GREEN NEW DEAL = BLIZZARD OF LIES

[Jay McKinsey + 1,489]

1 minute ago, turbguy said:

Since both solar and battery require power electronic inverters to generate to the grid, there is not much difference,

When penetration reaches very high levels, these inverters better be of the "grid-forming" type, and distribution system issue will arise.

I am certain there are, at a minimum, technical safety requirements for an interconnect permit.

As far as I know, all counties and cities in California require permits for rooftop solar installations. The specific permitting process can vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, but all jurisdictions will require you to submit a permit application and pay a permit fee. Some jurisdictions may also require you to obtain a building permit or an electrical permit, or even both.

Here are some of the key technical requirements for connecting rooftop solar to the grid in CALISO:

• System size: Rooftop solar systems must be sized appropriately for the customer's electrical load and the capacity of the local electrical circuit.
• Interconnection equipment: Rooftop solar systems must be interconnected to the grid using approved interconnection equipment. This equipment includes a solar inverter, disconnect switches, and other safety devices.
• Metering: Rooftop solar systems must be equipped with a meter that measures the amount of electricity generated by the system. This meter allows the customer to be credited for the electricity they generate and sell back to the utility.
• Safety certification: Rooftop solar systems must be certified by a qualified testing laboratory to ensure that they meet all applicable safety standards.

So this would be no different than solar and people get rooftop solar all the time. Not to mention that if you have solar then adding in your car is a minor issue. Given the penetration of rooftop solar I just don't see how using a battery instead is a big deal. 

Some California counties, for example Tulare, El Dorado, Yolo and Placer, had penetrations over 60%

[turbguy + 1,413]

54 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

So this would be no different than solar and people get rooftop solar all the time. Not to mention that if you have solar then adding in your car is a minor issue. Given the penetration of rooftop solar I just don't see how using a battery instead is a big deal. 

Some California counties, for example Tulare, El Dorado, Yolo and Placer, had penetrations over 60%

Sure, you can have high penetration. You just have to accommodate with distribution system mods, such as:

• Installing voltage regulators: Voltage regulators can help to maintain a stable voltage on the distribution system, even in the presence of reverse power flow and voltage spikes resulting from sudden shading
• Upgrading transformers: Transformers need to be upgraded to handle the increased reverse power flow from rooftop solar.
• Installing harmonic filters: Harmonic filters can help to reduce harmonic distortion on the distribution system.  Grid-forming inverters are much more desirable to combat harmonic distortion.   Those filters also block part of the power flow that would be transmitted.

Hawaiian Electric got there first.

[Jay McKinsey + 1,489]

10 minutes ago, turbguy said:

Sure, you can have high penetration. You just have to accommodate with distribution system mods, such as:

• Installing voltage regulators: Voltage regulators can help to maintain a stable voltage on the distribution system, even in the presence of reverse power flow and voltage spikes resulting from sudden shading
• Upgrading transformers: Transformers need to be upgraded to handle the increased reverse power flow from rooftop solar.
• Installing harmonic filters: Harmonic filters can help to reduce harmonic distortion on the distribution system.  Grid-forming inverters are much more desirable to combat harmonic distortion.   Those filters also block part of the power flow that would be transmitted.

Hawaiian Electric got there first.

Ok, so states are doing it with little effort. It seems the problem you raised is not a big deal.

[TailingsPond + 495]

15 hours ago, Eyes Wide Open said:

It's a order of magnitude thingy..

1.Tailing Ponds

2. 

Cell phones have a proven history of burning down homes. Orders of magnitude more than EVs or powerbanks.

 

 

Edited October 1, 2023 by TailingsPond

[turbguy + 1,413]

I'll just leave this here for most, if not all, to view.

Scroll slowly down and absorb.

https://theoatmeal.com/comics/believe

[bloodman33 + 20]

Ecocharger and the oil companies hate dolphins!

 

CNN — 

More than a hundred dolphins have been found dead in the Brazilian Amazon amid an historic drought and record-high water temperatures that in places have exceeded 102 degrees Fahrenheit.

The dead dolphins were all found in Lake Tefé over the past seven days, according to the Mamirauá Institute, a research facility funded by the Brazilian Ministry of Science.

The institute said such a high number of deaths was unusual and suggested record-high lake temperatures and an historic drought in the Amazon may have been the cause.

 

 

The news is likely to add to the concerns of climate scientists over the effects human activity and extreme droughts are having on the region.

“It’s still early to determine the cause of this extreme event but according to our experts, it is certainly connected to the drought period and high temperatures in Lake Tefé, in which some points are exceeding 39 degrees Celsius (102 degrees Fahrenheit),” the institute said in comments carried by CNN affiliate CNN Brasil.

The Amazon River, the world’s largest waterway, is currently in the dry season, and several specimens of river fauna are also suffering from record-high temperatures.

 

 

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,136]

32 minutes ago, bloodman33 said:

Ecocharger and the oil companies hate dolphins!

 

CNN — 

More than a hundred dolphins have been found dead in the Brazilian Amazon amid an historic drought and record-high water temperatures that in places have exceeded 102 degrees Fahrenheit.

The dead dolphins were all found in Lake Tefé over the past seven days, according to the Mamirauá Institute, a research facility funded by the Brazilian Ministry of Science.

The institute said such a high number of deaths was unusual and suggested record-high lake temperatures and an historic drought in the Amazon may have been the cause.

 

 

The news is likely to add to the concerns of climate scientists over the effects human activity and extreme droughts are having on the region.

“It’s still early to determine the cause of this extreme event but according to our experts, it is certainly connected to the drought period and high temperatures in Lake Tefé, in which some points are exceeding 39 degrees Celsius (102 degrees Fahrenheit),” the institute said in comments carried by CNN affiliate CNN Brasil.

The Amazon River, the world’s largest waterway, is currently in the dry season, and several specimens of river fauna are also suffering from record-high temperatures.

 

 

Greenies HATE Bison

As little as 700 years ago, 2000 years ago and 4000 years ago, the Great North American Plains were covered in moving sand dunes.  But due to changing climate patterns the Great North American Plains are now a wonderland supporting Bison, crops, and an abundance of other native species and wildlife.  With addition of more human population, cutting of forests, and burning of coal, oil, ng..

Greenies are therefore clearly Bison killer scum. 

[Rob Plant + 2,648]

On 9/30/2023 at 3:44 PM, Old-Ruffneck said:

No Energy Transition Unless Tech Can Make It Cost Competitive: BlackRock | OilPrice.com

 

This the reality of it all. Those so called intellectual thinkers on here live in a fantasy world where everythink is green. Some wealthier nations may adopt , but the majority of the world can't affort "green technology" and willl still burn coal and liquid fuels. 

You posters know who you are. Wake the fuck up already.

Here are a couple and theyre pretty damn game changing IMHO

AI-Tech Leads To NASA Energy Breakthrough | OilPrice.com

Great news for everyone, especially EV's

[Ecocharger + 1,382]

On 9/29/2023 at 3:51 AM, Jay McKinsey said:

What abyss do you live in?? Here in the Bay Area electricity has an uptime of at least four 9s and few gas stations in the whole country have backup power so no gas when the power does go out.

Everyone can see your desperation to defend your failing argument.

Just read the report, Jay. Hydroelectric generation DOWN 6% due to water power shortages.

Where do you have a problem with that? I guess the facts are too much for you to swallow.

[Jay McKinsey + 1,489]

11 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

Just read the report, Jay. Hydroelectric generation DOWN 6% due to water power shortages.

Where do you have a problem with that? I guess the facts are too much for you to swallow.

Problem? Yes I have a problem. You did not quote or cite your sources. Which means you did not present facts. All we have is another of your unfounded claims.

Here is US hydro electricity production and it is up on the year:

https://www.eia.gov/electricity/data/browser/#/topic/0?agg=2,0,1&fuel=vtvv&geo=g&sec=g&linechart=ELEC.GEN.HYC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NG-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.WND-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.TSN-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NUC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.COW-US-99.Q~&columnchart=ELEC.GEN.ALL-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.COW-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NG-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NUC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.HYC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.WND-US-99.Q&map=ELEC.GEN.ALL-US-99.Q&freq=Q&ctype=linechart&ltype=pin&rtype=s&pin=&rse=0&maptype=0

Edited October 2, 2023 by Jay McKinsey

[Ecocharger + 1,382]

5 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Problem? Yes I have a problem. You did not quote or cite your sources. Which means you did not present facts. All we have is another of your unfounded claims.

Here is US hydro electricity production and it is up on the year:

https://www.eia.gov/electricity/data/browser/#/topic/0?agg=2,0,1&fuel=vtvv&geo=g&sec=g&linechart=ELEC.GEN.HYC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NG-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.WND-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.TSN-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NUC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.COW-US-99.Q~&columnchart=ELEC.GEN.ALL-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.COW-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NG-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NUC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.HYC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.WND-US-99.Q&map=ELEC.GEN.ALL-US-99.Q&freq=Q&ctype=linechart&ltype=pin&rtype=s&pin=&rse=0&maptype=0

I gave you the source.

Here is the problem with electrical energy....unreliability, Even hydro electricity is unreliable.

https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=60522

"Weather events in the U.S. Northwest this past spring and summer led to lower water supply, prompting us to reduce our forecast of U.S. hydropower generation by 6% this year compared with last year."

[notsonice + 1,093]

Ecochumps bs babble.........

I gave you the source.

Here is the problem with electrical energy....unreliability, Even hydro electricity is unreliable.

 

electrical energy....unreliability,????
 

only when deadbeats do not pay their bills....they get cutoff

 

otherwise .......electrical energy with renewables is super reliable except during extremely bad weather then all electrical energy is prone to failure when the lines go down IE during icestorms or hurricanes

6 percent lower hydro production due to drought caused by climate change????

Lay the blame where it belongs on the burning of coal

and the 6 percent short fall in hydro this year???? Solar to the rescue with a 25 percent increase this year over last year

Enjoy the transition......

The lights in my house........never went out ...maybe the guy bsing that hydro electricity is unreliable did not pay his bill

 

 

[Jay McKinsey + 1,489]

Just now, Ecocharger said:

I gave you the source.

Here is the problem with electrical energy....unreliability, Even hydro electricity is unreliable.

https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=60522

"Weather events in the U.S. Northwest this past spring and summer led to lower water supply, prompting us to reduce our forecast of U.S. hydropower generation by 6% this year compared with last year."

So you gave your source days ago...

Didn't you previously support hydro power? Yes it goes up and down more than before because of climate change. We are going to get an El Nino winter this year so it will be back up next year. This is also why we build other sources of supply such as solar and wind which combined have surpassed coal in the first half of the year:

https://www.eia.gov/electricity/data/browser/#/topic/0?agg=2,0,1&fuel=vtvv&geo=g&sec=g&linechart=ELEC.GEN.HYC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NG-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.WND-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.TSN-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NUC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.COW-US-99.Q~&columnchart=ELEC.GEN.ALL-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.COW-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NG-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NUC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.HYC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.WND-US-99.Q&map=ELEC.GEN.ALL-US-99.Q&freq=Q&ctype=linechart&ltype=pin&rtype=s&pin=&rse=0&maptype=0

[Ecocharger + 1,382]

3 minutes ago, Jay McKinsey said:

So you gave your source days ago...

Didn't you previously support hydro power? Yes it goes up and down more than before because of climate change. We are going to get an El Nino winter this year so it will be back up next year. This is also why we build other sources of supply such as solar and wind which combined have surpassed coal in the first half of the year:

https://www.eia.gov/electricity/data/browser/#/topic/0?agg=2,0,1&fuel=vtvv&geo=g&sec=g&linechart=ELEC.GEN.HYC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NG-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.WND-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.TSN-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NUC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.COW-US-99.Q~&columnchart=ELEC.GEN.ALL-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.COW-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NG-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.NUC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.HYC-US-99.Q~ELEC.GEN.WND-US-99.Q&map=ELEC.GEN.ALL-US-99.Q&freq=Q&ctype=linechart&ltype=pin&rtype=s&pin=&rse=0&maptype=0

So my point is valid, hydro electric power, like other sources of electricity, is unreliable. We saw the same thing in Europe last year. One panic event after another.

[Jay McKinsey + 1,489]

3 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

So my point is valid, hydro electric power, like other sources of electricity, is unreliable. We saw the same thing in Europe last year. One panic event after another.

No, it is just something that has to be planned for. Fossil fuel plants break, burn and blow up all the time but you think that isn't a problem.

Fossil Fuel Power Fell Up to 68% as Blackouts Hit US South

• Duke Energy, Tennessee Valley Authority instituted blackouts
• Blackouts were latest example of failure in the US grid

 

 

December 30, 2022 at 6:28 AM PST

 

Power plants that burn coal and natural gas to produce electricity had significant drops in generation as a winter storm hit the US Southeast, forcing blackouts that left hundreds of thousands in the dark.

Duke Energy Corp. and the Tennessee Valley Authority cut power to homes and businesses during the holiday season as an extreme winter storm pummeled the region. Duke instituted rotating outages Dec. 24 that interrupted service to about 500,000 customers, while TVA for the first time in its history had rotating blackouts Dec. 23 and Dec. 24.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-12-29/fossil-fuel-power-plunged-up-to-68-as-blackouts-hit-us-south#xj4y7vzkg

 

Edited October 2, 2023 by Jay McKinsey

[Ecocharger + 1,382]

1 minute ago, Jay McKinsey said:

No, it is just something that has to be planned for. Fossil fuel plants break, burn and blow up all the time but you think that isn't a problem.

Fossil Fuel Power Fell Up to 68% as Blackouts Hit US South

• Duke Energy, Tennessee Valley Authority instituted blackouts
• Blackouts were latest example of failure in the US grid

 

 

December 30, 2022 at 6:28 AM PST

 

Power plants that burn coal and natural gas to produce electricity had significant drops in generation as a winter storm hit the US Southeast, forcing blackouts that left hundreds of thousands in the dark.

Duke Energy Corp. and the Tennessee Valley Authority cut power to homes and businesses during the holiday season as an extreme winter storm pummeled the region. Duke instituted rotating outages Dec. 24 that interrupted service to about 500,000 customers, while TVA for the first time in its history had rotating blackouts Dec. 23 and Dec. 24.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-12-29/fossil-fuel-power-plunged-up-to-68-as-blackouts-hit-us-south#xj4y7vzkg

 

Yes, the planning was bad for that disaster and the system was caught with over-reliance on green.

Have we not discussed that a few times? Tell us something new, Jay.

Like for instance, when did you buy your new EV? Or are you still clinging to that old fossil fuel vehicle?

[Jay McKinsey + 1,489]

Just now, Ecocharger said:

Yes, the planning was bad for that disaster and the system was caught with over-reliance on green.

Have we not discussed that a few times? Tell us something new, Jay.

Like for instance, when did you buy your new EV? Or are you still clinging to that old fossil fuel vehicle?

Over reliance on green in the deep south!?! That is stupidity incarnate.

Your continuing reliance on me as some sort of anecdote to prove your argument just shows how desperate you are. 

[notsonice + 1,093]

44 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

Yes, the planning was bad for that disaster and the system was caught with over-reliance on green.

Have we not discussed that a few times? Tell us something new, Jay.

Like for instance, when did you buy your new EV? Or are you still clinging to that old fossil fuel vehicle?

the US South East over-reliance on green.?????

again you are babbling BS

There is no Wind Energy in the South East....IE the South Eastern portions of the US has poor wind resources and solar is less than 5 percent in the US South East today

 

you should do some research first before you spew BS

the US South East .........................over-reliance on green.?????

what a joke

 

[notsonice + 1,093]

for those who doubt renewables availability every hour of the day

introduce yourselves to reality and the amount of battery storage in service today and the additions to battery storage , on a large scale, being built now  and in the future

 

Please note all of the grey dots are battery storage projects.....note the vast amount in California  Texas Arizona and Nevada being built today

 

 

Edited October 2, 2023 by notsonice

[Ecocharger + 1,382]

2 hours ago, Jay McKinsey said:

Over reliance on green in the deep south!?! That is stupidity incarnate.

Your continuing reliance on me as some sort of anecdote to prove your argument just shows how desperate you are. 

Well, Jay, you are a prime exhibit on the futility of the Green Madness.

No one really wants an EV, and that seems to be true even for those glassy-eyed acolytes who spout meaningless slogans about EVs.

Who am I referring to? Look in the mirror, old man.

[Ecocharger + 1,382]

The hot oil demand appears to heating up the political scene, as Biden & Co. are approaching the election season with a failing report card.

The American people can be fooled once, but rarely are they fooled twice in a row by the same old baloney.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Crude-Oil/Rising-Oil-Prices-Threaten-Economic-Stability.html

"The COVID-19 pandemic and Russia's invasion of Ukraine disrupted oil markets, with the U.S. responding by releasing oil from the Strategic Petroleum Reserve.

OPEC+ countered the SPR release by cutting production, with extensions through 2023 and recent events like Libya's floods further straining supplies.

Despite rising U.S. production and entering a lower-demand season, the Biden Administration faces limited options to counter potential oil price spikes influenced by OPEC+ decisions."

Edited October 2, 2023 by Ecocharger

[turbguy + 1,413]

2 hours ago, Ecocharger said:

So my point is valid, hydro electric power, like other sources of electricity, is unreliable. We saw the same thing in Europe last year. One panic event after another.

I must ask, "what level of electric reliability is satisfactory"

The electric generation availability in wind, solar, hydroelectric, nuclear, coal, and natural gas units (in 2022), according to the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA), was as follows:

Wind | 95.5%

Solar | 99.5% 

Hydroelectric | 95.3%

Nuclear | 92.7% 

Coal | 83.2%

Natural gas | 92.1% |

Actually, coal units are the LEAST available.  That's why you need a bunch of 'em.

[Jay McKinsey + 1,489]

26 minutes ago, Ecocharger said:

Well, Jay, you are a prime exhibit on the futility of the Green Madness.

No one really wants an EV, and that seems to be true even for those glassy-eyed acolytes who spout meaningless slogans about EVs.

Who am I referring to? Look in the mirror, old man.

"No one really wants an EV" yet EV sales just keep skyrocketing. 

[footeab@yahoo.com + 2,136]

34 minutes ago, turbguy said:

I must ask, "what level of electric reliability is satisfactory"

The electric generation availability in wind, solar, hydroelectric, nuclear, coal, and natural gas units (in 2022), according to the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA), was as follows:

Wind | 95.5%

Solar | 99.5% 

Hydroelectric | 95.3%

Nuclear | 92.7% 

Coal | 83.2%

Natural gas | 92.1% |

Actually, coal units are the LEAST available.  That's why you need a bunch of 'em.

One truly has to be a perverted piece of garbage to say wind has a 95.5% uprate. 

Power is only reliable when IT exists when YOU want it to exist.  Not when the damned wind blows or sun shines.

[TailingsPond + 495]

2 hours ago, footeab@yahoo.com said:

One truly has to be a perverted piece of garbage to say wind has a 95.5% uprate. 

Power is only reliable when IT exists when YOU want it to exist.  Not when the damned wind blows or sun shines.

Hence the batteries, and a lot of energy is wanted when the sun shines.  Humans are generally most active during the day.