notsonice + 1,168 DM November 17, 2023 1 hour ago, Eyes Wide Open said: Quite interesting numbers, very illuminating. It would seem the GREEN ZOMBIES have aligned themselves with the CCP. Quite puzzling actually, the Green Party actually destroying the Socialist labor party in the EU. Revolution Eats It's Own Children comes to mind...Will Europe ever learn... Europe probes China’s electric car subsidies as imports soar Chinese companies exported nearly 350,000 EVs to nine European countries in the first half of the year, more than they exported in all of 2022, according to data from the China Passenger Car Association. And in the last five years, EU imports of Chinese cars have quadruple Senior German and French industry executives have recently sounded the alarm about the growing threat posed by Chinese EVs. Electric cars sold in China are roughly 40% cheaper than those sold in Europe, and 50% cheaper than in the US, according to research firm Jato Dynamics. https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/13/cars/europe-china-electric-car-subsidies/index.html It would seem the GREEN ZOMBIES have aligned themselves with the CCP. Quite puzzling actually, the Green Party actually destroying the Socialist labor party in the EU.???? seriously you need mental health care.....did you dream up all of your BS or are you just plain ignorant and someone is feeding you BS??? asking for a friend as he thinks you may need a mental health checkup in the meantime EVs are increasing and taking more and more market share away from clunkers Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eyes Wide Open + 3,550 November 17, 2023 (edited) 10 minutes ago, notsonice said: seriously you need mental health care.....did you dream up all of your BS or are you just plain ignorant and someone is feeding you BS??? No conjecture on my part...From CNN with love. By chance only do you believe the German labor party is aware of 350,000 cheap EV'S are taking away there way of life? Chinese companies exported nearly 350,000 EVs to nine European countries in the first half of the year, more than they exported in all of 2022, according to data from the China Passenger Car Association. And in the last five years, EU imports of Chinese cars have quadruple Senior German and French industry executives have recently sounded the alarm about the growing threat posed by Chinese EVs. Electric cars sold in China are roughly 40% cheaper than those sold in Europe, and 50% cheaper than in the US, according to research firm Jato Dynamics https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/13/cars/europe-china-electric-car-subsidies/index.html Edited November 17, 2023 by Eyes Wide Open Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,168 DM November 17, 2023 15 minutes ago, Eyes Wide Open said: No conjecture on my part...From CNN with love. By chance only do you believe the German labor party is aware of 350,000 cheap EV'S are taking away there way of life? Chinese companies exported nearly 350,000 EVs to nine European countries in the first half of the year, more than they exported in all of 2022, according to data from the China Passenger Car Association. And in the last five years, EU imports of Chinese cars have quadruple Senior German and French industry executives have recently sounded the alarm about the growing threat posed by Chinese EVs. Electric cars sold in China are roughly 40% cheaper than those sold in Europe, and 50% cheaper than in the US, according to research firm Jato Dynamics https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/13/cars/europe-china-electric-car-subsidies/index.html It would seem the GREEN ZOMBIES have aligned themselves with the CCP. Quite puzzling actually, the Green Party actually destroying the Socialist labor party in the EU.???? so you saving if you buy anything that is made in China you aligned with the CCP..... got it so you are aligned with the CCP as just about everything these days has some little part in it that was made in China. I would then take it you are a China Zombie and a socialist....this is all based on your reasoning..... It would seem the GREEN ZOMBIES have aligned themselves with the CCP. Quite puzzling actually, the Green Party actually destroying the Socialist labor party in the EU...... lol.....words from the forums China Zombie Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SafetyKris + 10 KC November 17, 2023 https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/Has-the-Energy-Transition-Hit-a-Wall.html We all knew it was coming, even with the government subsidies. Long Live Petrol. "The transition will be neither as fast nor as smooth—or as cheap—as initially expected. It will take a long time; it will be uneven, and it will be expensive." “There’s this notion that it is going to be a linear energy transition,” Daniel Yergin, S&P Global vice chairman and a veteran energy chronicler, told the Wall Street Journal. “It’s going to unfold in different ways in different parts of the world.” No matter where in the world, it will be slooow. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,168 DM November 17, 2023 29 minutes ago, SafetyKris said: https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/Has-the-Energy-Transition-Hit-a-Wall.html We all knew it was coming, even with the government subsidies. Long Live Petrol. "The transition will be neither as fast nor as smooth—or as cheap—as initially expected. It will take a long time; it will be uneven, and it will be expensive." “There’s this notion that it is going to be a linear energy transition,” Daniel Yergin, S&P Global vice chairman and a veteran energy chronicler, told the Wall Street Journal. “It’s going to unfold in different ways in different parts of the world.” No matter where in the world, it will be slooow. Long Live Petrol???? well the demand side is getting hammered China is not going to save oil in the long term....those pesky sales of EVs are booming (and no more China Gov Subsidy to boot) Enjoy the transition.......... Crude oil prices drop 5% CNBC U.S. crude oil prices fall 5% as supply grows amid demand worries The U.S. reported that crude inventories rose by 3.6 million barrels last week while production held steady at a record 13.2 million barrels... . 1 day ago Yahoo Finance Oil falls nearly 5% as demand worries, inventory builds send prices off 20% from 2023 highs Crude oil prices remained under pressure on Thursday as worries over bloated inventories, a bad technical setup, and demand fears weighed on... . 1 day ago Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,400 DL November 18, 2023 17 hours ago, Rob Plant said: the clue here is it says the most popular sedan, not vehicle. Dont worry though that is coming soon Don't worry, fossil fuel vehicles will continue to rule the transport scene into the foreseeable future. It is just not worth the effort to replace fossil fuel transport, which currently dominates the market. There is no demonstrable climate benefit from replacing fossil fuel vehicles with battery vehicles. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,168 DM November 18, 2023 (edited) https://www.carbonbrief.org/eus-use-of-fossil-fuels-for-electricity-falls-17-to-record-low-in-first-half-of-2023/ EU POLICY 29 August 2023 23:01 EU’s use of fossil fuels for electricity falls 17% to ‘record low’ in first half of 2023 Edited November 18, 2023 by notsonice Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TailingsPond + 557 GE November 18, 2023 (edited) 8 hours ago, footeab@yahoo.com said: Well suggest you read. That is average per day, not average per trip. So, here in REALITY, no one drives on Saturday/Sunday, or at least not much. So average distance per day is ~40miles, not 30. Now remove all those people who own a car but take the bus, train, walk to work which currently is about ~+5% of the population so here in REALITY that 40miles turns into ~45miles/day for the average car driver per day. Here in REALITY, batteries do NOT last long if you drain them 100% continuously. Therefore if the battery will last as long as the car the average discharge needs to be less than 50%. So, if your hybrid "range" is 20 miles or 30 miles, here in reality it is only 10-->15miles. So, your "sleuth" detective ability has short bus challenges shall we say... You don't understand how averages work; you can't remove zeros from the data set just because you want to. By your absolute junk "logic" (if you can even call it logic) if I drove 365 Km in one day, then didn't drive for the rest of the year I would "average" 365 Km/day when in REALITY the average is 1km/day. Furthermore, he said average per journey not average per day so you are doubly wrong. Edited November 18, 2023 by TailingsPond 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,400 DL November 18, 2023 1 hour ago, TailingsPond said: You don't understand how averages work; you can't remove zeros from the data set just because you want to. By your absolute junk "logic" (if you can even call it logic) if I drove 365 Km in one day, then didn't drive for the rest of the year I would "average" 365 Km/day when in REALITY the average is 1km/day. Furthermore, he said average per journey not average per day so you are doubly wrong. I think that you can rest assured that people do not buy a fossil fuel engine unless they plan to use it, and demand for those things remains strong. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 November 18, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Ecocharger said: I think that you can rest assured that people do not buy a fossil fuel engine unless they plan to use it, and demand for those things remains strong. Actually a lot of people buy fossil fuel engines hoping to never use them such as emergency backup generators for the potential bad blackout. That is exactly what the ICE in a PHEV is, a backup generator. Face it, you lose this argument every time! Edited November 18, 2023 by Jay McKinsey 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron Wagner + 668 November 20, 2023 https://www.zerohedge.com/energy/heating-homes-natural-gas-more-40-percent-cheaper-electricity-us-eia Heating Homes With Natural Gas Is More Than 40% Cheaper Than Electricity: US EIA BY TYLER DURDEN FRIDAY, NOV 17, 2023 - 04:00 AM Authored by Naveen Athrappully via The Epoch Times (emphasis ours), Heating homes this winter using natural gas is estimated to cut down energy costs by more than 40 percent compared to electricity, according to a recent report by the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA). Blue flames rise from the burner of a natural gas stove in Orange, Calif., June 11, 2003. (David McNew/Getty Images) Recommended Videos Coffee price slump leaves farmers earning less than a cent a cup 57.1K Expo Essentials on Sale! Take me to Sale Simplifi by Quicken Try Now Ad Skip Ad Households using electricity to heat homes are projected to pay $1,063 on average between November and March, according to a Nov. 7 winter fuels outlook report by the EIA. In comparison, households using natural gas are only expected to shell out $601. Region-wise, the biggest difference is in the Midwest, where electric heating is expected to cost $1,213—more than double the gas cost of $581. In the Northeast, gas heating is projected to be cheaper by $704, in the South by $507, and in the West by $417. Natural gas heating is also cheaper compared to other alternative energy sources such as propane and heating oil, which are expected to cost $1,343 and $1,851 respectively. High heating costs borne by households using electricity come as the Biden administration is pushing an electrification agenda. The administration is already imposing several restrictions on the use of gas-powered appliances. The U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) has announced new efficiency standards for residential gas furnaces, pool pumps, battery chargers, dehumidifiers, ceiling fans, incandescent light bulbs, and gas stoves that would severely curtail their use. Secondly, the Biden administration is offering rebates on the use of electric appliances in homes. The 2022 Inflation Reduction Act set aside $8.8 billion in rebates for home energy efficiency and electrification projects. In a June 2 interview with The Epoch Times, O.H. Skinner, executive director of the Alliance for Consumers, said the Biden administration’s push for electrification of home appliances is bad news for Americans. “That will make it so that nearly the majority of the current products on the market don’t meet the standards and have to be redesigned or removed from the market,” he said. “Everyday things that people actually want are going to get more expensive or disappear, and the products that will be available will be more expensive but not better. People are going to wonder why life is worse.” At present, there are more homes using natural gas than electricity in the United States when it comes to heating. “Natural gas is the main space heating fuel in 46 percent of U.S. homes, making it the most widely used residential heating fuel in the country,” the EIA report reads. “The share of U.S. homes that use electricity as a primary space heating fuel has grown to 42 percent from 38 percent 10 years ago.” The Biden administration’s electrification push has attracted criticism for its unnecessarily burdening American consumers. In August, Rep. Stephanie Bice (R-Okla.) raised concerns about the DOE’s energy efficiency standards on ceiling fans, arguing that it's against consumer choice and would result in higher prices. “We are currently in a period of hot summer weather but also a time of high inflation. It is unconscionable that your department would seek to limit the options of the American people to stay cool in their own homes at a time like this,” she wrote in an Aug. 25 letter to Energy Secretary Jennifer Granholm. More Than Triple the Cost An August report by the DOE revealed that natural gas is a far cheaper energy source than electricity. The cost of electricity was calculated to be $46.19 per million British thermal units (Btu). Natural gas cost only came to $13.97 per million Btu, which is 3.3 times cheaper than electricity. The Energy Department’s analysis confirms that there's a “very clear and substantial cost-advantage of natural gas,” Karen Harbert, president of the American Gas Association (AGA), said in an Aug. 28 statement. “Our nation’s domestic abundance of natural gas means American customers pay a fraction of what customers pay for other energy sources here at home and see significant savings compared to energy costs globally,” Ms. Harbert said. “Our industry invests $91 million every day to ensure our vast modern delivery infrastructure provides the reliability Americans expect. America’s natural gas is critical to American and global energy security.” The AGA estimates that households using natural gas for heating, drying clothes, and cooking save about $1,068 per annum on average compared to homes that use electricity for such activities. Through 2050, natural gas prices are projected to be half to a third of the price of other fuels. Since 1970, the typical residential property has cut consumption by half even though homes have become bigger. AGA credits this to “steady improvements in building and appliance energy efficiency, and the positive impacts of gas utility energy efficiency program.” President Joe Biden has implemented several steps to limit natural gas production ever since he assumed office back in 2021. This includes a moratorium on oil and natural gas leasing activities in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge, imposing new taxes on gas extraction through the Inflation Reduction Act, and proposing revisions to the National Environmental Policy Act guidance, which would make it harder to permit natural gas projects. In September, a bipartisan coalition of 25 governors committed to decarbonizing buildings across the United States. “Decarbonizing buildings through accelerated energy efficiency and electrification is an imperative ... to reduce emissions and achieve U.S. climate targets,” a Sept. 21 statement by the U.S. Climate Alliance reads. Speaking to Daily Caller, Tom Pyle, president of the American Energy Alliance, said that the “political appointees in the White House ... are more interested in helping their big money backers in the green movement than they are in helping provide relief for working-class American families.” “Higher electricity prices don’t hurt wealthy coastal elites, but they crush the poor, seniors, and those living on fixed incomes,” Mr. Pyle said. In a March 21 letter to Ms. Granholm, House Republicans insisted that the department’s rules restricting gas appliances “has no basis in law or within your jurisdiction.” "[The DOE] has enjoyed bipartisan support," it reads. "[But] your actions to appease the Biden Administration’s radical climate agenda does not reflect well upon the Department.” 51,733187 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,400 DL November 20, 2023 On 11/17/2023 at 11:48 PM, Jay McKinsey said: Actually a lot of people buy fossil fuel engines hoping to never use them such as emergency backup generators for the potential bad blackout. That is exactly what the ICE in a PHEV is, a backup generator. Face it, you lose this argument every time! You are great on hot air, Jay, but short on statistics (admittedly not your strong point). So, where exactly do you see any numbers to back up your rhetoric? Nothing at all? 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,400 DL November 20, 2023 2 hours ago, Ron Wagner said: https://www.zerohedge.com/energy/heating-homes-natural-gas-more-40-percent-cheaper-electricity-us-eia Heating Homes With Natural Gas Is More Than 40% Cheaper Than Electricity: US EIA BY TYLER DURDEN FRIDAY, NOV 17, 2023 - 04:00 AM Authored by Naveen Athrappully via The Epoch Times (emphasis ours), Heating homes this winter using natural gas is estimated to cut down energy costs by more than 40 percent compared to electricity, according to a recent report by the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA). Blue flames rise from the burner of a natural gas stove in Orange, Calif., June 11, 2003. (David McNew/Getty Images) Recommended Videos Coffee price slump leaves farmers earning less than a cent a cup 57.1K Expo Essentials on Sale! Take me to Sale Simplifi by Quicken Try Now Ad Skip Ad Households using electricity to heat homes are projected to pay $1,063 on average between November and March, according to a Nov. 7 winter fuels outlook report by the EIA. In comparison, households using natural gas are only expected to shell out $601. Region-wise, the biggest difference is in the Midwest, where electric heating is expected to cost $1,213—more than double the gas cost of $581. In the Northeast, gas heating is projected to be cheaper by $704, in the South by $507, and in the West by $417. Natural gas heating is also cheaper compared to other alternative energy sources such as propane and heating oil, which are expected to cost $1,343 and $1,851 respectively. High heating costs borne by households using electricity come as the Biden administration is pushing an electrification agenda. The administration is already imposing several restrictions on the use of gas-powered appliances. The U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) has announced new efficiency standards for residential gas furnaces, pool pumps, battery chargers, dehumidifiers, ceiling fans, incandescent light bulbs, and gas stoves that would severely curtail their use. Secondly, the Biden administration is offering rebates on the use of electric appliances in homes. The 2022 Inflation Reduction Act set aside $8.8 billion in rebates for home energy efficiency and electrification projects. In a June 2 interview with The Epoch Times, O.H. Skinner, executive director of the Alliance for Consumers, said the Biden administration’s push for electrification of home appliances is bad news for Americans. “That will make it so that nearly the majority of the current products on the market don’t meet the standards and have to be redesigned or removed from the market,” he said. “Everyday things that people actually want are going to get more expensive or disappear, and the products that will be available will be more expensive but not better. People are going to wonder why life is worse.” At present, there are more homes using natural gas than electricity in the United States when it comes to heating. “Natural gas is the main space heating fuel in 46 percent of U.S. homes, making it the most widely used residential heating fuel in the country,” the EIA report reads. “The share of U.S. homes that use electricity as a primary space heating fuel has grown to 42 percent from 38 percent 10 years ago.” The Biden administration’s electrification push has attracted criticism for its unnecessarily burdening American consumers. In August, Rep. Stephanie Bice (R-Okla.) raised concerns about the DOE’s energy efficiency standards on ceiling fans, arguing that it's against consumer choice and would result in higher prices. “We are currently in a period of hot summer weather but also a time of high inflation. It is unconscionable that your department would seek to limit the options of the American people to stay cool in their own homes at a time like this,” she wrote in an Aug. 25 letter to Energy Secretary Jennifer Granholm. More Than Triple the Cost An August report by the DOE revealed that natural gas is a far cheaper energy source than electricity. The cost of electricity was calculated to be $46.19 per million British thermal units (Btu). Natural gas cost only came to $13.97 per million Btu, which is 3.3 times cheaper than electricity. The Energy Department’s analysis confirms that there's a “very clear and substantial cost-advantage of natural gas,” Karen Harbert, president of the American Gas Association (AGA), said in an Aug. 28 statement. “Our nation’s domestic abundance of natural gas means American customers pay a fraction of what customers pay for other energy sources here at home and see significant savings compared to energy costs globally,” Ms. Harbert said. “Our industry invests $91 million every day to ensure our vast modern delivery infrastructure provides the reliability Americans expect. America’s natural gas is critical to American and global energy security.” The AGA estimates that households using natural gas for heating, drying clothes, and cooking save about $1,068 per annum on average compared to homes that use electricity for such activities. Through 2050, natural gas prices are projected to be half to a third of the price of other fuels. Since 1970, the typical residential property has cut consumption by half even though homes have become bigger. AGA credits this to “steady improvements in building and appliance energy efficiency, and the positive impacts of gas utility energy efficiency program.” President Joe Biden has implemented several steps to limit natural gas production ever since he assumed office back in 2021. This includes a moratorium on oil and natural gas leasing activities in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge, imposing new taxes on gas extraction through the Inflation Reduction Act, and proposing revisions to the National Environmental Policy Act guidance, which would make it harder to permit natural gas projects. In September, a bipartisan coalition of 25 governors committed to decarbonizing buildings across the United States. “Decarbonizing buildings through accelerated energy efficiency and electrification is an imperative ... to reduce emissions and achieve U.S. climate targets,” a Sept. 21 statement by the U.S. Climate Alliance reads. Speaking to Daily Caller, Tom Pyle, president of the American Energy Alliance, said that the “political appointees in the White House ... are more interested in helping their big money backers in the green movement than they are in helping provide relief for working-class American families.” “Higher electricity prices don’t hurt wealthy coastal elites, but they crush the poor, seniors, and those living on fixed incomes,” Mr. Pyle said. In a March 21 letter to Ms. Granholm, House Republicans insisted that the department’s rules restricting gas appliances “has no basis in law or within your jurisdiction.” "[The DOE] has enjoyed bipartisan support," it reads. "[But] your actions to appease the Biden Administration’s radical climate agenda does not reflect well upon the Department.” 51,733187 Yes, you can see that the current gang in the White House have declared war on the average American household, and will, if unchecked, destroy the standard of living for most Americans. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
notsonice + 1,168 DM November 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Ecocharger said: Yes, you can see that the current gang in the White House have declared war on the average American household, and will, if unchecked, destroy the standard of living for most Americans. cost of electricity and nat gas is down this winter in the US and you call this war on the average American household????? you are as usual confused, The US is doing just fine, Maybe in Russia your standard of living is falling fast Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay McKinsey + 1,489 November 20, 2023 2 hours ago, Ecocharger said: You are great on hot air, Jay, but short on statistics (admittedly not your strong point). So, where exactly do you see any numbers to back up your rhetoric? Nothing at all? The commercial standby generator sets market size crossed USD 6.1 billion in 2022 and is poised to record over 7.8% CAGR during 2023 to 2032 How dumb can you be? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob Plant + 2,693 RP November 20, 2023 (edited) On 11/17/2023 at 5:41 PM, footeab@yahoo.com said: Well suggest you read. That is average per day, not average per trip. So, here in REALITY, no one drives on Saturday/Sunday, or at least not much. So average distance per day is ~40miles, not 30. Now remove all those people who own a car but take the bus, train, walk to work which currently is about ~+5% of the population so here in REALITY that 40miles turns into ~45miles/day for the average car driver per day. Here in REALITY, batteries do NOT last long if you drain them 100% continuously. Therefore if the battery will last as long as the car the average discharge needs to be less than 50%. So, if your hybrid "range" is 20 miles or 30 miles, here in reality it is only 10-->15miles. So, your "sleuth" detective ability has short bus challenges shall we say... "no one drives on Saturdays or Sundays" Dont go to a game of football or baseball, dont take the kids out or go to the mall or the park, never take the wife our for a meal at the weekend or catch up with your mates (oh wait yeah I forgot you probably have none)??? hahahahaha really? they all stay home and do nothing! Maybe theryre all in care homes like yourself? Your life sucks!!!! Daily miles driven in the US per driver is 25.9 according to this back in 2017 and that number is dropping. Daily miles of travel per driver in the United States 2017 | Statista So to use your logic that no one drives at the weekend (which is obviously wrong) equates to 36.26 miles a week (5 working days) so they'd have to drive on ICE for 12.5 miles on a round trip of 72.52 miles. Note this is "per driver" so you public transport BS is meaningless! Do you still think a PHEV is mostly used as an ICE vehicle? Edited November 20, 2023 by Rob Plant Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob Plant + 2,693 RP November 20, 2023 On 11/18/2023 at 1:34 AM, Ecocharger said: Don't worry, fossil fuel vehicles will continue to rule the transport scene into the foreseeable future. It is just not worth the effort to replace fossil fuel transport, which currently dominates the market. There is no demonstrable climate benefit from replacing fossil fuel vehicles with battery vehicles. And yet all the major auto manufacturers are doing just that! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob Plant + 2,693 RP November 20, 2023 OPEC Said To Consider Additional 1 Million Bpd Output Cut | OilPrice.com Oops look like that oil demand Eco keeps talking about isnt going quite as well as expected! 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,400 DL November 20, 2023 9 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said: The commercial standby generator sets market size crossed USD 6.1 billion in 2022 and is poised to record over 7.8% CAGR during 2023 to 2032 How dumb can you be? Jay, how could miss my point again? Do you have any data to show that purchasers of fossil fuel vehicles do not use the fossil fuel option? No? Just plain old dumb silence again? 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,400 DL November 20, 2023 (edited) 8 hours ago, Rob Plant said: "no one drives on Saturdays or Sundays" Dont go to a game of football or baseball, dont take the kids out or go to the mall or the park, never take the wife our for a meal at the weekend or catch up with your mates (oh wait yeah I forgot you probably have none)??? hahahahaha really? they all stay home and do nothing! Maybe theryre all in care homes like yourself? Your life sucks!!!! Daily miles driven in the US per driver is 25.9 according to this back in 2017 and that number is dropping. Daily miles of travel per driver in the United States 2017 | Statista So to use your logic that no one drives at the weekend (which is obviously wrong) equates to 36.26 miles a week (5 working days) so they'd have to drive on ICE for 12.5 miles on a round trip of 72.52 miles. Note this is "per driver" so you public transport BS is meaningless! Do you still think a PHEV is mostly used as an ICE vehicle? Rob, spare us your personal logic. Do you have any data whatsoever to support your claims that people who buy fossil fuel vehicles do not use the fossil fuel option? You have not shown us anything yet, old boy. Edited November 20, 2023 by Ecocharger 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,400 DL November 20, 2023 (edited) 8 hours ago, Rob Plant said: And yet all the major auto manufacturers are doing just that! Nonsense, they are following government dictates. A free market would extinguish the EV nonsense. Edited November 20, 2023 by Ecocharger 1 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TailingsPond + 557 GE November 20, 2023 3 minutes ago, Ecocharger said: Jay, how could miss my point again? Do you have any data to show that purchasers of fossil fuel vehicles do not use the fossil fuel option? You said engine not vehicle. I can assure you there are plenty of backup generators that are ideally never used. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ecocharger + 1,400 DL November 20, 2023 (edited) 4 minutes ago, TailingsPond said: You said engine not vehicle. I can assure you there are plenty of backup generators that are ideally never used. That is just garbage, show some data that people who purchase fossil fuel vehicles do not use the fossil fuel option. That was the claim from the Green posters. Edited November 20, 2023 by Ecocharger Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TailingsPond + 557 GE November 20, 2023 5 minutes ago, Ecocharger said: Nonsense, they are following government dictates. A free market would extinguish the EV nonsense. EV's have better performance than ICE vehicles. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TailingsPond + 557 GE November 20, 2023 (edited) 1 minute ago, Ecocharger said: That is just garbage, show some data that people who purchase fossil fuel vehicles do not use the fossil fuel option. No. You said engine, he gave an example of an engine. Use better word choice. Edited November 20, 2023 by TailingsPond 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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