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear'" (Matthew 13:16). Christ promised His disciples, “He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father” (John 14:12).Oct 4, 2015

As I said, you may be 100% correct!

In my view, The Holy Spirit does exist, absolutely everywhere and at all times, within every subatomic particle (and/or wave), or vibrating string, or whatever view of "matter and energy" you are attracted to.  That Spirit exists in us.

I am in continual awe of what that chaos has created (and continues to create).

Edited February 9, 2023 by turbguy

[Ron Wagner + 702]

I can't agree with God being formed by chaos, but I can believe that chaos comes and goes throughout the universe under laws that were set by God. Science is still trying to figure out all of that, as you well know. 

One theory that I think is ridiculous is the Big Bang theory. It posits that there was one event that created the entire universe all at once. To believe that is IMHO to believe that the universe is not infinite in size. It is infinite in size and has many planes of existence. The human mind cannot come close to understanding infinity and planes of existence. Few people even have a hint of the make up of material objects and the space between atomic particles. 

 

Edited February 9, 2023 by Ron Wagner

[turbguy + 1,535]

4 minutes ago, Ron Wagner said:

I can't agree with God being formed by chaos, but I can believe that chaos comes and goes throughout the universe under laws that were set by God. Science is still trying to figure out all of that, as you well know. 

One theory that I think is ridiculous is the Big Bang theory. It posits that there was one event that created the entire universe all at once. To believe that is IMHO to believe that the universe is not infinite in size. 

 

Oh, In my view, our chaos was a creation of the Holy Spirit, with chaotic "laws" that can be bent and transformed in ways we may never comprehend.

Ever notice, the smaller (or larger) we observe, the more we see?

And our questions about those observations never seem to be satisfied.

Yeah, the Big Bang is quite a theory, supported by significant observation and evidence. Actually, it can make some sense if you consider general relativity and time dilation.  In order to have a "big bang", all matter and energy existed at one "place".  That infers that ALL "prior time" existed in that instant.

Just what we need, another mathematical "singularity".   Damn!

[Ron Wagner + 702]

2 minutes ago, turbguy said:

Oh, In my view, our chaos was a creation of the Holy Spirit, with chaotic "laws" that can be bent and transformed in ways we may never comprehend.

Ever notice, the smaller (or larger) we observe, the more we see?

And our questions about those observations never seem to be satisfied.

Yeah, the Big Bang is quite a theory, supported by significant observation and evidence. Actually, it can make some sense if you consider general relativity and time dilation.  In order to have a "big bang", all matter and energy existed at one "place".  That infers that ALL "prior time" existed in that instant.

Just what we need, another mathematical "singularity".   Damn!

I guess we agree on a lot but may disagree on the most important point, which is IMHO the role of God. 

[turbguy + 1,535]

26 minutes ago, Ron Wagner said:

I guess we agree on a lot but may disagree on the most important point, which is IMHO the role of God. 

I'm certain we have much in common.

I am just WAY to humble to impose or assume any "role" on such an entity.

That is a pure matter of faith.

I CAN impose a role on life.

That role is purely to support other life.

Edited February 9, 2023 by turbguy

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

36 minutes ago, Ron Wagner said:

I can't agree with God being formed by chaos, but I can believe that chaos comes and goes throughout the universe under laws that were set by God. Science is still trying to figure out all of that, as you well know. 

One theory that I think is ridiculous is the Big Bang theory. It posits that there was one event that created the entire universe all at once. To believe that is IMHO to believe that the universe is not infinite in size. It is infinite in size and has many planes of existence. The human mind cannot come close to understanding infinity and planes of existence. Few people even have a hint of the make up of material objects and the space between atomic particles. 

 

Hahaha, creating infinity all at once is ridiculous but over seven days is just fine. What silliness. 

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

59 minutes ago, Ron Wagner said:

Evolution is widely supported by science. I am sure you would agree with that. I do have my own evidence that God actually exists but you have to have "eyes to see and ears to hear" in order to see that truth and hear from Holy Spirit. I hope you have an encounter with him before you die. 

“Of them, Jesus said: '[B]lessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear'" (Matthew 13:16). Christ promised His disciples, “He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father” (John 14:12).Oct 4, 2015

So you don't have any evidence.

[turbguy + 1,535]

1 minute ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Hahaha, creating infinity all at once is ridiculous but over seven days is just fine. What silliness. 

Actually, a case can be made for "seven days", once gravitational time dilation is considered.

[notsonice + 1,243]

1 hour ago, Ecocharger said:

The oil industry is beginning to take up the attack on the pernicious CO2 junk science which has stampeded the political classes into a mindless rush into renewable energy' The fragile foundations of the CO2 theory of climate change are being exposed for all to see, and it is a pathetic sight.

We will now see legal action over the matter.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/Climate-Crisis-Tide-Turns-For-Big-Oil.html

"French TotalEnergies was quick to take legal action against none other than one of the icons of the environmental movement: Greenpeace. After the organization issued a report claiming that TotalEnergies was underreporting its emissions, the supermajor acted swiftly and slammed Greenpeace for spreading misinformation, filing a lawsuit against the organization.

“The Greenpeace report follows a methodology that is dubious, to say the least,” TotalEnergies said at the time, adding that “the dissemination by Greenpeace of misleading information in this matter is serious.”

pernicious CO2 junk science? more BS babble

enjoy the transition to renewables, I am 

[notsonice + 1,243]

1 hour ago, turbguy said:

Ice storms very rarely directly cause HV transmission line and substation failures.

Ice storms frequently DO cause considerable DISTRIBUTION line failures (think, the wires running though your neighborhood, subject to vegetation-caused damage).  Lineman repairs are delayed by the storm as well.

Ice storms and deep freezing weather CAN cause coal-fired plant de-rates and even full unit outages when the stored coal becomes frozen, or coal cannot be unloaded from rail cars. Have you ever been in a coal-fired plants that has now iced over/defrosted, and very wet coal attempting to exit the coal bunker?  Trust me, you don't wanna be there...

Deep-freezing weather CAN cause natural gas supply issues to natural gas fired plants.  Without sufficient fuel at pressures well above a CT's compressor discharge pressure, it ain't gonna run.

the problem with the last storm was line failure due to ice...

not frozen stockpiles nor problems with frozen rail cars

and yes I have worked coal stockpiles and bins

the coal stockpiles and bins had nothing to do with the outages

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

3 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

We went through this a few hundred times, Jay. The natural gas plants relied on starters powered by electricity, just a tiny spark to get the process going....and the renewable sector could not even manage that tiny little task. Pathetic.

So natural gas power plants are so feeble they require renewable electricity to work. Good to know!

[notsonice + 1,243]

3 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

Nonsense, there will be no transition, and there is nothing in the Biden bills to fuel any serious transition. Any serious transition would cause a huge political backlash against the Demos and turf them out of office.

Nonsense, there will be no transition??? 

HA HA HA look out the window of your double-wide......solar panels and wind turbines everywhere...enjoy the view 

[notsonice + 1,243]

3 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

Oil is big and is going to get bigger, its a generational transition requirement.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/Road-Tripping-Retirees-Set-To-Bolster-US-Gasoline-Demand.html

"Yet, people drove more in the United States in 2022 than in 2019, before the pandemic. 

“We forecast this trend of increased travel will continue in the United States during 2023 and 2024, "

people drove more in the United States in 2022 than in 2019, before the pandemic

yep the are now driving EV's and hyrbrids.....

Enjoy the transition

love the line in the article   ......

Gasoline Consumption in the U.S. has been lower than pre-pandemic 2019 

now tell us all that less is now bigger????

[Ecocharger + 1,446]

45 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

So you don't have any evidence.

I have been saying that to you for quite some time, Jay.

[Ecocharger + 1,446]

18 minutes ago, notsonice said:

pernicious CO2 junk science? more BS babble

enjoy the transition to renewables, I am 

Pernicious is a good term for it. It is actually contrary to the evidence which I have posted here.

Scientists who ignore evidence are not real scientists.

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

Just now, Ecocharger said:

I have been saying that to you for quite some time, Jay.

Yep, I only have cold hard economic data. 

[Ecocharger + 1,446]

6 minutes ago, notsonice said:

people drove more in the United States in 2022 than in 2019, before the pandemic

yep the are now driving EV's and hyrbrids.....

Enjoy the transition

love the line in the article   ......

Gasoline Consumption in the U.S. has been lower than pre-pandemic 2019 

now tell us all that less is now bigger????

Transportation is more than 99% fossil fuel, and if you think that hybrids on the road are not using fossil fuel, you really are into dreamland, friend.

[Ecocharger + 1,446]

Just now, Jay McKinsey said:

Yep, I only have cold hard economic data. 

Limited data only. Out of context, sure.

[Jay McKinsey + 1,490]

Just now, Ecocharger said:

Limited data only. Out of context, sure.

It is hilarious watching you flail around from one intellectual disaster to the next.

[notsonice + 1,243]

2 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

Transportation is more than 99% fossil fuel, and if you think that hybrids on the road are not using fossil fuel, you really are into dreamland, friend.

hybrids use less fuel .........and also can be plugged in so they can run on electric power with no need for fossil fuels

cars and small trucks are no longer 99 % fossil fuel.....

Enjoy the transition 

You are living in the past ...