Mercedes Unveils Electric Car In Direct German Challenge to Tesla

[Pavel + 384]

Mercedes showed on Tuesday how it is “aggressively” gunning for top spot in upscale battery cars market currently dominated by Tesla, as it unveiled the EQC, its first fully electric car, at an event in Stockholm. The event marks the start of the German onslaught against the American upstart and showcased a SUV with a 450 kilometer range, distinctively full-width rear light and clean-cut interiors that Mercedes hopes will find favor with luxury customers and tech-savvy millennials alike.

[Petar + 76]

Nice job. Where they gonna get the battery packs from? Tesla’s batteries are proven....

[jpZelabal + 63]

Proven to set themselves on fire ....

[pinto + 293]

Ah.... More electric cars for the common man. I suppose, price is small

[damirUSBiH + 327]

I'm not car expert, but looks like a cross between a Toyota Highlander and a Subaru Outback. Won't be a "Tesla killer"....

Edited September 4, 2018 by damirUSBiH

[rainman + 263]

4 minutes ago, damirUSBiH said:

I'm not car expert, but looks like a cross between a Toyota Highlander and a Subaru Outback. Won't be a "Tesla killer"....

From that angle all I see is a handlebar mustache.... 

[NickW + 2,714]

28 minutes ago, Petar said:

Nice job. Where they gonna get the battery packs from? Tesla’s batteries are proven....

Mercedes are already in the Battery game. 

[NickW + 2,714]

27 minutes ago, jpZelabal said:

Proven to set themselves on fire ....

Good job gasoline isn't flammable. 

[ThunderBlade + 231]

Funny the "cult of Elon Musk" is showing up same day re news about Mercedes entering the Tesla market. Elon Musk continuing to shoot himself in the foot... The race started long ago, not since yesterday....

[50 shades of black + 254]

54 minutes ago, Petar said:

Nice job. Where they gonna get the battery packs from? Tesla’s batteries are proven....

 

25 minutes ago, NickW said:

Mercedes are already in the Battery game. 

The Mercedes First All Electric car features 384 pouch style batteries vs Tesla’s 7,104 Cylindrical cells

 

[Petar + 76]

1 minute ago, 50 shades of black said:

 

The Mercedes First All Electric car features 384 pouch style batteries vs Tesla’s 7,104 Cylindrical cells

 

Any fire risks? That’s like a thousand note 7s

[Tom Blazek + 38]

With the oil industry fighting and EPA denying, the clean air benefits that ethanol brings to liquid gasoline fuels, electric vehicles are the only way we’re going to get cleaner air in our cities.

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

2 hours ago, Tom Blazek said:

With the oil industry fighting and EPA denying, the clean air benefits that ethanol brings to liquid gasoline fuels, electric vehicles are the only way we’re going to get cleaner air in our cities.

Actually, a combination of trolley cars and electric bicycles will get you cleaner city air a whole lot faster (and cheaper).  But not to quibble. 

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

Before everybody here starts jumping up and down for Mercedes and their new pouch-driven buggy, I would remind you that Mercedes has this bad attitude towards their customers,  one which I would doubt is not carrying over to the current new model.  And that is:  Mercedes has developed a new type of bolt head, which requires a very special tool to work on.  It is specifically designed to prevent the buyer from becoming a shade-tree mechanic, doing his own repairs.  So no fastenings are used that you would have a common wrench set or socket set to go work on.  Even worse, Mercedes zealously guards the distribution of the tools that can work on the new bolt heads, so that you are forced to go to the Dealer for your work - and pay dealer rates.  Forever.

What this practice means in the field is that the buyer of the new car gets to have his work done under warranty, and when the warranty is over, nobody will buy his car in a private sale (or at another dealership as a trade-in).  He has to turn that car in to the Mercedes Dealer who will sell him another one.  Would you buy a car you cannot repair yourself?  On which your stock six-point and twelve-point sockets and wrenches will not fit?  I sure wouldn't.  Now, does that used Mercedes have any further retail value?  No, of course not.  Once a car gets past 5 years and it starts to need more and more mechanic attention, the next buyer will be faced with ever steeper repair bills.  So the used car gets fully depreciated in whatever the warranty period is.  The rich guy who buys it new does not much care, especially if he leases it.  The poor guy who would like to be the next owner cannot afford it; he cannot fix it, an independent garage cannot fix it, and Mercedes is going to charge him $130/hr plus require him to buy only Mercedes parts at Mercedes prices - no secondary car parts allowed. 

Would you go buy a Mercedes with those special bolts that you cannot remove or replace?  I sure wouldn't. Mercedes has engineered the car to be functionally worthless. 

[hameed parappil + 2]

LET    MERCEDES  PUT THE PRICE  TAG   FOR  COMMON  PEOPLE 

[BillKidd + 139]

15 hours ago, Jan van Eck said:

Before everybody here starts jumping up and down for Mercedes and their new pouch-driven buggy, I would remind you that Mercedes has this bad attitude towards their customers,  one which I would doubt is not carrying over to the current new model.  And that is:  Mercedes has developed a new type of bolt head, which requires a very special tool to work on.  It is specifically designed to prevent the buyer from becoming a shade-tree mechanic, doing his own repairs.  So no fastenings are used that you would have a common wrench set or socket set to go work on.  Even worse, Mercedes zealously guards the distribution of the tools that can work on the new bolt heads, so that you are forced to go to the Dealer for your work - and pay dealer rates.  Forever.

What this practice means in the field is that the buyer of the new car gets to have his work done under warranty, and when the warranty is over, nobody will buy his car in a private sale (or at another dealership as a trade-in).  He has to turn that car in to the Mercedes Dealer who will sell him another one.  Would you buy a car you cannot repair yourself?  On which your stock six-point and twelve-point sockets and wrenches will not fit?  I sure wouldn't.  Now, does that used Mercedes have any further retail value?  No, of course not.  Once a car gets past 5 years and it starts to need more and more mechanic attention, the next buyer will be faced with ever steeper repair bills.  So the used car gets fully depreciated in whatever the warranty period is.  The rich guy who buys it new does not much care, especially if he leases it.  The poor guy who would like to be the next owner cannot afford it; he cannot fix it, an independent garage cannot fix it, and Mercedes is going to charge him $130/hr plus require him to buy only Mercedes parts at Mercedes prices - no secondary car parts allowed. 

Would you go buy a Mercedes with those special bolts that you cannot remove or replace?  I sure wouldn't. Mercedes has engineered the car to be functionally worthless. 

Curious what the new bolt head is shaped like.

I despise companies that do stuff like this so that consumers must go to the dealership for ripoff prices!

[NickW + 2,714]

20 minutes ago, BillKidd said:

Curious what the new bolt head is shaped like.

I despise companies that do stuff like this so that consumers must go to the dealership for ripoff prices!

It looks like a well stretched Sph1ncter. Kind of symbolic of what Merc is planning to do to its customers

[ceo_energemsier + 1,818]

18 hours ago, Tom Blazek said:

With the oil industry fighting and EPA denying, the clean air benefits that ethanol brings to liquid gasoline fuels, electric vehicles are the only way we’re going to get cleaner air in our cities.

Ethanol does not bring any enviro benefits, just the opposite factoring in from Farm to Tank basis!

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

11 hours ago, BillKidd said:

Curious what the new bolt head is shaped like.

I despise companies that do stuff like this so that consumers must go to the dealership for ripoff prices!

I have a chum in the industry that managed to obtain a set of those special tools  (better not to ask how).  I will investigate further and report. 

Back in 1973 Chrysler did a special bolt head in order to prevent thieves from stealing dash radios and tape players, it was a fully rounded slope head that a vice-grip could not attach to, and then an internal probe went into a center hole, but a pin stuck out in there to prevent any other than the special tool from getting inside.  It was diabolical, but effective. Then again, Chrysler only did that for the radio, the rest of the car was strictly UNC and UNF. Anybody could hammer on it. Many did!

Edited September 6, 2018 by Jan van Eck

[Dan Warnick + 6,100]

Here you are:

http://www.mercedesmedic.com/7-tools-you-must-have-for-mercedes-benz-diy-repair/

Curious, though.  Is it the E-Torx you were mainly talking about?  I've got a set of those in my toolbox.

[John Sherwood + 1]

Don’t consumers of brand new Mercedes always take their vehicle to the dealer for service and maintenance anyway?  I hardly see how some controversial and secret bolt and/or tool will harm sales or interest.  Isn’t “shade tree Mercedes mechanic” a bit of an oxymoron?  Fortunately for me, the price tag steered me clear long before the secret bolt & tool.

Edited September 6, 2018 by John Sherwood

[Rodent + 1,424]

38 minutes ago, John Sherwood said:

Don’t consumers of brand new Mercedes always take their vehicle to the dealer for service and maintenance anyway? 

YES.

Even if you buy one used, you can buy a service package (and it makes sense) and it comes with warranty, provided you buy it from a dealership. Service for Mercs are very expensive, and it just makes sense to do it this way. 

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

11 hours ago, Dan Warnick said:

Here you are:

http://www.mercedesmedic.com/7-tools-you-must-have-for-mercedes-benz-diy-repair/

Curious, though.  Is it the E-Torx you were mainly talking about?  I've got a set of those in my toolbox.

U dunno.  Never go into it as I don't much care for Mercedes.  But here is what those guys will do - and I have the same issues with BMW.  They will use some odd-ball size that does not come in a standard tool set, even the expanded tool sets.

For example, the brake calipers on my BMW have these two caliper pins that the pad assembly slides on. That pin has an internal, recessed hex head, which is 7 mm.  Nobody carries 7 mm.  The typical Allen key sets are 6 mm and then 8 mm.  Who has 7 mm?  Nobody.  So you have to go scramble around to find that 7 mm Allen, and then you better not lose it or the next time you want to pull the calipers you cannot.  Meanwhile, the caliper mounting bracket is held by two bolts with standard six-sided bolt head - except the size is 16 mm.  Socket sets go from 15 mm to 17 mm.  Nobody has 16 mm.  SO you have to go scramble around to find an impact-grade 16 mm six-point socket.  Why does BMW do that?  To discourage you from fixing your own car, that's why! 

The original cast-iron rotors are made of a "soft" formulation.  That way you cannot go cut the rotor on a lathe and true it up, they don't leave you enough metal for that.  So you have to discard a perfectly good rotor because it was deliberately manufactured to be non-serviceable.  My solution is to buy one full set of replacement aftermarket rotors and repair those as I go along. At this point I am up to two sets, that's fine, they are still less than half the price of the BMW stuff from the BMW parts dept. 

The idea of these auto builders is that you trade it in for a new one, becoming a perpetual customer.   I hate that.

[Jan van Eck + 7,558]

1 hour ago, Rodent said:

YES.

Even if you buy one used, you can buy a service package (and it makes sense) and it comes with warranty, provided you buy it from a dealership. Service for Mercs are very expensive, and it just makes sense to do it this way. 

So if you fancy an older model, say a 1966 sedan, you are now forced to go to the Dealer and pay them $140/hr to work on it, as they prevent you from doing your own.  The car cost you $1,400., and your first trip to the garage sets you back $6,500. Just lovely. 

[GeoSciGuy + 74]

While this might be a threat to the Model X, it is in no way a threat to the Model S or Model 3. 

The S and 3 continue to have no competitors.  

Let's look at all the current offerings of pure EVs available: 

Chevy Bolt (hatchback) 
Chevy Spark (hatchback, discontinued as EV)
Ford Focus EV (hatchback)
Nissan Leaf (hatchback) 
VW e-Golf (hatchback)
Fiat 500e (hatchback) 
Smart car (hatchback) 
Honda Fit EV (hatchback) 
Honda Clarity EV (sedan, 80 mile range) 
Toyota Rav4 EV (crossover, discontinued) 
BMW i3 (crossover/hatchback/cube)
BMW i8 (3-banger hybrid now, pure EV yet to come)
Mercedes B class EV (crossover)
Mercedes EQC (crossover) 
 

The Honda Clarity EV is the only sedan EV offered other than the Model S and Model 3, but comes nowhere near Tesla in range or performance.  For some reason, traditional automakers are obsessed with making their EVs hatchbacks or crossovers.  

The Porsche Mission E is the closest competitor to Tesla, but I have yet to see any production from them.  

Tesla owns the Sedan EV market.